Threads Of Destiny(Eastern Fantasy, Sequel to Forge of Destiny)

Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
[X] Withdraw, seek cooperation with the Ministry and the ruling family, go down as a group.

I don't really see the point in rushing. There's little to be gained as we can't resolve a city-wide situation alone, and plenty to lose if this is a trap. It's not like getting cooperation is going to delay us that much anyways.
 
This operation was a simply stalk and grab, not anti terror. The ministry here had no idea this was even a possibility. They only expected someone with a grudge messing with our mail, not a city wide terror Attack, why the fuck would they have anything more then a small team ready?

I'm not saying their incompetent, I'm saying their slow.
Their operation, which we followed, uncovered this plot. Which LQ by herself would not be able to do. And this is the Seat of a Viscount Family, which is now under enemy attack.

Why wouldn't the Powers that be have more assets on the call?

You really have no solid evidence that they are slow either.
 
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[X] Withdraw, seek cooperation with the Ministry and the ruling family, go down as a group.

I am inclined to keep cooperating with the Ministry here.
 
[X] Withdraw, seek cooperation with the Ministry and the ruling family, go down as a group.

If Ling Qi was also a hyper capable divination expert she might be able to manage this alone. Since she isn't it behooves her to acquire knowledge of the city and expertise from others.
 
One thing to consider as well is we just voted for an allied speed and armor buff. Withdrawing may allow us to see it in action very quickly which would be very very cool.
 
Their operation, which we followed, uncovered this plot. Which LQ by herself would not be able to do. And this is the Seat of a Viscount Family, which is no under enemy attack.

Why wouldn't the Powers that be have more assets on the call?

You really have no solid evidence that they are slow either.
They only noticed something was wrong because we noticed someone was messing with our mail and send it up the pipeline. If we hadn't investigated and if Ren wasn't a petty bitch this city could have exploded 10 times over. That's why I'm sceptical about their competence.

And of course they have more assets, but how many of those are here, right now ready to deal with this? Because again, they only thought this was dealing with someone messing with our mail, not trying to fuck over the whole city.
They are Cultivators. Time is relative when you have the potential power to bend it into a pretzel.
Then why doesn't that count for us too?
 
They only noticed something was wrong because we noticed someone was messing with our mail and send it up the pipeline. If we hadn't investigated and if Ren wasn't a petty bitch this city could have exploded 10 times over. That's why I'm sceptical about their competence.

And of course they have more assets, but how many of those are here, right now ready to deal with this? Because again, they only thought this was dealing with someone messing with our mail, not trying to fuck over the whole city.

Then why doesn't that count for us too?
So could LQ have uncovered all of this herself? No, and that's no insult to her.

And the Ministry uncovered this ploy after LQ informed them that something was wrong, and did it in a decent amount of time too. Is that high praise for them? No that's their job and they should be capable of at least that much.

So LQ did her civic duty and covered her political position by informing them. And they in turn did their job and uncovered the trace with a fair amount of competence.

What is there to be skeptical about? The success of many cases and operations relied on the trained institutions receiving critical info from citizens and gaining intel from locals. That's what they are supposed to do. Its not more a epic about LQ being awesome than it is a damning condemnation of the Ministry.

They did good working together so far, so why is it somehow beneath us now to trust them?
 
[X] Withdraw, seek cooperation with the Ministry and the ruling family, go down as a group.

While first-mover advantage matters, mass and timing matter as well. For both political (working with Imperial agencies, local nobility, and the Diao) and bureaucratic (I am going to make sure that if this fucks up someone else is standing in the splatter zone with me) reasons, I'm voting thus. There are so many external actors to blame for this that even if we fail in the co-op run, the most that we can be blamed for is our rank incompetence as part of the group. If we go solo, and fail, it will be extremely easy for us to be blamed as much as the shishigui, as a singular point of failure that is within the reach of censure.
 
Putting aside the negatives for now, since there's a clear positive with working with the MoL and the ruling family, I think I want to focus what could the positive of going down the sewers now is.

The immediate thing that comes to mind is that "it's gonna be cool". I still remember LQ sneaking into Yan Renshu's base as one of the biggest highlights of that quest, and if possible, I'd wanna try it again. Plus since it's daring, it's gonna be a bonus to Grinning.

It being cool aside though, that alone ain't enough to contend against the political boon we'd get from cooperating (I think). So I went and speculated what other things could be good from just charging down there, and I came up with one.

Since this is a bit of a time-sensitive event, I just thought what if going early will let us see a Shishigui secret and give us extra intel that we haven't known before. Once we come in a group, it's no longer gonna be there. If this speculation is correct, then it slightly ups the merits of going down there now.

Of course, I could just be completely wrong, and we'd see the same thing all the same whether we go alone or not. Who knows. It doesn't matter to me in particular which vote wins since both things have what I want in an equal sense.
 
Since this is a bit of a time-sensitive event, I just thought what if going early will let us see a Shishigui secret and give us extra intel that we haven't known before. Once we come in a group, it's no longer gonna be there. If this speculation is correct, then it slightly ups the merits of going down there now.

I dont think there's anything particularly interesting down there other than the party favors themselves. It sounds like the Shishigui aren't in the city at all if they're just using a patsy like this.
 
[x] Withdraw, seek cooperation with the Ministry and the ruling family, go down as a group.

You know what works for defusing large numbers of bombs planted across the city's sewers?
The guys who maintain the sewers, with the guy that planted said bombs fucking over Renshu for spite.

And the hundreds of agents already active across the city waiting for the capture signal on someone who's participating in crown treason already
 
[X] Withdraw, seek cooperation with the Ministry and the ruling family, go down as a group.

I think it's debatable as to which will be better at bomb defusal: there's too many uncertain factors. The more capable Renshu's preparations, the more likely going it alone will fail, but going it alone does have a higher potential payout. But in terms of what happens in the worst-case scenario, I think it's fairly unambiguous.

There's no reasonable grounds for blaming her for negative outcomes here, because the general security of the city is not her responsibility, and she doesn't have the official authority to go full cowboy cop here. True, that's fine if she succeeds (success needs no excuses, etc), but that's not certain. Meanwhile, if she fails to do this solo, she will absolutely be held responsible for the failure, even if the bulk of it was due to the Ministry and the ruling family not following up on her provided information. If she's doing it all solo, she's also in substantially more personal danger.

If it clear that we would succeed on our own, I would absolutely vote for the other choice. But in terms of the larger goal? Ling Qi's reputation is the coin we're trading in to establish ties outside the Emerald Seas and turn those enemies into friends, and reputation is like money: you need it to earn it. The reputation damage we sustain here if we go it alone and fail could kill a lot more people than the incident today.
 
[X] Withdraw, seek cooperation with the Ministry and the ruling family, go down as a group.

If everything does go wrong at least the local forces will be poised to start an evacuation.
 
So could LQ have uncovered all of this herself? No, and that's no insult to her.

And the Ministry uncovered this ploy after LQ informed them that something was wrong, and did it in a decent amount of time too. Is that high praise for them? No that's their job and they should be capable of at least that much.

So LQ did her civic duty and covered her political position by informing them. And they in turn did their job and uncovered the trace with a fair amount of competence.

What is there to be skeptical about? The success of many cases and operations relied on the trained institutions receiving critical info from citizens and gaining intel from locals. That's what they are supposed to do. Its not more a epic about LQ being awesome than it is a damning condemnation of the Ministry.

They did good working together so far, so why is it somehow beneath us now to trust them?
...again, they didn't notice the teleport formation in the middle of the city nor the sudden increase of cultivator "bombs" in their sewers. If we hadn't made a fuss about our mail what would have happened? Best scenario someone accidentally stumbles over the plot like we did. Worst case? Ren shu gets bored and the city goes up in flames.

They only started doing good work after a higher up started poking over someone with actual influence being inconvenienced.
 
It doesn't not matter what they have or don't have. We don't know that yet. The important thing is keeping them informed and on the loop.

DOCUMENTATION is the name of the game. This is a novel(ish) attack from an enemy they didn't feel the need to be on guard against. And doing that is quite literally part of the job of both the ruling family and the Ministry of Investigation.



On the not noticing bit you keep harping on about, Ling Qi herself never noticed as well. What does that matter though? Just because we ascribe intelligence to our opponents doesn't mean we have to call others stupid. Careless or off-guard at most, but no need to call them stupid when this is a novel opponent they are facing (mixing Renshu's knowledge with his new corruption buddies).
 
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...again, they didn't notice the teleport formation in the middle of the city nor the sudden increase of cultivator "bombs" in their sewers. If we hadn't made a fuss about our mail what would have happened? Best scenario someone accidentally stumbles over the plot like we did. Worst case? Ren shu gets bored and the city goes up in flames.

They only started doing good work after a higher up started poking over someone with actual influence being inconvenienced.
Yes that's how it tends to go. Institutions arent magic, they are made up of people. Which have their biases, and this is a new attack from a new enemy. So they didnt notice.

But then when we informed them they did notice that something was wrong, not the exact thing because they didnt have the intel. But they had an operation tailing YR's cousin up pretty fucking fast.

If they hadn't done that. We wouldnt be here and LQ wouldnt have been able to disable to trigger implemented in his ribcage. Because we wouldnt have been tailing him.

Again, its not a Epic Sage announcing their heroic omni competence. Just a demonstration that when they are given the information they can do their job. And that's what we need them for right now, because we have the intel to give them.
 
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