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Threads Of Destiny(Eastern Fantasy, Sequel to Forge of Destiny)

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JowKeen said:
okay but there are a few reasons, in story, for this to have happened.

First of all, everyone hated the Li Clan. They were a "medicinal" clan with the flesh-sculpting Arts that filled the Hui fleshmarkets with things that wouldn't otherwise be possible. Individual Li could perhaps be redeemable, but the only clan that "liked" the Li were the Hui. And the Li were wiped out as Counts because the Hui refused to lift a finger to help them against Ogodei when he kicked off his invasion by assassinating the Li Patriarch.

The old Li lands are heavily corrupted, and no Li has been able to gather power enough to attempt any degree of reclamation. Not that any of the contemporary Counts would tolerate someone from the main Li house attempting to return to power anyway. No. Instead you have small amounts of Li blood by marriage within the Wang and Diao courts that are arguing over the claim. These Counts would be able to clear out the corrupted halls of the Li, but neither would be guaranteed the spoils afterwards which means that the Li Mountain has been festering for hundreds of years. The one with the strongest claim was the late wife of Sect Head Yuan He, who was a Li. She never pressed her claim, and they had no children.

So you have Li Suyin's ancestor (forget if they're Grandfather or Great Grandfather) who had his Dantian shattered for unspecified crimes, passing his Arts (which are almost certainly Li Fleshcrafting Arts) onto Li Suyin as she goes off to Cultivation school. He has long forsaken the Li name, either because he was a Li married off, a Li outcast, had married into the Li and learned their Arts from his wife, or some other reason (like the Li being a deeply despised clan that would make rebuilding harder rather than easier).

Li Suyin's mom finds a successful commoner-cultivator that works at the Ministries for a husband, and he happens to have the last name Li. From the ancestor's perspective, this lets his descendants reclaim the Li name while laundering the baggage/scars, and he approves of the marriage.

now the Fleshcrafting Arts that Li Suyin showed us way back when were significantly too-advanced for her to fully understand. When she used the basics of them on Huang Da it freaked her out and I don't think Ling Qi knows how much she's studied them since. Because she's willing to support Su Ling despite disagreeing, I suspect she's willing to use the Li Arts for purposes such as: more easily testing on herself, confident she can repair any damage done.

Anyway, this brings things back to this Diao.

Entirely possible that this all has nothing to do with anything this Diao has to say, and may be completely unused as plot points. I think that'd be unfortunate since it lines up so nicely with other thematic and narrative elements, but who knows how much the Diao know about the descendants of the Li or how strong Li Suyin's claim would be.

We've known for a long time that Li Suyin had Li Arts from her mom's side. The interaction where she talked to us about those Arts was pretty early into Forge, so it's not like this is a twist. In fact, that confession was around the time Li Suyin wasn't sure she should continue to be a cultivator, because it wasn't anything like the heroic Immortals she thought it'd be. And the Arts kinda, made her second guess the idea that being an Immortal was a good thing because she looked into the Li and. Ooof.

Anyway. This hypothetical storyline would have to confront the question of whether or not Li Suyin is reclaiming the Li Clan Legacy or whether she's starting a new Li Clan Legacy and she just happens to have some blood from that other Li. A Li clan that will not be honored as if they're the same Li as the clan of her Father. Because that's a persistent question in this world. How much can an Individual separate themselves from all the ties that bind them, and how do you draw the lines between connection and separation, those Boundaries.
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The other thing is that the Li got mostly wiped out, but there is a regular stream of Li trying to reclaim their inheritance. If you just send a small loan of Spirit Stones to this address, they will surely repay you tenfold once they succeed!
 
JowKeen said:
okay but there are a few reasons, in story, for this to have happened.

First of all, everyone hated the Li Clan. They were a "medicinal" clan with the flesh-sculpting Arts that filled the Hui fleshmarkets with things that wouldn't otherwise be possible. Individual Li could perhaps be redeemable, but the only clan that "liked" the Li were the Hui. And the Li were wiped out as Counts because the Hui refused to lift a finger to help them against Ogodei when he kicked off his invasion by assassinating the Li Patriarch.

The old Li lands are heavily corrupted, and no Li has been able to gather power enough to attempt any degree of reclamation. Not that any of the contemporary Counts would tolerate someone from the main Li house attempting to return to power anyway. No. Instead you have small amounts of Li blood by marriage within the Wang and Diao courts that are arguing over the claim. These Counts would be able to clear out the corrupted halls of the Li, but neither would be guaranteed the spoils afterwards which means that the Li Mountain has been festering for hundreds of years. The one with the strongest claim was the late wife of Sect Head Yuan He, who was a Li. She never pressed her claim, and they had no children.

So you have Li Suyin's ancestor (forget if they're Grandfather or Great Grandfather) who had his Dantian shattered for unspecified crimes, passing his Arts (which are almost certainly Li Fleshcrafting Arts) onto Li Suyin as she goes off to Cultivation school. He has long forsaken the Li name, either because he was a Li married off, a Li outcast, had married into the Li and learned their Arts from his wife, or some other reason (like the Li being a deeply despised clan that would make rebuilding harder rather than easier).

Li Suyin's mom finds a successful commoner-cultivator that works at the Ministries for a husband, and he happens to have the last name Li. From the ancestor's perspective, this lets his descendants reclaim the Li name while laundering the baggage/scars, and he approves of the marriage.

now the Fleshcrafting Arts that Li Suyin showed us way back when were significantly too-advanced for her to fully understand. When she used the basics of them on Huang Da it freaked her out and I don't think Ling Qi knows how much she's studied them since. Because she's willing to support Su Ling despite disagreeing, I suspect she's willing to use the Li Arts for purposes such as: more easily testing on herself, confident she can repair any damage done.

Anyway, this brings things back to this Diao.

Entirely possible that this all has nothing to do with anything this Diao has to say, and may be completely unused as plot points. I think that'd be unfortunate since it lines up so nicely with other thematic and narrative elements, but who knows how much the Diao know about the descendants of the Li or how strong Li Suyin's claim would be.

We've known for a long time that Li Suyin had Li Arts from her mom's side. The interaction where she talked to us about those Arts was pretty early into Forge, so it's not like this is a twist. In fact, that confession was around the time Li Suyin wasn't sure she should continue to be a cultivator, because it wasn't anything like the heroic Immortals she thought it'd be. And the Arts kinda, made her second guess the idea that being an Immortal was a good thing because she looked into the Li and. Ooof.

Anyway. This hypothetical storyline would have to confront the question of whether or not Li Suyin is reclaiming the Li Clan Legacy or whether she's starting a new Li Clan Legacy and she just happens to have some blood from that other Li. A Li clan that will not be honored as if they're the same Li as the clan of her Father. Because that's a persistent question in this world. How much can an Individual separate themselves from all the ties that bind them, and how do you draw the lines between connection and separation, those Boundaries.
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Yes Li Suyin told us a bit about her fleshcrafting arts pretty early in Forge, but she never referred to them as 'Li clan' arts. She's actually been relatively tightlipped about the specifics of what they can do and where they come from beyond being from her grandfather. This thing with them being tied to the actual 'used to be a big deal' Li clan is pretty new and I don't recall it being even hinted at before that.

I maintain that naming a character Li, confirming that said Li clan isn't the same Li clan as the destroyed but still plot relevant Li comital clan, and then backtracking and saying they're using Li clan arts that they got from the other side of their family is needlessly convoluted.
 
JowKeen said:
you know she's production track, right? And she was a pill maker?

she'd be competing with Xuan Shi, Li Suyin and some others if she'd even competed. Don't thing she did though.
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Ah, you expected her to get in production track.

Well. Harder to judge on that front, since we've seen less of that ourselves, but as far as I remember she honestly didn't stand out in that, either. And I don't think our year was that exceptional in terms of crafters - other than Xuan Shi, any other year the rest of the competition should have been there too.
 
PrimalShadow said:
Ah, you expected her to get in production track.

Well. Harder to judge on that front, since we've seen less of that ourselves, but as far as I remember she honestly didn't stand out in that, either. And I don't think our year was that exceptional in terms of crafters - other than Xuan Shi, any other year the rest of the competition should have been there too.
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yeah most of Su Ling's renown as a pill maker came in second year after she broke through and dumpstered a bunch of very suprised yellows and fully went into Gan's faction

She did make those argent vent pills first year so she's got some talent.
 
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kfrar said:
Mmm, there's always a balance to be struck between being honest and being needlessly aggressive when discussing conflicting views on IRL-relevant stuff, and the line between those extremes can seem fuzzy at times.

But if someone says they wouldn't be comfortable doing [thing] with a friend, there are only so many ways to interpret the flat assertion that you're not real friends if you're uncomfortable doing [thing].

That being said, it's easy to lose sight of how targeted a statement might appear from the other side if you're not actually thinking about targeting anyone in the first place. So no worries, it happens.
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This is...fair. for my own part, most of my friendships are built on giving each other shit and puncturing each other's egos when deemed necessary so anything so...passive, I guess is the best word, feels very wrong to me. I will admit it's very personal.
 
Song of Winter and Spring
Balanced, Cold, Wood, Expression
Keywords: Isolation, Endings, Cycles
Antithesis: ???
Art Type: Offensive

As Spring Ends
Potency: X
Type: Song, Cold, Drain
Duration: Scene
Warmth is fleeting, and the cold sets in, as familiar notes bring a font of cold anew into the world. Qi shivers and whimpers, drawn to a close as the creeping Cold steals it away to survive, leaving naught but ice and chills in it's wake. Nearby foes have their Qi drained, and their meridians sealed in their wake, reducing their maximum Qi capacity until the blockage is dispelled. If a foe lacks Qi, then Cold begins to sap away at their very vitality, damaging their Health and sealing away their maximum Health until dispelled. If the target is affected by Spring Begins, this technique becomes internal, and can not be affected by external techniques or effects unless they outrank this technique by at least 2 potency.

Winter Begins
Potency: X
Type: Cold, Attack, Area, Toxin, Drain
Duration: Stunt
The wind howls, and the snow falls. Winter has arrived, and with it comes the Cold in all it's terrible beauty. White blankets all, and a cloying stillness settles in, as all things slowly fall quiescent. All are alone in the Cold, and warmth shared is simply warmth lost, as Winter claims all in the silent Cold. All nearby enemies suffer damage as chilling winds cut into them, and Cold qi settles into the wounds, dealing damage over time until dispelled. Additionally, enemies with techniques or effects that either passively or actively support their allies suffer a Qi drain for each of such techniques or effects that are active, multiplied by the number of allies those techniques or effects affect. Such enemies are given the option to retract their techniques or effects from their allies, at the cost of leaving their allies undefended against Winter Begins. Any nearby enemy affected by Spring Begins has it's lingering effects dispelled and replaced with the lingering effect of Winter Begins. This effect is internal, and cannot be affected by techniques or effects which are external to the target unless they outrank this technique by at least 2 potency.

As Winter Ends
Potency: X
Type: Attack, Cold, Finisher
Duration: Stunt
The wind falls quiet, and the snow ceases to fall. Stillness is all that remains, as even Winter itself falls quiet. A deathly peace falls, and though it makes no sound, it echoes all the same. A single target which suffers from Winter Begins feels a terrible pain as the chill infecting them grows to a terrible potency, and every last shred of heat flees their body. The damage to spirit and body is immense. Should the singer lay hands upon the victim however, no defense may save them from the cold. In this condition, the technique is treated as having a Potency of GX+2 and ignores lower ranked defense techniques. Should the target fall, any ally of the target that had been benefiting from any of the target's techniques or effects suffers this same effect as the original target suffered it.

Spring Begins
Potency: X
Type: Wood, Attack, Area, Drain, Toxin
Duration: Stunt
The Cold recedes, it's job done. In it's wake, comes the beginning of Spring, as familiar notes bring forth warmth where there was once cold. All nearby enemies still affected by As Spring Ends have any remaining blockages inflicted by As Spring Ends dispelled, and suffer a Qi drain and damage as the plant life springs forth from the icy blockages. This damage is internal, and cannot be affected by techniques or effects from external sources unless they outrank this technique by at least 2 potency. Any enemies that died to any of the other techniques of this art have their corpses erupt into flowers and grasses, becoming unusable by any other effect, inflicting any other enemies near their corpses with similar growths that sap away at their health until dispelled. This same effect is inflicted on any nearby enemy that is still affected by Winter Begins, dispelling the lingering effects of Winter Begins in the process.
 
Floom said:
Song of Winter and Spring
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Hmm, I feel like this name might be a bit too literal. Maybe we could also draw in themes of opposites working together? Song of Snow and Sun? Nah, that sounds too weird.


Oh, I know! Song of Ice and Fire!

Jokes aside, I do like the idea for Spring Begins. Maybe freezing/blocking the targets meridians or even blood vessels gives the wood qi enough time to plant a seed that would normally be swept away by a cultivator's defense or qi circulation. Another idea is that the wood qi could absorb whatever the target uses to remove the ice blockages to power up its attack. Even once an enemy is out of combat, they could be attacked after an ignorant healer tries to dispel the ice.
 
Ferroic said:
Hmm, I feel like this name might be a bit too literal. Maybe we could also draw in themes of opposites working together? Song of Snow and Sun? Nah, that sounds too weird.


Oh, I know! Song of Ice and Fire!

Jokes aside, I do like the idea for Spring Begins. Maybe freezing/blocking the targets meridians or even blood vessels gives the wood qi enough time to plant a seed that would normally be swept away by a cultivator's defense or qi circulation. Another idea is that the wood qi could absorb whatever the target uses to remove the ice blockages to power up its attack. Even once an enemy is out of combat, they could be attacked after an ignorant healer tries to dispel the ice.
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Yup names are deff way too literal. One of the things I love about Yrsillar's arts is how creative his names and the descriptions are,
 
yrsillar said:
"Well, I just think that stealing your enemies' tools is a better form of spite," Ling Qi said after a moment. "They're yours now, no one else's."

"Not a terrible sentiment," Bao Qingling said, her eyes were fixed on the testing chamber being set up ahead, today would began the presentation of the examinees final projects, with the second half finishing tomorrow. A change from last year. More disciples had made it through the preliminary exams this year it seemed.

Or more were avoiding the combat tourney.

"I don't know your situation, junior sister," Bao Qingling continued. Her oddly relaxed demeanor continued to disturb Ling Qi a little. "Do whatever you do for yourself first. Anyone else should come second or third. That is what cultivation is."
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As we see here, Qingling changes her stance really quick when she realizes what motivates it.

Spite, she understands very well(and demonstrates some later).
Its the same advice Jiao gave - Cultivate your Way for yourself.
Anything else can only be suffering.
yrsillar said:
Li Suyin smiled reaching over to pat Su Ling on the hand. "You know my sentiments, but you have my support. And my scalpels."

Su Ling snorted, Li Suyin's smile turned impish. Ling Qi covered her mouth to muffle a laugh.

"Right, thanks for the image Suyin," Su Ling drawled.

"You're welcome," Li Suyin said primly.
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Suyin affirms here, however, that if Su Ling has considered everything and is still resolved to proceed, she WILL be helping to the full extent.

ALSO!

yrsillar said:
Being able to, having to, look beyond the next moment, the next meal, the next night. It could be paralyzing. She wished she could know she wasn't charging off into her own ruin. Surety, that too was the fruit of cultivation.

"Small problems," Bao Qingling grunted, her fingers laced together in her lap. She didn't look over at them.

"What do you mean, senior sister?" Li Suyin asked.

"Solve small problems. Break things down. One ingredient, one step. You can have a plan, but finish your current step before you start agonizing over the next one."
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This works great with plans and processes.
Using it on people not so much.
yrsillar said:
Bao Qingling didn't look at her, but ling Qi felt a crawling sensation on her skin that she knew was the older girl's attention. "I've gotten a contract with your friend. Will be the go between for the Bao and the Bai on your little trip. Medicines and cultivation supplies."

The corner of the girl's thin lips curled up in a smirk. "My brother's face when I gave him that contract."
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Bao Qian's probably just stood there crashed for a few minutes.
yrsillar said:
Her gaze strayed back to the contests where she saw again the young man from last time she had been here, Jin Tae, presenting his project. It was a small automata, about the size of a cat, made of brass and steel. It was shaped like a tiny man with wings and an exaggerated birdlike face, like the great thunder spirit she had encountered with Yu Nuan. She watched as it performed various tasks, including carving new formations on tablets of clay, needing only a final infusion of qi from its maker to activate its work.
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...hey, isn't that the same method Xuan Shi is using for his own demo with us?
yrsillar said:
"Baroness Ling, Baroness Li, Baroness Su," the woman greeted politely, inclining her head only slightly. Her gaze lingered a moment on Su Ling before moving to their companion. "Bao Qingling."

"Diao Hualing," Bao Qingling said shortly, sounding intensely disinterested.

It was slightly rude to give someone's name before they could give it themselves. Diao Hualing's stare bored into Bao Qingling's impassive face for a long few seconds. "It has been some time," she finally said, turning her eyes from.
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Its really hard to do subtle courtly moves when someone is determined to be rude and does not give a shit about what you think of them.
yrsillar said:
"I disagree. But it seems I may have caught you in another engagement," Diao Hualing said. "If-"

"I'm going," Bao Qingling grunted. "Li Suyin, be at my workshop tomorrow evening for the project we discussed."

"Yes, senior sister," Li Suyin said, glancing between them nervously. Even she caught the tension there.
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Especially if she just keeps interrupting then takes the last word too.
yrsillar said:
Bao Qingling left, and Diao Hualing watched her go for a moment, before speaking in a considering tone. "In any case, do the three of you have plans at the moment?"

"I was going to escort Li Suyin around and introduce her to a few people," Ling Qi said humbly. "Nothing more."

"Well, that is convenient. Will you allow me to walk with you, Baronesses? I will not take up much of your afternoon." the older woman asked calmly. It had the air of a request, but Ling Qi glanced at her friends and saw that they understood just as well how rude it would be to deny a comital scion such a small thing. Particularly when she was giving them some face by simply walking with them publicly while Ling Qi introduced Li Suyin to people.
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She's actually doing the group a bit of favor...even as she socially strongarms them.
And also excludes the Bao from Suyin's introduction.

Thats at least 3 visible moves in one.
Best make nice and establish some kind of boundaries, because this sort of player just casually causing disruption is nothing compared to them being determined to actually fuck it all up for you
 
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Anxieties of a Serpent
  • Sidestory
    • Bai Meizhen glanced down at the package in her hands with satisfaction. Within lay a number of unique reagents and a new wine from her homeland, neither of which were yet in public circulation within the Empire. She was quite certain that Qingling would enjoy them.

    She paused on the high mountain path which led to her paramours workshop, looking out over the green valleys below. These past few months still felt unreal. When it had begun, she had felt as if she were floating atop the waters of lake Hei, warm and weightless. She still felt a bit embarrassed by it. It was a wonder that none had noticed her distraction or demeanor. Truly, most outsiders were quite thick.

    That feeling of unreality had not lasted, the initial haze had faded, awkwardness and uncertainty returned. However, the dream did not end. It just became… grounded. The thrill of avoiding scrutiny for their liaisons, and the warmth in clasped hands and even when she felt daring, Qingling's lips; these replaced the dream-like feeling of those first days. Real things, solid things. Things that did not disappear when she averted her eyes.

    This week especially, she had spent almost every day with Qingling, talking, crafting, cultivating sparring. She still felt a touch of unseemly giddiness as she recalled the clever ruse which had left her winded on the ground, Qingling pinning her with steel claws at her throat.

    How delicious it would be, when she could reverse that.

    Those empty rooms in Zhengjian seemed so far away.

    Resuming her walk, Bai Meizhen soon crested the clifftop, reaching the flat plateau which overlooked the ravine where Qingling's workshop hung. If she was honest, she found the lumpy, organic mass of webbing to be a bit uncouth, but she understood that among the Emerald Seas, naturalistic architecture was traditional, even among those who hewed closer to imperial standards.

    Therefore, she resolved, she would accept the difference in opinion on aesthetics. This, according to her correspondence with her Aunt, was an important part of 'tolerance'. For much the same reason, she did not nitpick Qingling's choice of garments. Even if she would look very good in a proper dress. Ah, but if she dared to use some of the Duchess' modern fashions, perhaps Qingling could be enticed as well?

    Bai Meizhen blinked, and felt a touch of heat rise in her cheeks as she glanced around.

    ...No witnesses to her moment of distraction. That was good. No one needed to die. There was only her shadow, and the yet nameless spirit of fear that dwelled there was hardly going to gossip. She was allowing herself to dither though, and that was unacceptable. She approached the top of the workshop where it peaked over the cliff, the circular entrance barred by a veil of silken webbing embossed with a few simple words.

    'Closed to clients. Return tomorrow.'

    She was hardly a mere client however, and a brush of her fingers caused the webs to twitch and jerk away, opening the workshop to her. Qingling had keyed her to the wards. She passed into into the rounded entry passage, her footfalls silent on the slightly springy spider silk. Their vibrations would alert Qingling regardless. She soon came to the first oval chamber, the workshops 'guest room'. Laid out with a few spartan furnishings and lit by faeries trapped in the webs overhead, it was… cozy, she supposed. She really should speak to Qingling about her presentation a little.

    It was as she was pondering the possibilities of carpet in a room already made from silk that Qingling arrived.

    She emerged from a hidden hole in the floor, standing on the back of one of her spirit beasts many young, a brown hairy spider the size of a large dog. Qingling stepped down from the beasts back, a frown on her lips. She wore her heavy smock today, and her features were smeared with soot save for the pale circles around her eyes that her work goggles protected.

    "We did not schedule a date today. What is wrong?" Qingling asked, crossing her arms. Meizhen felt the tingling sensation of the other girl's senses as she was studied.

    "Nothing wrong, I simply wished to stop by," Bai Meizhen replied lightly.

    Qingling's frown deepened. "We spoke yesterday. You made no indication that you were coming today."

    Bai Meizhen's small smile faded. Qingling could be so brusque at times. "Yes, well, I found good reason to come. I r-"

    "Bai Meizhen, I am in the middle of a delicate project. I told you I would be," Bao Qingling said. "You cannot just interrupt me whenever you please."

    She felt a flash of hurt. Why in the world was Qingling being so confrontational about this? "Are you saying you cannot take even a few minutes from your work for me?"

    "Yes," Qingling said irritably. "When you did not even bother to schedule this meeting ahead of time."

    Bai Meizhen narrowed her eyes. "What is wrong with you today, Qingling?"

    "This is the first day I have been able to work uninterrupted in a week is what is wrong," the other girl snapped, exasperated. "I need my time to work, and I had expected you to respect that. Please leave."

    The flash of hurt returned and remained this time. She had thought the last week had been wonderful, they had done something together every day. Was Qingling saying that she had seen it all as a bother, an imposition on her time? "Am I truly bothering you so?"

    "Yes, come back tomorrow," Bao Qingling replied, turning away.

    Bai Meizhen stared at her back for a moment and then turned away herself. "Very well. Let me stop bothering you," she said coldly.

    As a Bai, naturally her voice didn't waver at all. She left the way she had came, moving swiftly to leave the place she had been so eager to arrive at.

    Foolish. Her own voice chided in her mind. Once again, she had seen what she wanted to see, and in doing, she had overstepped herself. Her earlier optimism seemed so terribly stupid now. Again.

    She did not see Bao Qingling behind her, still standing in the meeting room, holding her hands to her temples.
     
  • Sidestory
    • aaaaahhh as a neurodivergent introvert who desperately needs alone time and defined periods when nobody is in my space this is distressingly real, I cannot count the number of times I have had to explain this to people who were trying to be nice but walked away convinced I hated them

    Poor Qingling.
     
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    Tobtorp said:
    You think these two chuckle heads are going to find a solution on their own? They have the communications skill of a particular stubborn rock! And not one of the xianxia talking rocks...
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    They're more likely to fix it then Ling Qi doing it. She's the last person to be helping others with relationship problems. They're both intelligent women and they both want this. They'll figure it out, given some time to nurse their wounds. Have some faith.
     
    okay, so this was almost certainly the turbulence that Meizhen and Qingling had some time ago that we didn't involve ourselves in. This is almost certainly a recently published story from the backlog on Patreon, and so I will not be very anxious about it because it's already resolved c:


    those are my assumptions and I'm sticking to them! lol

    but yes this is very real. Ooof. That feel when u love but need space or you're going to destabilize woof. Connection truly is pain Meizhen. But good news, future you and future Qingling have worked it out <3 yayy
     
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