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The Lords of Ruin -- Battletech/Killzone

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Adventwolf said:
They aren't getting built this turn. This turn is all about getting agreements for all the parties so we can build them later. That is why I have the gathering of supplies and materials this turn so that we can ship them after we get the others to help. Not everything can happen in a month and none of my action choices are any that are doing anything this month. They are all getting people to talk and agree to help nothing is being built that is why I said not to misrepresent my actions. The only real action is the MoC deal and even that is not this turn it is not until the Restoration agrees to it that it will do anything. Your plan is bare-bones and doesn't do enough to set up the framework for future actions.
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What are the odds two factions fighting a civil war would allow a third party they might have not known before or that they have heard few things, to step in and do stuff in their lands?
This is what I am questioning first and foremost, I am also worried about how it would look to other parties but this has to be tiered, we need MOC and TC on the table to move forward because they do have the prestige and power to get the ball rolling, because this comes into little known nation of small size and questionable reach to "The big guys of this neighborhood plus one" that is from the Aurigans POV, from the TC and MOC, how do you think it would look if a newcomer to the area started spearheading initiatives and they include you as "one more factor"? To big for their britches would be one comment, plotters and manipulators another, and those are labels we certainly don't want

That is my angle and why I am concentrating on the TC and MOC now, this is in part getting them on board and giving them their due respect as the established star nations they are (and also making sure this won't upset the apple cart of trade and diplomacy we have going) and make sure all possible issues between the two are ironed out before we approach the Aurigans
 
[X] Playing The Great Game

Sorry. But this is a Real Politics decision. We do not have the resource to do a moral or humane decision. We are now playing the Game of Thrones and the only exit option is death.
 
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Chaos Blade said:
What are the odds two factions fighting a civil war would allow a third party they might have not known before or that they have heard few things, to step in and do stuff in their lands?
This is what I am questioning first and foremost, I am also worried about how it would look to other parties but this has to be tiered, we need MOC and TC on the table to move forward because they do have the prestige and power to get the ball rolling, because this comes into little known nation of small size and questionable reach to "The big guys of this neighborhood plus one" that is from the Aurigans POV, from the TC and MOC, how do you think it would look if a newcomer to the area started spearheading initiatives and they include you as "one more factor"? To big for their britches would be one comment, plotters and manipulators another, and those are labels we certainly don't want

That is my angle and why I am concentrating on the TC and MOC now, this is in part getting them on board and giving them their due respect as the established star nations they are (and also making sure this won't upset the apple cart of trade and diplomacy we have going) and make sure all possible issues between the two are ironed out before we approach the Aurigans
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Which is why the plan has the TC and MoC involved in the camps in the first place. And the talk to both sides of the war even makes it clear that the camps are a TC, MoC, and Republic action. Not something we are doing on our own. You seem to think this will all happen in one turn it will not but we need to take action to start the idea to set up the camps because neither of the two powers will do anything on their own. Your plan has us talk but with no direction given and the two powers already made it clear they will do nothing it will take an outside force to get them to move one way or the other. We could wait for even more shit to go wrong and the chemical attack to force that move or we could start the process ourselves. Being passive in this is not a smart move we most be proactive.
 
Inserted tally
Adhoc vote count started by coyote16able on Sep 7, 2019 at 3:24 PM, finished with 152 posts and 13 votes.
  • [X] Playing The Great Game
    [X] Playing All Sides
    [X] Diplomacy In Action, Extended
    --[X] Contact the Taurian Embassy about the Aurigan Situation
    ----[X] Suggest ourselves as a neutral negotiating ground
    --[X] Contact the Magistocracy Embassy
    ----[X] Inquire about the current Aurigan situation
    ----[X] Suggest ourselves as neutral negotiating ground
    --[X] Try to make contact with the Restoration
    ----[X] Try to figure out what their deal is
    --[X] Contact the Aurigan Directorate, open diplomatic relations
    [X] Playing All Sides
    -[X] Homeland
    --[X] Start building up supplys and materials to setup aid camps in the Aurigan Reach.
    --[X] Talk with the many transport companies that were failing or have failed and being acquiring their assets to form the necessary merchant marine fleet to support the movement of goods and people to and from the Aurigan Reach.
    --[X] Start talks with the factions that are against the Directorate to see what they want and see if they can be used to help make intervention on a greater scale palatable to the Helgan people.
    -[X] Contact the Taurians
    --[X] Ask for clarification on how much weapons trade is happening between the Directorate and the Taurians.
    --[X] Provide the proof we have gathered and attempt to convince the Taurians to help set up relief and humanitarian aid alongside both the Republic and the Magistracy to alleviate the suffering of the Aurigan people .
    -[X] Contact the Magistracy
    --[X] Inquire about aiding in providing financial aid in the form of materials to help the Restoration buy food contingent on the Restoration agreeing of course.
    --[X] Provide the proof we have gathered and attempt to convince the Canopians to help set up relief and humanitarian aid alongside both the Republic and the Concordant to alleviate the suffering of the Aurigan people.
    -[X] Contact with the Restoration
    --[X] Offer assistance in the form of humanitarian aid and materials to help pay for their own purchases of food and medicine in the form of materials.
    --[X] Attempt to convince the Restoration to allow the set-up of relief and humanitarian aid camps alongside the Republic, Canopians, and the Concordant to alleviate the suffering of the Aurigan people.
    --[X] Let them know that the Directorate is trying to open trade relations with us and that we will listen to what they have to say but that we are more supportive of the Restoration. Ensure they understand that we need to maintain the appearance of neutrality until we have enough proof and casus belli to act.
    --[X] Request that they allow investigators and documenters from the Republic to accompany their forces in order to gather that proof and help spread the word. (In secret brooch the subject of having spec ops units attached if the Restoration requests them to offer covert aid under the alias of a merc company made up of former republic citzens.)
    -[X] Contact the Aurigan Directorate, open diplomatic relations
    --[X] Attempt to convince the Directorate to allow the setup of relief and humanitarian aid camps alongside the Republic, Canopians, and the Concordant to alleviate the suffering of the Aurigan people.
    --[X] Let them know that the camps are for all Aurigan people no matter what side they are on or where they are. They are neutral zones and will focus only on treating and helping the people and not take part in the war.
    --[X] Inquire about just what they want from the trade deals, so we are better prepared for their offers.
    --[X] Request that they allow investigators and documenters from the Republic to accompany their forces so that we can prevent or prove any war crimes committed by either side and to try and keep those officers under control.
    [X] Playing The Great Game
    -[X] Homeland
    --[X] Talk with the many transport companies that were failing or have failed and being acquiring their assets to form the necessary merchant marine fleet to support the movement of goods and people to and from the Aurigan Reach.
    --[X] Start talks with the factions that are against the Directorate to see what they want and see if they can be used to help make intervention on a greater scale palatable to the Helgan people.
    -[X] Contact the Taurians
    --[X] Ask for clarification on how much weapons trade is happening between the Directorate and the Taurians.
    --[X] Provide the proof we have gathered regarding the Directorate's actions, try to set up further talks on the matter
    -[X] Contact the Magistracy
    --[X] Inquire about aiding in providing financial aid in the form of materials to help the Restoration buy food contingent on the Restoration agreeing of course.
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Well it seems like you managed to convince people of your plan Chaos. Let's just hope that we don't take to long to set up the camps since it will be longer now since not even discussions about them are being made. Hopefully, we are in a position to help stop some of the shit that caused the most problems instead of spending time building things that could have been started earlier. Really feel that your plan basically does nothing to get us in a better position to make changes but hey you wanted to do nothing originally anyways so minimal actions make sense.
 
I just had a thought so one of the disadvantages of our warp coils was the fact they need to refueled every so often but has that changed since we know have primitive Fusion Reactors?


And what do you guys think our next three research topics should be? I'm thinking Prototype Fusion Drive, organ cloning and Prototype Neuro Helmets.
 
Welp that looks definitive now I guess we will have to see what they other factions will do and how the war advances.

Inserted tally
Adhoc vote count started by coyote16able on Sep 10, 2019 at 9:20 PM, finished with 158 posts and 16 votes.
  • [X] Playing The Great Game
    [X] Playing All Sides
    [X] Diplomacy In Action, Extended
    --[X] Contact the Taurian Embassy about the Aurigan Situation
    ----[X] Suggest ourselves as a neutral negotiating ground
    --[X] Contact the Magistocracy Embassy
    ----[X] Inquire about the current Aurigan situation
    ----[X] Suggest ourselves as neutral negotiating ground
    --[X] Try to make contact with the Restoration
    ----[X] Try to figure out what their deal is
    --[X] Contact the Aurigan Directorate, open diplomatic relations
    [X] Playing All Sides
    -[X] Homeland
    --[X] Start building up supplys and materials to setup aid camps in the Aurigan Reach.
    --[X] Talk with the many transport companies that were failing or have failed and being acquiring their assets to form the necessary merchant marine fleet to support the movement of goods and people to and from the Aurigan Reach.
    --[X] Start talks with the factions that are against the Directorate to see what they want and see if they can be used to help make intervention on a greater scale palatable to the Helgan people.
    -[X] Contact the Taurians
    --[X] Ask for clarification on how much weapons trade is happening between the Directorate and the Taurians.
    --[X] Provide the proof we have gathered and attempt to convince the Taurians to help set up relief and humanitarian aid alongside both the Republic and the Magistracy to alleviate the suffering of the Aurigan people .
    -[X] Contact the Magistracy
    --[X] Inquire about aiding in providing financial aid in the form of materials to help the Restoration buy food contingent on the Restoration agreeing of course.
    --[X] Provide the proof we have gathered and attempt to convince the Canopians to help set up relief and humanitarian aid alongside both the Republic and the Concordant to alleviate the suffering of the Aurigan people.
    -[X] Contact with the Restoration
    --[X] Offer assistance in the form of humanitarian aid and materials to help pay for their own purchases of food and medicine in the form of materials.
    --[X] Attempt to convince the Restoration to allow the set-up of relief and humanitarian aid camps alongside the Republic, Canopians, and the Concordant to alleviate the suffering of the Aurigan people.
    --[X] Let them know that the Directorate is trying to open trade relations with us and that we will listen to what they have to say but that we are more supportive of the Restoration. Ensure they understand that we need to maintain the appearance of neutrality until we have enough proof and casus belli to act.
    --[X] Request that they allow investigators and documenters from the Republic to accompany their forces in order to gather that proof and help spread the word. (In secret brooch the subject of having spec ops units attached if the Restoration requests them to offer covert aid under the alias of a merc company made up of former republic citzens.)
    -[X] Contact the Aurigan Directorate, open diplomatic relations
    --[X] Attempt to convince the Directorate to allow the setup of relief and humanitarian aid camps alongside the Republic, Canopians, and the Concordant to alleviate the suffering of the Aurigan people.
    --[X] Let them know that the camps are for all Aurigan people no matter what side they are on or where they are. They are neutral zones and will focus only on treating and helping the people and not take part in the war.
    --[X] Inquire about just what they want from the trade deals, so we are better prepared for their offers.
    --[X] Request that they allow investigators and documenters from the Republic to accompany their forces so that we can prevent or prove any war crimes committed by either side and to try and keep those officers under control.
    [X] Playing The Great Game
    -[X] Homeland
    --[X] Talk with the many transport companies that were failing or have failed and being acquiring their assets to form the necessary merchant marine fleet to support the movement of goods and people to and from the Aurigan Reach.
    --[X] Start talks with the factions that are against the Directorate to see what they want and see if they can be used to help make intervention on a greater scale palatable to the Helgan people.
    -[X] Contact the Taurians
    --[X] Ask for clarification on how much weapons trade is happening between the Directorate and the Taurians.
    --[X] Provide the proof we have gathered regarding the Directorate's actions, try to set up further talks on the matter
    -[X] Contact the Magistracy
    --[X] Inquire about aiding in providing financial aid in the form of materials to help the Restoration buy food contingent on the Restoration agreeing of course.
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Treasure
  • Sidestory
    • Treasure​



    "Exactly why are we out here in the first place?"


    "Like I told you at the Base camp we're searching for an old TSV Storage bunker and seeing if there's anything still in it. And it's there even got a map for the rough location of it.


    "Yeah if the Petursite fires didn't destroy it in the first place!"


    "Well the thing was supposedly meant to survive orbital bombardments so it should still be there."


    "What's in it?"


    "Unknown the TSV Documents called it a Tracked Entrance Storage Depot built 20 years before the war so it could be anything!"


    "Hey guys I Found something!"


    Hearing a cry from up far the group of four Helghast trekked up towards the ridge line where they could see their compatriot.


    When they got to the ridge the unmistakable sight of a Bunker entrance was seen built into a mountain. Parts of the mountain around the Entrance was gone showing more of the smooth bunker concrete.


    "Damn look at the size of that thing you could fit Three Mawlers side by side through that door!"


    "Howler 5 this is Prospector we've found the goldmine" Spoke the teams leader into his radio.


    A few minutes later the sound and sight of multiple Overlord Dropships flying into the area herald the arrival of another Treasure hunting Company. Treasure Hunting it had become a thing on Helghan after contact had been made with other planets. The Marks made in Search and Salvage of old bunkers and battlefields was enough to make anyone rich beyond their wildest dreams. Especially with off world trade with Mir, Portland, Independence, The Magistracy and Concordant the market for old Equipment was on the rise. Helped that the Helghan Republic was also interested in the location and contents of these types of buildings the Petursite fires having destroyed towns and records.


    Having volunteers to search Helghan for these facilities and towns for a small price was seen better than having the military go searching around.



    So this was just a thought I had about how after the Terracide that there was probably tons of abandoned Depots, bases, towns and so on. that where seen as not important or just lost in the chaos and that People looking to make some money would go looking for them. That small bit at the end about the Helghan Republic also paying some fee's for the finding and cataloging of these places is because of even though it's more stable the goverment is probably still stretched thin and see it as a very low priority.
     
  • Sidestory
    • I thought in this timeline Stahl's superweapon "only" destroyed the Helghan navy in orbit of the planet? With the planet itself pretty much untouched?

    At least, that's the impression I got from the opening post:
    prometheus110 said:
    Four years ago, at the end of a blood-soaked war started by a martyred dictator, the power-hungry CEO of Stahl industries accidentally unleashed a weapon of genocidal potential on the inhabitants of Helghan during a coup against his rivals.

    With a flash of emerald light that blinded thousands of terrified Helghast and irradiated tens of thousands more, Stahl's abhorrent weapon detonated above the ruins of Phyrrus city --the assembled might of the Helghast navy simply evaporating as arching lines of energy devoured their ships and closed off the sky. Despite the loss of their navy and the death of their leaders, the council of cronies, strongmen, and corrupt nobles that made up the so-called leadership of the Helghan empire held on for a time --countless thousands murdered in secret and in the open as a panicked populace raged against an ever-more inhuman regime. Eventually, however, something had to give; and like the Russian monarchy in the 20th century, the council soon found itself on the wrong end of its own soldiers' guns.
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    It confirms the weapon was used, but doesn't really give the impression about most of the planet surface being destroyed, as it happened in the games IIRC.
     
    Kelenas said:
    I thought in this timeline Stahl's superweapon "only" destroyed the Helghan navy in orbit of the planet? With the planet itself pretty much untouched?

    At least, that's the impression I got from the opening post:

    It confirms the weapon was used, but doesn't really give the impression about most of the planet surface being destroyed, as it happened in the games IIRC.
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    Well it wasn't as bad as what's seen in shadowfall the damage was still pretty severe due to exactly how Irradiated Petursite acts and the knock on effects of a planet engulfing nuclear fire storm that seeks out movement and electricity.
     
    I like this quest.

    Good CK2 quests are not easy to find and Prometheus does a downright fantastic work of not wanking Killzone. It's like, holy crap, the Halghast AREN'T going to steamroll simply by being the player faction?:o

    The victories are satisfactory and so is the interaction within the universe. However, if I simply HAVE to make a criticism, it is this: I, even after all this time, do not feel like the game has earned its premise. Or rather, part of it.

    To wit, the fact that Helghast starts off socialist is the biggest stumbling block in it. The background breaks WSoD because going from being Fascist to being left leaning democratic with no transition in between is a bit unbelievable. In truth, IMOH, after reading the whole thing, I feel that making Helghast a nation formed into "a new, more democratic nation founded on the principles of peace, justice, and freedom" a task best left to the player base. It should have been a goal rather then the background.

    Survival and winning the game of CK2 is nice and all, but the game started off with it's biggest battle already won.

    That said, I get the feeling that the author would not have liked to write this quest at all if he had to write a player influenced Fascist government and, well, that is completely understandable. It is better to have a quest like this update as it does then have another interesting game abandoned because it couldn't keep the attention of it's writer.

    Nonetheless, in aggregate, this game is fantastic and I congratulate Prometheus110 on it.
     
    mithril-blade said:
    I like this quest.

    Good CK2 quests are not easy to find and Prometheus does a downright fantastic work of not wanking Killzone. It's like, holy crap, the Halghast AREN'T going to steamroll simply by being the player faction?:o

    The victories are satisfactory and so is the interaction within the universe. However, if I simply HAVE to make a criticism, it is this: I, even after all this time, do not feel like the game has earned its premise. Or rather, part of it.

    To wit, the fact that Helghast starts off socialist is the biggest stumbling block in it. The background breaks WSoD because going from being Fascist to being left leaning democratic with no transition in between is a bit unbelievable. In truth, IMOH, after reading the whole thing, I feel that making Helghast a nation formed into "a new, more democratic nation founded on the principles of peace, justice, and freedom" a task best left to the player base. It should have been a goal rather then the background.

    Survival and winning the game of CK2 is nice and all, but the game started off with it's biggest battle already won.

    That said, I get the feeling that the author would not have liked to write this quest at all if he had to write a player influenced Fascist government and, well, that is completely understandable. It is better to have a quest like this update as it does then have another interesting game abandoned because it couldn't keep the attention of it's writer.

    Nonetheless, in aggregate, this game is fantastic and I congratulate Prometheus110 on it.
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    They're valid criticisms. I just decided that I wanted to have players be controlling a left-wing faction for the sake of variety and so I could talk about nazis getting shot. :V

    It does/will inform some other things, but players have mostly avoided making bad decisions.
     
    mithril-blade said:
    Well...why the Helghast then? Wouldn't the ISA have been more aligned with that desire?
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    Because the ISA where the good guys of the games because the helghan Empire was the desginated bad guys lore? yeah no the UCN and ISA are the bad guys full bore.

    A interesting thing to do if they ever do another Killzone would be to focus on something other than the vetkans and helghast and from the propesctive of those oppose to the ISA and UCN.
     
    mithril-blade said:
    Well...why the Helghast then? Wouldn't the ISA have been more aligned with that desire?
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    Because how would you have moved the ISA or the Vektan's into this universe. The ISA's war crimes and actions destroying Helgan give us plenty of room to make the universe jump. Also no the ISA, UCN, Vekta and Earth are not more aligned to those ideas. They put on the show of being just and democratic while suppressing and chocking the other colonies for all they are worth. They keep valuable technology and power to make their own decisions out of the hands of the colonies as well. They are an authoritarian regime with much better PR.
     
    prometheus110 said:
    I just didn't want to write about space Americans. :V
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    The ISA and UCN aren't really Space Americans though. Like I said they have the cover and flavor to seem like the good guys but looking deeper it becomes obvious that they are pretty screwed up and corrupt. The First Interstellar War was all about stealing the lucrative Vekta and the control of the trade route from the Helgan Corporation. The people that made the colony, paid for the right to settle it from the UCN, and did all the work to make it successful. Plus there is a reason that there is a powerful league of colonies that have broken off from the ISA and UCN control. A faction that has enough power to be considered a major player and potential threat.
     
    Adventwolf said:
    The ISA and UCN aren't really Space Americans though. Like I said they have the cover and flavor to seem like the good guys but looking deeper it becomes obvious that they are pretty screwed up and corrupt. The First Interstellar War was all about stealing the lucrative Vekta and the control of the trade route from the Helgan Corporation. The people that made the colony, paid for the right to settle it from the UCN, and did all the work to make it successful. Plus there is a reason that there is a powerful league of colonies that have broken off from the ISA and UCN control. A faction that has enough power to be considered a major player and potential threat.
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    I'm talking more their general aesthetic, visible culture, names, etc. As Sci fi cultures go, they're a very American one and that's boring.
     
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