The issue with these is that they risk losing us our position in Linz. We just had a demonstration that we can't go on the offensive in both Austria and Poland without being pushed back somewhere, and losing Linz and being pushed back over the Inn removes our ability to threaten Vienna in a single campaign while giving the Austrians much better defensive terrain.
Springtime of Nations II: A European Republic Quest
- Thread starter Etranger
- Start date
- Original Alt. History
- Pronouns
- They/Them
@Etranger , what are the Balkans thinking about this whole... everything. Since if we keep on advancing then eventually it'll be their problems.
A good point, though is Austria really going to try a major offensive with a bunch of entirely green and untrained troops? At least on the defense, the troops can think they're protecting their country or yada yada.
A good point, though is Austria really going to try a major offensive with a bunch of entirely green and untrained troops? At least on the defense, the troops can think they're protecting their country or yada yada.
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- Location
- America
Well one of my plans is a direct attacks towards Vienna, from Linz, so how that results in us losing Linz is baffling. And I think you're overestimating the risk to Linz. We have an army freed up from Denmark to shore up our lines, and Austria's army is degrading in quality, making it harder for them to conduct more offensives. I believe we can hold Linz.
I'm just not confident we can do offensives everywhere without losing ground anywhere, and I think we have enough time to knock out Austria before turning on Russia.
[] Plan: Operation Death Blow
-[] [POLAND] Reallocate troops toward the Austrian front.
-[] [AUSTRIA] Initiate an offensive toward Vienna (Green).
-[] [ITALY] Ask the Allies to initiate a full offensive.
-[] [BALTIC] Deploy the Allied fleet to contest the eastern Baltic Sea.
-[] [MED] Ask the Allies to threaten the Dalmatian coast.
Here is an alternate plan. This one is focused on seriously threatening Vienna this turn. Once again, taking soldiers off the line in Poland gives us a substantial numerical superiority. When coupled with the fact that the Austrians are using untrained conscripts and the fact that we have total naval dominance on the Danube, we can very likely shatter the Austrian's Danubian army, forcing them to further weaken the defenses in the Alps for the Italians to break through.
- Pronouns
- They/Them
Is the Russian army in enough of a bad state that allowing them to outnumber us on the Polish Front even more than they do now wouldn't give them cause to initiate an offensive? I mean, in this case I could be convinced of it, since they did get their asses kicked less than a month ago, and it'd be smart to regroup... but the same logic could easily justify not worrying about Austrian counter-attacks, but you are worried about those.
The Russians have been essentially unable to make gains against us even when going up against only basic field fortifications. Transferring troops to Austria also nets us the benefits of a full turn spent fortifying our Polish positions, so even if they do manage to get their logistics unfucked enough to attack, they'll be running into even stronger defences than before. Meanwhile the Austrians have made gains even against defences that we spent that turn on, so I think I'm justified as viewing them as a larger threat.
The option also has the benefit of taking a turn to really build up our logistical capacity in Poland, which we have so far neglected. Repairing the rails and turning Warsaw into our own logistics center will do a great deal to support further Polish campaigns.
DracoDracul
Transbian Communist
- Location
- Austin
- Pronouns
- She/They
I'm thinking we shore up defenses in Poland and then work to cut off the alpine defense from resupply so that it's easier for our allies to breach those defenses. This will mean more troops for an assault on Vienna in the Fall.
So my first plan, then? I don't think we can take Klagenfurt without the support of troops from Poland.
nachtingale
20. On that "honk, mimimi" type beat everyday.
- Location
- Malaysia
- Pronouns
- He/They
Very much support this one, further weakening the Austrian grip on their capital while we prepare for a strategic-level strike on the rear lines across the Pannonian Basin come Autumn. The fact that the Italians now outnumber the defenders on the Italian front 2:1 (not counting the newly arrived conscript force), also points to a chance to breakout our allies in tandem with the Dalmatian coast plan.
Parzival
They shall not pass. We shall overcome.
- Location
- Northern Virginia
- Pronouns
- He/Him
[] Plan: Operation Mousetrap
-[] [POLAND] Reallocate troops toward the Austrian front.
-[] [AUSTRIA] Initiate an offensive toward Klagenfurt (Red).
-[] [ITALY] Ask the Allies to initiate a full offensive.
-[] [BALTIC] Deploy the Allied fleet to contest the eastern Baltic Sea.
-[] [MED] Ask the Allies to threaten the Dalmatian coast.
I support this plan. It will enable our allies to help us on the Austrian front.
-[] [POLAND] Reallocate troops toward the Austrian front.
-[] [AUSTRIA] Initiate an offensive toward Klagenfurt (Red).
-[] [ITALY] Ask the Allies to initiate a full offensive.
-[] [BALTIC] Deploy the Allied fleet to contest the eastern Baltic Sea.
-[] [MED] Ask the Allies to threaten the Dalmatian coast.
I support this plan. It will enable our allies to help us on the Austrian front.
- Location
- the Republic
- Pronouns
- He/They
Impossible to say at this point, really. If the Republic actually dismembers Austria, then it's a heaven-sent opportunity for them, but if they make a move and then Austria or Russia are left in any sort of position to strike back, they're very likely to get crushed. Combine that with the threat of Bulgaria and everything gets very uncertain, so mostly they're just waiting to see what happens.
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I imagine they'll be much more likely to move after we take Vienna.
- Location
- France
- Pronouns
- She/They
Gotta say, didn't vote for the winning plan, but I'm not mad at all at the result. Britain took it really well considering we're still gobbling up Denmark and in position to close up the Baltic.
It's interesting that the only two schools of thought are "basically a normal European empire" and "insert unhinged race science". I wonder if there will be more reaction to the post war plan if we make more sister republics or if it will just be chalked up as imperialism and thus ignored as fitting the model. I could see the average British political analyst not giving our ideological motivations proper weight and seeing no difference with OTL imperial Germany's short lived eastern European empire.
Anyway, war plan.
[] Plan Keep Up The Pressure
-[] [POLAND] Initiate an offensive toward Konigsberg (Gold).
-[] [AUSTRIA] Initiate an offensive toward Brno (Gold).
-[] [ITALY] Ask the Allies to put pressure on the League.
-[] [BALTIC] Deploy the Allied fleet to contest the eastern Baltic Sea.
-[] [MED] Ask the Allies to maintain the situation in the Mediterranean.
The idea is to go for targets they care about and build up threats towards their heartlands but aren't what they've fortified the most so they keep having to disperse their forces in defending what this threatens. It sets up for closing around Vienna in Austria and for threatening Riga in Russia.
I don't really care about the connection between both countries because I think we have the means to push on both fronts anyway so I don't think they'll have lots of opportunities to surprise us by shuffling troops around without losing more ground.
This also gives us very solid borders if we have to exit the war due to British pressure, with a complete Bohemia and a fairly defensible Poland that denies Russia a major port.
It's interesting that the only two schools of thought are "basically a normal European empire" and "insert unhinged race science". I wonder if there will be more reaction to the post war plan if we make more sister republics or if it will just be chalked up as imperialism and thus ignored as fitting the model. I could see the average British political analyst not giving our ideological motivations proper weight and seeing no difference with OTL imperial Germany's short lived eastern European empire.
Anyway, war plan.
[] Plan Keep Up The Pressure
-[] [POLAND] Initiate an offensive toward Konigsberg (Gold).
-[] [AUSTRIA] Initiate an offensive toward Brno (Gold).
-[] [ITALY] Ask the Allies to put pressure on the League.
-[] [BALTIC] Deploy the Allied fleet to contest the eastern Baltic Sea.
-[] [MED] Ask the Allies to maintain the situation in the Mediterranean.
The idea is to go for targets they care about and build up threats towards their heartlands but aren't what they've fortified the most so they keep having to disperse their forces in defending what this threatens. It sets up for closing around Vienna in Austria and for threatening Riga in Russia.
I don't really care about the connection between both countries because I think we have the means to push on both fronts anyway so I don't think they'll have lots of opportunities to surprise us by shuffling troops around without losing more ground.
This also gives us very solid borders if we have to exit the war due to British pressure, with a complete Bohemia and a fairly defensible Poland that denies Russia a major port.
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Driven by Apathy
Formerly known as Brain_Caster
As far as I can tell, Vienna is the key to Austria. Not only is it the political capital and an important military and economic center, it is also almost certainly the logistical hub for the Austrian rail network. Take Vienna, and Austria will be paralyzed. Even just surrounding Vienna would be devastating.
Therefore:
[ ] Plan Setting Up the Knockout Blow
-[] [POLAND] Reallocate troops toward the Austrian front.
-[] [AUSTRIA] Initiate an offensive toward Brno (Gold).
-[] [ITALY] Ask the Allies to put pressure on the League.
-[] [BALTIC] Deploy the Allied fleet to contest the eastern Baltic Sea.
-[] [MED] Ask the Allies to threaten the Dalmatian coast.
This would set things up for an attack on Vienna 3-6 months from now. I'd have liked to try and take Lvod too, but it seems to me that it's more important to kock Austria out of the war swiftly, and focusing more troops on the Austrian Front will hopefully help with that.
Alternatively:
[ ] Plan The Knockout Blow
-[] [POLAND] Reallocate troops toward the Austrian front.
-[] [AUSTRIA] Initiate an offensive toward Vienna (Green).
-[] [ITALY] Ask the Allies to put pressure on the League.
-[] [BALTIC] Deploy the Allied fleet to contest the eastern Baltic Sea.
-[] [MED] Ask the Allies to threaten the Dalmatian coast.
Same as above, but we go straight for the throat. I'd prefer to set things up though - Vienna is certain to be heavily defended, and if we attack from the west without first securing the region north of it, a worst case scenario might have our attacking force getting cut off by an Austrian counteroffensive from the south.
Either way, I believe our primary goal right now should be to defeat Austria. Once Austria is dealt with, our allies will be able to reinforce us without those pesky alpine defenses blocking them. At that point, Russia won't stand a chance.
Therefore:
[ ] Plan Setting Up the Knockout Blow
-[] [POLAND] Reallocate troops toward the Austrian front.
-[] [AUSTRIA] Initiate an offensive toward Brno (Gold).
-[] [ITALY] Ask the Allies to put pressure on the League.
-[] [BALTIC] Deploy the Allied fleet to contest the eastern Baltic Sea.
-[] [MED] Ask the Allies to threaten the Dalmatian coast.
This would set things up for an attack on Vienna 3-6 months from now. I'd have liked to try and take Lvod too, but it seems to me that it's more important to kock Austria out of the war swiftly, and focusing more troops on the Austrian Front will hopefully help with that.
Alternatively:
[ ] Plan The Knockout Blow
-[] [POLAND] Reallocate troops toward the Austrian front.
-[] [AUSTRIA] Initiate an offensive toward Vienna (Green).
-[] [ITALY] Ask the Allies to put pressure on the League.
-[] [BALTIC] Deploy the Allied fleet to contest the eastern Baltic Sea.
-[] [MED] Ask the Allies to threaten the Dalmatian coast.
Same as above, but we go straight for the throat. I'd prefer to set things up though - Vienna is certain to be heavily defended, and if we attack from the west without first securing the region north of it, a worst case scenario might have our attacking force getting cut off by an Austrian counteroffensive from the south.
Either way, I believe our primary goal right now should be to defeat Austria. Once Austria is dealt with, our allies will be able to reinforce us without those pesky alpine defenses blocking them. At that point, Russia won't stand a chance.
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I think you're making a mistake in overlooking Klagenfurt, @Driven by Apathy. It's called out as risky, but if we reallocate troops from Poland then even in the worst possible case(if Austria pulled all of their armies out of the Alps to hit us) we'd be outnumbered by 2 million or less, and most of those would be totally green conscripts.
Of course, Austria can't actually do that. Threatening the Dalmatian coast will naturally pull some troops away, and those that remain in the Alps will face a dedicated offensive from an Italian and Spanish force that outnumbers them almost two to one. They absolutely will not be able to spare enough troops to effectively pry us out of the city.
So we'd actually be facing a rough equivalence in total numbers with many of the Austrian's troops being unreliable. I am totally confident in being able to hold the city in those conditions—its honestly better odds than we had in Prague.
And, if we succeed, we are likely to utterly destroy the Austrian forces in the Alps. We'd be sitting right on their line of resupply and retreat, and they won't have factories to resupply themselves with like the armies we trapped in Prague. They can't help but crumble under those conditions. The single best thing we can do to weaken Vienna this turn is going to be capturing another few million Austrians, and Klagenfurt is the way to do that.
Of course, Austria can't actually do that. Threatening the Dalmatian coast will naturally pull some troops away, and those that remain in the Alps will face a dedicated offensive from an Italian and Spanish force that outnumbers them almost two to one. They absolutely will not be able to spare enough troops to effectively pry us out of the city.
So we'd actually be facing a rough equivalence in total numbers with many of the Austrian's troops being unreliable. I am totally confident in being able to hold the city in those conditions—its honestly better odds than we had in Prague.
And, if we succeed, we are likely to utterly destroy the Austrian forces in the Alps. We'd be sitting right on their line of resupply and retreat, and they won't have factories to resupply themselves with like the armies we trapped in Prague. They can't help but crumble under those conditions. The single best thing we can do to weaken Vienna this turn is going to be capturing another few million Austrians, and Klagenfurt is the way to do that.
Shadows
Sacred Priestess of the Benevolent Dice Gods
- Location
- USS Civilian, DDG-214
- Pronouns
- She/Her
[] Plan: Operation Mousetrap
-[] [POLAND] Reallocate troops toward the Austrian front.
-[] [AUSTRIA] Initiate an offensive toward Klagenfurt (Red).
-[] [ITALY] Ask the Allies to initiate a full offensive.
-[] [BALTIC] Deploy the Allied fleet to contest the eastern Baltic Sea.
-[] [MED] Ask the Allies to threaten the Dalmatian coast.
This is the only plan worth voting for, IMO. Crack open 3 million fresh, well trained troops for the war effort and drown the Habsburgs in shells in the fall.
-[] [POLAND] Reallocate troops toward the Austrian front.
-[] [AUSTRIA] Initiate an offensive toward Klagenfurt (Red).
-[] [ITALY] Ask the Allies to initiate a full offensive.
-[] [BALTIC] Deploy the Allied fleet to contest the eastern Baltic Sea.
-[] [MED] Ask the Allies to threaten the Dalmatian coast.
This is the only plan worth voting for, IMO. Crack open 3 million fresh, well trained troops for the war effort and drown the Habsburgs in shells in the fall.
Driven by Apathy
Formerly known as Brain_Caster
It's not a bad move, certainly. If it succeeds, it's a massive victory for us. What concerns me, however, is the potential for disaster if it fails.
Admittedly, Plan The Knockout Blow could also end quite painfully if things go poorly. War is inherently risky and I'm somewhat risk-averse, so I never don't have any reservations about any war plan. Since this vote uses approval voting, I'll probably vote for any plan that endorses an "Austria First" strategy and takes concerted action to put pressure on Austria from as many directions as possible.
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Shadows
Sacred Priestess of the Benevolent Dice Gods
- Location
- USS Civilian, DDG-214
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Astra Myst
Do you want a wish?
- Location
- Milky Way Galaxy
- Pronouns
- Femhon/Boymoder
[] Plan: Operation Mousetrap
-[] [POLAND] Reallocate troops toward the Austrian front.
-[] [AUSTRIA] Initiate an offensive toward Klagenfurt (Red).
-[] [ITALY] Ask the Allies to initiate a full offensive.
-[] [BALTIC] Deploy the Allied fleet to contest the eastern Baltic Sea.
-[] [MED] Ask the Allies to threaten the Dalmatian coast.
-[] [POLAND] Reallocate troops toward the Austrian front.
-[] [AUSTRIA] Initiate an offensive toward Klagenfurt (Red).
-[] [ITALY] Ask the Allies to initiate a full offensive.
-[] [BALTIC] Deploy the Allied fleet to contest the eastern Baltic Sea.
-[] [MED] Ask the Allies to threaten the Dalmatian coast.
Driven by Apathy
Formerly known as Brain_Caster
Heh. Thanks for pointing that out. Edited.Quite the plan name!
Not the kind of competition I'm trying to get into with the Austrians, though I certainly hope we'll leave them feeling inadequate afterwards.
[] Plan Keep Up The Pressure
-[] [POLAND] Initiate an offensive toward Konigsberg (Gold).
-[] [AUSTRIA] Initiate an offensive toward Brno (Gold).
-[] [ITALY] Ask the Allies to put pressure on the League.
-[] [BALTIC] Deploy the Allied fleet to contest the eastern Baltic Sea.
-[] [MED] Ask the Allies to maintain the situation in the Mediterranean.
Im in favor of this but i don't think going on the offense in both austria and poland will get us the bread so maybe staying on defense in austria is better
[] Plan Keep Up a bit of Pressure
-[] [POLAND] Initiate an offensive toward Konigsberg (Gold).
-[] [AUSTRIA] strengthen the deffense in austria.
-[] [ITALY] Ask the Allies to put pressure on the League.
-[] [BALTIC] Deploy the Allied fleet to contest the eastern Baltic Sea.
-[] [MED] Ask the Allies to maintain the situation in the Mediterranean
-[] [POLAND] Initiate an offensive toward Konigsberg (Gold).
-[] [AUSTRIA] Initiate an offensive toward Brno (Gold).
-[] [ITALY] Ask the Allies to put pressure on the League.
-[] [BALTIC] Deploy the Allied fleet to contest the eastern Baltic Sea.
-[] [MED] Ask the Allies to maintain the situation in the Mediterranean.
Im in favor of this but i don't think going on the offense in both austria and poland will get us the bread so maybe staying on defense in austria is better
[] Plan Keep Up a bit of Pressure
-[] [POLAND] Initiate an offensive toward Konigsberg (Gold).
-[] [AUSTRIA] strengthen the deffense in austria.
-[] [ITALY] Ask the Allies to put pressure on the League.
-[] [BALTIC] Deploy the Allied fleet to contest the eastern Baltic Sea.
-[] [MED] Ask the Allies to maintain the situation in the Mediterranean
- Location
- USA
Russia is, sadly, likely out of our reach for this war.
Vienna, however, is one leisurely boat ride down the Danube...
Godwinson
"Well, I've got nothing."
That's the ideal scenario from smacking them hard enough. There's various "acceptable" conditions below that point. "Knock loose Poland and Bohemia and nothing else is done besides" is the line for this war being a failure -- we have to do better than that much, otherwise we are comprehensively fucked in about 20 years when the next war is against the four empires around us (Britain, France, Austria, Russia).