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Springtime of Nations II: A European Republic Quest

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BoredStudent1414 said:
I favor a lenient peace for Denmark and the other Nordic countries to allow greater freedom from the Entente for Germany to reshape Central and Eastern Europe. The Nordic countries lack the strength to truly threaten Germany and its allies even when united together in a Scandinavian union and in an alliance with great powers hostile to Germany as shown by this war. A Finlandized neutral Denmark and a Scandinavia also Finlandized or even just knocked out of the Imperial League is enough to protect Germany's northern border. Taking down or significantly weakening the Hapsburg and Russian Empires as much as possible should be the goal for this war. Entente diplomatic intervention must be delayed as long as possible.
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Personally I'm not willing to give up Denmark. Maintaining control over it gives us the permanent ability to close the Oresund and cut off Russia from British support if and when we have to fight Russia and the Entente in the next war. That said, I don't really care about keeping Scandinavia neutral. Sweden and Norway are never really going to be in a position to threaten us—our strength in the Baltic is only going to grow from here.
 
Fission Battery said:
There's no point nabbing the colonies. We can't defend them, it burns through goodwill, and they'll ultimately get occupied by the Entente when we go to war, or end up occupied by America to protect them. I'd love to include them too but it's not in the cards right now. We need a freer hand in Austria, so keeping the Entente happy as an observer is important. They need to think we're going to be reasonable when we carve up Eastern Europe into sister republics.
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I move we retitle every Radical platform in the future of this thread "But What About Iceland" until the global republic is achieved.
 
Zimmerwald1915 said:
If Britain can intervene, militarily or otherwise, in Danish domestic politics, so can we. And we win that contest. And any number of ostensibly neutral powers participate in our institutions, including but not limited to the USA and the Latin American republics.

But I don't think "politically neutral" means anything in regards to the Danish constitution. I think it refers to bloc alignment short of military commitment. @Etranger ?
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"Neutrality" means foreswearing any participation in current or future military conflicts or military alliances. It could also be argued (read: will be argued by the other side) to apply to things like customs unions or other forms of membership in economic or political blocs. It's purely about international affairs, not domestic politics (except insofar as it limits how much domestic politics can impact international affairs).

This might prevent them from joining the Council for Economic Integration, for instance, but not necessarily from benefiting from other more limited agreements with Germany on a bilateral basis.
 
Etranger said:
It's purely about international affairs, not domestic politics (except insofar as it limits how much domestic politics can impact international affairs).
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Thank you.

Now, can we please stop assuming that only imposing a long occupation on Denmark will be the only way it will ever see a reconstruction?
 
[] Plan Acting Too Greedy
-[] Denmark and its overseas territories shall remain under Allied control.
-[] Scandinavia must be dissolved.
-[] Scandinavia must pay severe reparations.
 
If our plan is to try and keep the Entente from interfering too heavily in Austria or Poland up until we defeat the League, I think the point they'll focus on the most is the first one. They'll frown very heavily on us overtly reorganizing Denmark as a sister republic and it will definitely signal to them that we intend to do the same in the east.
 
-[] Denmark and its overseas territories shall remain under Allied control.

This is a must, I will not abandon Greenland and Iceland to the capitalists, and any suggestion to do so is simply the modern face of those who had us abandon Poland so long ago
 
Zimmerwald1915 said:
Thank you.

Now, can we please stop assuming that only imposing a long occupation on Denmark will be the only way it will ever see a reconstruction?
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It being very easy to argue against participation in even the non military parts of our bloc is unacceptable to me. Denmark should be a sister republic with all the rights to join us in building a socialist future.

Nothing in this says that Denmark will see a reconstruction if we let it go now either.

Actually @Etranger do we have some data on how well the Danish republicans are doing right now? Are they likely to be able to keep on top by themselves if our army withdraw when we sign the treaty?
 
Having Greenland and Iceland as a revolutionary sister republic sounds good ngl, it puts pressure to the British by having a potential front from the North Sea. and also the potential for oversea North Sea oil
 
Greenland and Iceland are tiny, lmao. They're so small that there's absolutely no way they can maintain their independence without a literal Alliance fleet anchoring outside their shores.

Like, I can respect the argument from principle, but let's not pretend that getting Iceland and Greenland would represent some great geopolitical coup on our part. Scandinavia in general is a sideshow and their overseas holdings are sideshows to even that.
 
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Fakkk said:
Having Greenland and Iceland as a revolutionary sister republic sounds good ngl, it puts pressure to the British by having a potential front from the North Sea. and also the potential for oversea North Sea oil
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There's no possible scenario where this doesn't piss off the British immediately, a hostile Iceland is just way too great a threat to them for them to accept. Worse, we have nowhere near the navy needed to actually hold on to those territories if Britain wants to take them, so we'd be pissing them off for no reason and to benefit nobody.

We also need to remember that Denmark's colonies are like 100,000 people compared to the tens of millions in Austria and Poland. The longer we can keep the entente happy, the more people we can liberate from absolutism.
 
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Random Member said:
@Etranger Wouldn't Finland get immediately absorbed by Russia, since it's supposed to be co-run by the King of Sweden and the Tsar or something iirc?
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Even if that's not official, in practice unlike we totally break Russia, that's likely.

A neutralized Scandinavia is probably a better prospect for the Finns than this is. The main winner is Norway.
 
I think people are forgetting that in the realpolitik plan that I made and someone else wrote from first principles, the Entente actually thinks we're Wise Elder Statesmen because we end with +2 leverage after taking the entire Danish crown. Which, we should do.

Even if we can't keep the islands in a war with the Entente, better for them to spend the years of peace living free than under someone else's boot. And honestly, demanding neutrality and reparations is.... not worth it. I don't really care about the former and the latter will only bring harm to the common people.
 
grimely said:
I think people are forgetting that in the realpolitik plan that I made and someone else wrote from first principles, the Entente actually thinks we're Wise Elder Statesmen because we end with +2 leverage after taking the entire Danish crown. Which, we should do.

Even if we can't keep the islands in a war with the Entente, better for them to spend the years of peace living free than under someone else's boot. And honestly, demanding neutrality and reparations is.... not worth it. I don't really care about the former and the latter will only bring harm to the common people.
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Why don't you care about neutrality? Scandinavia not going back to aligning with Russia or shifting to Britain is very important for us if we want to keep the Baltic safe, which will free up our attention.

No one is really advocating for reparations so I'll grant you that one.
 
I'm fully behind this

[] Plan: Baltic Gate (1 Leverage)
-[] Denmark shall remain under Allied control.
-[] Scandinavia must be made to accept neutrality.
-[] Scandinavia does not have to pay reparations.

With all of our minority rights i don't think there will be much resitance to the eventual integration into the ESR(earth socialist republik)
 
[X] Plan: Counter-Imperialism and Realpolitik
-[X] Denmark and its overseas territories shall remain under Allied control.
-[X] Scandinavia must withdraw from the Imperial League.
-[X] Scandinavia does not have to pay reparations.
 
[X] Plan: Counter-Imperialism and Realpolitik
-[X] Denmark and its overseas territories shall remain under Allied control.
-[X] Scandinavia must withdraw from the Imperial League.
-[X] Scandinavia does not have to pay reparations.
 
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