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Paths of Civilization II: Paths of Industrialization

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Marlin said:
When is polution calculated? Cause I think you're saying you weren't supposed to calculate polution this phase. We are supposed to end the phase with 4 (8) pollution. Beginning with 3 (5) pollution, according to an old post of yours.
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Nah that pollution calculation is correct. +2(2) from RDI, +0(2) from the additional 2 IC over the cap, -1(1) from the sewers.

Overall change is +1(3), so 3(5) goes to 4(8).

Pollution is solely derived from other stats, so, like happiness, it doesn't decay like a normal stat.

All this fuckery is why we have the spreadsheet :V
 
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Xepheria said:
Nah that pollution calculation is correct. +2(2) from RDI, +0(2) from the additional 2 IC over the cap, -1(1) from the sewers.

Overall change is +1(3), so 3(5) goes to 4(8).

Pollution is solely derived from other stats, so, like happiness, it doesn't decay like a normal stat.
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Whoms't must I beat with my branch for this. THESE NUMBERS ARE AN AFFRONT TO ALL I HOLD DEAR.
 
soulcake said:

Whoms't must I beat with my branch for this. THESE NUMBERS ARE AN AFFRONT TO ALL I HOLD DEAR.
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Fear not, my leafy friend. Sewers shall become more abundant to deal with the perm pollution, and that temp pollution is only due to our currently low IC cap, which shall be boosted by RAILS.

if you really need to beat someone though, beat the walrus :V
 
Xepheria said:
Nah that pollution calculation is correct. +2(2) from RDI, +0(2) from the additional 2 IC over the cap, -1(1) from the sewers.

Overall change is +1(3), so 3(5) goes to 4(8).

Pollution is solely derived from other stats, so, like happiness, it doesn't decay like a normal stat.
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Xepheria said:
I was correct in my bugspotting.

Turns out that the total end temp consciousness was in essence adding the consciousness due to pollution at the start of the turn and at the end of the turn together, or rather, counting the pollution at the start of the turn twice.

This means that our iterated consciousness after the plan and stat regen will be 4(12) instead of 4(14).

On the downside, that means our innovation is at 6(13) instead of 6(14). On the upside, an extra point of happiness (6(6) vs 6(5)), which is a nice buffer!

Damn doublecount bugs. So bloody hard to spot
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I understood some of that, but the change to temp con from pollution is gone? Shouldn't temp con go up by one point?
 
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Marlin said:
I understood some of that, but the change to con from pollution is gone? Shouldn't con go up by one point?
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There would be a consciousness gain of 0(2) because of the additional pollution that we're getting this turn, but we lose 0(6) due to stat decay. This is the overall order of calculations:

Start: 4(16)

(16-4)/2 = 6, so lose 6 temp consciousness due to decay (ie. 0(6))

After decay: 4(10)

Parliamentary plan stat changes apply, gain 0(2) consciousness due to the additional pollution in the plan.

Final: 4(12)
 
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[X] [Parl] Parliamentary Budget 1846 (Infrastructure and Security Bill)

[X][Research1] Organic Chemistry (10/40-50?) AND Inorganic Chemistry (17/40-50?) [Science][Chemistry][Open]
-[X][Research1] Organic First
[X] [Kiel] Yes, please (-1 SoL while Five Crowns active (Kale-Yllthon line under construction or have not natively developed Steel Railroad), founds Rail Company)
[X][Research2] Breechloading Cannon (0/???) [Military][Weaponry][Open]
[X] [BS] Containment (Gives time for attempts at diplomacy and mobilization, increases risk to lowlands, gives time for the rebels to organize)

Can we please please please not jump immediately on the first offer? Hell, we won't even know what the prince is like at this point if we accept immediately; AN said that we'd need to wait and see before we'd even know what he's like rather than accepting immediately.

And I want to know what is going on with the other countries and what they might offer. Those offers might tell us a lot about their intentions and, if we get something from Hespranxer or the Black Sheep, also tell about what they think of us or what they hope to accomplish.

Also: we don't need to accept immediately. We're going to get a "pick a marriage option?" this upcoming turn, which will show us other candidates, where you can still pick the Kielmyr if you want to. We're not insulting the Kielmyr by not immediately agreeing the very first time they even floated the idea past us. (Though I am worrying that by not even looking at the others, we tell them we don't care/aren't interested at all.)

Just... guys. Can we please see what all the other nations are doing first before we agree immediately?

I want to at least find out what's going on in this area.

Or at least for Yenyna to meet the various princes and see if she clicks with any of them. Or if any of them look like budding Heroes in the future.
 
Xepheria said:
There would be a consciousness gain of 0(2) because of the additional pollution that we're getting this turn, but we lose 0(6) due to stat decay. This is the overall order of calculations:

Start: 4(16)

(16-4)/2 = 6, so lose 6 temp consciousness due to decay (ie. 0(6))

After decay: 4(10)

Parliamentary plan stat changes apply, gain 0(2) consciousness due to the additional pollution in the plan.

Final: 4(12)
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Why subtract 4?
Xepheria said:
Standard of Living 7 (17) -> 8 (14)
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Can you walk me through your simple calculation for SoL? The fact you subtracted 4 consciousness throws my mind.
 
One of the big reasons to jump on it @Garlak is specifically because it is a really good deal diplomatically, and by jumping on it now, we don't give the Sketch a chance to respond before its done. And all Sketch responses will not be something that benefits us.

It's also the foreign marriage that offers the least problems domestically, which is very important.
 
I really, really want to avoid the Husbando wars. It is much better to accept a good deal now, than it is to have to deal with threadlocks and a hubdred pages of salt in the hopes of getting a better deal later.

Especially since it doesn't seem ti be a clear idea of what a better deal (other than a personal union, which seems to be pretty unlikely) we could even want in the first place.
 
[X][Research1] Organic Chemistry (10/40-50?) AND Inorganic Chemistry (17/40-50?) [Science][Chemistry][Open]
-[X][Research1] Organic First
[X] [Kiel] Yes, please (-1 SoL while Five Crowns active (Kale-Yllthon line under construction or have not natively developed Steel Railroad), founds Rail Company)
[X][Research2] Breechloading Cannon (0/???) [Military][Weaponry][Open]
[X] [BS] Containment (Gives time for attempts at diplomacy and mobilization, increases risk to lowlands, gives time for the rebels to organize)
 
noliar said:
Hopefully the Kielmyr buy a port from the Nohon before the marriage is announced...
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Nah. We have more or less greenlit our allies to buy Hung ports so long as they keep out of the opium trade. The Kiel lands suck for Opuim production.

We are counting on being able to negotiate peaceful return of ports after Hung stabalizes. In the medium term the Saffron powers keeping the ports open is a good thing over all if we can reduce opium input. Hung warlords owning the ports won't stop the opium anyway.

You can't really stop smuggling at industrial scale at ports of entry. Too much money for bribes. You need to stop the growers.
 
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Marlin said:
Why subtract 4?
Can you walk me through your simple calculation for SoL? The fact you subtracted 4 consciousness throws my mind.
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Start: 7(17) SoL

(17-7)/2 = 5, so subtract 0(5) SoL due to decay

After decay: 7(12)

Parliamentary actions apply. We gain 1(1) SoL from perm SoL raisers, and a net +0(1) temp SoL due to the Crown Corp sale, for a total of +1(2)

Final: 8(14) SoL
 
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Sivantic said:
How much latitude do the parties have in fulfilling their Ambitions and Objectives?

Can I build an Espionage Network, just because the Liberals are already developing Industry?
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Possibly? Depends on how you sell it.

Also, I suppose I should enforce a degree of favour trading. In the plans (technically each party leader is free to do whatever they want and can gleefully stab the other party leaders in the back if they want) if any Party leader is doing an action specifically to benefit another party because of lack of resources otherwise, please actually indicate which actions those are.

mastigos said:
shouldn't this be shatteringly bad for the Sketch? Not just "depressed economy" but "what economy?". They're an island nation focused on international trade via naval power. International trade is their lifeblood
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It's actually kind of the other way around. The Sketch are hurting real bad, and as one of the premier traders their depressed demand is causing everyone else to drag. Right now there is some logic to "Strengthening the Sketch will help the Hung", if one ignores all the problems a revived Sketch would bring the Hung.
 
Academia Nut said:
It's actually kind of the other way around. The Sketch are hurting real bad, and as one of the premier traders their depressed demand is causing everyone else to drag. Right now there is some logic to "Strengthening the Sketch will help the Hung", if one ignores all the problems a revived Sketch would bring the Hung.
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I really want to poke the Sketch though.
 
Academia Nut said:
It's actually kind of the other way around. The Sketch are hurting real bad, and as one of the premier traders their depressed demand is causing everyone else to drag. Right now there is some logic to "Strengthening the Sketch will help the Hung", if one ignores all the problems a revived Sketch would bring the Hung.
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So what you're saying is that if we poke the Sketch too hard, they'll drag the Hung with them?
 
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