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Magical Girl Escalation Taylor (Worm/Nanoha)

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[X] (Epoch) Cross Fire Shoot

Basically whichever of this, Birdshot Shell, Photon Lancer Phalanx/Genocide Shift.... an AOE upgrade for his shooter spell. Might as well boost what he can already cast if he's stuck with a single spell but has A-rank power to put behind it. It also potentially combos very nicely with his Time Powers, I'd hope (basically make him go watch some of Homura's fights :p Freeze enemy while you set up multiple shooters, then speed time so they jump range right after.

[X] (Standstill) Guardian Beast

I'd had lots of ideas for how a Template would hopefully let her keep her same role, but on C-rank core and no Device I don't have much hope that she'd be effective enough even with a Ring Bind (at which point she'd be using it instead of her power, so why no device or template?). So instead lets give her a friend in advance to keep her intact until she feels comfortable with a rebrand. Beast of the Shield seems pretty obvious and necessary to her needs, even if less strong than a random.

[X] Boost Device – jewelry or ornamentation, best for support casting and healing
-[X] A bicep torc, three golden triangles looped through one another into a single piece

Basically going with a mix of "giver of rings" and valknut symbol, trying for something that goes well for a Maclibuin-buffer other than a hammer :p (though healing hammer would necessarily mean Three Stooges jokes :p )

[X] (Maclibuin) Boost Up
[X] (Maclibuin) Boosted Healing

While I'd initially thought of giving him something like Subaru's Revolver Knuckle and similar boosted-attacks, the spell he developed as his own combined with his actions in this scene (and desire to lose powers) give the impression he'd be happier in a support role rather than "controlled Brute". With a barrier jacket (I hope Boost's jacket isn't too much weaker than an Armed Device? >_> C rank anyways so eh) and other device-freebies he can hopefully pull off battlefield-healing quite nicely. And maybe Boost Up will still let him buff enough to attack on his own, if we get Tim to build him a nice Mechashift or Hard-Light weapon?
 
Silently Watches said:
That's… not how Epoch would describe himself.
I believe I've said this, but only mages with the Calamity Witch template can have Flare anything. If you mean a spell that makes the blade sharper or hit harder, please say that instead.
This is default with any Armed Device and so is not a valid spell suggestion.
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Huh. Well. Colour me an idiot, then. Time for a second set of suggestions, I guess.

[X] (Epoch) Telekinesis

[X] (Standstill) Guardian Beast

[X] Armed Device – melee weapon, best for close-range fighting
-[X] An unornamented, cruciform longsword, with a single gem in the pommel that is the main core. Name: Claiomh Solais

[X] (Maclibuin) Physical Heal
[X] (Maclibuin) Break Impulse

Basically, we give Epoch a long range manipulation and/or offensive ability in the form of TK, which can be used in innumerate ways as a big ol' attack or to create fun CC effects. Also, it's more wizard-y and, let's be honest here, just kinda cool.

Standstill, she gets a Guardian Beast. She needs a Guardian Beast. Everyone needs a Guardian Beast, and Standstill having one is basically only the next step in that plan. On a side note, we should give Vista a Guardian Beast.

Maclibuin, he gets to Deus his Vult - Physical Heal being a stand-in for the Paladin staple of Lay On Hands, and Break Impulse to represent smiting. Also, as he has an Armed Device, he gets to maintain his Brute status, though he might not be as strong as he otherwise would. Also, the device name fits two of the established naming schemes: mythological weaponry, and "[Adjective] [Noun]", as it translates to "Shining Sword". And might also be the Irish name for Excalibur.
 
[x] (Epoch) Guardian Beast: offensive
[x] (Standstill) Guardian Beast: defensive
[X] Boost Device – jewelry or ornamentation, best for support casting and healing
-[X] A bicep torc, three golden triangles looped through one another into a single piece
[x] (Maclibuin) Telekinesis
[x] (Maclibuin) Guardian Beast: Gear
Silently Watches said:
I will admit I thought people would vote to give Epoch a template,
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so did I.... only reason to go unassisted at all is to either keep him off the team, or the far out hope he starts writing his own spells like Malciburn and teaches wizardry old school.
Silently Watches said:
All the power still comes from one mage. It's why rituals fell out of favor once Devices were developed.
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This sounds like a very bad weakness and a reason for rituals to not have been developed at all. The point of them in literally every other setting ever was to increase the amount of power going through a spell beyond what one person could put out. Whether solo, as a group or evoking some-one/thing else to help.
landcollector said:
Not too invested in wanting to deal with the (former?) Adepts any further, so I'm probably skipping this one. *shrug*
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boooooo
Adhoc vote count started by Solusandra on Apr 30, 2018 at 11:26 PM, finished with 24 posts and 5 votes.
  • [X] Boost Device – jewelry or ornamentation, best for support casting and healing
    [X] (Standstill) Guardian Beast
    -[X] A bicep torc, three golden triangles looped through one another into a single piece
    [X] (Epoch) Cross Fire Shoot
    [X] (Maclibuin) Boost Up
    [X] (Maclibuin) Boosted Healing
    [X] (Epoch) Strong Shield.
    [X] (Maclibuin) Break Impulse
    [X] (Epoch) Telekinesis
    [X] (Maclibuin) Physical Heal
    -[X] An unornamented, cruciform longsword, with a single gem in the pommel that is the main core. Name: Claiomh Solais
    [X] Armed Device – melee weapon, best for close-range fighting
    [X] (Maclibuin) Teleport
    [X] (Maclibuin) Cure
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Adhoc vote count started by Solusandra on May 1, 2018 at 11:14 AM, finished with 39 posts and 11 votes.
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Hate Fish said:
Also, as he has an Armed Device, he gets to maintain his Brute status,
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Interesting that you think this would be a selling point.
Solusandra said:
This sounds like a very bad weakness and a reason for rituals to not have been developed at all. The point of them in literally every other setting ever was to increase the amount of power going through a spell beyond what one person could put out. Whether solo, as a group or evoking some-one/thing else to help.
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I know people have posted multiple clips from the show and movies, so it should be apparent that for many mages, raw power is not the issue. In fact, Hayate's canonical problem is that she has too MUCH power, to the point that she needs a lot of outside assistance just to aim some of her spells.

That's what rituals were developed to do. Give the casting mage the focus and finesse needed to make the spell do what it is supposed to do.

And if I may be so bold, most magic settings don't have high-level multidimensional mathematics and supercomputers as an integral part of their world-building, so it shouldn't come as a surprise that rituals might use a different kind of mechanic for a similar payoff in what is essentially a magical scifi series.
 
aceraptor said:
I'd say Mac should have a armed device. He's a brute cape right? He'd be the most at home up close and personal.
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Hate Fish said:
[X] (Maclibuin) Physical Heal
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I'm not the best at Nanoha lore, but looking at the general descriptions and all.... I don't think his Healing will be very good with an Armed Device? Like...arguably its the worst of the four for it, except for self-healing?

Solusandra said:
[x] (Epoch) Guardian Beast: offensive
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I recognize that you want all of the everyone's to have a Guardian Pokemon, but as much as I support for the plan for "every random nobody who is doing nothing capey with their life but happens to have a core", for actual experienced in-combat capes they need to be judged individually....

How is Epoch going to feel if, after learning that his organization was a sham and only the barest handful is left (he's huddling in their empty old base with his one teammate, adrift of purpose and too prideful? to call Calamity Witch rather than wait for her to show...thats friggin depressing already) , that because of its downsides for a parahuman he's only going to learn one more spell anytime soon (his vaunted A-core having little difference from lesser mages at that point) .... and then he goes for a Beast?
For all that Familiars are a classic for wizards.... they're usually sidekicks on top of a versatile magic user. Epoch has one (useful, adapted to variety of applications) trick in his spellbook, Shooter is a second but even with our help he's basically a babbeh sorcerer. And then we give him a Beast who will likely have more tricks than him and be a more effective fighter? xD

Epoch learned magic to gain cool new powers for himself, I don't get the impression he'll be happy (having focused on flight and fireballs) sitting back as a minion-mancer.

Solusandra said:
[x] (Maclibuin) Telekinesis
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So...for the former brute, who developed a buff/support spell as his one special trick he's focused on.... you give him battlefield control? o_O I don't see how that relates to either his past abilities or his indicated interests....its a valuable power sure, but it would be on anyone. Whats it got to do with Maclibuin?

Solusandra said:
This sounds like a very bad weakness and a reason for rituals to not have been developed at all.
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The purpose of Rituals is to provide a substitute for Devices. Its basically like saying that the flaws of horse drawn carriages are a reason to never invent them because Cars are so much better at transportation :p

For people who lack an Advanced AI to do all the processing for them (said to be the reason why Epoch would have 10 shooters with a device versus 3 unassisted, despite same core and spell) , parralell-processing with human brains is an effective substitute for those situations where its feasible to use (its likely not any worse really for things like Healing, or non-combat uses generally).
 
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Racoras said:
So...for the former brute, who developed a buff/support spell as his one special trick he's focused on.... you give him battlefield control? o_O I don't see how that relates to either his past abilities or his indicated interests....its a valuable power sure, but it would be on anyone. Whats it got to do with Maclibuin?
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For a brute who really doesn't want to be a brute, a MASSIVELY versatile utility spell that can be used offensively defensively and just for shits and giggles sounds about perfect.
Racoras said:
I recognize that you want all of the everyone's to have a Guardian Pokemon, but as much as I support for the plan for "every random nobody who is doing nothing capey with their life but happens to have a core", for actual experienced in-combat capes they need to be judged individually....
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I am taking their needs into account. They're down alot of fucking members and Malciburn specifically complained about this as a core problem for the Adepts. Two powerful magical recruits the pair of them can study and maybe learn new spells from sounds about right.

Edit: also, I voted for him to get a template. I have ABSOLUTELY NO FREAKING CLUE who so many people wanted him to go unassisted. Most of your argument against my beast vote is a pile of reasons for him to get the device.
Silently Watches said:
I know people have posted multiple clips from the show and movies, so it should be apparent that for many mages, raw power is not the issue. In fact, Hayate's canonical problem is that she has too MUCH power, to the point that she needs a lot of outside assistance just to aim some of her spells.
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aren't people with that sort power really rather rare in Nanoha though? I vaguely remember the numbers you guys keep posting, and its almost vanishingly small.
 
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Hate Fish said:
On a side note, we should give Vista a Guardian Beast.
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Already checked that. Vista has no Linker Core, so no Murdorable Beast for her.

[X] (Epoch) Cross Fire Shoot
[X] (Standstill) Guardian Beast
[X] Boost Device – jewelry or ornamentation, best for support casting and healing
-[X] A bicep torc, three golden triangles looped through one another into a single piece
[X] (Maclibuin) Boost Up
[X] (Maclibuin) Boosted Healing
 
Solusandra said:
aren't people with that sort power really rather rare in Nanoha though? I vaguely remember the numbers you guys keep posting, and its almost vanishingly small.
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At Hayate's level? Incredibly rare, once in a generation. But there was a reason I was using her as an extreme example.

If you just want to look at people who can sustain a high energy output where they would need some kind of processing assist for controlling their power, you're looking at all mages A-ranked and above easily and arguably B-rankers as well. That's 10-20% of the population.

It wouldn't necessarily be used all the time, either. Mostly when those mages were trying to perform an impressive piece of magic where the main mage could supply the power but couldn't focus it all by himself. Large destructive blasts. Summoning monsters. Crossing dimensions. Spells like that where there are a lot of details that have to be kept track of for the spell not to blow up in people's faces. Turning magic from wishes into math simplified that greatly, and then calculating aids (i.e., the precursors to modern Devices) were invented to take the role of some and later all of the participants in the ritual.

You have to understand, ritual magic is basically Stone Age methodology compared to the Space Age of Devices. It's a first step towards controlling magic.
 
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Silently Watches said:
Interesting that you think this would be a selling point.
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I think he'd like the option to choose, as choice makes all the difference in the world. And, with an Armed Device, he can toggle his strength. Also, I really want someone to be a Belkan-style fighter, damnit!

Racoras said:
I'm not the best at Nanoha lore, but looking at the general descriptions and all.... I don't think his Healing will be very good with an Armed Device? Like...arguably its the worst of the four for it, except for self-healing?
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You'd be surprised - Shamal is cannonically one of the best, if not the best healer out there, and she uses an Armed Device. Still, you raise a valid point, but to counterpoint, we want our medic to be hard to hurt, Epoch is easier to heal anyway and if Standstill is near the frontlines or the backlines are attacked something has gone horribly wrong.
 
Hate Fish said:
Shamal is cannonically one of the best, if not the best healer out there, and she uses an Armed Device
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That....is odd. Looking it up, her "armed device" is a set of Elven Rings of Power? Aaand not weapon shaped (or does she punch people?) , she primarily casts support and healing spells...lookng at the list of spells she has at all it seems the only attacks she ever uses are in the Video Games (where everything playable needs an attack as a genre-conceit) ? And unlike (most? all?) armed devices she doesn't have the ability to use Cartridges?

....Seriously, is there some requirement for Wolkenritter to only have Armed Devices, or was there some other reason I'm not getting for her not having another type xD

Hate Fish said:
I think he'd like the option to choose, as choice makes all the difference in the world.
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The reoccuring awkwardness of update/vote format, as with the Vista vote and ones in the past (like various social/patrol activities) the fact that it wins Player Vote (and was allowed at all) tends to create the state of the NPC having wanted to choose it. Much like how Lacey was disinterested in being a mage at the time in large part because Tim won the vote to get the first template.

But we can still look at events thus far and the update for a bit of evidence. If he'd wanted to just be a Brute with control over his power, Extinction Knight template should've seemed like a great choice for him right? Buuut he'd rather keep his support-spell , even at the expense of keeping cape powers he considers a detriment (he mentioned downside of uncontrolled strength, no mention of positive times he enjoyed having them) , rather than take the template..... so that to me suggests Support > Brute in his mindset.

Really, I wish we knew what Maclibuin's trigger event had been... it might give insight as to whether being a Brute suits him or was just an oddity of the circumstance (maybe Shadow Stalker would say that being one with roaches suits Taylor, but getting Skitter powers instead of Captain powers from the same shard was obviously a matter of the specific trigger-event as much as anything :p ).
 
Racoras said:
That....is odd. Looking it up, her "armed device" is a set of Elven Rings of Power? Aaand not weapon shaped (or does she punch people?) , she primarily casts support and healing spells...lookng at the list of spells she has at all it seems the only attacks she ever uses are in the Video Games (where everything playable needs an attack as a genre-conceit) ? And unlike (most? all?) armed devices she doesn't have the ability to use Cartridges?

....Seriously, is there some requirement for Wolkenritter to only have Armed Devices, or was there some other reason I'm not getting for her not having another type xD
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All the Wolkenritter are ludicrously good combattants by default, and specialise in melee. I highly doubt this is different for Shamal, and considering the only offensive spell she's ever shown using in the main continuity is a Breaker-class bombardment and she's probably as knowledgable of humanoid anatomy as anyone out there, plus with her knowledge of portals and shields, I would hesitate to challenge her to a fight.

Also, I get the feeling that, originally, the cartridge system was developed for Armed Devices only, so you'd need an Armed Device to produce them. That, plus the fact that every team needs a medic somewhere, means that an Armed Device would be necessary to provide all resource-related support on a battlefield that might not have contact to a more formal form of support.

Essentially, they just wanted to give all the Wolkenritter Armed Devices as they were the shiny new thing that season and made them stand out.

Racoras said:
But we can still look at events thus far and the update for a bit of evidence. If he'd wanted to just be a Brute with control over his power, Extinction Knight template should've seemed like a great choice for him right? Buuut he'd rather keep his support-spell , even at the expense of keeping cape powers he considers a detriment (he mentioned downside of uncontrolled strength, no mention of positive times he enjoyed having them) , rather than take the template..... so that to me suggests Support > Brute in his mindset.
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See, this is why I kinda want a Paladin-style take on it. He's already done the whole "superhuman strength" thing, so he knows the downsides, and giving him some more support-y spells (like, for example, healing) means he can fill an essential battlefield role whilst also being a decent combattant with prior experience in the style he is using.

Actually, that brings up a good point. @Silently Watches I remember vaguely you mentioning something about a ritual-version of the Guardian Beast spell that could give someone a cuddly combat pet without needing to actually teach them the spell. Is it plausible to use this to give Standstill her Guardian Beast whilst teaching her, say, Physical Healing, so she can backline much more efficiently?
 
[X] (Epoch) Telekinesis
[X] (Standstill) Guardian Beast
[X] Boost Device – jewelry or ornamentation, best for support casting and healing
-[X] A bicep torc, three golden triangles looped through one another into a single piece
[X] (Maclibuin) Boost Up
[X] (Maclibuin) Boosted Healing

Racoras said:
That....is odd. Looking it up, her "armed device" is a set of Elven Rings of Power? Aaand not weapon shaped (or does she punch people?) , she primarily casts support and healing spells...lookng at the list of spells she has at all it seems the only attacks she ever uses are in the Video Games (where everything playable needs an attack as a genre-conceit) ? And unlike (most? all?) armed devices she doesn't have the ability to use Cartridges?

....Seriously, is there some requirement for Wolkenritter to only have Armed Devices, or was there some other reason I'm not getting for her not having another type xD
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Boost Devices were not properly written in at the time mostly. But Klarwind is certainly a Belkan style Boost device even if it didn't have the name.
Device archetypes are labels like parahuman power categories are labels, they are convenient references.
Nanoha's Raising Heart is a classic Mid-Childan style Intelligent device. But after she took it to the shop it's a partial conversion Modern Belkan Armed Device(energy blade) due to the lance form Excelion Mode and the cartridge system. To be fair, Nanoha was using it as a bludgeon to begin with. Flash Impact is NOT a normal use of a staff!

Fate's Bardiche is a hybrid Intelligent/Armed Device to begin with, in its basic mode its an Old Belkan style poleaxe, which with her speed is a legitimately dangerous weapon. In it's scythe and daiklave forms, it's a Modern Belkan style energy blade weapon.

The Wolkenritter have more classic weapons for Signum and Vita, which are all enhanced mass weapons.
Hayate uses her Sword-Cross for her primary casting device because she tends to break less durable devices from overload(Armed Devices are usually much tougher), even though she's more suited to an intelligent device by style.

Teana is doing her own weirdass thing where she has a GUN for a spell focus, and it sort of acts like a Modern style Armed Device, even though she's a blaster type.

For the purpose of not giving our GM a headache, we simplify.
 
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[X] (Epoch) Ring Bind

[X] (Standstill) Guardian Beast.

[X] Boost Device – Pocket Watch
-[X] Metallic looking and rather plain, with a red jewel in the center of the clock handles.

[X] (Maclibuin) Kinetic Recursion Fields- Redistributes Kinetic impacts and nullifies damage.
[X] (Maclibuin) Slow In-Depth Healing- Has a range from minor injuries to life threatening conditions, but the time for treatment increases exponentially with the severity and complexity of the wound/ailment.
 
Hate Fish said:
Actually, that brings up a good point. Silently Watches I remember vaguely you mentioning something about a ritual-version of the Guardian Beast spell that could give someone a cuddly combat pet without needing to actually teach them the spell. Is it plausible to use this to give Standstill her Guardian Beast whilst teaching her, say, Physical Healing, so she can backline much more efficiently?
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Why can't us teaching her the spell let her be the one focusing the ritual for other people to get Guardian Beasts? I don't see why she'd be opposed to it, and they could grab some normals for the processing power if they don't have enough mages. One less thing relying entirely on Taylor, in the hands of someone we can be reasonably sure won't abuse it.
 
Dalxein said:
Why can't us teaching her the spell let her be the one focusing the ritual for other people to get Guardian Beasts? I don't see why she'd be opposed to it, and they could grab some normals for the processing power if they don't have enough mages. One less thing relying entirely on Taylor, in the hands of someone we can be reasonably sure won't abuse it.
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No, yeah, that's fair. I was more thinking of the "Device-less mages can only have X spells" limit, but us spending our time getting her a cuddly combat pet makes sense.

Which brings up a new avenue of discussion: what animal do you think she'll want?
 
@Silently Watches - if we give Maclibuin a Guardian Beast spell, is it for his personal use only or can he make them for others?

Anyway, here's plan: Helpful Beasts

[X] (Epoch) Guardian Beast (offense)
[X] (Standstill) Guardian Beast (defensive)
[X] (Maclibuin) Telekinesis
[X] (Maclibuin) Guardian Beast (support/heal)

This might not be what they'd want, but this is what they need. Someone to protect Standstill, someone with decent combat-oriented powers, and someone that can heal. With Maclibuin picking Telekinesis for versatility (he can, after all, throw just about anyone away with it).

As a reminder to others:

Telekinesis+Wide Area Search is a viable synergized combination.
The greatest problem that Adepts are now facing is that they were utterly gutted in terms of numbers following their collapse. Doubling their numbers would help with solving this problem greatly.
 
[X] (Epoch) A Bombardment spell similar to Divine Buster/Thunder Smasher and its variants
[X] (Standstill) Guardian Beast
[X] Boost Device
[X] (Maclibuin) - Boost Up
[X] (Maclibuin) - A Healing Spell

I wanted to have Epoch learn a Shield type spell since he has no device and therefore no automatic defenses but a Bombardment spell to take advantage of his A rank linker core capacity is a good idea IMO. It was either a Bombardment type spell or a Breaker type spell but I think we should not have people other than us having knowledge on breaker type spells.

@Silently Watches Do we get to set Macalibuin's automatic defense spell on his device?
 
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Hate Fish said:
On a side note, we should give Vista a Guardian Beast.
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That will be difficult, considering she's not a mage.
On the other hand, we can give her a combat pet, just like we gave her a weapon arm - with Tim's help!
Take a dog, implant a mana-reactor, telepathic radio, some weapons, apply some trainings and voila! Combat Pet is ready to serve!



...Nothing can possibly go wrong.


[X] (Epoch) Telekinesis
[X] (Standstill) Guardian Beast
[X] Boost Device – jewelry or ornamentation, best for support casting and healing
-[X] A bicep torc, three golden triangles looped through one another into a single piece
[X] (Maclibuin) Boost Up
[X] (Maclibuin) Boosted Healing

Not sure about Epoch's spell.
Bombardment spell has its merits, but Adepts has nothing to counter collateral damage.
Upgrade for Shooter gives additional firepower, but make Epoch less versatile.
 
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Hate Fish said:
Actually, that brings up a good point. @Silently Watches I remember vaguely you mentioning something about a ritual-version of the Guardian Beast spell that could give someone a cuddly combat pet without needing to actually teach them the spell. Is it plausible to use this to give Standstill her Guardian Beast whilst teaching her, say, Physical Healing, so she can backline much more efficiently?
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Unfortunately not.
Silently Watches said:
«Linker Core of Standstill strong enough to create and support Guardian Beast. Not strong enough to perform other spells should she do so without Device to maximize efficiency of spellcasting.»
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.
Faraway-R said:
@Silently Watches - if we give Maclibuin a Guardian Beast spell, is it for his personal use only or can he make them for others?
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He's the one the Guardian Beast would be bonded to. The GB could certainly be helpful to other people, but making familiars/GBs is a very personal process.
Windward said:
@Silently Watches Do we get to set Macalibuin's automatic defense spell on his device?
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No.
Windward said:
I wanted to have Epoch learn a Shield type spell since he has no device and therefore no automatic defenses but a Bombardment spell to take advantage of his A rank linker core capacity is a good idea IMO. It was either a Bombardment type spell or a Breaker type spell but I think we should not have people other than us having knowledge on breaker type spells.
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Well, he would need to be AA-rank to learn a Breaker anyway, so that's not's a problem.
 
[X] (Epoch) Telekinesis
[X] (Standstill) Guardian Beast
[X] Boost Device – jewelry or ornamentation, best for support casting and healing
-[X] A bicep torc, three golden triangles looped through one another into a single piece
[X] (Maclibuin) Boost Up
[X] (Maclibuin) Boosted Healing
 
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