Too be fair these are chaos marines
Most of the stuff is probably tainted
Loyalty is its own Reward (A Traitor Legion Chapter Master Quest)
- Thread starter ThunderOwl
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Most of the stuff is probably tainted
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- The internet
While true, Space Marine's seem to usually be more worried by personnel attrition than equipment losses.
Don't get me wrong, we should be looting every spaceship we can possibly get away with nicking, and land raiders or Sicarius should be difficult to acquire, but getting a halfway decent complement of predator tanks shouldn't be an impossible dream.
Nicholas Brooks
Redeemer and Destroyer
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- United States
For that I understand though I'd like to at least roll for anything where it's light enough to be purified. But this problem applies to Orks and conventional traitors too.
Noroboro
Consistency is key and I’m consistently tired :)
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Well fuck me, loosing the Shrouded Blade is really going to sting. We seriously need escorts and pronto. It's also painful that we couldn't figure out what the EotM were doing but that's just how the rolls are sometimes. At least they lost their strike cruiser and didn't escape with whatever they were doing on that station.
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We do have the option to start building forges or at least have the opportunity to unlock that fairly soon if we focus on it. At this point I think its needed.
If we lose, it should be because we did our best and it wasn't good enough.
So when we try to figure out what went wrong and how to do it better, whether that be improving our own actions or asking the QM about what is and is not possible to do better, it's kind of a real cunt move to say "Don't bother trying, you're going to fail anyway".
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I mean we were in a pretty even fight. So the fact that it was a pyrrhic victory is understandable.
Night_stalker
Slava Ukraini!
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More or less this. Anything left is super tainted or not worth salvaging.
I don't have any issues with that, though losing a ship when we have no current means of resupply sticks in my craw.
I have a major issue with what appears to be plain old nihilism insisting that slow, almost guaranteed failure is the way a 40k quest MUST play out. Because far too often that insistence on "Any victory must be hard-won" slides into "We can't currently see how to get a victory from where we are, so we're not even going to bother to try."
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Sigh, and there went on of our only ships we possibly had in our position, while we have just everyone fucking up their rolls the entire turn. Looks like we are going to be heavily indebted to space navy forge world, because god damn we lost a fifth of our navy, we are constantly losing any and all armour we get, and we are starting to suffer casualties amongst our specialists.
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Well that got to suck for Dragomir. You were only gone for five years and now your brother is a dirty chaos cultist.
Besides that ow we are just constantly fuck when it comes to equipment.
Pretty sure that both Forges can provide ships. It's just that one is better at it than the other.
Nicholas Brooks
Redeemer and Destroyer
- Location
- United States
It does matter when said downside includes "the other guys will try to blow up the ship you just bought". Unless we've got an outstanding reputation with the sector's major players, we won't be able to get rid of this major danger without also being essentially the servant of the Forge World we buy our shit from.
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In the face of lacking an effective fleet and having a shrinking vehicle park. No it doesn't matter. We need to commit. And do it immediately. We aren't going to stop the wasting away of our chapter assets otherwise. Hoping for loot is foolish.
Especially when after several Ork washes we've beaten, we have never gotten any loot before in the first place. And since I doubt that's likely ever going to happen, we need to take the bullet and commit to a forge world to supply us before we die a painful death bled by a thousand tiny cuts and a hundred bad rolls.
Nicholas Brooks
Redeemer and Destroyer
- Location
- United States
It doesn't and we don't. The attrition we're taking now would just get worse if on top of that we also have a Forge World trying to destroy us because we're buddy buddy with their rival.
Edit: And I'm not hoping for loot. I was expressing disappointment and annoyance that we weren't getting any, not saying "Oh but next time for sure."
One is just a tad more speedy than the others.
While the loss of a Strike Cruiser sucks, we almost got one of our named characters corrupted. Which could have hurt us considerable worse than the loss of a cruiser.
Maybe a way to differentiate between mission killed and destroyed would work?
In the Angels of Death Prequel (it´s free to watch on GW´s youtube channel, go watch it, it´s actually quite good!) the Sword of Baal ends up pretty much mission killed, with most of the crew dead, but the ship itself is repairable.
But that would require that enemies and allies stop shooting at a ship that seems dead in space. Maybe a roll if they continue firing or switch targets?
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You are immediately assuming the Forge World would choose to make an enemy of a Space Marine Chapter via dire sabotage.
That would no longer make it an internal spat between the semi-independent Forge Worlds, it would be a treasonous action that would gain them the full fury of the Inquisition that sponsors us and the Sector government for escalating tensions.
These Forge words also supply the other arms of the Imperial warmachine in the region. If one of them so openly attacks an arm of that machine it invites censure, blockade and escalating violence in return.
Nicholas Brooks
Redeemer and Destroyer
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- United States
My dude, they literally do that. This is from turn 2.
Now admittedly the Luctusians were not Astartes, but to say that these guys wouldn't do something like that is objectively wrong. But then again, they don't have to do it personally either. They could just use a proxy or several instead to save face.
I'm not against getting our fleet bulked up by one of them on occasion, but your plan of committing to one completely pretty much guarantees we'd be dealing with all kinds of bullshit from the other.
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ConfusedCanuck
Where did it all go wrong?
- Location
- Neverland
I'm gonna be honest I don't like how easy it was too lose one of our very hard to replace ships like as others have said you seriously need to relook at how you balance things when involving equipment, vehicles and ships cause this rate of loss is insane for us and not sustainable long term I feel. We simply can't keep up with repairing and building new combat vehicles let alone our fleet where we lost one of our strikes cruisers we can't currently replace not even touching the fact we still haven't gotten access to escorts.
My sincere suggestion is you rework this part in some way else battle damage and losses will acuminate till a point we have little to nothing left especially ship wise or constantly stuck trying to replace loss's with our too few BP. And for that matter Strike Cruisers and Battle Barges should be a lot more tougher then this given there role of carrying SM into fights and planetary bombardment which they specialize in, I feel in the above scene the Strike Cruiser on both sides died to easily.
I would say having an option to salvage the battle and potentially bring our Strike Cruiser in for a rebuild in a yard should be an option for sure, it's common enough in lore as well.
Edit: For Forge World talk I have been saying we need to talk to the guys that do ships for several turns now regardless of the consequences we need ships now not later as we try to work some fancy solution to make both Forge Worlds to like us. We need to pick one and deal with it, and if one is dumb enough to attack us over us getting supply's to uphold our duties then they can get censured by Sector authority and the Inquisition along with us showing why that's a bad idea to involve a Space Marines into there feud when we're happy to stay out of it and mind our own business.
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I'm actually thinking we go with Smilnay instead. Attacking an Astartes Chapter would be a very bad idea, for both the reasons you mentioned and the fact that Astartes are very good at violence. What I am concerned with is the possibility of them performing subtler moves.
Both Forge Worlds have a ton of pull with the fighting forces of the Imperium. Milan handles the Navy and Smilnay the Guard. They could deprioritize requests from those individuals in said organizations who work with us, tanking our ability to work together. We rely more on the Guard than the Navy, so Smilnay it is.
Alternatively, we could hit up a Hive World and ask them for some BP. Might not be able to get a full Strike Cruiser, but just some Escorts should help us from falling too deeply in the camp of one side or the other.
ConfusedCanuck
Where did it all go wrong?
- Location
- Neverland
At this point I do not care which Forge World we go to as long as we can get ships to replace our losses and gain escorts I will be happy but we must choose either way and not sit on the fence.
And I do not think the Hive World idea will work given most of there spare BP is most likely sent/spent towards the Tithes.