Loyalty is its own Reward (A Traitor Legion Chapter Master Quest)

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Speaking of Volkite has Karark Zel taught any of our tech marines how to make them or anything else they were not taught on Mars?
Both Volkites in the equipment tab say, (Requires Great Crusade-Era Techmarine), and there was a mention in the relevant chapter that the newbies were not taught on Mars.

So at some point we need to spend a Turn action to have Karark teach all the current crop of Techmarines how to make one.
 
Ah I see. @ThunderOwl Theoretically speaking, what sort of stuff could we trade Volkites for ? Favors or STC of equal value ?
Both of the Forge worlds would basically give you a blank check for the technology and it would boost their relationship a lot. The problem is that however you didn´t give that technology (Or gave it second) would probably do something drastic.
Also, once the orbital docks are built, could Karak Zel build great crusade era escorts ?
Karark Zel lacks the knowledge for that.
 
Both of the Forge worlds would basically give you a blank check for the technology and it would boost their relationship a lot. The problem is that however you didn´t give that technology (Or gave it second) would probably do something drastic.
About what I expected. If/when we release the technology to the Two Twatworlds, we must give it to both if we want to prevent antipathy from turning to outright hatred.
 
we must give it to both if we want to prevent antipathy from turning to outright hatred.
We are already suding with Smilnay. There's no point in giving it to Milan. They will hate us anyway. Better to improve the relationship and stabding of the one we are actually working with and let them subsume Milan somewhere down the road.

Otherwise you are just prolonging the conflict between the two Forge Worlds.

This here:
Both Forgeworlds were specialiced in the production of Volkite weaponry, with Milan producing the lighter variants and Smilnay the more heavier ones.
[...]

Once the traitors were repelled, it was discovered one of the Forge worlds blueprints for the Volkite weapons had been destroyed during the fighting.

Fearful of falling under the authority of the Forge World that still had theirs, an Arch-magos of that world staged a theft of the blueprints, but they were found out by the skitarii guarding them and they were destroyed during the subsequent fighting.
Returning the Volkite data to one of them (Smilnay) will increase their prestige and popularity to the point where they will gradually subsume the other after some time (Decades? Centuries?).

Best case we get the Milan dockyards in the long run as well. At the very least it would set a definitive end point on this particular conflict within the sector and ends another inter-faction conflict.

Sometimes you can't please everyone and trying it just makes them distrust you. That goes ten-times for everything Warhammer related.
 
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We are already suding with Smilnay. There's no point in giving it to Milan. They will hate us anyway. Better to improve the relationship and stabding of the one we are actually working with and let them subsume Milan somewhere down the road.

Otherwise you are just prolonging the conflict between the two Forge Worlds.
Or, we can...just not...follow in the footsteps of that shitbag Curze and deal with all annoying social situations like they are moles to be whacked.

Seriously, do you really believe there is no possible fucking way we can leverage the act of giving them exactly what they've wanted so badly for 10k years they've been willing to kill for it...into calming their tits just a little bit?
 
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Seriously, do you really believe there is no possible fucking way we can leverage the act of giving them exactly what they've wanted so badly for 10k years they've been willing to kill for it...into calming their tits just a little bit?
Looks at Warhammer 40k

Looks at the kind of grudges they hold


They are more likely to use their new weapons to fight each other. If we are lucky they will just ignore each other.

Most likely case? Milan still won't like us, since we favor Smilnay and Smilnay favor will go down because we helped their enemies. Not sure why you are bringing Konrad into this, because that guy would take the Volkites, keep them and kill both for the lolz.

So yeah. Make sure one can take over the other to end the conflict in the most effective manner. It's not even amoral or weird or anything. It's the path of least collateral damage imo.

Helping both mostly means nobody is happy. Then they will just try to make sure the other side doesn't have it anymore, so that they can take over.

Honestly? I believe we are doing the Sector a favor by siding with one of them.
 
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Looks at Warhammer 40k

Looks at the kind of grudges they hold


They are more likely to use their new weapons to fight each other. If we are lucky they will just ignore each other.

Most likely case? Milan still won't like us, since we favor Smilnay and Smilnay favor will go down because we helped their enemies. Not sure why you are bringing Konrad into this, because that guy would take the Volkites, keep them and kill both for the lolz.

So yeah. Make sure one can take over the other to end the conflict in the most effective manner. It's not even amoral or weird or anything. It's the path of the least collateral damage.

Helping both mostly means nobody is happy. Then they will just try to make sure the other side doesn't have it anymore, so that they can take over.
This whole screed? This is why I'm bringing Curze into it.

Because your proposed solution to this disagreement, in the middle of;
at least one chapter of Chaos Marines
A major pirate fleet
Assorted xenos infestations and petty revolts
a planet-wide Genestealer rebellion in the Sector Capital
and being told that the entire sector is stretched thin

Is to leverage your tech advantage into stoking a war between
the two major forge worlds in the area. Said forge worlds being very notable major suppliers to the Imperial Guard and Navy, among others.

And you seriously have the gall to say that fucking the war logistics for a huge portion of the sector and crippling uncounted trillions of people's ability to supply and defend themselves is "not even amoral or weird or anything". Which is doubly preposterous given some of the in-character statements some of our Chapter leadership has made in previous updates.

Why?

Because you can't be bothered to even attempt diplomacy, writing it off as impossible before you've even tried, despite the QM telling you that giving the belligerents Volkite tech is the next best thing to a blank check we can get out of them.

You are not notably separating yourself from Curze methodology just because you put a couple orders of separation between yourself and the brutality you've created.
 
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Wow man.

Maybe calm down a little? We can always discuss things in a civil manner without getting aggressive or personal.

I simply hold a different point of view than you.

Warhammer 40k factions tend to be extremely aggressive in their interactions and hold long grudges. In this case a grudge that went on for several thousand years and included multiple wars.

Before accusing me of murderous or maniacal intentions, I would prefer if you read where I'm coming from.

I simply don't believe that they won't escalate at some point and that a swift end to hostilities would be more beneficial to the sector in the long term than hoping that nothing goes wrong.

You're allowed to disagree with that. That's fair.

But at least have the good grace of coming into this argument with the stance that we all wish for success for our Chapter and the Sector. We just have different ways of doing it.

So stuff like this:

You are not notably separating yourself from Curze methodology just because you put a couple orders of separation between yourself and the brutality you've created.
Because you can't be bothered to even attempt diplomacy, writing it off as impossible before you've even tried,
And you seriously have the gall to say
Is just weirdly personal imo.

You can make your points without accusing me of not caring about imminent war.

I'm also not accusing you of causing another that destroys production facilities and lifes.

I said:
Then they will just try to make sure the other side doesn't have it anymore, so that they can take over.
They are more likely to use their new weapons to fight each other. If we are lucky they will just ignore each other.
That it might cause certain issues. Even used "likely" in the other because it's not a certainty.


I never insulted you. Simply hold a different opinion.
 
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[X] Plan Death To The Alien
-[X] Call for the Order of the Thorned Spear to join the Mist Shrikes in crushing the Genestealer uprising on Lezo
-[X] Request Lord Admiral Adherbal send a battlegroup to Zatloczony Tertius to bring the attacking Eldar ships to heel
-[X] Tell Lord General Tavisolta to send reinforcements to Lezo, and only if there are still men to spare after the mustering for the Sector Capital, send some to Faisal and Seibourc
Any chance we can get the Angels Crusader in on this? Fighting alongside each other is a good way to improve relations, and I want to do as much of that as possible before Gerard de Lusignan takes over from Baldwin.
 
Any chance we can get the Angels Crusader in on this? Fighting alongside each other is a good way to improve relations, and I want to do as much of that as possible before Gerard de Lusignan takes over from Baldwin.
You can try, but with you deciding not to send anyone to the First and Fifteenth Deployment options, there is going to be a malus in asking that. On the other side, you can ask people to send them assistance, if you want to foster the spirit of jolly cooperation.
 
This whole screed? This is why I'm bringing Curze into it.

Because your proposed solution to this disagreement, in the middle of;
at least one chapter of Chaos Marines
A major pirate fleet
Assorted xenos infestations and petty revolts
a planet-wide Genestealer rebellion in the Sector Capital
and being told that the entire sector is stretched thin
Um you do know we can WAIT right? Don't think anyone was actually proposing we give it out right this moment. We kept it a secret for seven turns already which is like 35 years it can wait a few more decades.
 
Warhammer 40k factions tend to be extremely aggressive in their interactions and hold long grudges. In this case a grudge that went on for several thousand years and included multiple wars.

Before accusing me of murderous or maniacal intentions, I would prefer if you read where I'm coming from.

I simply don't believe that they won't escalate at some point and that a swift end to hostilities would be more beneficial to the sector in the long term than hoping that nothing goes wrong.
I legitimately don't see how it could escalate to any significant degree at this point in time. Tech priests from the opposing worlds literally kill each other on sight. I suppose they could attack other Imperial factions that do business with their rival, but that would lead to severe retaliation by the other factions in the Sector. It's stayed at this level for millennia. Why should it change now?
 
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You can try, but with you deciding not to send anyone to the First and Fifteenth Deployment options, there is going to be a malus in asking that. On the other side, you can ask people to send them assistance, if you want to foster the spirit of jolly cooperation.
Assuming of course that they're not fighting the Thousand Sons for any sus reasons... such as wanting to interrogate a sorcerer for information about the Fallen.
 
Um you do know we can WAIT right? Don't think anyone was actually proposing we give it out right this moment. We kept it a secret for seven turns already which is like 35 years it can wait a few more decades.
Or we just... don't? Volkites are nice but they're not suddenly going to make one Forge World start winning against the other, regardless of whether or not the Aetelian Sector is completely peaceful. What it will do is probably make the cold war between Smilnay and Milan go completely hot, and that will probably cause horrific damage not just to one another but to the entire Sector as they call in all kinds of favors and allies against one another. And the guys who gave one Forge World access to Volkite technology (that's us) will probably be specifically targeted by the other as a punitive measure.
I legitimately don't see how it could escalate to any significant degree at this point in time. Tech priests from the opposing worlds literally kill each other on sight. I suppose they could attack other Imperial factions that do business with their rival, but that would lead to severe retaliation by the other factions in the Sector. It's stayed at this level for millennia. Why should it change now?
It would probably change if suddenly Volkite tech, which is the thing this whole feud started over, was accessible again to one or the other. But so long as we keep our mouths shut, it's unlikely that we'll have to deal with a full blown Aetelian Sector civil war or something.
 
Or we just... don't?
Also an option. We just have to keep in mind that we more or less already picked a side once this turn is over. This gives Smilnay a political advantage within the sector and in regards to whatever politics are played within the AdMech.

The most annoying case I could imagine would be the Ecclesiarchy siding with Milan, who would certainly accept the offer to deny Smilnay any political advantage over them.

This would give us the following "factions:"

Smilnay, Mist Shrikes and the Imperial Guard

And on the other hand...

Milan, the Ecclesiarchy (maybe) and the Navy (big "?" here since the Navy is currently in a power struggle)

Still, it wouldn't be a pretty picture politically.

As for hiding our Volkite tech, that would probably involve never producing or really using them. It's likely known that Severus has a Volkite sidearm. If we suddenly showed up with 5 more Volkite guns, then some heads will definitely turn. If said numbers increased again then the AdMech could only conclude that we either found them on our planet or found an STC to build them.

Not sure how that would go. Even with Smilnay, whom we would be "allied" with. Space Marine Chapters are extremely indipendent and some tend to have their own technology seperate from the Mechanicus. But those are First Founding Chapters like the Blood Angels (Baal Pattern) or the Dark Angels. (As far as I know at least)

Right now I'm still tending towards giving the designs to Smilnay at some point (Could be 50 years. Could be 100). With what is written in the informational threadmark and what the QM wrote it appears to be a surefire way to get Terminatior Armor or other stuff. Depending on how this whole thing develops politically (the Ecclesiarchy) it might even become needed.

We'll see though.
 
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Also an option. We just have to keep in mind that we more or less already picked a side once this turn is over. This gives Smilnay a political advantage within the sector and in regards to whatever politics are played within the AdMech.

The most annoying case I could imagine would be the Ecclesiarchy siding with Milan, who would certainly accept the offer to deny Smilnay any political advantage over them.

This would give us the following "factions:"

Smilnay, Mist Shrikes and the Imperial Guard

And on the other hand...

Milan, the Ecclesiarchy (maybe) and the Navy (big "?" here since the Navy is currently in a power struggle)

Still, it wouldn't be a pretty picture politically.

As for hiding our Volkite tech, that would probably involve never producing or really using them. It's likely known that Severus has a Volkite sidearm. If we suddenly showed up with 5 more Volkite guns, then some heads will definitely turn. If said numbers increased again then the AdMech could only conclude that we either found them on our planet or found an STC to build them.

Not sure how that would go. Even with Smilnay, whom we would be "allied" with. Space Marine Chapters are extremely indipendent and some tend to have their own technology seperate from the Mechanicus. But those are First Founding Chapters like the Blood Angels (Baal Pattern) or the Dark Angels. (As far as I know at least)

Right now I'm still tending towards giving the designs to Smilnay at some point (Could be 50 years. Could be 100). With what is written in the informational threadmark and what the QM wrote it appears to be a surefire way to get Terminatior Armor or other stuff. Depending on how this whole thing develops politically (the Ecclesiarchy) it might even become needed.

We'll see though.
We haven't picked a side in any serious sense yet. We're requesting some vehicles from Smilnay, which is known to not be Milan's specialty, and crucially we've not done anything to help them. If we wanted to, we could go to Milan next turn and go "Look that was just a one time thing, I'd love to have your services, Thomas." To get in the good graces of a Chapter Master they'd likely let it slide so long as that doesn't become a habit. As the leader of a Space Marine Chapter, we have the privilege of making direct requests for supplies to any planet we choose, and though they can refuse, it would not be looked upon well to leave the Emperor's Angels of Death high and dry, so it's not like Smilnay is going to have us actually do something for them in order to get stuff, at least right now.

Aa for having Chapter-exclusive weaponry, that isn't just a First Founding or Second Founding thing. It's just less common due to needing a source which isn't "holdover from the good old days when our Primarch was around" unless you're a Dark Angels successor. And thanks to Luctus' known Archaeotech remnants, the Mist Shrikes have the perfect excuse for how their Forge learned to create this incredible weapon.
 
As for hiding our Volkite tech, that would probably involve never producing or really using them. It's likely known that Severus has a Volkite sidearm. If we suddenly showed up with 5 more Volkite guns, then some heads will definitely turn. If said numbers increased again then the AdMech could only conclude that we either found them on our planet or found an STC to build them.
"Oh, these? We recovered a whole bunch of them from a Great Crusade-era transport vessel during a deployment. When the Chapter Master heard, he figured they were a gift from the Emperor, meant to arm the leadership of the Chapter. Where was said deployment? Alas, certain individuals of an Inquisitive bent have made it clear that such information should not spread. Don't ask me why though, as I have no idea. I really am truly sorry".
If we wanted to, we could go to Milan next turn and go "Look that was just a one time thing, I'd love to have your services, Thomas." To get in the good graces of a Chapter Master they'd likely let it slide so long as that doesn't become a habit.
We should probably wait a few turns though before talking with Milan, so it's clear we aren't trying to play both sides.
Aa for having Chapter-exclusive weaponry, that isn't just a First Founding or Second Founding thing. It's just less common due to needing a source which isn't "holdover from the good old days when our Primarch was around" unless you're a Dark Angels successor. And thanks to Luctus' known Archaeotech remnants, the Mist Shrikes have the perfect excuse for how their Forge learned to create this incredible weapon.
I considered that excuse as well, but we don't want those two Forges going on a Great Volkite hunt in Luctus. That seems like it could end badly for all involved.
 
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