IWIW RWBY

V08C04 Fault

V08C04 Fault


During the chessboard metaphor in the titles, close attention reveals that Ironwood is standing on the queen's space, not the king's as one might perhaps expect. This probably symbolises his immense hard power and otherwise strategic irrelevance. There are limits to the inferences that can be drawn, because the game has already been partially played. Salem, meanwhile, also stands on the queenside, and the kingside pieces appear to have all been moved - including the king, so either Salem is playing with a screw loose, or she's pulling double duty (which would fit).

The shot just before Team RWBY falls into the crevasse still shows Teams RSBV (Penny absent) and APRY. Maybe they won't reconcile? Maybe I'll just have to wait and see.

Anyway. In the cellblock for top-secret clearances, Robyn is passing the time by telling stories. Meanwhile, Jacques is being irritated by a fly, and I'm actually not sure I'd wish that on him given he's already in serious jail. How did it get in, anyway?

Robyn eventually cracks a joke that gets Qrow to crack a smile. It doesn't last long; Qrow is regressing just as hard as I thought and feared he would, blaming himself for Clover's death. This is somewhat factually accurate, as I explained when it happened, but I'm sure as h*ck not saying that to Qrow's face when he's already blaming himself for the parts that he shouldn't be.

Qrow drops a title song lyric in the middle of spiralling.

Find a Branwen/Rose/Xiao Long who isn't traumatised challenge (impossible).

Robyn can actually commiserate. Having a lie-detector Semblance isn't quite the same tier of terrible as a bad-luck aura (lowercase a), but it still gets in the way of human connection because humans like having a few things they keep to themselves. Qrow starts processing that, but it'll have to wait because here are the guards to shove Watts back in now that his usefulness has expired for the day. Harriet and Marrow are also supervising the process. Harriet now sees that Qrow kept Clover's emblem, and reminds Qrow that he's the prime suspect in Clover's murder based on the weapon-wielder fallacy, never mind the bad smell of Tyrian over the entire thing (but I guess it's an Ace Ops thing to underestimate Tyrian).

Robyn offers the use of her Semblance to clear the matter up, but Harriet expectedly rebuffs this with a threat of violence, and I'm not sure how much Robyn could actually contribute given that she was unconscious at the time. Robyn keeps goading Harriet anyway; unclear whether her objective is truth (like she says), violence (like she must be thinking), or getting Harriet to use her head for its intended purpose. Harriet might actually have been thinking about taking Robyn up on truth and/or violence; Marrow snaps her (Harriet) out of it, so she stalks off.



Meanwhile outside, Team ARY is still in hot pursuit of the Grimm that abducted Oscar; clearly it's been stringing them along for a while. Now the pursuit is getting into difficult terrain where it will be much more difficult for the hoverbikes to find a viable straight line to drive in to keep up. To make matters worse, the bikes aren't built for any sustained deployment outside urban terrain, and Ren's is starting to present warning indicators.

Yang wishes they could fly. This gives Jaune an idea: Ren abandons his bike and uses Jaune's shield to launch into the air, getting close enough to the Grimm to tether to it using one of his weapons. He promptly gets treated as an improvised flail and bounced off every rock on the sides of this canyon, but at least the Grimm is being slowed down a bit.

Ren tethers a decently-sized rock to slow the Grimm further. It catches on and gives him a good jerk to untether the rock, then resumes bouncing him off the canyon walls.

Yang hatches her own plan, taking advantage of a convenient 'ramp' wall and the Grimm's distraction to reach its level and start taking potshots at it. The Grimm's response to this is to howl in a particular way that causes every Centinel for approximately five kilometres to unburrow in Yang and Jaune's way. If you thought Team ARY were confused and baffled that a Grimm talked, wait 'til you hear their reactions to it calling for backup.

And here come the lyrics!

Flying Grimm have also been attracted, and are going to give Ren a really bad time.

Jaune's hoverbike takes an acid projectile from a Centinel, and doesn't like it very much. It takes him some pretty fancy acrobatics to abandon it and jump from the lower level of the canyon (where he was riding) to the upper level (where Yang can pick him up).

Yang dodges Centinels like a pro. A landed flier is much less dodgeable, so Jaune throws his forcefield grenade to create a ramp in front of it. Sadly the bike clips a rock during landing and doesn't like that very much either. Analysis of how that will affect its performance profile in even the short term is moot, because Yang and Jaune outrun the Grimm wave and are moments too slow to realise that the reason the wave is slowing down its chase is that it has them where it wants them: they're about to go over a cliff.

Song ends. Despite deliberately stacking the bike (it goes crunch on a rock) and rolling in the snow to bleed off momentum, they both go over the cliff. Jaune tries to anchor his sword in the ground to avoid this, and succeeds in the anchoring, but still has too much momentum so he loses his grip on it.

Suddenly, Ren! tethers one weapon to Jaune's leg (Yang grabs Jaune's scabbard) and the other to Jaune's securely anchored sword. Seeing an approaching flier, he masks them all to avoid provoking an attack.

The good news is that Team ARY have made it out alive. The bad news is that, aside from having no functioning hoverbikes left, they've failed their objective: Oscar is still being carried away. His abductor heads for The Whale now visible in the distance.



There's only one safe place Team RSB+M could think of to take Nora to recover: Whitley is rather taken aback when he opens the door to see them. He starts berating them, and is interrupted by Weiss, who has had enough of all this for one day, holding him at swordpoint.

Whitley's problem is the staff are all gone, Willow is self-isolating again (presumably with alcohol), the Schnee reputation is in tatters, and now some fugitives have wandered in and expect to be harboured. Blake disagrees considerably with Whitley's priorities; Ruby successfully plays good cop, negotiating down to staying out of his hair long enough for Nora to recover.

Oh Weiss. Weiss yes, but also no. Telling Whitley to go to his room like you're the second coming of Willow (or maybe Jacques) might feel good, but isn't going to help matters much.

As Weiss shows May where to cart Nora off to, Blake suggests Ruby try assuaging her fears by calling Yang. Ruby has already tried, and is still trying in the face of the evidence.



Yang gathers up loose bike parts as Jaune tries to call literally anyone who'll hear them. The snowscape they're standing on, and the triangular formation in which they're doing it, look a lot like that seen early in the titles (except that Yang is standing in for Nora).

Fade to the trio walking across the snowscape, Jaune walking a bike (presumably Yang's that they stacked into the rock, because presumably it's the one they could find). It is Yang's job to pay attention to their Aura levels as the cold bites at them, and they're now all crossing from yellow-zone to red-zone. She asks Ren, who is taking point, how much further it is to "the outpost". Ren initially doesn't answer; asked again, he says he doesn't know. From his tone, there's definitely an argument brewing; I hope they'll wait until they're under cover to have it.

It doesn't look like they'll wait to have it.

Nope, here it is.

I'm seriously torn between sympathising with Ren, and joining Yang in telling him to get a hold of himself. ...Now closer to the latter as he reckons that Atlas staying put is handing it to Salem on a silver platter. Ren, you were there when Oscar told you all it was a bad idea to open the Creation Vault.

Jaune has been trying to pry one of them loose from the argument the entire time. At his latest attempt, while Ren is listing why everybody (so far Ruby and himself) isn't qualified for making serious decisions, Ren decides it's Jaune's turn, turning to snap at him that "and you cheated your way into Beacon!" Jaune is undeterred, resolving to get out of the cold before making any other decisions. Yang follows, angrily asking Ren "Is your goal just to push everyone away?" Ren neither answers nor follows. What a fine mess this is.



Unsettling string music as Ozpin requests Oscar to "don't panic", which is nigh-always a counterproductive thing to say. The reason for panic is that he's dangling from his Grimm captor's jaws by the scruff of his neck while Salem monologues at him. I'd panic.

Salem drops that this beastie is called a Hound. Congratulations, show crew, you've made a Hound scarier than a Beowolf in defiance of the relative scariness of their names.

Salem is a bit angry that Oscar tried pretending to be merged with Ozpin.

Salem starts interrogating: Where is the Beacon relic? (By a process of elimination, it is the crown; and probably of Choice, because the sword at Vacuo is probably Destruction.) Oscar says he doesn't know; it is left uncertain whether he actually does, but I think he actually doesn't, because that seems like the kind of thing Ozpin would have tried really hard not to tell him for precisely this reason.

Salem tries another one: What is the password for Knowledge? Oscar says there are no questions left. Salem, uniquely among everyone in this entire show, immediately picks this for a lie. So, being Salem, she gets out the agony beam. Ow, ow, and also ow. After getting in her fill of torture for the moment, she insinuates that Oscar and Ozma are "like-minded souls" because of how easily they both lie (you shut your evil mouth), before monologuing about her certain eventual success in prying it out of either of them. Oscar backtalks. Oscar, that is a bad idea. Sure enough, Salem hands over to Hazel, who furthers the torture with his fists, forcefully enough that Oscar falls out of the Hound's grip.

I'm just going to try not to think about the continuing beating of Oscar.

(Obligatory note not to do torture - aside from the morals, it gets you unreliable information.)

Down a hallway somewhere, Cinder and Neo await. Salem and the Hound round the corner. Cinder kneels in supplication and gets three words into preparing to ask something before noticing the Hound and being a little creeped out. Salem introduces it as a successful experiment and bids her continue.
"Yes, I... I want to search for the Winter Maiden. I think-"

"Do you hear that, my pet? She thinks. She wants. As if she's done something that warrants me caring about either of those things."
Remember when Salem pretended to give a toss about Cinder? Speaking of Cinder, she now questions Salem's short-term plan, which Salem will likely interpret as Cinder forgetting her station entirely. ...Yep.

Salem directly orders Cinder to stay on The Whale. Cinder's rehearsed answer almost makes me feel sorry for her.

Aaaand it's gone: Cinder schemes with Neo to leave The Whale and check on Amity Colosseum, muttering the whole way about how she (Cinder) knows better than Salem that stuff might be going down there. Maybe you should have led with this hunch? But then you wouldn't have been able to sneak off like this. I hope Salem gives you another disappointed glare when you get back.

Neo is unreceptive, but here's Emerald to try to stay in Cinder's good graces (having not figured out that Cinder doesn't have good graces).



At what I can only presume is "the outpost", Jaune percussively maintains the heater into working, then tries again to get through to Ren, who is passive-aggressively staring out the window at the semi-snowstorm. Ren instead leaves the building (passing Yang on her way in). Somebody keep an eye on Ren's Aura so they can go haul him in when it breaks.

At least Yang and Jaune are still getting on okay. Yang starts bike repairs. Soon she pauses to ask Jaune:
Yang: "Do you... think she thinks less of me... for not helping out with Amity?"

Jaune: "Ruby is your sister, she's always going to love you even if you disagree with each other."

Yang: "Yeah. Ruby."
I get the feeling that Yang did not the slightest bit mean Ruby. I only realised that when Yang responded, but I'm not sure if Jaune realised at all.

Jaune tries to sleep first, despite his (very, very justified) concern for Oscar; Yang offers to keep an eye on Ren's Aura. Jaune reflects that "things always seem to get worse before they get better" as the camera goes on a journey that does not make me feel good about wherever it's going. Yeah, something's making its own cracks to climb out of the ice, I have a bad feeling about this too.



Next time: Do not adjust your set...
 
There are limits to the inferences that can be drawn, because the game has already been partially played.

Salem has been playing this game for a long time.

(but I guess it's an Ace Ops thing to underestimate Tyrian).

Also, it's an aceops thing to apply blame in the wrong direction, as shown with their interactions with the heroes.

Robyn keeps goading Harriet anyway; unclear whether her objective is truth (like she says), violence (like she must be thinking), or getting Harriet to use her head for its intended purpose. Harriet might actually have been thinking about taking Robyn up on truth and/or violence;

Harriet was totally going to go for police brutality. And I figure Robyn was going to use it as an escape attempt for her and Qrow. Would have worked if Marrow wasn't there.

If you thought Team ARY were confused and baffled that a Grimm talked, wait 'til you hear their reactions to it calling for backup.

The Hound is full of surprises.

Oh Weiss. Weiss yes, but also no. Telling Whitley to go to his room like you're the second coming of Willow (or maybe Jacques) might feel good, but isn't going to help matters much.

Yeah, it might be satisfying, but it's not going to encourage him to behave. I can't really blame her though, given the stress of the situation and Nora's condition has her stressed out enough to not want to give Whitley a chance, given he's burned her every time.

I'm seriously torn between sympathising with Ren, and joining Yang in telling him to get a hold of himself. ...Now closer to the latter as he reckons that Atlas staying put is handing it to Salem on a silver platter. Ren, you were there when Oscar told you all it was a bad idea to open the Creation Vault.

Plus, Operation: YEET isn't going to work Ren, if you take a moment to think about it, you'd know that. But at this point, he's scared, confused, angry, and generally lashing out at anyone. We've seen his calm facade crack before back in V4, and this is a great demonstration that one act of vengeance/justice is no substitute for therapy.

At his latest attempt, while Ren is listing why everybody (so far Ruby and himself) isn't qualified for making serious decisions, Ren decides it's Jaune's turn, turning to snap at him that "and you cheated your way into Beacon!" Jaune is undeterred, resolving to get out of the cold before making any other decisions.

Luckily, Ren didn't drag up this old character detail two volumes ago, before Jaune started steering off his own self destructive path. Jaunes maturity in trying to deal with this shows how far he's come from that dumbass in V1.

Salem, uniquely among everyone in this entire show, immediately picks this for a lie.

Honestly, I don't think she knew it was a lie. Let's face it, Oscar would say the same thing either way. So she might as well assume he was lying, because this way she gets to hurt a small child AND Oz!

Salem has some issues.


Might as well, she's gonna torture him more anyway.

Salem hands over to Hazel

AND THEN THERE'S THIS ASSHOLE! Salem has centuries of trauma and Grimmstuff as an excuse at least.

Cinder kneels in supplication and gets three words into preparing to ask something before noticing the Hound and being a little creeped out

Yes, even Cinder, the woman who has a Grimm fused with her, is freaked out by the Hound.

Aaaand it's gone: Cinder schemes with Neo to leave The Whale and check on Amity Colosseum, muttering the whole way about how she (Cinder) knows better than Salem that stuff might be going down there. Maybe you should have led with this hunch? But then you wouldn't have been able to sneak off like this. I hope Salem gives you another disappointed glare when you get back.

Success forgives many sins. Well, in most cases. Salem is still the sort to dislike disobedience.

here's Emerald to try to stay in Cinder's good graces

Compare Salems treatment of Cinder this ep to Cinders treatment of Emerald.

At what I can only presume is "the outpost"

I figure there's more than a few waystations out in the wilds, for travelers between the villages, and possibly may have been military early warning posts in the past, although this one looks like it was abandoned for that purpose long ago. May have been replaced by tech.

Ren instead leaves the building

You know you're being emo when you sulk out in the blizzard as opposed to inside with the heater. Just curl up on the bed facing the wall Ren, jeez!

I get the feeling that Yang did not the slightest bit mean Ruby. I only realised that when Yang responded, but I'm not sure if Jaune realised at all.

She absolutely did not mean Ruby. And no. Jaune did not realize in the slightest.
 
Jaunes maturity in trying to deal with this shows how far he's come from that dumbass in V1.
Everybody's come a long way since V1, really. Except Pyrrha.

...well, individual specks of Pyrrha have probably gone a pretty long way, but that's not quite the same thing.

(Look, I either laugh or cry, especially while playing Grimm Eclipse and listening to Pyrrha's lines about destiny, which... the writers have to have known exactly what they were doing there, the DLC release date requires it.)

Salem has some issues.
Salem has a perpetual subscription (not a lifetime subscription, it's been several of those) that has been active for a length of time that nobody else save possibly Ozma can possibly comprehend.

Compare Salems treatment of Cinder this ep to Cinders treatment of Emerald.
I'm not quite smart enough for that, except by accident. Luckily, somebody on the SB thread made the comparison for me:
LordDarthYoda said:
"Don't think. Obey." - Cinder to Emerald in v2c1

"Do you hear that, my pet? She thinks. She wants. As if she's done something that warrants me caring about either of those things." - Salem to Cinder in v8c4

It's here where it becomes really obvious Cinder has been trying to do her best Salem impression the whole time.

Also like to think Salem was taking the Hound to get a treat for a good game of fetch.
I thought it was Roman whom Cinder used that line on, but I checked the transcript and it was indeed Emerald. This recontextualises a bit.

If it was then Watts probably shut those down.
V07C11 suggests he did. The other theory raised there is that Salem steamrolled them, but I find it unlikely that she was able to cloak The Whale well enough to avoid tripping a single detector while destroying them.
 
(Look, I either laugh or cry, especially while playing Grimm Eclipse and listening to Pyrrha's lines about destiny

Been there before...

I'm not quite smart enough for that, except by accident. Luckily, somebody on the SB thread made the comparison for me:

And they're reading this thread here right now, according to the viewing list :p

I find it unlikely that she was able to cloak The Whale well enough to avoid tripping a single detector while destroying them.

No one expects the whale to be a ninja.
 
V08C05 Amity
Fun fact: "Do not adjust your set" is entirely an NTSC-region (Americas and Japan) trope. Part of NTSC's design tradeoffs was the need to possibly adjust one's set; the benefit was less complex, therefore cheaper, decoding machinery in said set because it didn't have to self-adjust. PAL and SECAM, the broadcasting standards of collectively the rest of the world, chose differently.



V08C05 Amity


During the nostalgia shots of Team RWBY in the titles, the outer (non-nostalgia) instances are surrounded by the same golden motes that would turn up at the other end when they fell. There's just more to be Concerned about every time!

Amity Colosseum still floats above an abandoned Dust mine in the middle of nowhere. Pietro is high up it and out in the open. Penny, down in the mine, calls to tell him that "this does not seem like a very good idea". Pietro explains that it's the best idea they've got. The idea is apparently to blow the mine to Brothers come to start the launch, given that Penny is now arming a bomb.

Maria, piloting an industrial mech, confirms that I have guessed the plan correctly.

Penny objects that she doesn't have to - and shouldn't - be on Amity once it launches. Pietro shuts this down by appealing to his authority as her father, which makes me a little uneasy. He also won't hear Maria raising the point I didn't know I had that Penny has had enough people appealing to their own authority over her lately.

The launch moves ahead. Penny is able to intercept the request for Ironwood's authorisation and arm Amity, then remotely arms the bomb. Everybody straps themselves in, then reconsiders that as Cinder bloody Fall enters proceedings. Penny goes to fight Cinder and Emerald despite Pietro urging her not to.

Penny made the terrible mistake of hovering slightly above the ground when the festivities started. The ground catches up to her rather fast. This makes Cinder happy, which makes me sad.

(Ironwood and the Ace Ops stand around in some room somewhere watching a holotable. The table informs them that Amity is launching, to which Ironwood simply says "It's time.". I don't like the look of this one bit.)

Emerald has also been knocked to the ground by the platform she's on deciding to do its best impression of being in a rocket. How exactly is Cinder the one who's managing this best? Correction, Cinder's honestly not doing that much better.

Cinder has her turn to push Penny's buttons, while summoning an impressive array of bladed weaponry to throw once the thrust cuts off, which it now does. Penny has the rare experience of having way fewer swords than the opposition, and is starting to have trouble deflecting them before Maria drops the mech in to cover her. Maria's moment of awesome is then cut short by Emerald (I presume) ramming the mech with their transport.

The Cinder v Penny show resumes. No, Emerald's out here while Maria's mech is still grappling with the transport, so who is flying that thing? ...Neo is. I'd hoped she stayed on The Whale.

Maria manages to point the transport down, so Neo reverses it out, and Maria has no tools to prevent her leaving. We then discover at the same time as Maria that the view angles on industrial machinery are terrible for combat, even without Emerald helping. With Emerald making Maria hallucinate the total absence of the transport, she (Maria) has no hope whatsoever of seeing it coming.

The mech is toast. Maria climbs out to discover Neo waiting for her. I fear Maria is about to be murdered. The only thing that might stop her is Emerald (I think - confirmed by subtitle) shouting "Let's go!" from the distance.

Maria, staring death in its two-toned face: "And what do you want?"

Neo cloaks herself in Ruby and tosses Maria away. Maria, it turns out, is still quite capable of landing on her feet.

As Maria dodges Neo swinging what looks for all the world like Crescent Rose, Pietro does what he can, which is return to his main terminal to check his hope that Amity has reached broadcast altitude by now. It has. It then reconsiders staying there.

The problem is that Cinder's potshots at Penny are doing double duty as putting holes in Amity's flight systems.

Penny clues in eventually, and flies away from Amity. Cinder, who has target fixation by now, follows, so at least there are no new holes. Cinder is angry, which makes me happy except for the destruction it portends.

Cinder soon reconsiders, and now Penny is badly out of position to stop new holes in Amity.

(Meanwhile on the arena floor, Maria is having the time of her life fighting Neo, who clearly underestimated her. You live to see it.)

Cinder reaches Pietro's platform above the arena floor and starts melting its supports. Penny isn't far behind, angrily asking what Cinder's trying to achieve by "serv[ing] Salem". Cinder protests that she serves nobody and pushes Penny's servitude button again. This doesn't work so well the second time - Penny counters that she's choosing to fight for people who care about her. Penny takes a break to shore up the platform supports; Cinder does not stop her. Weird storyboarding, or armour-piercing answer? You decide. ...Now Cinder stops her. Penny is in a great deal of pain even before Cinder clamps her Grimm hand on Penny's face and starts with the Maidenship-siphoning. May that go as well for her as it did when she tried it on Raven.

Penny, out of conventional swords because she was using them to hold up the platform, eventually works out how to summon replacements out of ice. Unfortunately Emerald has returned to the arena floor in time to see Cinder lose her advantage. Penny lands in a heap again, distracting Maria long enough that Neo gets a good hit on her. So really this has all gone pear-shaped pretty fast.

Neo walks over to officially murder Maria, but gets lasered into the transport's side because she (Neo) got fixated and forgot about Penny, who has recovered. Penny then takes to the air to resume the fight against Cinder. Cinder summons a new weapon, and Emerald does her about-oldest trick of duplicating Cinder many times over. Penny summons a thundercloud for reasons unclear (it doesn't seem to do anything), then uses an alternate camera mode to find the real Cinder, because Emerald somewhat-understandably forgot that Penny's artificial nature means extra senses that have to be fooled.

Where Neo got lasered to rare, the real Cinder is rendered at least medium by sustained application. Emerald freaks out, forgets about doing any hallucinations on anybody, and runs to check that Cinder isn't crispy-fried. I sorta hope she is. (She doesn't seem to be.)

Emerald, seeing Penny coming for her (and by extension Cinder), fires past Penny at some item of Colosseum infrastructure, then uses the threat of doing it some more to blackmail the provision of safe passage off in the transport for all three of them. They leave unmolested. It is abundantly clear that Penny is a better person than me - why else not laser the h*ck out of them once they were past the range of useful retaliation options (especially down a Maiden)?

Penny delivers Maria to Pietro's platform (stabilised), where Pietro delivers the bad news: with the damage Cinder inflicted, Amity cannot sustain the altitude required for global broadcast, and has already dropped too low. Penny has a plan: they only need to broadcast for a few minutes, so she'll go and personally hold them in place for the duration. Pietro plays the parental-authority card again. Maria backs Penny up by citing the big picture, to which Pietro finally has the outburst he must have been keeping in since well before launch:
"I don't care about the big picture! I care about my daughter!"
Pietro, you may recall, does not have the Aura left to revive Penny again, and having had to do it (at least) once already, refuses to make any choices that endanger her life (understandable), or let Penny make them (less so). With the outburst over, Penny reminds him that it's her life, in the end. They make up.

Penny heads for the hull. Outside, she looks down at Atlas and the surrounding storm, seeming so small from up here; and looks up at the auroras, and the moon, still as shattered as ever.

Between rocket boots, Maiden rockets, and impressive overengineering of the hull to safely distribute that much force applied in an area of Penny's palmprints, Penny compensates for the damaged flight system and pushes and holds Amity above the magic line in the atmosphere. Pietro presses the button.

A recording plays. I'd paraphrase it, but it doesn't deserve to be paraphrased, so I mostly just copied from the wiki's transcript:
Ruby stands in frame, in a room that, judging by the posters, is back in the Happy Huntresses' hideout.

(Blake, off-camera: "Okay, go ahead.")

Um, uh. Hi. My name is Ruby Rose. I'm a Huntress. And if we've done everything right, then... I'm talking to all of Remnant right now. Doctor Polendina can explain more later, but right now you all need to know that the Kingdom of Atlas is under attack.

Things are dire, and we need help. But please, try not to panic. This isn't some new enemy or invading kingdom. This is a force we've faced before, for centuries: Salem. The White Fang, Atlesian drones, even the Grimm themselves have all been controlled and manipulated by her, in order to tear down the Huntsman Academies.

I know the idea of the Maidens and Relics seems, well, crazy. But I promise Professor Goodwitch of Beacon and Headmaster Theodore of Shade can verify all of this. They might even be able to help organize a way to fight back. But... sadly, General Ironwood can no longer be trusted.

We didn't have time to prepare for Salem. But now you do! Just because she can't be destroyed, doesn't mean she can't be beaten. If she really was unstoppable, she wouldn't have acted with such caution until now. She knows we're a threat! So even if we - even if Atlas falls, you can't give up.

I hope Amity Tower will help bring us all together. Because in the end, that's how we'll win-

(Clearly, there is more in between those paragraphs, because they jump erratically to new ideas, some not mentioned previously but implied to have been.)

This is seen in a montage of the following places:
  • The Atlas military headquarters command room.
  • A big screen on a skyscraper in Mantle, site of so many recorded speeches by Ironwood and Winter not so long ago.
  • Big-ish screens in somewhere else Mantle-themed - I think this might be in the Crater wiki says it's "Mistral Central Station", previously seen as the origin of the Argus Limited.
  • Saphron and Terra Cotta-Arc watching on one of their Scrolls in their house. Yes, it's global!
  • Whitley in what was Jacques' office.
  • No, I think this is the Crater.
  • Sun and Neptune watch on their Scrolls in the absolute middle of sandy nowhere.
  • Ilia, perched on a rooftop. Ghira calls her; we cut away before she decides whether to answer.
  • The evacuation of Mantle has paused to watch, including this group Joanna was herding along.
  • Penny, tiring, changes posture to try to keep going.
  • In an absolute blast from the past, this is the shopkeeper who did everything way back when. He's watching on his Scroll as it also plays on the TV on the wall of the shop. As Ruby namedrops Professor Goodwitch, the shopkeeper turns to Goodwitch herself, who is A Bit Surprised at Ruby blowing the entire conspiracy and counter-conspiracy wide open.
  • Ironwood and the Ace Ops are in some office watching on the screen on the wall. Harriet turns it off when Ruby denounces Ironwood.
    (Ironwood goes to tell Watts what he already knows. Watts tells him what might not already have been known (we certainly didn't) - the same trick that they know worked to clone Ironwood's terminal is the underpinning of the trick Watts is about to pull on Penny. I hate to think.)
  • In The Whale, Tyrian watches on his Scroll as Salem watches over his shoulder.
  • Nora sleeps in a bed. By the bedside, Team RSB watch on Blake's Scroll. Ruby looks as astonished as she's ever been to be watching herself.
  • ("Even if Atlas falls," says recorded-Ruby as Watts installs a new module in the sword stolen from Penny. Penny's eyes momentarily turn red and she loses propulsion for a moment, falling away from Amity. She returns. Pietro asks what's happening. Penny doesn't know, eyes still flickering red every now and then.)
  • The signal cuts out as Amity falls below the magic line, to Taiyang Xiao Long's massive distress.

Pietro urges Penny to get back inside. Penny, now red-eyed more than 50% of the time, declines, trying to say something about the vault. She switches off her rocket boots and falls. When an increasingly alarmed Pietro urges her to "say something!", Penny (green-eyed for the trip down) eventually says "I love you", which might have somehow been the most worrying thing she could possibly have said - certainly it's a great big death flag.



Back in jackboot central, Harriet reports that the broadcast has ceased. Ironwood's main concern is that Penny hasn't been hijacked like he wanted. Watts, who may well have decided to do some sneaky sabotage after all, passes this off as Penny restarting, before starting a reflexive insult at Pietro. Ironwood shuts him up by throwing his (Ironwood's) Scroll at him (Watts).

Ironwood decrees that the plan is to proactively find Penny rather than waiting for whatever homing mechanism Watts may or may not have put in. He sends Winter and the Ace Ops to do it. Except for Harriet, who will be taking Watts back down to captivity.

Remember how Qrow got to sneak Clover's emblem in there? Well, Watts gets to sneak Ironwood's damaged Scroll in there. This cannot possibly end badly. /s



Team ARY are among those deeply concerned by the broadcast cutting out. They also have more immediate concerns: a river of Grimmstuff flowing towards Mantle. I don't know what this train's called exactly but it sure as h*ck has no brakes!

Credits: Have I mentioned how adorable the Ruby scale indicators are? They are a much-needed island of adorable in this ocean of bleak sadness, much like Ruby herself.



Next time: Doctor, I'm afraid of backstories!
 
Gotta love how "Miss Normal Knees" likely just became one of the most recognizable people on the planet. "Where were you when Ruby Rose announced the Salem War?"
 
Neo cloaks herself in Ruby and tosses Maria away.
I do love how Neo can communicate in so many ways.

Maria is having the time of her life fighting Neo, who clearly underestimated her.

Ohhhh, this was glorious. Maria is possibly the worst person for Neo to fight, and demonstrates once again that this show doesn't run on power levels. She's smaller than Neo, which is a unique experience for Ice Cream Murder, her cane gives her surprising reach, much like Neo's umbrella does her, she is vastly more experienced than Neo, and her semblance is almost a hard counter for Neos illusions and slight of hand fighting style. On top of that, Old Lady Sass is far superior to Silent Sass, leaving Neo as the one struggling to control her emotions as her opponent continues to act like she's not taking the fight seriously for a change, and you KNOW Neo can't take what she's dishing out. And as a final touch, here Neo's the one on the offensive, but her entire style is about forcing her opponent to react.

The screaming from the 'Neo is the ultimate fighter and could kill anyone else in the show' crowd was delicious.

Pietro, you may recall, does not have the Aura left to revive Penny again, and having had to do it (at least) once already, refuses to make any choices that endanger her life (understandable), or let Penny make them (less so).

There's a contrast to be made with Ironwood here, who is supposedly so desperate to protect Renmant The Kingdom the flying island he will sacrifice anything else. But unlike Ironwood, Pietro can recognize that his actions are flawed, and backs away from the edge.

In an absolute blast from the past, this is the shopkeeper who did everything way back when. He's watching on his Scroll as it also plays on the TV on the wall of the shop. As Ruby namedrops Professor Goodwitch, the shopkeeper turns to Goodwitch herself, who is A Bit Surprised at Ruby blowing the entire conspiracy and counter-conspiracy wide open.

Glynda isn't voiced here because her VA burned her bridges with RT after V3 due to... drama. More than some of it self-inflicted in this case. Not as bad as Port and Ooblecks VAs drama, but still, something about teachers at Beacon... She wouldn't be recast until Ice Queendom a year or so after this ep.

Harriet turns it off when Ruby denounces Ironwood.

Hey, at least she didn't attack the television thinking it was actually Ruby daring to call out Ironwood in front of her. I kid, I kid... mostly.

I'm also kind of sad, I would have loved to see exactly what Ruby said about his cowardice and treason.

In The Whale, Tyrian watches on his Scroll as Salem watches over his shoulder.

Creeeeeeepy.

Nora sleeps in a bed

Weiss's bed, in fact.

Taiyang Xiao Long's massive distress.

But the question is, will he do anything, or will he stay at home more?

Ironwood's main concern is that Penny hasn't been hijacked like he wanted.

I mean, it's not like he cared about the rest of the world before now, might as well focus on violating the free will of a young woman.

He sends Winter and the Ace Ops to do it.

Note that Winter is now wearing a support exoskeleton. She REALLY should still be in a hospital bed.

Well, Watts gets to sneak Ironwood's damaged Scroll in there.

Hey James! I don't think your programmer's loyal, and I don't think all the guns pointed at him did anything.

They also have more immediate concerns: a river of Grimmstuff flowing towards Mantle.

Remember, Jimmy is barely paying attention to Salems whale because he's so focused on stealing Penny, and he's not looking at Mantle at all. She's sneaking this thing in. When you can sneak in a RIVER, someones fucking up.

Next time: Doctor, I'm afraid of backstories!

So, the flashbacks you're referring to were originally planned for V5, but didn't happen because of budget restrictions (GEN:LOCK! *Shakes fist dramatically*), with another possible point being when she woke up at the start of V6. Honestly, I think it works better here.
 
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The screaming from the 'Neo is the ultimate fighter and could kill anyone else in the show' crowd was delicious.
There is only one ultimate fighter, and it's Salem, because she has magic and won't stay dead. (Ozmas have less magic and stay dead longer.)

Glynda isn't voiced here because her VA burned her bridges with RT after V3 due to... drama. More than some of it self-inflicted in this case. Not as bad as Port and Ooblecks VAs drama, but still, something about teachers at Beacon...
Yikes. (checks) Double yikes. Either Rooster Teeth really knew how to pick 'em, or they're just nearly everywhere. I fear it's mostly the latter.

Ozpin's drama was in-universe. (dodges tomato)

It's Salem and Tyrian, when aren't they?

Note that Winter is now wearing a support exoskeleton. She REALLY should still be in a hospital bed.
Ironwood has this problem where he has Key People who fill Key Roles and can't bring himself to sub them out even when they're half-dead (Winter), traitors (Watts), or both (himself).

Hey James! I don't think your programmer's loyal, and I don't think all the guns pointed at him did anything.
...What did I tell this dude.

So, the flashbacks you're referring to were originally planned for V5, but didn't happen because of budget restrictions (GEN:LOCK! *Shakes fist dramatically*)
Ah, gen:LOCK, the gift that keeps on taking.
 
Either Rooster Teeth really knew how to pick 'em, or they're just nearly everywhere. I fear it's mostly the latter.

In the case of Glyndas VA, she was there in the early days of RT, as a VA and something of a cat herder, and may not have handled the transition to an actual company well. Either way, claiming on Twitter that coworkers got their ideas approved because they were sleeping with the boss is the sort of thing that just nukes a professional relationship in a way that mostly catches yourself in the blast radius.

Ozpin's drama was in-universe. (dodges tomato)

... About that... Shannon McCormick, voice of Ozpin and Wash in RvB, suffered blacklisting consequences for trying to do something about RT's in-house culture, but he was a major voice actor in RT's two biggest shows, so Management couldn't replace him outright without putting a target on their heads.

It's Salem and Tyrian, when aren't they?

... I mean, Salem wasn't creepy in some parts of the V6 flashback?

Ironwood has this problem where he has Key People who fill Key Roles and can't bring himself to sub them out even when they're half-dead (Winter), traitors (Watts), or both (himself).

Honestly, I suspect the fact the Atlas Military has so little depth in terms of qualified personel is the initial cause of a lot of the bad habits we see in Ironwood, Winter, Harriet, Clover, even the likes of Penny.

What did I tell this dude.

We told him a lot of things. Stop shooting teenagers, don't throw armies at every problem, don't destroy democracy, don't abandon a city of civilians to the Grimm, don't hire Watts to take over the IT Department after Pietro quit in protest...
 
V08C06 Midnight
"Doctor, I'm afraid of backstories!"
"When did this all start?"
"Well, er... aaaaaaaaAAAAAAAA-"




V08C06 Midnight


Just before the main fight scene in the titles, as Penny positions herself as a thing being fought over (which hits harder now that Watts is doing it), the Grimm that are about to be in the fight scene are visibly coming from the Atlas/Mantle side of the screen rather than the Whale side. Is this suggesting something about the river of Grimm, or what? (And yes, The Whale is quite visible, in the mirror position to Atlas.)

An extended fade-through-black brings us to another floor-scrubbing visual, as seen at the start of Chapter 1. Whoever's doing it has one finger bandaged, as if injured.

Very briefly, somebody in heels walks along what looks to be the same kind of floor? Cut to a barn with picnic tables outside. A girl, with the same hairstyle as the floor-scrubber, is being pushed around by some other kids.

More floor-scrubbing. Other kids run by. Mrs Heels walks some more. Cut back outside where our main character snaps and beats up one of her tormentors - or tries to, because an accomplice outsizes her and can just throw her away.

Scrub. Walk. Cut to black. "I'll take her." says presumably Mrs Heels. Cut to main character staring up at a very fancy building. I think I recognise the rim of Atlas in the background of this next shot.

It's really very fancy. Main Character doesn't know what to do with herself as she's led inside.

I don't think this is shaping up well. Mrs Heels, having led MC inside to the back, gives her a list of tasks and leaves, leaving MC in the care of these two kids who are slightly older and/or much better fed.

"Food?" asks MC. The other two just giggle. I'm getting bad vibes. Heels does deign to toss a bread roll on the floor in front of MC, which is about the lowest by which she (Heels) could possibly have cleared this already very low bar.
"Now hurry and get to your chores. The floor looks filthy."
I'm getting such bad vibes. The other two giggle some more as they leave. The viewable scene fades to black except for a spotlit circle around MC, reminiscent of when probably-she was scrubbing a floor back in Chapter 1. Cut to black completely with the sound of a door slamming.

...Chapter 1 cut straight from there to Cinder scratching up Neo's pilot seat with a kinda similar sound effect, and MC has Cinder's eye colour. I now even less like where this is going, 60% confidence.



And here come the lyrics! Not fun lyrics. They're lyrics about MC doing her chores, over a montage of exactly that plus the other two being pointlessly cruel.

Lyrics getting more degrading by the second.

Oh no oh no, that's coming out of her nonexistent paycheck for sure.

MC scrubs floor some more, which I'm guessing is a stock punishment.

MC is seeing some guy waving his sword around (not a euphemism) in the middle of telling a story to his friends. The listeners are impressed. So is MC.

The other two are deliberately tracking mud on the floors MC just scrubbed. What absolutely contemptible human beings. MC is so angry the scrubbing brush in her hand sizzles. 75% confidence this is Cinder.

MC screams in anger and throws the brush at them, creating an unreasonably massive dust cloud. Everybody notices. That is absolutely going to come out of her nonexistent paycheck. Sword guy is increasingly noticing all of this.

MC now screams and writhes in pain while Heels berates her. This is because Heels is triggering a shock collar around her neck. This is all just so very uncomfy for exactly the wrong people involved.

Oh dear yep, MC has just recited the same line that Salem just made Cinder recite a couple of Chapters ago: "Without you, I am nothing.". 95% confidence.

Cut to voices of Sword Guy exasperated that someone has stolen his sword and MC (or maybe one of those other two) apologising "for the inconvenience - we'll help you look for it", over a montage of MC sneaking into his room, stealing the sword, and bringing it back to what passes for her room. Almost certainly one of the other two, because Sword Guy has unexpectedly turned up to tell MC off. He has weapons to spare - blunt, maces - so can easily deflect it when MC throws it at him. "I'm not here to hurt you," he says, despite his somewhat menacing delivery of his opening line before that, and puts both his maces on the floor. MC sees a golden opportunity to snatch one up and charge at him. Being an untrained malnourished child, she accomplishes nothing: Sword Guy blocks it on his palm with no effort whatsoever, and uses MC's surprise to monologue about how he's noticed her being abused around the place.

Sword Guy reckons he knows what MC is thinking (revenge). MC disagrees. "Hurting them isn't going to make your life any better," interrupts Sword Guy. And running, he says, isn't going to work either. Implied MC crying as Sword Guy implies there's a third option; MC doesn't think so, because her world has shrunk to the bit she's allowed to be in. Sword Guy reckons there so is: he's a Hunter, and he reckons that given her present age, they've got time to train her to be one. It'll only take another seven years of living in the abusive workplace. What could possibly go wrong?



Training montage! Over soft orchestral music, which is not a common choice for a training montage.

At first, MC is sparring unarmed. Intercut MC getting shocked again. Sword Guy leaves. No-transition to his return. They now spar with improvised training weapons - glorified sticks.

More abuse. Sword Guy leaves. Returns. Presents MC with her own copy of his sword. Time is passing; the goal draws a little nearer. (Judging by the view out the window, this place is definitely in Atlas.)

Music ends. Those other two hurtle up to Heels to raise the alarm that "Cinder" (confirmed, then) has a weapon! They stalk into the back. Cut to twenty minutes later, as Sword Guy returns to the building. Nobody is present to greet him - it's the dead of night, and the permanents are busy. Busy with, well, that was the sound of something getting smashed out the back. This, combined with the door left open, is grounds for Sword Guy to investigate in a hurry.

I don't like what this new background music is implying. Ohhhh dear, those other two are on the floor unmoving, and Cinder is strangling Heels while completely ignoring her shock collar (which Heels is continuously activating in a doomed attempt to avoid being strangled).
"You're right. Without you, I am nothing. But because of you, I am everything!"
Heels drops the remote, then Cinder drops her. Then Sword Guy makes his presence known.
"I won't have to run now!"

"...That's all you'll ever do."

(wordless confusion)

(draws maces)

(wordless anger)
Sword Guy, I sense that you have just made an absolutely idiotic decision.

The electric guitar cuts into the background music. Sword Guy unblunts his maces and the fight begins.

Sword Guy is acquitting himself very poorly for a guy with twice as many weapons. Or maybe he doesn't - Cinder's presumably-Semblance lets her burn his skin if she has an opportunity to lay her other, empty, hand on him.

Here Cinder improvises an advantage: faced with gunfire from the maces, that are also guns (oh the out-of-universe nostalgia), she throws a bag of flour at him that bursts when he instinctively blocks it, blinding him long enough for her to steal his sword from his hip (oh the in-universe nostalgia). It doesn't take many sword hits after that for his Aura to break. He starts taking matters seriously, managing to overpower Cinder and break her Aura. Also at some point the lyrics arrived? I didn't even notice.

Sword Guy panics a little that he might have permanently hurt Cinder, so drops his weapons and goes to check she's okay. Cinder doesn't panic at all, she just stabs him on approach. There's the Cinder we know and loathe. Maybe she feigned being hurt to lure him over.

For reasons I cannot explain at all, Sword Guy's last living act is to pat Cinder on the head.

Cinder discards the new corpse and the shock collar, then looks up at the moon and cries a little.



Cut to the Cinder of the present, waking up aboard The Whale. Emerald happened to be coming by to visit, or perhaps vigil, and is immensely relieved. Cinder is not: she reckons she's in for it for disobeying Salem's orders and not even succeeding.

Here's Mercury to Mercury all over proceedings. This starts a verbal fight between him and Emerald. Cinder ends it, dismissing both of them. Mercury counters that Salem has promoted him from under Cinder, then summons them both to the bridge of The Whale to watch "something big". Emerald follows, adrift from Cinder's dismissal so soon on the heels of Mercury stating that Cinder didn't care about her (Emerald). Cinder does not follow, and is briefly seen in a spotlit circle again. The cycle of abuse rolls on.

Fade through black to Oscar's cell, where Ozpin is trying to convince Oscar to let Ozpin drive during Hazel's torture sessions. Oscar won't have a bar of it, insisting that Hazel is "holding back" because he can tell Ozpin's not driving. Oscar still looks like he's been through a small war.

"...you've done so much already. The least I can do is give you a break, and try to get us out of here."

"We can't leave yet. This is our chance."

"Maybe you've taken one too many hits."
Hey look, the return of actual comedy! Dark as it may be. Anyway, Oscar has had the insight that Salem softens up Her targets by infiltration, and here they are, just freely allowed to infiltrate into this cell and chat to their torturer. He's not trapped in here with Salem's council - they've foolishly let him in.

Ozpin and Oscar agree that this is an angle they can work. Before they can plan much else, Hazel enters to start the next round. Ozpin takes control, and just as they expected, Hazel stops holding back. (Your daily reminder not to torture, because it gives unreliable information.)

Ozpin asks Hazel why he follows Salem. Turns out Hazel's anger comes from the same place as Lionheart's fear, and for that matter Ozpin's distrust: they were/are all convinced that Salem is unstoppable. Hazel has twisted this in his mind into an acceptable excuse to beat up Ozpin (physically, Oscar) for training child soldiers for a doomed war. (Hazel's thoughts, not anyone else's.) As Hazel advances on him with an improvised sharp implement, Ozpin rushes to avert his stabbing/laceration/whatever else Hazel can dream up by asserting that Salem can be fought - unless She assembles the Relics. We can be pretty sure what she'll do with them, and Ozpin is sure, but he doesn't quite have time to tell Hazel before Salem announces Her presence in the room. She wants Ozpin on the bridge for "the show" as well.

Cut to the bridge, where all kneel before Salem and the Hound. Salem graciously deigns to inform them that Watts was able to contact Tyrian (presumably by repairing Ironwood's discarded Scroll) to pass on the news that he got to hack Penny (whom Salem dehumanises as a "puppet").
"I suppose he remains useful after all. Speaking of which... Cinder."
I'm fear-cringing in advance. Yep, as I expected, Salem uses Cinder's built-in Grimm features to cause her excruciating pain, just like the old shock collar. (Emerald is aghast.) Yep, here's a flashback to the shock collar.

Salem what? Salem's beration abruptly changes course to, I do not paraphrase at all,
"...and it's all my fault. You've fought your whole life, unwaveringly, for what you want, and here I am holding you back, instead of lifting you up."
My bewilderment is complete. Salem offers Cinder a hand, and Cinder takes it and is helped up. Emerald tries to control her fear as the Hound noses about her. Salem orders Cinder to go to Atlas and link up with Watts, who can lead Cinder to "the girl", presumably Penny from context. Salem will also be sending the Hound. Win-win, for Salem.

When Salem gloats-ish that after that She'll have the Relic of Creation, Oscar (or Ozpin? I'm not certain) chooses that moment to speak up.
"You'll only be helping Her bring about the end! For all of you!"
Hazel then makes him eat Whale-dirt, then presents him for Salem to get into his personal space and tell him (Ozpin) that he's too late.



Cut to an aircraft. For once it does not have anybody Salem-aligned on it. Instead it has the Ace Ops plus Winter. Winter and Marrow are up front while the others have an argument about what they're doing and the questionable choices that led to it (e.g. trusting Watts). Winter ends the argument just after either Elm or Harriet calls Penny "broken junk". Penny just can't get humanisation from anyone today.

Before anyone can even think about restarting the argument, Marrow reports that someone's broadcasting. It's Jaune (but they might not know that) reporting the river of Grimm (but not using that term) and pleading for anyone to help do something about it. The Ace Ops land, meet Team ARY on their one surviving hoverbike, and Harriet immediately tunnel-visions on antagonising them, to their exasperated dismay.

A couple of lines in, Harriet is interrupted mid-sentence by a major earth tremor that rattles everyone outside Atlas Proper for several seconds. Just a couple of seconds thereafter, there is another one, this time heralding a geyser from the end of the river that rises high enough to strike Atlas' hull shields. It persists until the shield fails and Grimmstuff coats a patch of the city hull. Centinels immediately spawn from it and start burrowing, despite the best efforts of about one defensive drone to kill them with lasers (those efforts are nowhere near good enough). Within seconds the Centinels have felled the nearest two shield emitter towers around the rim, taking down Atlas' dome shield as well.

Exactly one person is not paralysed by shock at all of this: Salem, who decrees that "it's time" and lands The Whale in one of Atlas' two major park districts. It then begins emitting its own river of Grimmstuff that begins coalescing into Grimm immediately.

I predict that Harriet will use this as an excuse to abuse Team ARY some more.

Credits: The barn-like structure has a Cinder scale indicator. I feel indescribably betrayed.

...wait. Cinder killed her cruel stepmother at the stroke of midnight (...hence the episode title), immediately after visiting about the same fate on her equally cruel stepsisters, and (checks) if we go all the way back to V01C01 when she first appeared on screen she was wearing glass heels of her own. Clearly this has been the longest and most negative Cinderella story in existence, complete with Prince Charming who got the Adam treatment on nearly every level. Does this make Salem a fairy godmother? Answers on the back of a postcard, mail through the nearest shredder.



Next time: Dropping some bombs.
 
Sword guy is kind of an idiot. The correct response would have been to try to get the girl out immediately.
Failing that, in another country you might be able to trust the courts to get her the help she needs after that killing, but in Atlas... Yeah, you might as well just help cover up some murders. Training her to fight and then trying to arrest her is kind of the worst of both worlds. Because now you have someone who can fight who you've just convinced that they really can't trust anyone.

Sword Guy panics a little that he might have permanently hurt Cinder, so drops his weapons and goes to check she's okay. Cinder doesn't panic at all, she just stabs him on approach. There's the Cinder we know and loathe. Maybe she feigned being hurt to lure him over.
Hey, he trained her to stab things with swords, she stabbed things with swords.

For reasons I cannot explain at all, Sword Guy's last living act is to pat Cinder on the head.
Presumably, realizing he's failed her on every conceivable level, he's trying to give her some comfort before he goes.
 
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I'm getting such bad vibes.

Yup. Cinder was a child slave. In Atlas. And the only person to ever show her kindness was a complete moral coward who gave her false hope, trained her, then expected her to just TAKE the abuse her owner inflicted on her for years on end. It doesn't excuse what she's done since the flashback, but we can understand how she ended up on this path. There's a reason Rhodes there is one of the more despised characters in the fandom.

Like I said, they were previously going to have her backstory in V5, but I think it works better here. For one, we've seen Cinder at her high points and low, after victory and defeats, and seeing it here, right after she dared to disobey Salem and FAILED, works perfectly. Especially since...

MC has just recited the same line that Salem just made Cinder recite a couple of Chapters ago: "Without you, I am nothing.".
I'm fear-cringing in advance. Yep, as I expected, Salem uses Cinder's built-in Grimm features to cause her excruciating pain, just like the old shock collar. (Emerald is aghast.) Yep, here's a flashback to the shock collar.

Salem what? Salem's beration abruptly changes course to, I do not paraphrase at all,

"...and it's all my fault. You've fought your whole life, unwaveringly, for what you want, and here I am holding you back, instead of lifting you up."

My bewilderment is complete. Salem offers Cinder a hand, and Cinder takes it and is helped up.

This. Right here, we have the most horrifying fact. Cinder never really escaped. Salem has been manipulating her for years, in the exact same way as the mistress, and Cinder doesn't realize. She applies the 'shock collar' and abusive words to wear her down, and just when Cinder might realize what's happening, she pretends to apologize, letting Cinder convince herself she's not a slave and fall right back into the trap.

Credits: The barn-like structure has a Cinder scale indicator. I feel indescribably betrayed.

Yeah, she never really escaped.

Here's Mercury to Mercury all over proceedings. This starts a verbal fight between him and Emerald. Cinder ends it, dismissing both of them. Mercury counters that Salem has promoted him from under Cinder

Another point for Salems manipulations. She's taken the member of Cinders minions most likely to say something Salem would prefer Cinder not hear, and made him her own, isolating both of them.

He's not trapped in here with Salem's council - they've foolishly let him in.

Yeah, it's not the immortal wizard they needed to watch out for. It's the farm boy that's put up with far too much shit lately.

Hazel has twisted this in his mind into an acceptable excuse to beat up Ozpin (physically, Oscar) for training child soldiers for a doomed war. (Hazel's thoughts, not anyone else's.)

Because his sister was a Huntress killed by Grimm. And he desecrates her memory with every action he takes, serving her ultimate killer, denying her the freedom of her own choices, and burning down the world she gave her life to protect. Fucking ass.

Just a couple of seconds thereafter, there is another one, this time heralding a geyser from the end of the river that rises high enough to strike Atlas' hull shields. It persists until the shield fails and Grimmstuff coats a patch of the city hull. Centinels immediately spawn from it and start burrowing, despite the best efforts of about one defensive drone to kill them with lasers (those efforts are nowhere near good enough). Within seconds the Centinels have felled the nearest two shield emitter towers around the rim, taking down Atlas' dome shield as well.

Exactly one person is not paralysed by shock at all of this: Salem, who decrees that "it's time" and lands The Whale in one of Atlas' two major park districts. It then begins emitting its own river of Grimmstuff that begins coalescing into Grimm immediately.

Including Apathy. Because that's what people want on a battlefield like this one :p

Honestly, I have to give Salem credit for her plans at the end of last volume and this one. They suffered setbacks and complications from time to time, but she adapted, and took advantage of opportunities like Ironwood losing it in front of her Seer. As such, Atlas didn't see the Grimm river coming, which stopped them from even trying to stop it, even just by putting airships in the way. The fleet was mostly floating above Atlas, after all, hence why only one ship shot at it (Well that and animation constraints.) Now, Atlas's barrier is broken, so even if they do open the Vault, they can't run to space. The heat and atmosphere won't stay in now.

Also, the 'park' was actually farmland. In one of the few sensible parts of Atlas infrastructure, there was farmland inside the heated barriers.
 
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Sword Guy, I sense that you have just made an absolutely idiotic decision.
In the grand debate on whether to be lawful or to be good, fuck this guy.
Sword Guy panics a little that he might have permanently hurt Cinder, so drops his weapons and goes to check she's okay. Cinder doesn't panic at all, she just stabs him on approach. There's the Cinder we know and loathe. Maybe she feigned being hurt to lure him over.
Or Cinder had her eyes closed from the pain and heard him approach, and assumed he was still attacking her.
Because his sister was a Huntress killed by Grimm. And he desecrates her memory with every action he takes, serving her ultimate killer, denying her the freedom of her own choices, and burning down the world she gave her life to protect. Fucking ass.
He might get along with Rhodes then.
 
V08C07 War

V08C07 War


Apropos of the episode title, some music:


Titles (described by subtitles as "(upbeat music)", I do not even): As the camera moves from Pietro to Penny (in front of the mirror), Pietro's reflection, that just looked at Penny, fades away. My Concerns continue to mount.

Also, during the combat sequence, Team RWBY get most of the emphasis. Team ALPN and Penny are kind of just there in the background once Cinder shows up.

Chapter proper: It is either dusk or dawn - I'll go with dawn - on some farmland. No, dusk, because this is where the Atlesian army have set the first defensive line against the incoming tidal wave (somewhat literally) of Grimm. We've got Apathies, we've got Goliaths (as opposed to the smaller Megoliaths - I'll complain about that naming choice every chance I get), we've got - why are these idiots formed up in parade squares instead of a vaguely modern battle line? They're not going to last long, are they.

Meanwhile, Ironwood orders a general evacuation of civilians into the subways. Where the Centinels can optimally slaughter them! He might think his matter-of-fact message is reassuring, but combined with the delay, everybody infers that things aren't going great and panics, which is exactly what you need when there's a zillion Grimm at the gates.

Turns out Ironwood maybe should have made that proclamation earlier than he did, because Atlesian airspace is now full of Lancers despite the best efforts of the air force. This isn't going well at all.

One aircraft is approaching from beyond Atlas. It contains the Ace Ops, Winter, and Team ARY (restrained, because of course). Comms traffic informs us that the city shield is down for good and The Whale is impervious to damage. Winter then reports the capture of Team ARY. Yang has another go at her for blindly following orders, but at this point Winter sees The Whale for the first time and anything else isn't being processed.

Jaune recognises The Whale as the Hound's destination. Those lucky enough not to have met the Hound refuse to believe that a Grimm took a prisoner.

Ironwood has a plan for The Whale: It's impervious from the outside, but probably not from inside, so he's having a big bomb built and the Ace Ops will then deliver it. Team ARY redouble their protests at the realisation that this writes off Oscar, to the expected no avail. Well, maybe some avail, because Winter's hand is shaking and she clenches a fist to stop it. Not sure yet what that means, but almost certainly not nothing.



What's the random piano music doing in the score? The answer is that Salem, with a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity to witness a major Grimm invasion, is standing at the fore of the bridge pretending to be a conductor (musical sense) and conduct the Grimm around. When I say 'pretend' I only mean the musical flourishes - she doubtless can actually conduct the Grimm around if she wishes.

With Salem ensconced in her happy place, Emerald is left alone on the bridge. She flees it, using her Semblance along the way to make at least one crystal-ball Grimm hallucinate her lack of presence to avoid detection. (She releases it early enough that, if crystal-ball Grimm have omnidirectional vision, she's been detected anyway. I'm not willing to risk that, but Emerald apparently is.) Eventually she reaches a door, from beyond which emanate Oscar's shouts of agony.

Inside, Hazel is being Hazel. (Your daily reminder not to torture, because it gives unreliable information.) When Ozpin asks why Hazel started following Salem, Hazel explains that they share an end goal of a "new world order", and then beats up Oscar some more for daring to suggest otherwise.

In particular, Ozpin tells Hazel that Salem is, in fact, suicidal, and seeks the Relics as the only possible way left for Her to die for good. Hazel completely skips over the part of this he doesn't like in order to assert that Salem is actually unkillable, which he (Hazel) knows because he killed her many, many times. Yes Hazel, Ozpin just told you that.

At the end of that, Hazel made assertions about "the vengeance I needed". Ozpin now goes for the risky play: telling him that Salem made him think that. Hazel falls back on roaring that this is what Ozpin deserves. Ozpin agrees just as loudly, which I hope he doesn't actually believe, then asks rhetorically whether everyone else out there deserves it too.
"You haven't done what you've done for justice. You've done it for yourself. Because she pushed you to think it would help you. Well? Has it?"



Nora wakes up while Weiss is changing her bandages. "Now what... am I good for?" she asks. For context, shortly before she got these injuries, her Plan A was being together-together with Ren which still isn't going so well, and her Plan B was "be strong and hit stuff" which she is now in no fit state to do. Weiss, quick, tell her she doesn't have to be good for something at every possible second.

Weiss, who has her own struggles with that concept, can't think of how before Nora falls asleep again.

Ruby and Blake enter with three hot drinks, and they all commiserate in their powerlessness to solve problems ranging from the small-ish (Nora needing professional medical care) to the medium (not knowing whether anybody who heard The Broadcast is sending help) to the huge (The Whale spawning overwhelming numbers of Grimm).

May enters the room more aggressively, reports that Team APRY are still missing, and tells them to come fly back to the Crater. Weiss refuses. May asserts that Atlas has plenty more protectors than Mantle at this point, and appeals to their emotions by telling them that "people are dying". Weiss responds that this is not unique to Mantle, and asks whether May has family in Atlas. Weiss probably knows the answer from having met Henry Marigold back in Volume 4. May answers anyway, stating that she chose protecting Mantle over her family's threats not to, and while she was at it chose to come out of the trans closet. She goes on to compare Henry to Whitley. Weiss might be conflicted about that comparison, but doesn't get even half a sentence in about it before:
May: "Which side are you on, anyway?!"

(significant pause)

Blake: "We've heard that before."
Forgot Blake was there, didn't you. May has a second to stew in the vast implications of that statement before Ruby picks up the slack by reminding everyone (but mostly May) of the pressing need to cooperate against Salem rather than dividing themselves.

May takes a deep breath and asks Ruby what the plan is. Undetected by all, Whitley is listening. Is that a good thing? Probably not.



Ozpin recites the curse on Salem, and explains its relevance to Salem's goal. Hazel refuses to trust anything Ozpin says.

Oscar has a plan. The plan is to just blurt out the password to Knowledge - y'know, the information he's been torturing them for. I'm surprised that Ozpin went along with it. Clearly there have been massive strides in trust in Oscar's mind.

Hazel is flabbergasted that Ozpin would just yield the password to Salem. To be fair, it makes no sense through that lens. Ozpin, or maybe Oscar, corrects Hazel: he's yielding the password to Hazel, there's still a question left, go verify. This is either a brilliant or terrible play, I'm not sure which yet.

Emerald is still eavesdropping.

Later, Emerald is implied to have told Mercury most of this. Mercury uses the right logic (torture gives unreliable information) to arrive at the wrong conclusion (Oscar and/or Ozpin are lying through their teeth). Emerald is in disbelief that Mercury is willing to be redeployed to Vacuo. Mercury displays the same failures of logic as Hazel, concluding that Hazel's failure to keep Salem dead means that Salem cannot be meaningfully opposed and doesn't want to die, regardless of anything Ozpin might say about the matter, which is lies anyway.

Cue Tyrian to Tyrian all over proceedings. Tyrian either got fed a different customised story or got told the real one and that he was trusted with it; regardless, he thinks these two are stupid for not having worked out that Salem is, in fact, in it to end the world. Mercury looks like he regrets signing up to accompany Tyrian to Vacuo, but it's too late for him to change his mind now.

Mercury's last visible action is to subtly nod at a distressed-looking Emerald while Tyrian is busy doing preflights. So, Emerald has been ditched by Cinder, ditched by Mercury as a bonus, had the rest of her worldview murdered by Tyrian, is still mightily creeped out by Salem, and has had part of Ozpin's ramblings confirmed which lends credibility to other ramblings like 'Salem can be meaningfully opposed'.



We'll presumably get to that later. In the meantime, Team ARY are still trying to at least buy time to get Oscar out of the literal blast radius of the bomb delivery mission. ...Hang on, The Whale is grounded on Atlas, how did Tyrian and Mercury take off in an aircraft and leave without any fuss? Is the Atlesian air force that depleted already? Anyway, Jaune eventually hits on the winning angle: they'll do the highly dangerous work of scouting inside The Whale before the bomb delivery, and if they find Oscar along the way then that's just gravy. (The objectives are actually in the other order, but the bootlickers don't need to know that.)

A lot of characters have been surprised by others' dialogue today, and Marrow is the latest, incredulous that Team ARY are volunteering to enter the closest thing Remnant currently has to the gates of hell to look for Oscar. Yang would like to know whether he'd do it for his teammates. Yang was expecting unqualified agreement and is a bit dismayed to get silence.

Elm admonishes Yang for letting her feelings get in the way of making hard decisions. Cue Ren to concur with Yang. Everybody forgot Ren was there: the Ace Ops, Winter, maybe even Yang, definitely me, probably you.

Harriet acts disappointed in Ren for not getting on her unemotional level. "When you lose someone on your team, you move on, replace them," she says, and starts giving examples among the Ace Ops. I'm honestly not sure whether she never heard about Pyrrha, or she did and is just twisting the knife some more. This makes Ren so absolutely livid that he Second Triggers evolves his Semblance on the spot, then uses his newfound ability to read the emotions of the Ace Ops to perform field psychic-surgery on the lot of them. I chose the 'surgery' metaphor over some possibly better-fitting vocabulary because he does not waste any words in the process of cutting them open.

Winter interposes herself in proceedings just before Elm could punch Ren, ending the argument and declaring that Team ARY will be permitted to scout for Oscar and the bomb. It is Harriet's turn to be apoplectic, but Winter has the cheat code of pulling rank. Winter asserts that the bomb will be delivered and set off whether or not Team ARY have returned by then. Marrow actually seems less okay with this than Team ARY are.

The aircraft lands and Team ARY disembark to head for the belly of the beast, Ren pausing on the way out to remind Marrow and Winter of their shared doubts about their orders from on high. Let's hope that takes.



May is getting a bit fed up with Ruby's optimism, asserting that they (Team RSB)'ll pick a defensive perimeter and go help it, rather than going on any wild goose chases for e.g. Qrow and Robyn. The similarities in outlook between May and the Ace Ops are getting unsettling. May demands they choose; they don't have to quite yet because there's a knock on the front door.

It's Klein! Apparently he's a medical professional on the side. Well, enough of one for present purposes.

After a bit Weiss thinks to wonder how he knew to come. The answer is Whitley called him. (Also, confirmation that Nora was in Weiss' room; I thought it looked familiar...) It is Weiss' turn to be (pleasantly) astonished at Whitley cooperating. Apropos of Whitley inexplicably deciding to start growing a conscience, some music:

(Yes, that is a megacorporation headquarters on the album cover.)

There follows a fairly strong earth tremor. Weiss asks Whitley if he called anyone else. Actual comedy.

For some reason nobody has their weapons out this time as Ruby opens the door. Seeing a literal smoking crater, Team RSB run to its rim, still with weapons stowed. In the crater is a very damaged Penny, who apologises for something (presumably the crater) before performing a remarkable facsimile of passing out.

This is the new record for the biggest voice cast: twenty-seven, one of whom appears twice.



Next time: ♪ Beware that the light is fading ♪ Beware if the dark returns ♫
 
Meanwhile, Ironwood orders a general evacuation of civilians into the subways.

I'll comment on the rest later (It's late here), but I have to note something VERY important here, about Atlas's general level of preparedness for disaster. They don't have proper Grimm shelters. Even Mantle had Grimm shelters, albeit poorly maintained and under budgeted. But the magical flying island of Atlas was so confident that nothing could ever threaten them, they didn't even bother. Now they have to make to with hiding in the subways. That's a level of cultural arrogance that has to predate Ironwood making general.
 
It's generally assumed Penny has been fighting the virus this whole time and constantly crashing in her attempts to reach Ruby (and everyone else. But mostly Ruby)
 
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Cue Tyrian to Tyrian all over proceedings. Tyrian either got fed a different customised story or got told the real one and that he was trusted with it; regardless, he thinks these two are stupid for not having worked out that Salem is, in fact, in it to end the world. Mercury looks like he regrets signing up to accompany Tyrian to Vacuo, but it's too late for him to change his mind now.
My guess is that Tyrian got a slanted version of the truth. After all, "have the gods destroy the world" is her suicide plan.
 
why are these idiots formed up in parade squares instead of a vaguely modern battle line?

Honestly, I class this as out-of-universe aspects to blame more than anything, looking a lot at the last two Avengers movies and such. A massive army lined up and ready is used to tell the viewer there's a big massive battle, even if they can't show much of it, and even if it doesn't make much sense. As such, I don't apply a heavy criticism of Ironwood and co for assembling like it's the 1400s. And the wall separating the farmland from the city isn't really wide enough to mount defenses on, so they have to be in front of it. What I DO criticize them for is putting the humans in front. You have a horde of robots whose network you can't trust any more, let them absorb the casualties, that's what they're for! If it turns out you missed a Watts back door, bomb them and the grimm among them!

Meanwhile, Ironwood orders a general evacuation of civilians into the subways. Where the Centinels can optimally slaughter them! He might think his matter-of-fact message is reassuring, but combined with the delay, everybody infers that things aren't going great and panics, which is exactly what you need when there's a zillion Grimm at the gates.

I noted the lack of secure bunkers in the city, but another aspect of the institutional arrogance that must be addressed here is how the civilians were going about business as usual. There were people having literal picnics, at a time when the largest grimm horde in history was on the other side of a forcefield. The lack of consideration for even minor breaches in the shield, let alone the complete failure we've seen, is truly impressive.

Comms traffic informs us that the city shield is down for good

Given how at least one of the towers fell off the island, this isn't really a surprise, but it needed to be said on screen.

Those lucky enough not to have met the Hound refuse to believe that a Grimm took a prisoner.

Yeah, it's not like we're fighting the woman that commands the Grimm, has the ability to make new kinds of grimm, and has a personal hatred of the voice in Oscars head...

Hazel explains that they share an end goal of a "new world order"

Because he's an idiot.

At the end of that, Hazel made assertions about "the vengeance I needed"

EAT A DICK HAZEL.

Ozpin agrees just as loudly, which I hope he doesn't actually believe,

Honestly, given I'm pretty sure Oz has severe depression, he probably does.

"You haven't done what you've done for justice. You've done it for yourself. Because she pushed you to think it would help you. Well? Has it?"

This really was dangerous. That's the sort of calling him out on his bullshit that makes Hazel want to crush skulls. But it was probably safer than 'What would your twin sister say and do if she saw what you were doing in her name?'
 
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May answers anyway, stating that she chose protecting Mantle over her family's threats not to, and while she was at it chose to come out of the trans closet

This was actually supposed to be the reveal May was trans. Mentioning it in passing while talking about a larger topic. It was planned with the help of Mays VA, a trans woman herself, and frankly it's one of the best approaches to the concept in fiction. So often, it's treated as the only aspect of the character that matters. Here, it's a side issue after we've seen so many other aspects of her personality, both good and bad. Also, we never get her deadname. While I have no problem with my birth name, many other trans individuals do, so it's nice to see it outright never said on screen. Sadly, someone mentioned that one of the HH was going to be trans back in early V7, and idiots proceeded to be transphobic, with nonsense ranging from the usual 'pandering' and 'unrealistic woke inclusion' to 'it must be Joanna, because shes BIG.' So her VA and one of the writers confirmed it on twitter before Mays first speaking appearance. Which didn't stop the Terfs, but I appreciate the attempt.

May, and her VA Kdin, came at a point in my life where after nearly twenty years of waffling, mostly due to fear over my safety and how people I knew would treat me, not to mention *Gestures wildly at the world*. This, along with several other elements, was the last element I needed to confess it to myself. It's one of several reasons why, if I ever do manage to properly transition in real life, I'll be going with May as my new name.

May has a second to stew in the vast implications of that statement before Ruby picks up the slack by reminding everyone (but mostly May) of the pressing need to cooperate against Salem rather than dividing themselves.

I'm going to be honest, I can understand where May's coming from here, even if I mostly agree with RWB. The fact is, Atlas had been an antagonistic force to Mantle even before V7, and with their abandoning all responsibilities to the people under Mays protection, one can argue that she has no obligation to try and protect the flying island. That said, she's only focusing on the small scale. The fact is, if Atlas is overrun now, there will be an island full of Grimm directly above the camp in the the crater. Protecting Atlas is protecting them. On the other OTHER hand, if they go to the front lines to try and help, the military will try to arrest them, at best.

And at the same time, RWB are looking at the long term plans, trying to find a solution for the bigger crisis, but in so doing, getting paralyzed by having too many directions to go in. There are ways they can help, but they don't know what to do. This leads to the image some in RWDE like to spout, that the girls sat around drinking tea for the whole volume, which besides demonising them for drinking something while not in a fight, ignores the dilemma they were in at this point.

She goes on to compare Henry to Whitley.

May takes a deep breath and asks Ruby what the plan is. Undetected by all, Whitley is listening. Is that a good thing?

Well, as we see at the end of the ep, I think it was. NO ONE wants to be compared to that dumbass. I think that was one of the things that spurred him into action.

Also possibly an egg moment, but that's entirely fanon :p

Hazel refuses to trust anything Ozpin says.

He only trusts the queen of the monsters that killed his twin sister!

Hazel is not a smart man.

Ozpin, or maybe Oscar, corrects Hazel: he's yielding the password to Hazel, there's still a question left, go verify. This is either a brilliant or terrible play, I'm not sure which yet.

I think Oz might have been banking on a safety net. Remember what Jinn said to Ruby at the end of V6? She wouldn't let herself be summoned like that again without answering a question, even if it was clever. So, if Hazel uses up the question, not only does he have proof Oz was telling him the truth, he's also taken Jinn out of play for a while.

That, or Oz is choosing to take a risk and trust him.

Emerald is in disbelief that Mercury is willing to be redeployed to Vacuo.

And Salem is cunning once again. She sends Mercury out with only Tyrian, leaving him isolated, and Tyrian can evaluate if the boy is worth keeping around now his ties to Cinder have been broken.

Cue Tyrian to Tyrian all over proceedings.

He is really enjoying the job of 'break Cinders minions to see if they have any value to your goddess.'


Is the Atlesian air force that depleted already?

Yup. Worlds best military!

Elm admonishes Yang for letting her feelings get in the way of making hard decisions.

Because volunteering for the scouting team into the Grimm whale is totally not a hard choice. The real hard choice is to write off your ally as a prisoner of the grimm queen and make no effort to save them. Makes you wonder how many other teammates they've let die.

Christ, the AceOps are FUCKING MORONS. Which leads us into...

Harriet acts disappointed in Ren for not getting on her unemotional level. "When you lose someone on your team, you move on, replace them," she says, and starts giving examples among the Ace Ops.

And the entire rant, she's failing to not only convince Ren or the audience, but herself. The simple fact is, the party line is bullshit, and they know it. Marrow replacing Torguta (As in, the tortise and the hare) did not pass without incident, and this entire team is broken and traumatised, trying desperately to convince themselves that there must be a reason. And in this moment, that realisation and final proof that no, the adults don't magically have their shit sorted and are not operating from a place of logic...


Unlike Worm, this seems to be based off added mental stability this time, as opposed to making his issues worse! :p

So, Sembleance Evolution. There's a few theories on this, none of which are confirmed, I believe. The first is that this isn't the first we've seen among the heroes, just the most dramatic. There are musings about Ruby and Blake potentially having the mechanics of how theirs works moving slightly, but this was at the end of V3, so that could just be animation shifts or early installment weirdness being smoothed out. There's also Emerald at the end of V5.

The main theory for how it connects to his existing power is that he could potentially always 'see' what his power would 'cloak', and realizing that Harriet was blatantly lying to everyone (herself included) helped him start to make sense of things.

The other theory, which I admit I somewhat subscribe to, is that this is actually how Rens sembleance was supposed to work, and the version we've seen since V4 was it operating in a somewhat broken manner, thanks to the trauma of his village. And the moment of getting his head on straight helped knock him on course.

Marrow actually seems less okay with this than Team ARY are.

Well, yeah. YRA understand that's the risk of making the hard choice.

May is getting a bit fed up with Ruby's optimism, asserting that they (Team RSB)'ll pick a defensive perimeter and go help it, rather than going on any wild goose chases for e.g. Qrow and Robyn. The similarities in outlook between May and the Ace Ops are getting unsettling.

I wouldn't go that far, even if she is from Atlas. I figure at this point, she thinks the best thing to do is join the fight directly in either place. Hell, going after Qrow and Robyn would require attacking Atlas personel, and they have enough on their plate with the Grimm.

It's Klein! Apparently he's a medical professional on the side.

Actually ties into his sembleance. Each of his alters have their own skill set. Very useful for a head butler.

It is Weiss' turn to be (pleasantly) astonished at Whitley cooperating. Apropos of Whitley inexplicably deciding to start growing a conscience,

Like I said, it's the Harry comparison. No one wants to be known as the useless tool.

And I think he was telling the truth when he said he didn't do it for Weiss. Which Weiss does to. That's so important. She's had Whitley reach out to her and try to build bridges before, only for him to reveal he'd mined them. Like it or not, he'd made it hard to extend a hand to him. But when he does something simple and good, that doesn't gain him anything? Weiss has that extra confidence to reach out again. And the boy who no longer has Jacques looming over him can freely return that hug.
 
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