It's a Girl's World -- And Lilly wants Adventure

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[X] [DreamLVL] She carried it with her always, no matter how far apart they drifted.
[X] [Milestone] Extend a Power's potential.
- [X] [Milestone-Power] {Golden Rapture} (x150%) (DC 40x1.5=60)
[X] [DwtFAME] I embrace the connection between all things. (Chapter 2.1)
[X] [CleaverLVL] It looked harmless, but fate told her the truth.
[X] [N:FES] [My Resolution, Thy Bedrock]
[X] [S:FES] [Reinterpretation Seed | 566-B, Manoth Placement Approval Only ]
[X] [SoT] Core Anchor

Edit: My main reason for Reinterpretation Seed is because Manoth seems like a cool guy and I want to get to know him.
 
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I mean, Manoth did find out what Evie was doing and go "Here, take this," which might be because he wants to field test his crazy Inverted Ethos, but it may also be because he genuinely wants to help. I can see that as a potential reason to want Reinterpretation Seed.
 
Slyvena said:
These are absolutely fantastic! You got a knack for this :)

Here I was thinking no one noticed Tarry was smitten with Lilly.
And not finding who was stealing the pies. Move over dad, that's the real tragedy.
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Thank you for the complement; glad you enjoyed it! :lol:

Yeah, I know that the speedrunners like to reset until they roll the coma event, since the built up Potential allows you to get multiple Ethos anyway, and fighting through the Alpha invasion makes sure you're not behind the power scale for Act 2, but then you miss out on so much side content. Sure, it's standard RPG tutorial quests, but the world-building and lore can be surprisingly engaging if you take the time to look into it. Maintaining relationships with your peers is also helpful to avoid getting the Numb condition at the end of Act 1 if the dice decide to wreck Lilly's emotional supports one by one.
 
Slyvena said:
No, Lilly needed to activate {Sample Space} for a full second later in the fight. Not one second later.
"Reserve the {Sample Space}; you will need a full second later." =/= "Reserve the {Sample Space}; you will need it in a second."
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Yeah, the {Sample Space} was used so Lilly could dispel the wound-link that the Bear (Or the [Rapid Iterator] ) put on the party before she passed out.

But yeah, the Name of Manoth's little Foundation here is interesting, but the fact it's an Inverted Foundational Ethos is... Concerning.

On the other hand, kind of by definition, a Foundational Ethos shouldn't include mental effects? At best it could include tendencies for development, but the impression I get is that the usual target for a Foundational Ethos is a parcel of land, not a sapient humanoid. What influence it has should be mitigated or outright eliminated by Bedrock since they're not usually intended to be applied to something capable of thinking on its own?

Might help us with {Inverted} Ethae in general too, since they seem to be Oath based so far?

Actually, on that note. [My Beautiful Pain], is that also an Oath Source @Slyvena ?
 
[Rapid Iterator] is probably most useful as a training dungeon. We can make enemies that are precisely the correct level to cause our guardsmen to keep leveling up.

[Championed Uplift] and [Library of Achievement] are probably the ones the powers that be would be most hesitant to destroy, due to their potential utility in adding to a nation's ethos.

And, of course, [Towering Edifice to Heaven] is the one most likely to become an industrial powerhouse.

...

@Slyvena: does Lilly's sample space optimize for results after the time has elapsed (for instance, an arrow that takes more than 1 second to hit the target?), or is it purely limited to results within said time?

Also, there's a potential issue in that people can vote for multiple plans that contain the same options, possibly causing them to be double-counted.
 
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Alectai said:
[My Beautiful Pain], is that also an Oath Source @Slyvena ?
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Alas, you'll have to wait for it to be properly offered to find out.


noncannon said:
@Slyvena: does Lilly's sample space optimize for results after the time has elapsed (for instance, an arrow that takes more than 1 second to hit the target?), or is it purely limited to results within said time?
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Limited to within the said time. The Infinite Lillys confer and decide on which future they think will be best.
{The Ladder} has a far more holistic reach and considers far more variables. It optimizes more along Hour/Day timescales.
(This isn't how it works but-) If you've read 'The Menocht Loop' by caerulex then you could imagine {Sample Space} as a Regret practitioner and {The Ladder} as an End practitioner.
 
Now, here is some wild and probably false speculation.
Abby doesn't want to kill us, or at least wants us dead for a different reason than expected.

You see, for an eldritch abomination, they seems surprisingly conversational. Almost friendly, as well. At least to Valerie. And Valerie herself seems vaguely sane, using a very loose definition of the word, instead of a corrupted puppet like I'd expect from the Maw.

Therefore, I theorize that they aren't Maw. They are a demon. In that case, Aboleath is either on our side, more or less, or trying to kill us because they thinks they havr a better way and wants to destroy the competition. And perhaps Valerie might try to kill us, even if Aboleath doesn't, out of petty jealousy.
 
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Alas!

Well, here's hoping we don't have quite so long a wait now that we're out of the climax of the first arc and will have at least a little downtime.

I hope.

We got a hell of a lot of goodwill at least, since Lilly's presence was critical to the strike team's success. Hah, maybe we'll actually be able to commission some decent gear in time for Valerie to pop in.

(Unless she's going to pop in, like, tomorrow because Lilly cannot be allowed any downtime :( )
 
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I already voted and I'm still sticking with it for now, but I suppose I'll also take a shot at parsing the ethea level-ups. ...Also sleep didn't help me at all, if anything I feel like I lost whatever momentum I had as my mind was desperately trying to start calling it a night.

[ ] [DreamLVL] She noticed even the smallest eddies in the current.
Agreed with the idea that this is a boon to detection. Eddies being anything that pings as "shouldn't be there" to Lilly/[Dreams]'s Essence senses. A more generalized version of how she noticed the ambush in this latest update but only because she was in "her" forest.

[ ] [DreamLVL] The root grew between the rock for years, until finally it split.
Taking a different approach on this one from many of the ones I've seen so far. I was thinking something like breaking through what would otherwise be terrain unsuited for growth. We know [Dream] works best in areas full of life and diminishes somewhat as we get away from nature. If we take those areas that [Dream] doesn't work so well as the metaphorical rock, maybe this allows [Dream] to, with effort, break through and find purchase (work better) in spots it wasn't as compatible with? Or maybe I'm just going nuts and talking more nonsense.

[ ] [DreamLVL] It could not lash out at her, she was friend to all.
Also kind of agreed this sounds like an evolution of Lilly's affinity to animals - making it much harder for nature-aligned things to act hostile towards her. While it's extremely unlikely it would be effective in a situation like the one we're in, maybe it would have manifested as redirecting aggro away from Lilly while other targets presented themselves. Or maybe this situation is unusual enough that it wouldn't apply at all and it only works in normal wildlife situations.

[ ] [DreamLVL] She carried it with her always, no matter how far apart they drifted.
Yeah, sounds like it helps Lilly's power act as though she's closer to her forest than she actually is, removing any diminishing effects given by distance. ...That sounds a bit similar to my idea on the rock one so I was probably wrong there though I would say the conceptual idea is different enough that I think it could still work.

[ ] [CleaverLVL] It looked harmless, but fate told her the truth.
Again, I'm with the consensus that this sounds like Detect Traps, perhaps weighted towards having spider-sense towards seemingly harmless situations.

[ ] [CleaverLVL] A moment to consider. Then she understood her odds.
Sounds straightforward in that Lilly will be able to get a read on her literal odds (a kind of in-universe acknowledgement of the DC rolls she would be facing for a course of action - whether she gets a literal read out of "Okay this has a 13% chance of working" or "This is rather unlikely to succeed, but there's a glimmer of hope" may depend on level/grasp.) In a way this has some synergistic applications with Cleaver's Critical Pivot (evenly balanced odds tend to fall in Lilly's favor more often than they should) but that might instill a false sense of confidence in either Lilly or us, the voters, because even if Lilly is playing with a weighted coin it can still land against her... if this ability isn't already factoring in that ability to begin with.

[ ] [CleaverLVL] She stabbed him in the heart, to kill his lover.
This is the toughest one for me I think because I have a few ideas floating around that I think might fit but would work very differently. My first thought is that it bends our advice in a more indirect way. Imagine reading the metaphor as striking indirectly at the "lover" by Lilly aiming at "him" rather than dealing with the "lover" directly. ...This sounds like something already in Ladder's armory already but maybe it pushes it towards being more indirect like that? Alternatively... could it allow for a more direct influence on the fates between people/things with the metaphor being that Lilly can strike at and sever fated connections between people? I don't like this interpretation as much though.

[ ] [CleaverLVL] No one knew her future, not even herself.
Agreed that this sounds like further disconnecting Lilly from fate - which fits in how [Cleaver] was originally pitched to us. I think there's something to the idea that this might impede Ladder's effectiveness but I don't think it would be a total shutdown of it... just make it less of a sure thing. I want to say Concordance has been used in relation to fate-related concepts so perhaps this also imbues Lilly with added defense against powers that act on Concordance?

Also to offer an explanation for my reasoning on strengthing Golden Rapture over Collective Communion... these are my top two picks so I'm fine with either winning, by the way... My rationale was more immediate need-based purposes rather than worrying at level caps (I'm uncertain the idea this removes the caps on Tier levels will hold but that's neither here nor there.) I think Golden Rapture's immediate utility is best for Lilly right now. Under Golden Rapture is her Essence Healing ability both for herself and others, as well as her ability to replenish energy, but perhaps more critically Sympathetic Linkage is noted to be able to strength links and it works best with concepts like family right now. I'm seeing it as our best chance to hold onto Yolun's consciousness by strengthening that tie and holding on as best we can. There's the obvious overlap with Collective Communion with that goal through the Heartstaff and many of its abilities seem similar to some of Golden Rapture - in fact being able to maintain the link to Yolun while unconscious falls here - but that's where I'm coming at this from.
 
...so as you see, it is very important that we find and befriend the other fragments so that, combined, our alliance may have some hope of--

"Yes, yes, you told me this already," Valarie grumbled, "but... can I explode people."

There was a moment of silence.

Must you?

"I'm telling you, Abby, if I don't start exploding people, I'm probably going to explode myself, and then where will you be?"

I'm fairly sure that's not how mortals work, Valarie. I've studied the science of metaphor very thoroughly, and even created some myself. I think this might be an accidental side-effect of--

"Explosion!"

A flash of light flared from the corner of their shared viewpoint; the former guardsman creaked onto the floor, his blade and armour sizzling.

Fine... I suppose to save several billions, a small number of cracked eggs would be an acceptable sacrifice.

"Yes!" Valarie cheered, doing a brief tiptoe jiggle. "Thanks, Abby; you're the best!"

It's Abole-- you know what, I can tell this is going to be a persistent issue. Can you please just try to avoid tanking all chance of a diplomatic solu--

"Explosion!"
 
Thanks for the response @Alectai and @noncannon !

Excellent points on Lilly's future-blank showing up as anomalous on Diviner scans, or other precognition. I was considering the shadowy parties like the Noosemen, who I doubt are the type to be slowed for long anyway. (The've probably hunted Diviners, or people Diviners tried to hide before). I have advocated for threat detection previously, and this seems like a good opportunity to capitalize on Lilly's other sensory abilities. If the "It looked harmless, but fate told her the truth." can piggyback off Lilly's other enhanced senses, Lilly's in much better shape for the enemies to come. Hopefully it frees up Ladder to give Lilly information on equally useful things like social actions, broader knowledge, and then the esoteric stuff like Lilly's namer.

I'm still cagey about being tracked by institutions and monsters. Valerie and Aboleath had something to point them toward Lilly, even before the latest Ethos installation. I'm also aware that according to the QM, running and hiding continuously are a surefire way to get Lilly killed. I just want to give her the chance to act unobserved, whether it's for subterfuge, training, retreating, or surprising enemies.

Right now, I'm thinking Lilly's social skills should be the next area of improvement, assuming she can leverage others into loyalty to her, or giving her trustworthy information, and definitely making her family less of a weak point for her.

Immediately behind that, I'd like to invest effort toward addressing Lilly's internal and external changes- Core Anchor is best for the durability and getting a faster handle on the new Ethos. But reading the Character Sheet and looking at Essence Metabolism's comments, Lilly already feels bad about the physical changes her Ethos are putting her through. On top of that, she's disconnected from her friends and family (we didn't include goodbyes for her mom and brothers in the write-in!) and afraid of the sudden, brutal violence and manipulative people she's getting caught up with. She'll make poor choices continuing like this, and loyal allies and restoration/acceptance are the only solutions.

For a few reasons, I'm throwing in my lot with Manoth. Not just for the firepower and Evie's knowledge of his work, but understanding an Inverted Ethos could help Lilly (and readers) learn more about Ethos and metaphysical-conflict situation going on.

-[X] [DreamLVL] She carried it with her always, no matter how far apart they drifted.
-[X] [Milestone] Extend a Power's potential.
--[X] [Milestone-Power] {Collective Communion} (x150%) (DC 40x1.5=60)
[X] [CleaverLVL] It looked harmless, but fate told her the truth.
-[X] [N:FES] [My Resolution, Thy Bedrock]
-[X] [S:FES] [Reinterpretation Seed | 566-B, Manoth Placement Approval Only ]
-[X] [SoT] Core Anchor
 
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The issue I feel is that you're assuming Concordance is the only means they have to keep track of us. Sure, it might work against the majority, but I don't think there's an easy solution to the whole "Transcendents can scry and die you" problem. At the very least, it's not something that'll be solved with a single Advance.

The situation is just super messy on the whole, but I'd rather not have any issues crop up because Lilly misunderstood something's threat level.
 
Ah, I catch your meaning. Just now in the forest, Lilly had a real risk of not noticing those enemies even with all her senses. I believe others have merit with their takes on lowering Ladder's effectiveness too. I think I'm convinced then. Thanks again!
 
Kymecho said:
Ah, I catch your meaning. Just now in the forest, Lilly had a real risk of not noticing those enemies even with all her senses. I believe others have merit with their takes on lowering Ladder's effectiveness too. I think I'm convinced then. Thanks again!
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Yeah, they hid from us by essentially melting in with the scenery, and appearing innoculous, it was only because we both had our super Essence sense, we did a {Stutter Ping}, and had the Home Field Advantage.

Whatever comes out of this means that just looking perfectly normal is no longer an adequate solution to ambush Lilly.
 
Silverking said:
Here's a fun little thing I wrote up:

Act 1 Complete!

Effective Level: 12

[X] Torn Apart and Put Together: Be in one piece after Awakening.

[X] Running a Bit Late: Take longer than expected to return home after Awakening.

[X] Daddy's Little Girl: Gain Rank 5 Relationship with Yolun.

[X] A Seer's Favor: Get a favor from Madam Silva (through bargain, cunning or threat)

[X] Marked in the Records: Have the Lore Warden finish his diagnosis.

[X] Might Be Worth a Bit: Have the Lore Warden mark Lilly down for the Tithe.

[X] Circle of Trust: Tell someone the truth about your Awakening without triggering a Bad End.

[X] A Father's Work: Have Yolun craft something special for Lilly.

[X] Averted Fratricide: Avoid killing your brother during a surprising Ethos gain.

[X] Stick Them with the Pointy End: Receive combat training.

[X] Bad Dog, No Biting: Kill 1 Alpha during the invasion.

[X] Wolfsbane: Kill 10 Alphas during the invasion.

[X] Ride of Paul Revere: Make it to Harmuph to warn everyone during the Alpha invasion.

[X] Why Don't You Say It Loud Enough For Everyone?: Harmuph finds you have above-average abilities.

[X] A Captain's Honor: Gain the patronage of Captain Martin.

[X] Jiggity Jig: Make it back home after reaching Harmuph during the Alpha invasion.

[X] I Didn't: Confront Sarah regarding the truth about your name.

[X] Continual Disappointment: Trigger the unlock conditions for 2 Inverted Ethos.

[X] Dungeon Clear!: Remove the corruption from the forest.

[X] No Death Run: Remove the corruption from the forest without losing any party members.

[X] No Funeral Planning: All of your family members survived Act 1.

[X] Noble Steed: Chariot survives Act 1.



[X] The Second of Many: Gain your 2nd​ Ethos.

[X] Oh, This Just Keeps Coming, Huh?: Gain your 5th​ Ethos.

[X] Common as Dirt: Gain a Common Ethos

[X] Myths and Legends: Gain a Mythic Ethos.

[X] Divine Attention: Gain an Ascendant Ethos.

[X] It's Been A Doozy of a Day: Gain 4 levels in 24 hours.

[X] And a Hell of a Night: Gain 8 levels in 24 hours.

[X] Peek Behind the Curtain: Gain …understanding?... of the underlying forces of this world.

[X] Maw's Pawn No More: Find a way to remove the Maw's influence on your soul.

[X] Got the Scent: Attracted the attention of a malevolent entity.

[] It's Better Than It Sounds: Gain a Lesser Ethos.

[] Once in a Blue Moon: Gain a Rare Ethos

[] Call of Cthulu: Gain an Apothetic Ethos.

[] Just Went For A Walk: Return home after Awakening with nobody in your family suspecting something's amiss.

[] Keeping Up the Routine: Complete Act 1 without your family suspecting that something's amiss.

[] What a Boring Life: Take a full week to gain your 2nd​ Ethos.

[] Big Happy Family: Gain Rank 5 relationship with all family members in Act 1.

[] Family Business: Have Yolun say he's proud of your progress with [Duty of Wood]

[] Not Worth the Tithe: Have the Lore Warden declare you to have no notable traits.

[] Someone Call The Noosemen!: Have the Lore Warden send for immediate transportation to Arrone.

[] Tall Poppy Syndrome: Learn the truth from Myah about what happens to those marked by the Lore Warden.

[] Garlic Allergy: Learn about Myah's Ethos.

[] Tragic News: Hear about the gruesome slaughter of the minor noble family in the north.

[] Little Entrepreneur: Find a way to earn some money in Harmuph in Act 1.

[] Raspberry Stains: Find out who's been stealing the pies from the bakery in Week 1.

[] Love Connection: Help the lovers resolve their differences in Week 2.

[] Where's Scruffy?: Help Sally find out what happened to her dog in Week 3.

[] Young Love: Pursue a relationship with Tally.

[] Boys Are The Worst: Reject a relationship with Tally.

[] Forbidden Letters: Learn how to read in Act 1.

[] Lilly Who?: Gain no special attention from the citizens of Harmuph through Act 1.

[] Declaration of Divinity: Have Harmuph find out that you're a Multi-Ethos.

[] Sprout Uprooted: Remove the source of corruption before something terrible happens.

[] Wait Out the Storm: Hide in the barn for the end of Act 1.

[] Pacifist: Kill nothing more than insects in Act 1.

[] Silver Bullet: Kill a human turned werewolf.

[] Stop at the Finish Line: Let the elite squad face the corruption without you.

[] Total Party Wipe: Be the only survivor of the final fight against the corruption.

[] A Courtier's Reward for Valor: Be betrayed after helping to save several lives. (Pending)
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This is funny, but you might want to edit things because the tally currently thinks this is your vote
 
{X] [DreamLVL] She carried it with her always, no matter how far apart they drifted.
[X] [Milestone] Extend a Power's potential.
-[X] [Milestone-Power] {Golden Rapture} (x150%) (DC 40x1.5=60)
[X] [CleaverLVL] It looked harmless, but fate told her the truth.
[X] [N:FES] [My Resolution, Thy Bedrock]
[X] [S:FES] [Towering Edifice to Heaven | 7958-A Series, Regional Stressor Event]

[X] [SoT] Exalted Flesh
[X] [SoT] Core Anchor
 
One thing I find interesting is that this town in the middle of nowhere had guards as well badass as they were (though I doubt any of the guard are that special in the grand scheme of theme). This is a relatively small unimportant place, so the fact that its guard (and the members) were as capable as they were says a lot about how dangerous the world is. I strongly doubt they normally have to deal with threats this bad, but I also doubt they are simply idle most of the time.

I'd imagine at least part of the reason is simply foundational ethos, after all dungeons can pop up anytime anyplace, but I doubt thats the whole story. The world seems like a dangerous place.
 
GlassMask said:
This is funny, but you might want to edit things because the tally currently thinks this is your vote
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Thanks for the heads up. I'll recopy my vote here.

[X] Plan: Rise Young Girl To the Heavens like a Legend! (Hopefully with less tang)
-[X] [DreamLVL] She carried it with her always, no matter how far apart they drifted.
-[X] [Milestone] Extend a Power's potential.
--[X] [Milestone-Power] {Golden Rapture} (x150%) (DC 40x1.5=60)
-[X] [CleaverLVL] It looked harmless, but fate told her the truth.
-[X] [N:FES] [My Resolution, Thy Bedrock]
-[X] [S:FES] [Towering Edifice to Heaven | 7958-A Series, Regional Stressor Event]
-[X] [SoT] Exalted Flesh

So, what is on Lilly's to-do list when she wakes up? What I have so far (in no particular order):
  • Find a way to push back the corruption in Yolun so that his body turns back to normal and his consciousness can be returned (hopefully this will be easier now that the Dungeon is gone)
  • Visit the Prime Tree (should be less risky now that the Dungeon is gone, nobody but us actually knows its location)
  • Use [My Resolution, Thy Bedrock] to try and get Lilly's shit together.
  • Check in with Captain Martin to establish current relationship, expectations, and the Mother of All Infodumps.
  • Visit the hillock to find the truth of our legacy (Flower got some explaining to do)
  • Figure out how to reestablish family's financial situation (cow investments are gone, hopefully Yolun can get back to work, steady job with Watch?)
  • Consult with Evie regarding the unlicensed remodeling of our insides (hopefully leveling up has upgraded her to complete sentences)
  • Reintegrate with the citizens of Harmuph (lessen chance of witch-burning, learn about current events, make some gosh-darned friends who aren't wrapped up in our madness).
  • Prepare for an unwelcome guest with indeterminate powers to be headed our way.
Just because things will be settling down doesn't mean there isn't plenty to do.
 
Absolutely!

That being said, I'd be wondering if we're about to go into a timeskip, but Valerie seems too close and too... Hostile to be something that just gets offscreened, and she's enough of a prick that I don't see why she'd wait eight or nine months for us.

The concerning thing though is that as crazy as Lilly's developing, it looks like Valerie's no weaker, if not stronger still. Because she doesn't seem to be exhibiting much caution and yet she's just trivializing everyone in her path--and we've just seen by now that the standard for full grown adults is level thirty or so. Even if we assume they get less per level than we do, the fact that pretty much fresh out of the oven she was going on an unopposed slaughtering spree sort of suggests her own Ethos is a jailbroken one, or she's using a completely different paradigm.

{Sample Space} is a hell of an edge, but it's strictly limited in time--and it assumes that 'Abby' can't cheat in her favor to nullify it.
 
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Alectai said:
Gosh, trying to make sense of all this Deep Lore is hard! But it's fun! Thanks for all the content @Slyvena !
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You're definitely wrong about the cleaver of fortune speculation. Because that stuff is determined by Lilly's own will and conviction, her resolution. Our own votes.
Slyvena said:
[My Resolution, Thy Bedrock] (Common): (Essence)
The danger of slowly losing track of who we set out to be is one so terrifying most choose to deliberately ignore it. You need not ever fear becoming what you are not, the truth of your origins will only grow deeper and more firm over time. Others will find themselves more solid and at ease in your presence. Decay will pause, decoherence will suspend, unravelling will be held in place. Whatever someone has been, you can always help them rediscover; no matter how lost they have become. Your very nature is a firm foundation on which the unstable may gain respite. You are the objective constant around which change must orbit.
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I'm pretty sure that my resolution, thy bedrock is a brainwashing power. A cult leader power.
You and your belief is the foundation around which your flock and sheep live their lives around. No one here has pointed out that it refers a lot to the meek, coming to or being pulled to, orbiting Lilly's ever self-reinforcing resolution.
Sounds entertaining.

Silverking said:
  • Visit the Prime Tree (should be less risky now that the Dungeon is gone, nobody but us actually knows its location)
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You voted to reveal the prime tree to Martin. Tsk. And if we followed through on the vote then we were denied.
Slyvena said:
[X] [APC] Yes, you will likely need their help to get there in the increasingly treacherous forest.
- [X] [APC] [Reveal] Try to convince Captain Martin to detour toward the Prime Tree.
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It's unclear in the chapter if we tried to convince them. It's only said that we will not be detoured to the prime tree. If we talked or asked about it, if we revealed it, our request was denied.

The best plan would have been to let the soldiers handle it on their own, as we've been repeatedly told that they would have managed it just fine without us, and while they were distracted go to the tree. Now, I'm not so confident we can slip under their notice and sneak there.
 
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Edifier said:
You voted to reveal the prime tree to Martin. Tsk. And if we followed through on the vote then we were denied.

It's unclear in the chapter if we tried to convince them. It's only said that we will not be detouring to the prime tree. If we talked or asked about it, if we revealed it, our request was denied.
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It was mentioned in the chapter, he just explicitly denied the request, saying that it would be better to do it later. And that he couldn't reveal why yet. Whether he was correct or bsing us is unclear as of yet. I could see either being true
 
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