Crystalwatcher's Magical Girl Quest!

isn't as funny anymore. Because it turns out she actually committed genocide. Sure they are demons and evil and all but still genocide!
Would now be a bad time to mention that at least one of the Soul Reavers was summoned against his will, and had no choice in his actions? And that most Demon Legionnaires are conscripted from the moment they were born?
is kinda odd however. One would think the Akashic Pillar would be pumping out transport vehicles, probably something like armored buses, like crazy. The increased mobility would make deploying the massive elf armies significantly faster even without one of their super gates.
The Super Gates allow billions to be transported at once. Which is kinda necessary, as the Elven Legions are billions strong.

There's also the fact that the Unified Light is, ironically, not that unified. And most of that production is spent on reinforcing Earths defences, or supplying troops stationed elsewhere.

It's a giant, disorganised mess, that only got worse after losing Gabriel and no one replacing her.
Still I bet the various demonic armies hate it when one of these show up:
Speaking of massive firepower I wonder if the various Metal Storm weapons systems ever got developed here. They would be great for dealing with the Unified Darkness' massive armies, assuming you can get enough ammo to them:
Oh, they do. That's why humanity is so effective, despite having a relatively small military.
Huh. I imagine Hell being infinite in size will make any counter-offensives quite impossible.
Against Hell, or from Hell?

Heaven's the same, incidentally.
 
To elaborate on Uber's comment about infinities: friends don't let friends make infinite planes. Infinities make weird things happen. For example, if you have infinite space populated with any population density greater than zero, then you have infinite population, which in turn means that every single possible story happens. Not just "it's likely that every story will happen", but every story is guaranteed to happen. Including things like infinitely powerful people: for any set level of power N, the probability of any given person achieving that level of power is nonzero; since you have infinite people, you'll have infinite people that surpass that level of power. Seriously. Then you have things like evolution: you have infinite trials. Eventually, somewhere in your infinite plane, something will spontaneously self-assemble straight from amino acids to a conscious human. Etcetera etcetera etcetera. Infinity is weird.

c.f. The Trouble with Infinity
 
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Well if randomness is involved, isn't infinite randomness still... well random theoretically? I.E couldn't an infinite plane have if it had randomness involved, have a randomness that was all the same 0 number?

So you'd have infinite 0's. Because random still allows for that infinitely small possibility that a plane of infinity could be infinitely empty.

Of course I think the hell plane is infinite but the # of demons created by broken promises aren't. So that means they have all the room in the world on an empty plane for all... not infinite of them.
 
For example, if you have infinite space populated with any population density greater than zero, then you have infinite population, which in turn means that every single possible story happens. Not just "it's likely that every story will happen", but every story is guaranteed to happen. Including things like infinitely powerful people: for any set level of power N, the probability of any given person achieving that level of power is nonzero; since you have infinite people, you'll have infinite people that surpass that level of power. Seriously.
The number of demons is not infinite. So, yes, the population density can be effectively considered 0.
Then you have things like evolution: you have infinite trials. Eventually, somewhere in your infinite plane, something will spontaneously self-assemble straight from amino acids to a conscious human. Etcetera etcetera etcetera. Infinity is weird.
Good thing such things can't happen in Heaven or Hell, huh?

Seriously, remember Heaven?
 
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so does that mean that in the entire multiverse there is only one hell? and the so called different hell's are just light year distant portions of the same plain that happened to have a cluster of spawn points on them?


also how do the demons gather? a finite number of spawn points scatter on an infinite plain would result in each spawn point being really far away from every other spawn point.
 
so does that mean that in the entire multiverse there is only one hell? and the so called different hell's are just light year distant portions of the same plain that happened to have a cluster of spawn points on them?
No.
also how do the demons gather? a finite number of spawn points scatter on an infinite plain would result in each spawn point being really far away from every other spawn point.
What makes you spawn in multiple places?
 
thats... ok point. Still kinda wondering what the point of having hell be infinite is though. infinite does weird crap and if the demons all spawn in one concentrated area whats the point of the giant empty infinite mass of whatever the ground is made of?

I mean that from a literary perspective by the way. couldn't hell just be insanely massive but finite?
 
I guess this makes sense. The infinite size is there so that Hell can scale to accept infinite population if the other planes keep growing. I guess the laws of physics are such that Demons spawn, say, near another demon that doesn't have any demons near it? Or something like that. Then demons don't spawn infinitely distant from anything interesting, but they also wouldn't (as planes grow) spawn enough of them in the center of the plane to instantly collapse the place into a black hole. Then any part of hell that's not actively occupied is also completely frozen so weird crap doesn't happen like random gusts of wind that (with almost but not actually zero probability) slam into each other to produce new universes via big bang.
 
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thats... ok point. Still kinda wondering what the point of having hell be infinite is though. infinite does weird crap and if the demons all spawn in one concentrated area whats the point of the giant empty infinite mass of whatever the ground is made of?

I mean that from a literary perspective by the way. couldn't hell just be insanely massive but finite?
Well, we were told a while back that destroying Hell completely would require destroying the concept of [PROMISES].
 
thats... ok point. Still kinda wondering what the point of having hell be infinite is though. infinite does weird crap and if the demons all spawn in one concentrated area whats the point of the giant empty infinite mass of whatever the ground is made of?

I mean that from a literary perspective by the way. couldn't hell just be insanely massive but finite?
*shrugs* Fairly sure Heaven and Hell are more interdimensional magical phenomena then a universe as we understand it.
to produce new universes via big bang.
The Big Bang was caused by Divine Entities. A mere gust of wind won't trigger one. :V

Physics and Maths go cry in the corner when Magic enters the room, which, amongst everything else, has Infinity as a definable and measurable quality, and doesn't follow what modern math and physics say it should do.

Humanity has lost far too many excellent mathematicians...
 
*pauses in my game of WC3*

Fucking Murlocks x.x

*opens thread to catch up*

*stares*

I'm too sane for this shit.

I can't help but feel kinda guilty that this is the second mechanics system I've caused you to redesign. Still I'm glad you take (hopefully) constructive criticism into account with these things.
Bitch, please. I'm just happy someone's bringing up a problem when they see it so I can fix it.

I fix it, I know not to do it in the future. I know not to do it in the future, my writing improves. My writing improves, more people read my stuff. More people reading my stuff, Happier I am.

So if problems come up, let me know about it and I'll see what I can fix and what I can bullshit away.

Something I've been meaning to ask for a while: How long can Nepgear sustain her transformation? Oh and does she know how long she can?
/人 ◕ ‿‿ ◕ 人\​

isn't as funny anymore. Because it turns out she actually committed genocide. Sure they are demons and evil and all but still genocide!
Octa-standards.

I do remember this. It's just crystalwatcher's statements made it sound more like the various races had weird interactions with dimensional travel so the speed each race could move units around varied.

That it's an actual logistical problem of getting so many troops through small portals comes as a complete surprise to me. Although it does make complete sense. It does however mean that this line:



is kinda odd however. One would think the Akashic Pillar would be pumping out transport vehicles, probably something like armored buses, like crazy. The increased mobility would make deploying the massive elf armies significantly faster even without one of their super gates.
Each race has different ways they travel between dimensions. I think I said something on this before.

As for the Akashic Pillar pumping out military equipment for their allies:

Remember that they had literally just finished World War III when the Darkness invaded Earth and sent them into the arms of the Light. They've been rebuilding huge swaths of infrastructure back on Earth for years now, as well as improving the quality of life in former third-world countries the world over. The Akashic Pillar was not ready for joining the Eternal War in any way, they've been playing catch-up resource-wise since the beginning. Our tech advantage is almost overwhelming but we simply don't have the raw material needed to build enough guns to make our victory decisive.

The Elvin Empire has given the Pillar mining rights so they can start collecting those resources, but it's been projected as years before we have anywhere near enough to reach that point. ears that the Unified Light doesn't have with the way things are going.

Being able to create unstoppable blades is neat and all. But not having the metal necessary to make enough of those blade to win the war is another matter altogether.

This brings up something else I've been curious about; why exactly hasn't humanity being deploying it's nuclear weapons before now? They are part of the reason why large congregated armies are no longer a thing; because exposed people are crazy vulnerable to even small nuclear weapons.
Several reasons, but there are two important ones:

1) From Humanity's perspective it's a matter of honor.

Nuclear Weapons are our ultimate trump card in this war. There is literally nothing any of the other Factions in the Local Dimensional Cluster has that can match them. The White Kingdom? The Fragarach has a better than average chance of killing one of their squid-ships, and everyone knows it. We'd still loose in a straight fight, but the fact we can make them bleed has given Humanity bragging rights like no one's business.

So, we haven't used them simply because as far as we care, it wouldn't be fair. For most of the War, Humanity has kind of been distracted by the novelty of going up against the literal Legion of Hell to think about cheating. Up until Hope we've been happily testing our metal against Hell Itself to see how well we stack up. It's only after Hope fell that we realized we weren't taking the War seriously enough and we paid the price for it.

2) We were actually in the middle of decommissioning them.

Human on Human warfare was shaping up to be a thing of the past, so everyone in charge felt that Nuclear Weapons were nothing more than a horrid reminder of darker days that we were better off without. Add in the fact we were also mostly unaware of the greater LDC zone, we saw no reason to keep nukes around at all. So we started with the most dangerous ones and went from there.

The Fragarach and Brahmastras are literally the only nuclear weapons we have left. The Counter Force are scrambling to see if the blueprints for any others are still around, but it's not looking good. So, for now we're stuck with the nukes left over from the initial fusing of Technology and Magic. We've tested newer versions recently, but nothing really serious.

That aside I bet the demons hate humans for our artillery. That stuff is nasty at destroying exposed armies, there is a reason trench warfare became a thing, and modern day (rocket) artillery can easily hit targets 70km away. Although there may have to be some redesign to deal with the lack of GPS satellites.
It's actually somewhat funny.

Instead of coming to dislike the fact that Humans fight from long distance, Demons have actually taken it up as a kind of challenge. Managing to close with a Human position, and forcing the defenders to directly engage you is seen as something of a honor amongst Hell's rank and file. "I survived an Artillery Strike" has become one really badass boast amongst them.

Speaking of massive firepower I wonder if the various Metal Storm weapons systems ever got developed here. They would be great for dealing with the Unified Darkness' massive armies, assuming you can get enough ammo to them:
They didn't. We got a little hooked on the novelty of Magitech, so Metal Storm weapons kind of fell by the wayside without anyone noticing.

thats... ok point. Still kinda wondering what the point of having hell be infinite is though. infinite does weird crap and if the demons all spawn in one concentrated area whats the point of the giant empty infinite mass of whatever the ground is made of?

I mean that from a literary perspective by the way. couldn't hell just be insanely massive but finite?
Heaven and Hell are both infinite, yes. But Angels and Demons are concentrated to hilariously "small" areas. Hell's populated landmass is roughly equal to five times the surface area of the Earth, while Heaven's is closer to just one and a half.

That, and Cosmos doesn't like it when people call her fat when she "isn't".
 
while your in the thread, I have a question about the apocalypse ability, namely what purpose does it serve? At first blush it seems fairly powerful, but in practice anything that has it is limited almost entirely to use in large scale battles because its almost impossible to use it on the tactical scale without killing your own allies. On top of that it doesn't even give any sort of buff in army combat compared to the far more manageable collateral damage ability.

I mean if its supposed to be a limitation to be worked around that fine, but then why did Supremacy Zone give us a debuff to our basic attacks rather than something more useful?

I mean, as it is now I would argue that outside of army combat Supremacy Zone is a net debuff. It makes our basic attack effectively unusable for any purpose, including interception fire if we have allies in the battle, and we always do. The only really useful thing it has is the damage immunity, but that has so many asterisks on it that its really kind of meh even without it doing nothing to stop someone from simply swatting us out of the sky.
 
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The Fragarach and Brahmastras are literally the only nuclear weapons we have left. The Counter Force are scrambling to see if the blueprints for any others are still around, but it's not looking good. So, for now we're stuck with the nukes left over from the initial fusing of Technology and Magic. We've tested newer versions recently, but nothing really serious.
That's weird. I would have expected magictech to allow for pure Fusion weapons, which would make it easier to build nukes. This would also make a decent origin for the Fragarach and Brahmastra.

Madman 1:"Do you remember how last year they announced that all fission weapons have been located and dismantled?"

Madman 2:"Yeah, what about it?"

Madman 1:"I want to see what happens if one of the fusion husks gets heated up by a fractal coil of 'hotbug' runes. The neutrons released might be able to re-ignite fusion after the hotbug yanks the heat back out."

Madman 2:"That's horrifying."
 
That's weird. I would have expected magictech to allow for pure Fusion weapons, which would make it easier to build nukes. This would also make a decent origin for the Fragarach and Brahmastra.

Madman 1:"Do you remember how last year they announced that all fission weapons have been located and dismantled?"

Madman 2:"Yeah, what about it?"

Madman 1:"I want to see what happens if one of the fusion husks gets heated up by a fractal coil of 'hotbug' runes. The neutrons released might be able to re-ignite fusion after the hotbug yanks the heat back out."

Madman 2:"That's horrifying."
Nope. The Fragarch and Brahmastra are fission weapons.

The main difficulty with fusion is making it not self-replicating, self-sustaining or simply ensuring it won't blow up the planet during small-scale testing. :V
 
The main difficulty with fusion is making it not self-replicating, self-sustaining or simply ensuring it won't blow up the planet during small-scale testing. :V
:???:

The main difficulty with fusion is that the planet is so much colder than fusion temperature that the heat is sucked out. This happens so quickly that terawatt lasers can barely keep up, even with special chambers meant to keep the plasma nice and warm.

This can't accidentally a planet because it would need to be powerful enough to scatter a planet first, which means the user knows darn well what their toy could do to a planet.
 
:???:

The main difficulty with fusion is that the planet is so much colder than fusion temperature that the heat is sucked out. This happens so quickly that terawatt lasers can barely keep up, even with special chambers meant to keep the plasma nice and warm.

This can't accidentally a planet because it would need to be powerful enough to scatter a planet first, which means the user knows darn well what their toy could do to a planet.
Well, besides the fact that my comment was mostly a joke, magic allows you ignore physical stuff like that. Such as a spell/magic ritual that results in the fusion sucking in the surrounding heat/matter/energy, reversing the 2nd law of thermodynamics and causing the entire planets to be absorbed into the mass, turning into a miniature star, and possibly a black hole.
 
Nuclear Weapons are our ultimate trump card in this war. There is literally nothing any of the other Factions in the Local Dimensional Cluster has that can match them. The White Kingdom? The Fragarach has a better than average chance of killing one of their squid-ships, and everyone knows it. We'd still loose in a straight fight, but the fact we can make them bleed has given Humanity bragging rights like no one's business.

Do the others fraction have anythings similar? I mean what makes the nuke so terrifying beside its sheer firepower is the amount humanity can make and bring to bare in a short amount of time. I mean if the other fraction in the LDC were attack by a divide being, not borderline, do they have anything to handle such being? Humanity answer to such being are nukes after all.
 
Bitch, please. I'm just happy someone's bringing up a problem when they see it so I can fix it.

I fix it, I know not to do it in the future. I know not to do it in the future, my writing improves. My writing improves, more people read my stuff. More people reading my stuff, Happier I am.

So if problems come up, let me know about it and I'll see what I can fix and what I can bullshit away.
Well then I'm reassured! Glad to be of assistance!

/人 ◕ ‿‿ ◕ 人\​
...this is going to be relevant at the worst possible time; isn't it?

...unless maybe there isn't a limit on how long Nepgear can stay transformed. Might be that all the Drives/Cores can (theoretically) remain transformed indefinitely.

Please explain? Google isn't helping here.

Remember that they had literally just finished World War III when the Darkness invaded Earth and sent them into the arms of the Light.
Are you sure about this? Familiar's timeline has "Suddenly Demon!" occurring two years after the unification crusade occurred, which itself happened post-WWIII. What's more since Hope was already in the process of colonization apparently humanity had already recovered enough that there were enough spare resources to start building a new colony capable of supporting over a billion people when it fell just two/three years later.

They've been rebuilding huge swaths of infrastructure back on Earth for years now, as well as improving the quality of life in former third-world countries the world over. The Akashic Pillar was not ready for joining the Eternal War in any way, they've been playing catch-up resource-wise since the beginning. Our tech advantage is almost overwhelming but we simply don't have the raw material needed to build enough guns to make our victory decisive.
I suppose it depends upon how devastating the war was. Europe was basically back to pre-WWII levels by 1950 according to my googling and that was a very damaging war.

The Elvin Empire has given the Pillar mining rights so they can start collecting those resources, but it's been projected as years before we have anywhere near enough to reach that point. ears that the Unified Light doesn't have with the way things are going.

1) From Humanity's perspective it's a matter of honor.
This is honestly nonsensical. How does honor factor into a war of such scale? Especially one where we're fighting for our very right to exist. War isn't a place where concepts like honor or fairness come into play. If they did we've have nice neat duels between soldiers rather then throwing flashbangs everywhere and mowing down the enemy with heavy machinegun fire while they are still dazed, blinded, and confused.

For most of the War, Humanity has kind of been distracted by the novelty of going up against the literal Legion of Hell to think about cheating. Up until Hope we've been happily testing our metal against Hell Itself to see how well we stack up. It's only after Hope fell that we realized we weren't taking the War seriously enough and we paid the price for it.
This however does kinda make sense. Basically up until Hope humanity didn't see the Unified Darkness as a significant threat. After all we can mow them down by the thousands with all our advanced weaponry while they just charge forwards with swords and pointy sticks.

Afterwards it also, kinda, makes sense since they probably went "Shit! We fucked up!" and decided to come up with a plan for a decisive victory instead of continuing to play around. At which point it makes perfect sense to try and avoid using nukes to prevent the enemy from better understanding them and possibly developing countermeasures.

2) We were actually in the middle of decommissioning them.

Human on Human warfare was shaping up to be a thing of the past, so everyone in charge felt that Nuclear Weapons were nothing more than a horrid reminder of darker days that we were better off without. Add in the fact we were also mostly unaware of the greater LDC zone, we saw no reason to keep nukes around at all. So we started with the most dangerous ones and went from there.
I could certainly see such a time of joy and peace leading to accelerated disarmament. Just three problems however;

1) Disarmament takes time.

It took the USA thirty five years to go from 27,000 nukes down to ~5,000. Even Russia took 22 years to go from 40,000 down to 5,000. In 2003 the USA and Russia each had 10,000 nukes. So assuming they didn't fire any, fairly reasonable, during WWIII then even optimistically we're talking a decade to disarm all the nukes.

2) Disarmament doesn't actually mean disarmament.

A nuclear weapon is generally considered disarmed not when it's destroyed but when it's rendered inoperable. Basically what the USA and Russia would do is simply remove the fissionable core from the weapon and store them separately. At which point they can truthfully, but not accurately, claim the weapon has been rendered inoperable. From this state it's a fairly simply process to just reinsert the core back into the weapon and have it fully functional again.

The Fragarach and Brahmastras are literally the only nuclear weapons we have left.
This is probably the most confusing thing. Literally every nuclear disarmament program starts with the biggest and nastiest nukes, because they are the least useful and have the worst side effects, and then works it's way down.

The Counter Force are scrambling to see if the blueprints for any others are still around, but it's not looking good.
...please read up on nuclear weapons. They are very easy to build. They are frighteningly easy to build. The only difficult part is getting a hold of sufficient amounts of weapons grade nuclear material.

To give you an idea of just how easy they are I'm going to tell you how to build one:
  1. Acquire 64kg of enriched uranium.
  2. Form 38.5kg into a hollow cylinder and the remaining 25.5kg into a solid rod designed to fit into the hollow cylinder.
  3. Place the rod at the bottom of a 2m gun barrel.
  4. Place the hollow cylinder at the top of the gun barrel.
  5. Behind the hollow cylinder put some C4.
  6. Place a thick backer behind the C4 such that instead of exploding the barrel it forces the hollow cylinder down the barrel and onto the rod.
  7. Rig up some kind of detonation system for the C4.
  8. Congratulations! You now have a 15kt nuclear bomb.
Where did I get my numbers from? The plans for Little Boy (Hiroshima bomb) are on Wikipedia. Lots of details on building nuclear weapons are actually easily available online because it's really not that hard. The problem is, as I said at the start, getting you're hands on the materials.

There is a reason people are terrified of terrorists building nuclear weapons; because all they need is the refined Uranium/Plutonium.

It's actually somewhat funny.

Instead of coming to dislike the fact that Humans fight from long distance, Demons have actually taken it up as a kind of challenge. Managing to close with a Human position, and forcing the defenders to directly engage you is seen as something of a honor amongst Hell's rank and file. "I survived an Artillery Strike" has become one really badass boast amongst them.
Yeah I can see that happening. I can definitely see that happening.
 
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