Crystalwatcher's Magical Girl Quest!

For anyone who missed it here is the invisible text:
Well. It was your fault that the Angel was going to be attached to Team GEAR, so you might as well find the poor person and get to know them. As the overall team leader, it was your responsibility to make sure that they were adequately situated.
And to bring them back alive.
So, in the interests of team unity, it was time to find your new teammate. Which turned out a lot harder then it sounded like.
You blink. Judgement Core Blinks. Everyone else present blinks. The music skips and cuts out.

Then Judgement Core empties the contents of her stomach all over you and passes out.
"Holy shit... that's our Team's Magical Girl?"
"Oops?"
"Yup. Badass, isn't she?"
-/LINE BREAK IDENTIFIED\-

The first one really reinforces just why we need to grab Core Connections now. Nepgear doesn't seem to fear dying but she does fear losing her friends.



Planning time. Now we know that poor Nepgear is going to run into Goddess White. Hell even Nepgear, miss fluffhead herself, can tell we're going to run into something crazy:
That's if your luck doesn't decide to play possum again. And considering how it's been you were pretty sure even if they sent you on something small, it would spin way out of control.

Best not to think to hard about that.

as can basically everyone:
That should keep her out of trouble."

"Hey! I'm not that bad!" Everyone just looks at you. You pout.



With that in mind let's consider what we're facing. Given how heavily it's been hinted at OOC and IC I'm guessing this:
"Shiva is on the move."

The tent is quiet as you glance between everyone there. After a moment, "Who's Shiva?"

Truth glances out the side of her eye at you, and answers before the Commander does. "A Divine Entity. They're officially part of the Unaligned Front, but they've been playing havoc on the War for the last year or so. We have no idea what they want, but Gaia has sent the WEAPONs to clash against his agents several time now."

Huh, that was news. "Who are his agents?"

"The Maiden of the East, Maiden of the West, and Goddess White."

You blink. Goddess White you knew needed no explanation but... "The Maidens of the Apocalypse?" Number eight and number nine strongest Magical Girls currently alive. Coming up short just after the WEAPONs. "What do they want?"

"Like I said. We don't know. But they've been showing up a lot recently. Just a couple days ago they hit Valhalla. The Angels there fought them off, but..."

"We took a lot of casualties in the attack. The only reason it's still standing is because Goddess White flattened the Unified Darkness' battle lines while the Maidens went after whatever it was they wanted. We're trying to figure out what they took, but it's taking a while. There was a lot of damage."
is what we're up against.

There will probably be a bunch of mooks, if only so we have something to fight, but we're likely looking at the Maidens of the Apocalypse and Goddess White.

So with that in mind let's look at who we can take:

[] Blue Sky

We know basically nothing about her other then she goes zoom zoom. Given that we are probably going to fighting through the guts of a research facility high speed flight is probably of limited utility. If we assume her abilities match up with her image, most MGs have, then she's probably a long range sniper which, again, doesn't really fit with being indoors.

[] Carnage

Carnage is tough but not well suited to this fight. Her dragon is almost certainly too big to fit inside, which both hampers her ability to fight and leaves a giant vulnerability for any rear attacks to take advantage of, and she is best suited to fighting armies of mooks and inside a building odds are mooks would be tightly packed enough to just obliterate them all with Purifier Beam.

[] Truth

Of the three Magical Girls she's the only one we've actually fought beside before, so there will be some familiarity there. Furthermore while she is weaker then Carnage she's probably more suited to this mission. She has a couple high power attacks, Define Truth makes interrogations/interviews of the research personnel easier, and Hell Rush provides another healing ability to keep everyone alive.


[X] Truth
[X] Purchase Core Connection

-[X] Save the remaining 161 XP.
 
research facility in Boston I going to be attacked. We're not sure who is going to attack it, but it's going to happen today apparently.
Prototype equipment get?
Power Suit GEAR with core connection will be glorious!
There will probably be a bunch of mooks, if only so we have something to fight, but we're likely looking at the Maidens of the Apocalypse and Goddess White.
Knowing our luck, Gaia is going to show up and turn this whole thing into a slugfest.

[X] Truth
[X] Purchase Core Connection
-[X] Save the remaining 161 XP.

Bringing only Truth isn't that bad, since buffed Gabriel and Team GEAR is easily worth 2-3 MGs minus the special abilties.

f we assume her abilities match up with her image, most MGs have, then she's probably a long range sniper which, again, doesn't really fit with being indoors.
Clad in Blue armor, and wielding a gun larger than she herself is, Ada Castle is a veritable walking fortress. And you can feel her power from where you stand.
Yeah, it seems like she fills a similar role to Judgement Core by bringing the dakka. Would be useful for mooks, but Team GEAR plus Nep can cover it pretty well with the coming upgrades.
 
Also, since we're heading into action, if we save the 161 XP we can buy Applied Teachings(200 XP) next update, which is important because we're heading indoors again, and if you recall, our ranged attacks have a tendency to drop the roof on us.

...I literally reposted the math on why buying Applied Techniques is a waste three posts up from yours.

But let me put it a slightly different way. If we bought Applied Teachings right now, next update is basically the same, then Panzar Blade would upgrade from:
Panzer Blade: 757 Base Damage * 0.75 + 1d170 = 652 (Average)​
To
Panzer Blade: 757 Base Damage + 1d170 = 842 (Average)​

for a grand total of +190 damage. Wohoo!

Meanwhile buying just one level of Purifier Beam, which incidentally costs half as much at 100XP, would upgrade Panzar Blade to:
Panzer Blade: 1,135.5 Base Damage * 0.75 + 1d170 = 936 (Average)​

So for half the XP we get one and a half times more damage.

The only benefit of Applied Technique right now is that it means Panzar Blade gets Juggernaut which while certainly a powerful ability may not make up for the different in damage gain. I haven't quite done the math on that yet.
 
Juggernaut: This renders an attack capable of piercing armor to an amazing degree. It also allows an attack to pierce certain other abilities, and defenses when they come into conflict with one another, rendering them useless. (Ignore 75% of opponent's Base Resilience. Extra effects are unknown.)
Well...ignores 75% of their Resilience AND crushes straight through defense raising effects.

Also if the usual thing happens this argument is moot since we could probably buy both :V
 
@crystalwatcher - While I was typing up this post I noticed an error. In Nepgear's character sheet you have her Base Damage at 757 but according to my calculations it should be 777 which is backed up by your own post here:
Ability Evolution

Armored Core: Mythril -----> Armored Core: Adamantium
-A barrier that separates you from the mortal. Damage must exceed 50% --> 75% of your health to pass through. Success reduces the taken damage by 50% --> 75%.

Base Resilience: 125 -----> 185

(Shop Item Unlocked!)
Ability Level Up!

Purifier Beam
Level 9 -----> 10
Base Damage: 518 -----> 777
Magic Modifier: 80 -----> 170
Attacks Per Turn: 2 -----> 3

Affinity Get! Divinity!

Flight
Level 3 -----> 4 -----> 5
Flight Speed: 20 mph -----> 30mph -----> 40mph

Ability Get! High-Speed Combat

Armored Core
Level 4 -----> 5
Base Resilience: 185 -----> 230

Core Containment
Level 6 -----> 7
Health: 400 -----> 450



13 Total EXP Remaining
this error also appeared in the most recent update:
Panzer Blade: 757 Base Damage



Well...ignores 75% of their Resilience AND crushes straight through defense raising effects.

So it's time for more math!

First off all we really know is that it bypasses 75% of the target's Base Resilience. It might, and probably does, work on other defensive abilities but we don't know for sure so I'll be assuming that is all it does.

Now you can effectively treat bypassing 75% BR as adding 75% of the target's BR to the attack since it mathematically works out the same:
End Damage = Damage - Base Resilience

Bypass applies a modifier of 0.25, reduces by 75%, to Base Resilience resulting in:
End Damage = Damage - (0.25 * Base Resilience)​

Adding 75% BR to Damage would result in:
End Damage = (Damage + 0.75 * Base Resilience) - Base Resilience​

If reducing BR by 75% is the same as adding 75% BR to Damage then the two equations should equal:
Damage - (0.25 * Base Resilience) = (Damage + 0.75 * Base Resilience) - Base Resilience​
First remove unnecessary brackets:
Damage - 0.25 * Base Resilience = Damage + 0.75 * Base Resilience - Base Resilience​
Next add "Base Resilience" to both sides of the equation:
Damage - 0.25 * Base Resilience + Base Resilience = Damage + 0.75 * Base Resilience - Base Resilience + Base Resilience​
Thirdly negative and positive "Base Resilience" cancel.
Damage - 0.25 * Base Resilience + Base Resilience = Damage + 0.75 * Base Resilience​
Collect like terms:
Damage - 0.75 * Base Resilience = Damage + 0.75 * Base Resilience​
Both sides equal therefore they are the same.

Now let's look at what Applied Technique actually gives the attack. First off it removes the 25% penalty buying it effectively gives Panzar Blade (+0.25 * Base Damage). Secondly it gives the 75% Base Resilience bypass which, as demonstrated, is effectively equal to adding (0.75 * Target's Base Resilience).

This can be represented by:
Damage Increase = 0.25 * Base Damage + 0.75 * Target's Base Resilience​

The efficiency of this increase is given by dividing through by the XP cost so:
Damage Increase per XP = (0.25 * Base Damage + 0.75 * Target's Base Resilience)/200​
Damage Increase per XP = 0.00125 * Base Damage + 0.00375 * Target's Base Resilience​

Purchasing a level in Purifier Beam meanwhile multiplies Base Damage by 1.5 and adds 5 to our Magic Multiplier with every 5th level doubling our Magic Multiplier. Unfortunately the Magic Multiplier doesn't really follow anything that is easy to map to a formula so I'll have to manually program that in.

Now I run a little spreadsheet magic and get an answer. Regardless of the target's Base Resilience, I tested all our enemies, Level 28 of Purifier Beam is the point at which Applied Techniques is a more efficient expenditure of XP then simply buying another Level of Purifier Beam.

That said I noticed something interesting; while increased Base Resilience didn't lower the Level at which Applied Techniques becomes efficient it did add a second range. Basically the added damage early on meant that for targets with sufficiently high Base Resilience it's actually better to get Applied Techniques early on.

However I don't think that's significant since it only really comes into play at really high enemy Base Resilience. For example with our current Level of Purifier Beam it would take facing an enemy with at least 650 Base Resilience for Applied Techniques to be worthwhile. Thing is the only enemies within that range we've seen are high level Magical Girls who'd stomp Nepgear anyway.



Also if the usual thing happens this argument is moot since we could probably buy both :V

Except, as I just showed, Applied Techniques just isn't worth it for another eighteen Levels of Purifier Beam. That is 3,330XP away. Although these numbers may very well change since every 5 levels of Purifier Beam seems to give either another Affinity or Ability which may be sealed from Panzar Blade until we get Applied Techniques. If so I'll redo the calculations again to find the new optimal point.
 
[X] Truth
[X] Carnage

They're almost part of our team, anyway.

[X] Purchase Core Connection
-[X] Save the remaining 161 XP.

And we can finally make our team less squishy. And unless the upgrade has some obvious effect that points to Nepgear as the origin of the effect, there's a chance the skill might be attributed to our new angel teammate, but I won't bet on that.
 
Eh. The math I did earlier to show that buying more Purifier Beam is more efficient then upgrading Skill still holds until level 21:

Especially since @crystalwatcher 's number is probably wrong. Because Medicore Skill specifies it applies to the attack's base damage:

and unless I'm misunderstanding something Panzar Blade's Base Damage, which is quite clearly labeled, should be 757:

but -308 isn't 25% of 757, that is 189, it's 25% of the total damage before Barely Competent is applied:
757 Base Damage, +88 Dice, +10 Surprise, +378 Ramming Speed = 1,233
25% of 1,233 = 308​



Although:

this does change things. @crystalwatcher are there any other non-obvious debuffs Panzar Blade is suffering under until we get Applied Techniques?

Once I know that I can re-run the math to redetermine the optimal point at which to buy Applied Techniques.




Here is Gabriel's stats with Core Connection boosting her:
Angel Gabriel

Stats

Health: 12,500
Base Damage: 4,000
Base Resilience: 1,000
Magic Modifier: 400
Affinity: Light | Hope
Weapon

Blade of Light
Level 4
Attack Per Turn: 2
Affinity: Light
Ability: Double Hit
Spells
Judgement
Level 3
Base Damage: 900
Magic Modifier: 100
Affinity: Hope
Ability: Armor Pierce | Boost-Self
Abilities
Flight
Level 9
-Gabriel is capable of flying at 80mph.

High Speed Combat
-Gabriel is able to track objects moving up to 90mph.

Presence of Light
Level 2
-Heals all Allies for 200 Health per turn. Damage all Enemies for 200 per turn.

Armor of Light
-Auto Negate all spell damage.


She's scary as fuck now. On top of her complete immunity to spell damage it now takes a 1,000+ damage to get through her Base Resilience. That makes her quite the tank and she definitely has the firepower to go with that description. Her sword deals a crazy 4,000 damage, times two thanks to double hit so really 8,000 damage, and she can attack twice per turn. That gives her 16,000 damage per turn.

Throw in her high speed letting her blitz most targets, just like Solid Core did to poor Judgement Core, and she's basically the Juggernaut.





This is actually quite the nice ability. It makes 1 shots significantly more likely to succeed and makes wearing down opponents a lot easier. Because it specifies 50% of their health not 50% of their maximum health. So all we need to do is get their health low enough for an attack to hit that 50% + 1 mark and boom!
Typo in math a caught literally just as I was getting up to go to bed. Was half-falling asleep when I reached that part, so it's my fault.


I only saw this on the second read through. You delayed my proofreading a good three minutes, I was laughing so hard.

Crys you tease.
Why thank you. /trollololol

Just realized you didn't answer this.
Was tired. I'll try to answer it today after work.

this error also appeared in the most recent update:
That was actually an older mistake that I fixed last night.

I've been meaning to round any decimal points that come up in the quest to the most inconvenient point for you guys when they apply. Like rounding down for damage upgrades, and rounding up for Enemy damage.
 
That was actually an older mistake that I fixed last night.

I've been meaning to round any decimal points that come up in the quest to the most inconvenient point for you guys when they apply. Like rounding down for damage upgrades, and rounding up for Enemy damage.

Good to know.

For those wondering I've now adjusted my math here:
Now I run a little spreadsheet magic and get an answer.
as follows to comply with the new policy:
  • Base Damage rounds down.
  • Barely Competent Damage Loss rounds up.
  • Juggernaut Damage Increase rounds down.
Level 28 is still the point at which Applied Techniques becomes more cost efficient.
 
Especially since @crystalwatcher 's number is probably wrong. Because Medicore Skill specifies it applies to the attack's base damage:

and unless I'm misunderstanding something Panzar Blade's Base Damage, which is quite clearly labeled, should be 757:

but -308 isn't 25% of 757, that is 189, it's 25% of the total damage before Barely Competent is applied:
757 Base Damage, +88 Dice, +10 Surprise, +378 Ramming Speed = 1,233
25% of 1,233 = 308​
Typo in math a caught literally just as I was getting up to go to bed. Was half-falling asleep when I reached that part, so it's my fault.
Oh, incidentally, this means that there was absolutely no chance that Judgement Core wouldn't be defeated by that attack. Zero, Zilch, Bupkiss, Nada.

Proof: AnyDice
 
Except, as I just showed, Applied Techniques just isn't worth it for another eighteen Levels of Purifier Beam. That is 3,330XP away. Although these numbers may very well change since every 5 levels of Purifier Beam seems to give either another Affinity or Ability which may be sealed from Panzar Blade until we get Applied Techniques. If so I'll redo the calculations again to find the new optimal point.

Getting Applied Teachings may still be useful as their are many situations whee a powerful beam is not as useful as a fully usable melee weapon as we are going to have to go into melee if we do not want to wipe out the structures. So far every time Nepgear used the Panzer Blade her results have been pathetic, and all of her capabilities require range so the moment that a sufficiently powerful enemy closes the gap she is likely to be screwed.

And I find it strange that we can upgrade our beam attacks while we can't upgrade out Panzer Blade, so it can be possible that until we get Applied Teachings any upgrade to the Panzer Blade is not going to be unlocked.
 
Oh, incidentally, this means that there was absolutely no chance that Judgement Core wouldn't be defeated by that attack. Zero, Zilch, Bupkiss, Nada.

Proof: AnyDice

To make things worse for poor Judgement Core if we end up getting even a single Level of Purifier Beam over the course of the mission we are almost guaranteed to OHKO her in our rematch, at least with her current stats, even without any modifiers.

Even with Nepgear rolling the bare minimum and Judgement Core the maximum we'd still do 255 damage. Given that for Judgement Core's current Health The Insurmountable Gap kicks in at 276 damage we have a 98.87% chance of pulling off a OHKO.

Getting Applied Teachings may still be useful as their are many situations whee a powerful beam is not as useful as a fully usable melee weapon as we are going to have to go into melee if we do not want to wipe out the structures. So far every time Nepgear used the Panzer Blade her results have been pathetic, and all of her capabilities require range so the moment that a sufficiently powerful enemy closes the gap she is likely to be screwed.

And I find it strange that we can upgrade our beam attacks while we can't upgrade out Panzer Blade, so it can be possible that until we get Applied Teachings any upgrade to the Panzer Blade is not going to be unlocked.

I think you've missed something really important. Panzar Blade and Purifier Beam are the same weapon just expressed differently. So upgrading one upgrades the other.

So when we buy a Level in Purifier Beam we also buy a Level in Panzar Blade. Therefore everything I said already applies to Panzar Blade.

Edit:
Technically to be perfectly correct Purifier Beam and Panzar Blade aren't even different expressions of the same weapon. Look at the image for Purifer Beam. Purifier Beam would be when using the central gun while Panzar Blade would be when we're using the big glowing purple blade.
 
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Getting Applied Teachings may still be useful as their are many situations where a powerful beam is not as useful as a fully usable melee weapon as we are going to have to go into melee if we do not want to wipe out the structures. So far every time Nepgear used the Panzer Blade her results have been pathetic, and all of her capabilities require range so the moment that a sufficiently powerful enemy closes the gap she is likely to be screwed.
I think you're on to something. Intercept uses melee calculation, so Applied Teachings is a buff to our ability to cross swords with opponents. Still overpriced at this point in my eyes, but it becomes a bit less situational. I expect the real boost will be the next few unlocks from it.

Judgement Core thought Panzer Blade was pathetic, now look at her :p.
 
Well, might unlock more melee skills?

Right now we aren't much good at melee, especially against more evasive targets(@crystalwatcher mentioned how evasion resolves, our melee accuracy will be terrible against anyone slippery due to being unskilled, and this works as a hidden effect like speed does on evasion)

Getting to professional leveled should help a lot.
 
I think you've missed something really important. Panzar Blade and Purifier Beam are the same weapon just expressed differently. So upgrading one upgrades the other.

So when we buy a Level in Purifier Beam we also buy a Level in Panzar Blade. Therefore everything I said already applies to Panzar Blade.

It still doesn't refute the fact that we might unlock more upgrades for our sword as without Applied Teachings we are mediocre with it. And a 25% penalty on melee is still a horrible thing. Applied Teachings seem to be one of those things that are expensive because they unlock something later on.

Even if they use the same base damage their should be a reason they have different names, why the long ranged option is called Purifier Beam, and the melee weapon is called the Panzar Blade.
 
Well, might unlock more melee skills?

That is a possibility. Although I question the wisdom of buying something on the off chance it would unlock something more useful.

Right now we aren't much good at melee, especially against more evasive targets(@crystalwatcher mentioned how evasion resolves, our melee accuracy will be terrible against anyone slippery due to being unskilled, and this works as a hidden effect like speed does on evasion)

Getting to professional leveled should help a lot.

I would like this argument except I can't actually find a single case of someone dodging an attack from Nepgear. So it's questionable how much of an effect this would have.

Plus I haven't found crystalwatcher's post on that but it might just be me not using the right search terms.

It still doesn't refute the fact that we might unlock more upgrades for our sword as without Applied Teachings we are mediocre with it.

Again I question the wisdom of buying something on the off chance it might unlock something more useful.

And a 25% penalty on melee is still a horrible thing.

It is a horrible thing. It's also something we can easily ignore to spend XP on more important areas.

Applied Teachings seem to be one of those things that are expensive because they unlock something later on.

Or alternatively Crystalwatcher wasn't thinking about the math when setting the price and modifier effect and thus didn't realize how mismatched they are.

Even if they use the same base damage their should be a reason they have different names, why the long ranged option is called Purifier Beam, and the melee weapon is called the Panzar Blade.

If you look at the XP costs of the other stuff in the shop Applied Techniques fits in quite well for the cost range of stuff like Severance: Echo and No Longer Human and has what, at first glance, appears to be a powerful increase to our fighting capabilities.

It's only when you sit down and do the math that the realization of how it's not that useful becomes obvious.

Even if they use the same base damage their should be a reason they have different names, why the long ranged option is called Purifier Beam, and the melee weapon is called the Panzar Blade.

Because whacking someone with a Purifier Beam doesn't make sense? Nor does shooting your Panzar Blade?

Joking aside I think I have an idea for why they have separate names. Looking at the image for Purifier Beam it's very clear they are two separate weapons bolted together by that grey and purple thing. I suspect that at some point we'll get the ability, either through buying it in the shop or by sufficiently upgrading Purifier Beam, to separate them.

That would let Nepgear fight with both ranged and melee weapons at once and effectively double her attacks per turn.
 
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