- Location
- North Carolina
At around the same time as the supposed hit, an Avenger did drop a 500-pound bomb on her.
Changing Destiny (Kancolle)
- Thread starter Skywalker_T-65
- Start date
At around the same time as the supposed hit, an Avenger did drop a 500-pound bomb on her.
Nobody will ever really know what happened to Choukai. As Drachinifel put it, "something happened" aboard her that caused an explosion that started fires that forced her to withdraw and led to the eventual loss of the ship, but exactly what is a matter of debate and will be pretty much forever.
My personal theory is that White Plains's shell didn't hit the torpedo launcher itself and set them off, but instead had splinters sever the LOX lines from the bulk oxygen storage to the launcher (for charging the torpedoes), causing a major LOX spill that caused a major conflagration triggered by any of a zillion potential ignition sources aboard a ship in battle. But my putting it down to White's shell as opposed to the bomb isn't based on any particular evidence, but just my preference for thinking that, in a battle with so much badassery from "small boys" that Hollywood's never even tried to make a movie about it, a CVE managed to beat a heavy cruiser in a gunnery duel, just because it fits in so neatly with the rest of the improbable nature of that battle...
My personal theory is that White Plains's shell didn't hit the torpedo launcher itself and set them off, but instead had splinters sever the LOX lines from the bulk oxygen storage to the launcher (for charging the torpedoes), causing a major LOX spill that caused a major conflagration triggered by any of a zillion potential ignition sources aboard a ship in battle. But my putting it down to White's shell as opposed to the bomb isn't based on any particular evidence, but just my preference for thinking that, in a battle with so much badassery from "small boys" that Hollywood's never even tried to make a movie about it, a CVE managed to beat a heavy cruiser in a gunnery duel, just because it fits in so neatly with the rest of the improbable nature of that battle...
Spherical_Light
Likely Illuminating a room near you
- Location
- NW US
ijnfleetadmiral
CinC Rengo Kanmusutai
- Location
- Admiral's Bridge, HIJMS Kongo
Incredible footage of Chokai's wreck shows her torpedo tubes INTACT. Furutaka was also said to have been lost due to torpedo explosions; however her wreck showed no such catastrophic damage as would have occurred with Long Lancers going off aboard. All five of the Japanese cruisers found by Petrel - Jintsu, Furutaka, Maya, Chokai, and Mogami - are in remarkable shape.
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- Location
- Kansas
I feel like that raises more questions then answers. Did a magazine explosion occur? Was it poor damage control?
Or was American Ordnance so awesome that the Japanese Crusiers couldn't withstand them?
ijnfleetadmiral
CinC Rengo Kanmusutai
- Location
- Admiral's Bridge, HIJMS Kongo
Magazine explosion is also a no, as Chokai's hull is 90% intact save for her broken-off bow (which is forward of No. 1 turret; all the turrets are still in place, which would definitely not be the case if a magazine explosion had occurred.I feel like that raises more questions then answers. Did a magazine explosion occur? Was it poor damage control?
Or was American Ordnance so awesome that the Japanese Crusiers couldn't withstand them?
Japanese DamCon was not all that great to begin with, so poor DamCon is a strong possibility of being a contributor to Chokai's sinking.
Sandy River DL
(Verified Destroyer Leader)
- Location
- Lake Michigan
- Pronouns
- Her/She
Less a desire for dakka and more a need for range and seakeeping. America did after all initially classify its 8in cruisers as light cruisers, which were scouts and fast screening ships.
- Location
- United States
Fair, but Second Amendment jokes are fun
Spectre
eternal servant to the Fire/EMS gods
- Location
- NY
well that's more a reference to how in OTL Atlanta had a dog named Lucky as a ships pet.@rdfox
Yeah, that theory sounds good to me. I usually leave those who killed who theories up to experts though, and we generally are not experts in ballistics, trigonometry, geometry, etc...
That was an interesting little aside on the Atlanta and Wichita a page or two back. No cats indeed.
- Location
- Pacific Northwest
@rdfox
Yeah, that theory sounds good to me. I usually leave those who killed who theories up to experts though, and we generally are not experts in ballistics, trigonometry, geometry, etc...
That was an interesting little aside on the Atlanta and Wichita a page or two back. No cats indeed.
And apparently no word about "Unsinkable Sam"
- Location
- United States
What about out of control fire? That would leave the ship's hull relatively intact, but would probably make the crew bail out.
- Location
- San Diego
That's what happened with the Lexington, partially. So it is possible. Surprised her boilers didn't explode though.
- Location
- USA
- Pronouns
- She/Her
I don't know if it has been brought up yet, but this video:
Is relevant to the the refit for the Hood, as he planned boiler refit would have vastly increased the amount of usable tonnage for armour, guns, and equipment.
I know everyone likes the big flashy things like Naval rifles and radar and the like, but apparently the advances in boiler technology in the interwar period flies under the radar a little. I certainly wasn't waware that it jumped that sharply until I saw this video, I had been under the mistaken assumption that the advances in speed were primarily due to the change from reciprocating piston engines to turbines, and while that helped, it wasn't the only thing.
Is relevant to the the refit for the Hood, as he planned boiler refit would have vastly increased the amount of usable tonnage for armour, guns, and equipment.
I know everyone likes the big flashy things like Naval rifles and radar and the like, but apparently the advances in boiler technology in the interwar period flies under the radar a little. I certainly wasn't waware that it jumped that sharply until I saw this video, I had been under the mistaken assumption that the advances in speed were primarily due to the change from reciprocating piston engines to turbines, and while that helped, it wasn't the only thing.
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- Location
- Pacific Northwest
This means a MAJOR refit, removing most of her superstructure and secondary armament. It also includes peeling back her main deck and other decks to her engine room. Probably includes replacing her turbines (with some good American Westinghouse or General Electric ones) and reduction gearing as well as a whole host of other things removed to be replaced.
Wonder if she ends up looking like the Iowas once she's finished being rebuilt. Gonna take some time to complete. Hopefully she'll be finished before the war ends.
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Sandy River DL
(Verified Destroyer Leader)
- Location
- Lake Michigan
- Pronouns
- Her/She
And it's a major refit she historically needed. Badly. As in, her original powerplant was so worn-out by her interwar flag-showing it had to be replaced if the RN wanted to keep her as a warship. There were plans to do so, but the build-up to WW2 pushed that back into 1942 or even later.
Skywalker_T-65
Writer with too many ideas.
- Location
- United States
- Pronouns
- Plural/They/He/Her
Hood's powerplant was so worn out she stripped a turbine just trying to get to around 28 knots. Even without battle damage, the ship would have eventually reached the point of 'flat out cannot move'.
(I know what her refit will look like, when she comes out of it)
(I know what her refit will look like, when she comes out of it)
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- Location
- Pacific Northwest
That's if the refit was done at Chatham or Devonport. She may look very different coming out of an American shipyard.
Hood after refit at New York Shipbuilding
"Damn it all! I told you not to let those Americans rebuild my superstructure! Now I look like a bleedin' Yank beauty paegent winner!"
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- Location
- Deep in the Badlands of Equestria
Think about what might happen if Halifax does the refit. "Why do I need a tank for maple syrup? And have a craving for poutine?"
- Location
- United States
Churchill: "Well, at least this will be great for morale."
- Location
- Pacific NW
Wichita: "At least you won't look like the girls in those calendars. Hopefully you won't suffer any camouflage malfunctions like they seem to have in every picture."
Elvgren shrugs as he applies paint to Hood's hull: "Hey, advertisers are cutting back and this is steady work!"
Elvgren shrugs as he applies paint to Hood's hull: "Hey, advertisers are cutting back and this is steady work!"
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- Location
- Pacific Northwest
It won't happen. Halifax doesn't have docks big enough for Hood
- Location
- Pacific Northwest
Hood:
"You never told me that the architecht who redesigned my superstructure was Alberto Vargas!"
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Hood commissioned in 1920 and got a deep refit for six days short of two years long at Portsmouth (June 1929 - May 1931), including extensive repairs to hull, machinery and equipment.
Otherwise put, Hood needed a long refit after about nine-ten years of service. Counting forward this can mean that her next refit would be needed somewhere around 1940, probably a bit sooner as she was aging. And by 1939 she was indeed starting to show signs of wear and a machinery replacement was seen as necessary in the near future, but by then Renown, Valiant and Queen Elizabeth were being reconstructed so there was no free place in the deep refit schedule. It was estimated that she could last until 1941 if nursed along which would work out for a 1939-1940 start of rebuilding. But I'm guessing this was based on peacetime steaming, not wartime tempo.
Her powerplant was not worn out by 'interwar showing the flag', it was a combination of age and it being nine years since her machinery had gotten its mid-life refit. Hood was hardly left alone after 1931 - she received smaller refits and modernizations: two weeks in 1932, one month in summer 1934, three and a half months in 1936, a month and a half in 1937, another month in 1938, seven months in 1939, two months in 1940 and finally two more months in 1941. This did not involve major engine repairs which were not necessary until 1939 or so, and in late 1939 the war broke out.
Ironically, if her machinery had started playing up in 1935-1936, one of the other ships would have forfeit their turn and Hood would have gotten a rebuilt instead. But at that point she was smack in the middle between major refits. She would simply have gotten the next spot for rebuilding in 1939-1940 when she was due for a major refit anyway.
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Spectre
eternal servant to the Fire/EMS gods
- Location
- NY
here's the thing though, Hood's Engines shouldn't have been that bad of a shape after only nine years that she was stripping turbines trying to run at full power and her crew couldn't shower because her condensers crapped out and her pipes have so many leaks they can't keep the boilers filled. For comparison the Tennessee and Colorado class battleships (which were roughly the same age and were still operating on their original machinery) weren't suffering any of the problems that Hood was. In fact Maryland and Tennessee made it through the war without any work on their machinery.