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A Sword Without a Hilt: A Song of Ice and Fire/D&D 3.5 Crossover

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We can always tell Dallas that we will kill her unless someone speaks in her favor and force her to use the oath to get Waymars sister to speak for her.
 
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Adhoc vote count started by Artemis1992 on Mar 17, 2018 at 11:18 AM, finished with 166107 posts and 18 votes.
  • [X] Plan "These things happen to teach lessons, and then Viserys bails you out of the fire"
    -[X] "To be perfectly honest my Lord? They would be beyond foolish to ask what would be beyond the means or overruling the expectations of a young girl of a noble house not yet even flowered. What could a girl of her years yet do without personal power at her own command but for the ear of her Lord father? If it was beyond such means and they asked it anyway, foolish are they in the doing, then, since they would answer to her relatives and their allies."
    -[X] "Such open ended favors exchanged with strangers are not what I would recommend any person make without desperation guiding them, but then anyone could have made such a promise not many years ago and without the eyes and ears of the Gods weighing heavily upon them. The world is closer to the stories of yore than it is to the one either of our fathers lived in, which is why I stress the importance of educating... everyone, about the dangers that we face, both from men who dabble in sorcery, have the ears of gods, or whatever else ilk preys upon the misconceptions of mankind this day."
    -[X] "As to what can be done? I doubt fire and steel should be necessary to absolve her of the favor owed... if but mere words were exchanged between they and I. I admit I am interested in what kind of person would even be interested in holding such a promise over the head of a child in her position. But beyond my curiosity I also have a duty. The sister of my friend, close in my council besides, has placed herself in a position that I feel she would not be in if I had only made contact with you sooner. But holding blame like packages to be weighted and passed around... it sounds pointless. No doubt if they hold such designs as you imagine upon her, they will come to regret them before long."
    [X] Assure Royce that you have talked to a higher-ranking servant of the Old Gods about it. The Godspeaker has gotten a message that abusing this favor would make us her enemies and her gods are unlikely to protect her from that.
    [X] Plan Crake + Promises
    -[X] "To be perfectly honest my Lord? They would be beyond foolish to ask what would be beyond the means or overruling the expectations of a young girl of a noble house not yet even flowered. What could a girl of her years yet do without personal power at her own command but for the ear of her Lord father? If it was beyond such means and they asked it anyway, foolish are they in the doing, then, since they would answer to her relatives and their allies."
    -[X] "Such open ended favors exchanged with strangers are not what I would recommend any person make without desperation guiding them, but then anyone could have made such a promise not many years ago and without the eyes and ears of the Gods weighing heavily upon them. The world is closer to the stories of yore than it is to the one either of our fathers lived in, which is why I stress the importance of educating... everyone, about the dangers that we face, both from men who dabble in sorcery, have the ears of gods, or whatever else ilk preys upon the misconceptions of mankind this day."
    -[X] "As to what can be done? I doubt fire and steel should be necessary to absolve her of the favor owed... but mere words exchanged between they and I. I admit I am interested in what kind of person would even be interested in holding such a promise over the head of a child in her position. But beyond my curiosity I also have a duty. The sister of my friend, close in my council besides, has placed herself in a position that I feel she would not be in if I had only made contact with you sooner. But holding blame like packages to be weighted and passed around... it sounds pointless. Regardless, even if they hold such designs as you imagine upon her, I do not plan on leaving it to fester over your house, but will resolve it promptly now that I'm in the Vale. "
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Artemis1992 said:
Is it her favor?
Or to the Clans or the Gods or whoever?
I'm not sure killing Dalla would help the situation much, she has still sworn before the gods.

And we can't find Dalla now and easily.
If she provokes us we will hunt her down, but for now that's quite the investment of effort.
We'd need to give Ysilla the Wayfinder and then fly to find her, I guess.
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The oath was to Dalla, a favor for a favor. We don't need to visit her to talk to her, we can use the same connections (Old Gods, Bloodraven) we share, and the same way she talked to us. The mere threat of us hunting her down and killing her should make her amiable to getting what she can now out of the favor, when the alternative is making us her personal enemy with our attention on her.

I'm not actually proposing we kill her. She is smart enough to see that asking her favor now, to get something material from Viserys, is a good deal, and that refusing is a bad deal.
 
[X] Assure Royce that you have talked to a higher-ranking servant of the Old Gods about it. The Godspeaker has gotten a message that abusing this favor would make us her enemies and her gods are unlikely to protect her from that.
 
Please people, explain to Yohn the nature of our agreement with the old gods.
The logical Next step from "Oh, the old gods listen to him" is "how did he make then listen?"
And then his mind goes to whatever he must have heard, Blood sacrifices and ritual. He has to ask himself, is he no different from the mountain Clans?
 
Diomedon, the point is that we don't need to do any of that, because we already did.

Let me reiterate: She worships Trees. Tree Jesus told her to ask for something harmless.

Nothing needs to be done.
 
das_slash said:
Please people, explain to Yohn the nature of our agreement with the old gods.
The logical Next step from "Oh, the old gods listen to him" is "how did he make then listen?"
And then his mind goes to whatever he must have heard, Blood sacrifices and ritual. He has to ask himself, is he no different from the mountain Clans?
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Yohn sent a spy to Sorcerer's Deep, one who probably witnessed us growing the Healing Tree if he was really there for the wildfire. I think it's safe to say our connection with the Old Gods is out in the open. Any claims that we have the Old Gods' favor will be believed.
 
TotallyNotEvil said:
"I've talked directly with her gods, and come to an agreement" does point to a big freaking lever.
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It's not one Royce understands. Not really. His daughter is still not safe, and Viserys is asking him to sit and do nothing and just trust him? He wont like it, and he'll do his best to kill Dalla to protect his daughter and end this threat to his family. Not while the favor still exists unasked.

TotallyNotEvil said:
Diomedon, the point is that we don't need to do any of that, because we already did.

Let me reiterate: She worships Trees. Tree Jesus told her to ask for something harmless.

Nothing needs to be done.
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Let me reiterate. As long as the favor is unresolved, Yohn will not see it as resolved, and his daughter will still be under threat in his mind. He does not trust wildlings, or their reasoning. Saying she wont ask for something unreasonable because "reasons" will fall flat, because he doesn't not expect reason from wildlings.
 
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Adhoc vote count started by Goldfish on Mar 17, 2018 at 11:27 AM, finished with 166118 posts and 20 votes.
  • [X] Assure Royce that you have talked to a higher-ranking servant of the Old Gods about it. The Godspeaker has gotten a message that abusing this favor would make us her enemies and her gods are unlikely to protect her from that.
    [X] Plan "These things happen to teach lessons, and then Viserys bails you out of the fire"
    -[X] "To be perfectly honest my Lord? They would be beyond foolish to ask what would be beyond the means or overruling the expectations of a young girl of a noble house not yet even flowered. What could a girl of her years yet do without personal power at her own command but for the ear of her Lord father? If it was beyond such means and they asked it anyway, foolish are they in the doing, then, since they would answer to her relatives and their allies."
    -[X] "Such open ended favors exchanged with strangers are not what I would recommend any person make without desperation guiding them, but then anyone could have made such a promise not many years ago and without the eyes and ears of the Gods weighing heavily upon them. The world is closer to the stories of yore than it is to the one either of our fathers lived in, which is why I stress the importance of educating... everyone, about the dangers that we face, both from men who dabble in sorcery, have the ears of gods, or whatever else ilk preys upon the misconceptions of mankind this day."
    -[X] "As to what can be done? I doubt fire and steel should be necessary to absolve her of the favor owed... if but mere words were exchanged between they and I. I admit I am interested in what kind of person would even be interested in holding such a promise over the head of a child in her position. But beyond my curiosity I also have a duty. The sister of my friend, close in my council besides, has placed herself in a position that I feel she would not be in if I had only made contact with you sooner. But holding blame like packages to be weighted and passed around... it sounds pointless. No doubt if they hold such designs as you imagine upon her, they will come to regret them before long."
    [X] Plan Crake + Promises
    -[X] "To be perfectly honest my Lord? They would be beyond foolish to ask what would be beyond the means or overruling the expectations of a young girl of a noble house not yet even flowered. What could a girl of her years yet do without personal power at her own command but for the ear of her Lord father? If it was beyond such means and they asked it anyway, foolish are they in the doing, then, since they would answer to her relatives and their allies."
    -[X] "Such open ended favors exchanged with strangers are not what I would recommend any person make without desperation guiding them, but then anyone could have made such a promise not many years ago and without the eyes and ears of the Gods weighing heavily upon them. The world is closer to the stories of yore than it is to the one either of our fathers lived in, which is why I stress the importance of educating... everyone, about the dangers that we face, both from men who dabble in sorcery, have the ears of gods, or whatever else ilk preys upon the misconceptions of mankind this day."
    -[X] "As to what can be done? I doubt fire and steel should be necessary to absolve her of the favor owed... but mere words exchanged between they and I. I admit I am interested in what kind of person would even be interested in holding such a promise over the head of a child in her position. But beyond my curiosity I also have a duty. The sister of my friend, close in my council besides, has placed herself in a position that I feel she would not be in if I had only made contact with you sooner. But holding blame like packages to be weighted and passed around... it sounds pointless. Regardless, even if they hold such designs as you imagine upon her, I do not plan on leaving it to fester over your house, but will resolve it promptly now that I'm in the Vale. "
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I like Artimises vote, but feel like it could be more explicit? Like

1 The wildling gets her power from worshipping gods
2 We have more sway with her gods than she does (point to Heart trees the spy saw)
3 This means she can't piss us off and have her connection to the gods stay intact
4 See point 1 for why she wouldnt want that
 
Okay, let me draw a parallel.

This is like a Tiamat Cleric having acquired some blood of Rhaella's that can be used in magical rituals against her. Then Bahamut shows up and says, "I spoke to the cleric, and made it clear that if they used that blood they would be destroyed. There is no need to do anything, the matter is resolved." Would we be happy with Bahamut? Would we not do anything and sit on our butts? I highly doubt it, and I doubt that our opinion of Bahamut would be improved.

Alternatively, if Bahamut intervened by saying he's working on intervening, and then shortly afterwards the vial of blood is returned to us due to his intervention, we would think much better of him, and actually feel the threat is resolved.

Which one do we want to be?
 
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[X] Diomedon
Eh, just like tomorrow' presidential election in Russia, this vote changes nothing, but at least I feel good.
That I mangled my blank, that is.
Sorry, @Crake <3
 
Diomedon said:
Okay, let me draw a parallel.

This is like a Tiamat Cleric having acquired some blood of Rhaella's that can be used in magical rituals against her. Then Bahamut shows up and says, "I spoke to the cleric, and made it clear that if they used that blood they would be destroyed. There is no need to do anything, the matter is resolved." Would we be happy with Bahamut? Would we not do anything and sit on our butts? I highly doubt it, and I doubt that our opinion of Bahamut would be improved.

Alternatively, if Bahamut intervened by saying he's working on intervening, and then shortly afterwards the vial of blood is returned to us due to his intervention, we would think much better of him, and actually feel the threat is resolved.

Which one do we want to be?
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That's not really a parelell?

More like, if Dany was still Tiamat's high priestress and she had assured us that she had a talk with the Cleric in question and she would send him straight to the Ninth Circle of Hell if he fucks with us, then I at least would accept that as done and over.

This comes from Waymar as much as Viserys here, from Royce's perspective.
 
Artemis1992 said:
That's not really a parelell?

More like, if Dany was still Tiamat's high priestress and she had assured us that she had a talk with the Cleric in question and she would send him straight to the Ninth Circle of Hell if he fucks with us, then I at least would accept that as done and over.

This comes from Waymar as much as Viserys here, from Royce's perspective.
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You're nitpicking at small details. The larger picture remains the same of "enemy action," followed by assurance from someone who is not an ally that their mere words will protect the ones the love, while the threat remains.

All I'm arguing for is the small concession that we tell Yohn that we will see that the matter is resolved so his daughter is safe. Why don't we want to? It's an easy win for political points and earning personal loyalty, when the entire purpose of our visit is...earning political goodwill with Yohn and earning his families personal loyalty.
 
Diomedon said:
You're nitpicking at small details. The larger picture remains the same of "enemy action," followed by assurance from someone who is not an ally that their mere words will protect the ones the love, while the threat remains.
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We do have Waymar backing our word here.
Diomedon said:
All I'm arguing for is the small concession that we tell Yohn that we will see that the matter is resolved so his daughter is safe. Why don't we want to? It's an easy win for political points and earning personal loyalty, when the entire purpose of our visit it...earning political goodwill with Yohn and earning his families personal loyalty.
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I'm just not seeing a way to do it quickly and efficiently.

We can't directly contact Dalla by any means we know of, jsut getting in contact with Bloodraven takes days of meditation.
And hunting her down personally would take days as well as taking Ysilla with us to use the Wayfinder.

It's just very impractical unless the OGs offer some Deus ex Machina to help us.
 
Does this work:
[X] Artemis1992
-[X] Mention that we are going to strongly suggest that the witch in question formulate the favor along rhe lines of "get me a PfE amulet" to Ysilla, and that if that works, we just give Ysilla one to give to Dalla. If she asks for anything that takes more effort or is perlious, then her clan dies.

@all, can we not ask Ysilla to morph into what Dalla looks like (disguise ribbon) and then scry her from that image?

@Diomedon - we just have to find a way to find a woman with no idea what she looks like or have any scryable materials - maybe Ysilla has something that belongs to a clan memeber?
 
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Artemis1992 said:
We do have Waymar backing our word here.

I'm just not seeing a way to do it quickly and efficiently.

We can't directly contact Dalla by any means we know of, jsut getting in contact with Bloodraven takes days of meditation.
And hunting her down personally would take days as well as taking Ysilla with us to use the Wayfinder.

It's just very impractical unless the OGs offer some Deus ex Machina to help us.
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She contacted us, so it should be reasonable she counts as familiar enough for us to contact her back via sending. If not, we can personally scry her with Blood Wish (and teleport back to SD and have Dany and Lya scry for her as well). As soon as we start prodding in that direction, even if we fail, Bloodraven will probably tell her to contact us.
 
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