- Location
- Voidbetweenstars
She put a hole though the ship to hit someone, also her beams were nonlethal.
Crystalwatcher's Magical Girl Quest!
- Thread starter Crystalwatcher
- Start date
- Original
I'm aware? I included that in my calculations. Assuming maximum possible damage, on turn 2 her reversed passive 75% healing would reduce her below -12,000, and then the further damage done to her that turn would mean that she's reduce to below -12,000 on turn 3. If White Souls Overwhelming Presence effect of "reduce Super Abilities effectiveness by 50%" means that Nepgears "survive with 1 HP" triggers every two turns, that would result in Nepgear dying.
If it's anything other then the maximum possible damage, or that effect remains something that can be triggered every turn, then White Soul can't kill her.
Crystalwatcher
(Verified GM)
- Location
- Limbo
The save from death isn't effected, since 1 can't be effectively divided in this case.
Anastasia doesn't know enough to answer this question.
- Location
- UTC -6
I keep thinking Summit would actually be useful in this circumstance -- except for the high likelihood she'd have gotten herself dead against Grey Champion.We need a way to make White Soul back off to give Solid Core a chance to thump the barrier carefully. It's time to make the Apocalypse Ability work for us. How kind of her to put out team-mates behind a shield.
[X] Plan Big Booms
-[X] Start blasting with Purifier Beam at your own feet and sweeping towards White Soul. Aim for as much AOE as you can as long as you avoid engulfing the barrier.
-[X] If White Soul backs away and gives a lull try to hit the barrier to weaken it, aim away from where Insight is located.
-[X] If White Soul moves to the barrier curse and fly far enough away that she can't reach you quickly.
- Location
- Little Rock, AR
Okay. This again sounds a your trapped with me sitation. Why don't we get on the barrier and shoit literally everything but the barrier. Ko white soul by hitting literally everyplace she can be at once and survive the backlash of icore and our save from death.
What does instinct say about this?
Then the answer is "White Soul can't kill Nepgear", at least without assistance from others/the environment.
Anyone curious, I made a spreadsheet: Damage calculations
ConfusedPotato
Unverified Verifier
- Location
- Australia
Is there a way to talk sense into her? Like therapy?
Well, if the actual brands that maintain the barrier are inside our current room, then flying around the room aimlessly with Core Purge should destroy them. We don't know enough to know if they're even inside the room though.
I'm very hesitant to use Core Purge though when we already are losing a lot of HP each turn.
I'm very hesitant to use Core Purge though when we already are losing a lot of HP each turn.
That means that for Nepgear this is purely a Puzzle Boss. There is still a time limit though, since we don't know how much that shrinking barrier can hurt our allies when it gets small enough.
Crystalwatcher
(Verified GM)
- Location
- Limbo
Does Smite work well against magical barriers? That should give just enough power to overload it, right?
So Gore17 did some calcs on how it should be impossible for White Soul to kill Nepgear. I want to try and verify that.
Turn 1:
Nepgear's Health = 1hp
Segarite Core: -4,500
Solid Core: 1 - 4,500 = -4,499
Revel In Darkness: -1,125
Solid Core: -4,499 - 1,125 = -5,624
Turn 2:
Nepgear's Health = -7,639hp
Segarite Core: -4,500
Solid Core: -7,639 - 4,500 = -12,139
Indestructible Core Last Save Triggers!
Solid Core: 1hp
Revel In Darkness: -1
Solid Core: 1 - 1 = 0
Turn 3:
Nepgear's Health = -2,015hp
Segarite Core: -4,500
Solid Core: -2,015 - 4,500 = -6,515
Revel In Darkness: -1,629
Solid Core: -6,515 - 1,629 = -8,144
Turn 4:
Nepgear's Health = -10,159hp
Segarite Core: -4,500
Solid Core: -10,159 - 4,500 = -14,659
Indestructible Core Last Save Triggers!
Solid Core: 1hp
Revel In Darkness: -1
Solid Core: 1 - 1 = 0
So while it's certainly a close thing it seems that even in a worst case scenario it's quite literally impossible for White Soul to kill Nepgear. Even if our save only triggers once every two turns.
Turn 1:
Nepgear's Health = 1hp
Segarite Core: -4,500
Solid Core: 1 - 4,500 = -4,499
Revel In Darkness: -1,125
Solid Core: -4,499 - 1,125 = -5,624
Soul Rend: 10,000 Base Damage, No Dice = 10,000 Total Damage
Solid Core: 2,600 Base Resilience, +1 Dice = 2,601 Damage Reduction
7,399 Total End Damage
50% Indestructible Core
50% No Longer Human
1,850 Final End Damage
Solid Core: -5,624 - 1,850 = -7,474 Total Health Remaining
Solid Core: 2,600 Base Resilience, +1 Dice = 2,601 Damage Reduction
7,399 Total End Damage
50% Indestructible Core
50% No Longer Human
1,850 Final End Damage
Solid Core: -5,624 - 1,850 = -7,474 Total Health Remaining
The White River: 1,000 Base Damage, No Dice, +520 Armor Pierce (False) = 1,520 Total Damage
Solid Core: 2,600 Base Resilience, +1 Dice, -1,300 Unstoppable (False) = 1,301 Damage Reduction
219 Total End Damage
50% Indestructible Core
50% No Longer Human
55 Final End Damage
Solid Core: -7,474 - 55 = -7,529 Total Health Remaining
Solid Core: 2,600 Base Resilience, +1 Dice, -1,300 Unstoppable (False) = 1,301 Damage Reduction
219 Total End Damage
50% Indestructible Core
50% No Longer Human
55 Final End Damage
Solid Core: -7,474 - 55 = -7,529 Total Health Remaining
The White River: 1,000 Base Damage, No Dice, +520 Armor Pierce (False) = 1,520 Total Damage
Solid Core: 2,600 Base Resilience, +1 Dice, -1,300 Unstoppable (False) = 1,301 Damage Reduction
219 Total End Damage
50% Indestructible Core
50% No Longer Human
55 Final End Damage
Solid Core: -7,529 - 55 = -7,584 Total Health Remaining
Solid Core: 2,600 Base Resilience, +1 Dice, -1,300 Unstoppable (False) = 1,301 Damage Reduction
219 Total End Damage
50% Indestructible Core
50% No Longer Human
55 Final End Damage
Solid Core: -7,529 - 55 = -7,584 Total Health Remaining
The White River: 1,000 Base Damage, No Dice, +520 Armor Pierce (False) = 1,520 Total Damage
Solid Core: 2,600 Base Resilience, +1 Dice, -1,300 Unstoppable (False) = 1,301 Damage Reduction
219 Total End Damage
50% Indestructible Core
50% No Longer Human
55 Final End Damage
Solid Core: -7,584 - 55 = -7,639 Total Health Remaining
Solid Core: 2,600 Base Resilience, +1 Dice, -1,300 Unstoppable (False) = 1,301 Damage Reduction
219 Total End Damage
50% Indestructible Core
50% No Longer Human
55 Final End Damage
Solid Core: -7,584 - 55 = -7,639 Total Health Remaining
Turn 2:
Nepgear's Health = -7,639hp
Segarite Core: -4,500
Solid Core: -7,639 - 4,500 = -12,139
Indestructible Core Last Save Triggers!
Solid Core: 1hp
Revel In Darkness: -1
Solid Core: 1 - 1 = 0
Soul Rend: 10,000 Base Damage, No Dice = 10,000 Total Damage
Solid Core: 2,600 Base Resilience, +1 Dice = 2,601 Damage Reduction
7,399 Total End Damage
50% Indestructible Core
50% No Longer Human
1,850 Final End Damage
Solid Core: 0 - 1,850 = -1,850 Total Health Remaining
Solid Core: 2,600 Base Resilience, +1 Dice = 2,601 Damage Reduction
7,399 Total End Damage
50% Indestructible Core
50% No Longer Human
1,850 Final End Damage
Solid Core: 0 - 1,850 = -1,850 Total Health Remaining
The White River: 1,000 Base Damage, No Dice, +520 Armor Pierce (False) = 1,520 Total Damage
Solid Core: 2,600 Base Resilience, +1 Dice, -1,300 Unstoppable (False) = 1,301 Damage Reduction
219 Total End Damage
50% Indestructible Core
50% No Longer Human
55 Final End Damage
Solid Core: -1,850 - 55 = -1,905 Total Health Remaining
Solid Core: 2,600 Base Resilience, +1 Dice, -1,300 Unstoppable (False) = 1,301 Damage Reduction
219 Total End Damage
50% Indestructible Core
50% No Longer Human
55 Final End Damage
Solid Core: -1,850 - 55 = -1,905 Total Health Remaining
The White River: 1,000 Base Damage, No Dice, +520 Armor Pierce (False) = 1,520 Total Damage
Solid Core: 2,600 Base Resilience, +1 Dice, -1,300 Unstoppable (False) = 1,301 Damage Reduction
219 Total End Damage
50% Indestructible Core
50% No Longer Human
55 Final End Damage
Solid Core: -1,905 - 55 = -1,960 Total Health Remaining
Solid Core: 2,600 Base Resilience, +1 Dice, -1,300 Unstoppable (False) = 1,301 Damage Reduction
219 Total End Damage
50% Indestructible Core
50% No Longer Human
55 Final End Damage
Solid Core: -1,905 - 55 = -1,960 Total Health Remaining
The White River: 1,000 Base Damage, No Dice, +520 Armor Pierce (False) = 1,520 Total Damage
Solid Core: 2,600 Base Resilience, +1 Dice, -1,300 Unstoppable (False) = 1,301 Damage Reduction
219 Total End Damage
50% Indestructible Core
50% No Longer Human
55 Final End Damage
Solid Core: -1,960 - 55 = -2,015 Total Health Remaining
Solid Core: 2,600 Base Resilience, +1 Dice, -1,300 Unstoppable (False) = 1,301 Damage Reduction
219 Total End Damage
50% Indestructible Core
50% No Longer Human
55 Final End Damage
Solid Core: -1,960 - 55 = -2,015 Total Health Remaining
Nepgear's Health = -2,015hp
Segarite Core: -4,500
Solid Core: -2,015 - 4,500 = -6,515
Revel In Darkness: -1,629
Solid Core: -6,515 - 1,629 = -8,144
Soul Rend: 10,000 Base Damage, No Dice = 10,000 Total Damage
Solid Core: 2,600 Base Resilience, +1 Dice = 2,601 Damage Reduction
7,399 Total End Damage
50% Indestructible Core
50% No Longer Human
1,850 Final End Damage
Solid Core: -8,144 - 1,850 = -9,994 Total Health Remaining
Solid Core: 2,600 Base Resilience, +1 Dice = 2,601 Damage Reduction
7,399 Total End Damage
50% Indestructible Core
50% No Longer Human
1,850 Final End Damage
Solid Core: -8,144 - 1,850 = -9,994 Total Health Remaining
The White River: 1,000 Base Damage, No Dice, +520 Armor Pierce (False) = 1,520 Total Damage
Solid Core: 2,600 Base Resilience, +1 Dice, -1,300 Unstoppable (False) = 1,301 Damage Reduction
219 Total End Damage
50% Indestructible Core
50% No Longer Human
55 Final End Damage
Solid Core: -9,994 - 55 = -10,049 Total Health Remaining
Solid Core: 2,600 Base Resilience, +1 Dice, -1,300 Unstoppable (False) = 1,301 Damage Reduction
219 Total End Damage
50% Indestructible Core
50% No Longer Human
55 Final End Damage
Solid Core: -9,994 - 55 = -10,049 Total Health Remaining
The White River: 1,000 Base Damage, No Dice, +520 Armor Pierce (False) = 1,520 Total Damage
Solid Core: 2,600 Base Resilience, +1 Dice, -1,300 Unstoppable (False) = 1,301 Damage Reduction
219 Total End Damage
50% Indestructible Core
50% No Longer Human
55 Final End Damage
Solid Core: -10,049 - 55 = -10,104 Total Health Remaining
Solid Core: 2,600 Base Resilience, +1 Dice, -1,300 Unstoppable (False) = 1,301 Damage Reduction
219 Total End Damage
50% Indestructible Core
50% No Longer Human
55 Final End Damage
Solid Core: -10,049 - 55 = -10,104 Total Health Remaining
The White River: 1,000 Base Damage, No Dice, +520 Armor Pierce (False) = 1,520 Total Damage
Solid Core: 2,600 Base Resilience, +1 Dice, -1,300 Unstoppable (False) = 1,301 Damage Reduction
219 Total End Damage
50% Indestructible Core
50% No Longer Human
55 Final End Damage
Solid Core: -10,104 - 55 = -10,159 Total Health Remaining
Solid Core: 2,600 Base Resilience, +1 Dice, -1,300 Unstoppable (False) = 1,301 Damage Reduction
219 Total End Damage
50% Indestructible Core
50% No Longer Human
55 Final End Damage
Solid Core: -10,104 - 55 = -10,159 Total Health Remaining
Nepgear's Health = -10,159hp
Segarite Core: -4,500
Solid Core: -10,159 - 4,500 = -14,659
Indestructible Core Last Save Triggers!
Solid Core: 1hp
Revel In Darkness: -1
Solid Core: 1 - 1 = 0
So while it's certainly a close thing it seems that even in a worst case scenario it's quite literally impossible for White Soul to kill Nepgear. Even if our save only triggers once every two turns.
- Location
- madison
... oh my god. oh my god! our gun is useful! she doesn't know it has a determinately large blast radius! it only has one setting! "hit everything on the battlefield" or fucking once we are in a fight where that works in our favor! she separated use form our allies! we can finally have a fight where our "super" ability isn't going to fuck us! we can just shoot her! wam bam tactical nuke incoming!
oh, hmm. ok we lead her away from the edge of the barrir, which we can do because she seems to like staying close, then turn of beam extenders and aim to catch her in the splash zone rather than directly at her. that should be enough to avoid breaking the barrier. I just really want to be able to actually fucking use the weapon we sunk so much exp into.
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So, as this fight seems likely to devolve into the realm of farce if Nepgear doesn't shut off her defenses with Core Purge and make a gigantic gamble (or at least it would if not for the time limit our teammates have), it's probably time to start thinking about what possible tack could be taken to win advantage via social combat. (There is of course one major problem regarding outright winning via social combat: White Soul presumably has a control seal (actually, come to think of it, does she spawn a new control seal on every clone, or is she just doing Ni's bidding for Reasons?)).
We don't want to try to follow up the tactics that her prior victims probably used (appealing to her rather 'better nature', pleading with her, calling her crazy, etc.). My initial thought is to take advantage of the one thing those previous fights didn't have: Red Rose's presence. White Soul is obsessed with Red Rose in... I'm honestly not sure what way precisely other than 'crazily'. But Red Rose is here, and White Soul actually opened something of a dialogue regarding their relationship, so I think it's at least worth our while to include something in that regard for Nepgear's angry shouting to aim at as the fight progresses.
We don't want to try to follow up the tactics that her prior victims probably used (appealing to her rather 'better nature', pleading with her, calling her crazy, etc.). My initial thought is to take advantage of the one thing those previous fights didn't have: Red Rose's presence. White Soul is obsessed with Red Rose in... I'm honestly not sure what way precisely other than 'crazily'. But Red Rose is here, and White Soul actually opened something of a dialogue regarding their relationship, so I think it's at least worth our while to include something in that regard for Nepgear's angry shouting to aim at as the fight progresses.
- Location
- UTC -6
...
None of the girls we met were trying to kill Red Rose, just wear down her friends for when White Soul fought. Irene wouldn't want to let just anyone kill her beloved Amanda.
And once White Soul has managed that she just needs to get back to Goddess Red and have Red Rose brought back. It's her quote on the character sheet. I'm a bit afraid White Soul is going to want to keep Red Rose as some sort of crippled pet at the current rate.
(BTW: Shapeshift is some serious bullshit. She emulated four abilities with a level 4 weapon.)
None of the girls we met were trying to kill Red Rose, just wear down her friends for when White Soul fought. Irene wouldn't want to let just anyone kill her beloved Amanda.
And once White Soul has managed that she just needs to get back to Goddess Red and have Red Rose brought back. It's her quote on the character sheet. I'm a bit afraid White Soul is going to want to keep Red Rose as some sort of crippled pet at the current rate.
(BTW: Shapeshift is some serious bullshit. She emulated four abilities with a level 4 weapon.)
You forget that Soul Rend has a Magic Modifier of 3,000. Also, Indestructible Core reduces it to 51% currently. And finally, each body has its own weapon and attacks per turn, though they share spells per turn.
Of course, I just realized I forgot to apply Indestructible Core and No Longer Human to White River in my calculations, which is something I've now fixed.
Are you sure about that? Because I grabbed the 50% thing from our fight with Solar Radiance:
Seeing as she reduced the effectiveness of Defensive Abilities by 50%:
and White Soul reduces supers by 50%:
it seems like they'd both drop ICORE down to a 50% reduction rather then a 49% reduction.
Crystal got lazy, and it didn't particularly matter.
Wouldn't regular attacks splash off of Indestructible Core's lolnope?
Even at the threshold reduced to 50%, White River's ~1500dmg is not enough.
Also, Revel in Darkness' Description:
Even at the threshold reduced to 50%, White River's ~1500dmg is not enough.
Also, Revel in Darkness' Description:
Why isn't that countered by this?
You don't get a more clear DoT description than literally 'damage per turn'...
- Location
- Voidbetweenstars
I think it means things like she cant die from a poison or bleeding out, being hit by magical AOE every turn however isn't.
As expected, it's not just "kill her".
I wonder where she heard about that? I'm pretty sure we got it after she left the base. Has she been keeping an eye on us? Or maybe she heard from Rei before we arrived.
Really? It looked to me like Brilliant Key and Solid Core were MVP on the mooks. Aquila was helpful that one time, but not necessary. Though the grenades probably would have seen use if it had been just Insight, Brilliant and Red.
Aww, nobody's bringing up the Goddess Gold option?
More Brandcraft. Lovely.
Ambush tactics. Of course.
Revel In Darkness unaffected by ICORE. Wonderful.
And the Panzer Blade's collateral damage/extended blade/whatever is uncontrolled enough that we can't swing without hitting the necropolis. Are only my bad guesses coming true? No, wait, there was Red Rose's feelings about White Soul, that was a good one.
Wait, what? She gets both a fake Armor Pierce and Unstoppable? But Unstoppable is a derivative of Armor Pierce! And Armor Pierce should be on Solid Core's line. Also: Armor Pierce is reduced from 25% of Base Resilience to 20%, and Unstoppable from "all resistances" to "50% of Base Resilience", i.e. less than Juggernaut.
Seriously? She must have met lots of girls who could ignore that.
Yup! We've gotten all the others, she's the only one left!
So, Revel In Darkness doesn't penetrate the Brandcraft barrier? Interesting.
I expect crys to bring the room down before we exhaust its Health. Remember, that represents the entire necropolis, otherwise it wouldn't have kept the damage from Grey.
@Gore17: Revel In Darkness procs at start of turn; your calcs have it at end of turn.
@UberJJK: You forgot Soul Rend's Magic Modifier and the Existence Bonuses that would apply to it. This adds +700 Damage/Turn, not quite enough to kill us even if the save-from-death were every two turns
Yes. But first I want to put ideas out there and let people discuss them and come up with things I may have missed.
Options:
-Starshine her. First part of Controlled Panic, basically. Issues: this is going to bring down the building. The necropolis as a whole has more HP, but the room we're in isn't going to survive. The rubble will give White Soul more cover if she survives. Also, requires spending EXP, though not all that much. And it may well cause earthquakes, affecting Red Rose's footing.
-Purifier Beam. Big Booms, basically. We have a big enough AoE to kill her. Hopefully. Issues: will bring down the building, may not kill her, seismic effects.
-Core Purge. Second part of Controlled Panic. It will prevent her from using Soul Rend (can't get into melee range when LoS causes you to evaporate), and make it harder for her to hit us with the White River (she'd have to control it from far away). And there's no need to aim. Issues: she may know about it and it has a non-zero, interruptible activation time; she may have cover; if my speculation as to why Revel In Darkness bypasses ICORE is correct, we may start taking more damage from it.
-Dungeon Bypass for our allies. Depending on the shapes of the room and barriers, it may be possible for them to go through the wall. If we yell at Sega, she may realize this.
-Charge past her. There's no reason to stay here, in the battlefield she's chosen. Charge her, make her dodge, get on the other side of her. Then either try to lead her away, or press her back toward the barrier. If she crosses it—which she can, because Follow The Waves is useful like that—Red Rose can kill her, especially if we calm Sega down and have them swap places.
-We can fly. White Soul can't. Lots of ways to use that, if there's no roof, or if we carve a hole through it.
-Get help from the others while they're still trapped. Could a spell get through the barrier? Especially if it's not a direct-damage spell? I'm thinking either Insight's stun or Sega can try death by overheal.
-Destroy the barrier. It might be possible with Celestial Severance aimed away from people, but it might explode when it fails, and Insight would be screwed.
-Diplomacy! Not sure how to approach this. Especially given the last line of the update. But if we can get her to talk, well. Her obsession with Amanda is useful, because it gives us a focal point. We could say "Oh, you want her all to yourself? Fine with me, I'll let you two talk this out." We could tell her about the Control Seal, see how she reacts, suggest that it would interfere with whatever she wants to do.
I think the most important question right now is: what's the room we're in like? Is it a hallway or an open space, is there cover, is there a roof and if so how high? @crystalwatcher?
Needs a comma for proper grammar, but it's dialogue so it's not necessary.
Either a comma after "hips" or "taps"->"tapping". I prefer the latter.
Either "things"->"thing" or "doesn't"->"don't".
Em-dashes.
Or make "changeover" one word.
For trailing in there's no space between the dots and the start of the sentence. And why three periods instead of a single-character ellipsis?
No space.
Or make it one word.
Cutesy attitude?
ReaperofInterest
Herald of Disaster
@crystalwatcher, I remember you saying in the past that White Soul's Soul Rend is limited to melee. Now, just to be absolutely clear, did you mean limited to melee as in "has to physically touch Solid Core's body with her own body", or limited to melee as in "has to touch Solid Core's body with her weapon"?
- Location
- Earth
Regarding Starshine...
My memory is a little fuzzy, but Target:Army does only trigger when attacking an army, yes?
Because if that is the case, its calculation would be like this (done for lv 17) :
Due to its nature of being hundreds of beams of light and not just a single attack, it should hit White Soul no matter where she vanishes to, even if she gets... whatever, 80% reduction due to being able to dodge most of it... that would still be enough to kill her in one spell. It would probably bring down the roof, but that could not really faze Solid Core. Plus, due to how she can direct Starshine at least somewhat, not all damage might splash onto the building itself.
Now people are right in that Insight might be in trouble if the roof comes down on her; however, not finishing this fight as soon as possible will make the barrier she is trapped in shrink even more and effectively kill her anyway.
We could just call out to Sega and Red Rose to cover her, though. A falling building is basically nothing to Solid Drive and Red Rose.
So... Plan Controlled Panic does look fine with the contingencies, although it might be prudent to add a note about telling our allies to protect Insight, @ReaperofInterest?
My memory is a little fuzzy, but Target:Army does only trigger when attacking an army, yes?
Because if that is the case, its calculation would be like this (done for lv 17) :
Due to its nature of being hundreds of beams of light and not just a single attack, it should hit White Soul no matter where she vanishes to, even if she gets... whatever, 80% reduction due to being able to dodge most of it... that would still be enough to kill her in one spell. It would probably bring down the roof, but that could not really faze Solid Core. Plus, due to how she can direct Starshine at least somewhat, not all damage might splash onto the building itself.
Now people are right in that Insight might be in trouble if the roof comes down on her; however, not finishing this fight as soon as possible will make the barrier she is trapped in shrink even more and effectively kill her anyway.
We could just call out to Sega and Red Rose to cover her, though. A falling building is basically nothing to Solid Drive and Red Rose.
So... Plan Controlled Panic does look fine with the contingencies, although it might be prudent to add a note about telling our allies to protect Insight, @ReaperofInterest?
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The solution is to fly up to the ceiling and then aim Starshine at the floor.
It requires an attack to be over 49% of Nepgears current health, which is decreasing. Currently, it does indeed bounce off.
Also, the ability technically applies itself to all valid targets in range each turn immediately. DoT effects linger, with the attacks full damage occurring, well, over time.