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Usagi Quest (CK3/Princess Maker) (Sailor Moon)

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FictionPack said:
The timeline of clientage is 2 to 4 turns from now. A month away in Quest.
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Getting the transfer of 1200 people set up and smoothed over may legitimately be hard for us to do in two weeks while also prosecuting operations against all the magical villain groups we want to beat up.

And the first paragraph of the "ATTENTION" instructions says future turns will be one week long. So 2-4 turns is 2-4 weeks.

Eternal_0bserver said:
Yes, but I honestly don't think Usagi wouldn't consider herself somewhat responsible even if she decides not to become their suzerain. Part of being a kind and compassionate person I guess.
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Yes, but it's a matter of degree and of how much of the work we're undertaking to do in advance just because we're nice, versus how much we're promising to do because we're a feudal overlady and good feudal overladies look out for their vassals.

A promise like that probably isn't insignificant in terms of how much extra obligation it puts Usagi under, or makes Usagi feel like she's under. The only other people in her life she's made those levels of personal guarantees to are her family and her Senshi.

FictionPack said:
And when MCAT asks how they got here? Then why we didn't tell them? It needlessly harms our working relationship with MCAT, we have never decided not to loop them in to matters such as this.
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Perhaps you misunderstand me.

When I say "get away with" I don't mean "zero consequences." I mean "any problems or working relationship damage that result can be smoothed over by the natural course of future events, without undue, extensive disruption." Making things go trouble-free is always a much, much higher threshold than making things go at all.

We might get away with 'moderate' amounts of trouble if we just arbitrarily dropped the Amazons into Nerima without notifying anyone, is what I'm saying.

We'd have significantly MORE difficulty dodging moderate to severe amounts of trouble if we insert ourselves into the situation as matron, not just as deliverer. It's a matter of increased severity and degree, not of "some versus none."

Spart117MC said:
The Senshi aren't equipped to carry out the day-to-day business of running a village of Amazons, true, but then they won't have to because the current leaders of the village are going to come with the rest.
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Honestly, if the Amazons were already settled in a little rural village and minding their own business most of the time (something they know how to do), I think that clientage would be a relatively low effort thing for exactly this reason.

Trouble is, the Amazons are a refugee population with no place to call home (unless someone gives them one), who have been uprooted from their traditional way of life, and who will be coming into contact with very large populations of foreigners unfamiliar with their ways.

Under those conditions, being "leader of their people" or a nominal overlady who is above the leaders of their people is going to be... rather more labor-intensive.

EDIT:

To be very, very, very clear, I'm not categorically saying "we shouldn't do it."

I'm saying "we need to be prepared for this to be a big responsibility, in sort of the sense that something like parenthood is, where it places effectively mandatory constraints on your time and options and you're suddenly responsible for planning ahead for shit that you didn't even have to worry about before."

So far Usagi has been able to offload the biggest new responsibilities on her life apart from "personally being a superhero" onto others. Crystal Millennium becomes Alice's problem most of the time. Taking care of Minori on a day to day basis is something Usagi's parents have smoothly slotted into doing for her.

This may be different.
 
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Simon_Jester said:
And the first paragraph of the "ATTENTION" instructions says future turns will be one week long. So 2-4 turns is 2-4 weeks.
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And 4 weeks is a month, how is what I said wrong?
I doubt they will be ready to mobilize in 2 weeks, that's Cologne being generous with her estimate. Or a defcon situation.
 
FictionPack said:
And 4 weeks is a month, how is what I said wrong?
I doubt they will be ready to mobilize in 2 weeks, that's Cologne being generous with her estimate. Or a defcon situation.
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I think her best case scenario was ten days. She's saying this on Monday, June 15, early in the week that will end at the end of the current turn.

She won't be ready in the week of June 14-21, even under her best case scenario. Since her best case will realistically not materialize, and even she said as much, it's very unlikely, effectively impossible, that she'll be ready in the week of June 21-28. But by the very last day or two of June, or the first week of July, over two weeks have passed and it becomes plausible that the Amazons will be ready...

...At which point they're going to expect us to be ready fairly promptly, even if they're not in immediate physical danger.
 
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[X] Promise to help the Amazons flee China. Offer them clientage.

Rebuilding the Silver Millennium/building Crystal Millennium is impossible without actually having subjects.
Starting with the Amazons sounds like a very good first step.
 
FictionPack said:
The timeline of clientage is 2 to 4 turns from now. A month away in Quest.
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What are you expecting to happen during that time that would change things?

Is it reasonable to expect that we'll be ready to take responsibility for twelve hundred people in a month?

We're currently responsible for maybe 30 people, at most, and most of them have pretty established lives where they are.

Like, we might get there, but it's going to be a stretch at best, and it's probably going to take a distinctly noticeable degree of effort.

And we are already in "AP Hell"!

We haven't even finished helping Minako get settled back in in Japan, and she's one person who arrived two whole-ass turns ago.
 
FictionPack said:
Is this a serious question or did you forget what we accomplished in a month's time frame in Quest already and how much things have changed?
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In a month we went from four girls and a cat to ten girls, two cats, a ferret, and eight employees, most of whom already had their own home lives moderately settled.

That's a factor of four growth.

You're asking us to grow by a factor of forty in that much time, with people who aren't that settled in.
 
Taking in the Amazons doesn't just result in Usagi being responsible for 1,200 people who she has to spend her AP on, it also means she gets the AP of 1,200 people. All the resources of the Amazon village are going to become the Senshi's, from its fighters to its lore.

Shampoo is going to be available for Usagi to command. Cologne is going to become her direct subordinate.
 
RadiantPhoenix said:
In a month we went from four girls and a cat to ten girls, two cats, a ferret, and eight employees, most of whom already had their own home lives moderately settled.

That's a factor of four growth.

You're asking us to grow by a factor of forty in that much time, with people who aren't that settled in.
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We have a castle on the Moon, with more than enough space to house all the amazons and more if necessary.
 
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RadiantPhoenix said:
In a month we went from four girls and a cat to ten girls, two cats, a ferret, and eight employees, most of whom already had their own home lives moderately settled.

That's a factor of four growth.

You're asking us to grow by a factor of forty in that much time, with people who aren't that settled in.
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Are you intentionally missing the point? My incredulity can only take so much here.
We established a company, gained a castle, a daughter, established a precure committee, formed government ties, handicapped 2 intercontinental threats to humanity, etc.

The fact you seem to be ignoring just how quickly things can and have and will change is strange when you explicitly ask how much can change in a month when that question has been resoundly answered.
 
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Spart117MC said:
Taking in the Amazons doesn't just result in Usagi being responsible for 1,200 people who she has to spend her AP on, it also means she gets the AP of 1,200 people. All the resources of the Amazon village are going to become the Senshi's, from its fighters to its lore.

Shampoo is going to be available for Usagi to command. Cologne is going to become her direct subordinate.
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Very, very good point.
Delegation is a thing.
These are not 1200 babies. These are warriors with partly literally centuries of experience and accumulated resources, including money to buy necessary things, and leaders used to lead them and knowing how to do it.
 
I wonder if the Chinese government will throw a fit/tantrum, that the Senshi decided to evacuate, the Amazons?

Seeing how, they at in RL, it is a almost guaranteed.
 
tenchifew said:
We have a castle on the Moon, with more than enough space to house all the amazons and more.
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We have a castle on the Moon, with no way in or out besides us personally carrying people to and from there.

There is no agriculture, no easy communication with Earth, I don't know if there's running water, and I'm not even sure if we've got automatically-renewing oxygen up there.

In order to get the Amazons settled on the Moon we will need to:
  1. Sort out which parts of the palace are reasonable for habitation
  2. Probably refurbish a bunch of the palace
  3. Make or reactivate a portal system
  4. Set up food and water supplies
  5. Possibly set up air supplies
  6. Set up communication
  7. Set up supply lines for other essentials
  8. Explain everything to the Amazons
  9. Probably work out some international relations along the way
  10. And then resolve whatever issues the Amazons have on top of that

And I'm probably missing some stuff too!

FictionPack said:
Are you intentionally missing the point? My incredulity can only take so much here.
We established a company, gained a castle, a daughter, established a precure committee, formed government ties, handicapped 2 intercontinental threats to humanity, etc.

The fact you seem to be ignoring just how quickly things can and have and will change is strange when you explicitly ask how much can change in a month when that question has been resounding answered.
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I'm saying this is a much larger step than what we've accomplished in the past month
 
Simon_Jester said:
I imagine that if we don't promise clientage, it's not our job to make it happen, at least not in the sense that the Amazons will blame us if it goes badly.

If we do promise clientage, then the Amazons will probably blame us if it goes badly, or expect us to bust them out of jail if they get in trouble, or something.

Hm. Why do you say that?
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A lot of is just feel and an ingrained reflex of no that is too small to actually function as a lasting settlement that is oh-so-common in fantasy settings though there are also a few postulations. In addition to existing as a village, they probably have duties that have to be done as wardens, and while only healers were called out and given their rather isolated nature, they probably have other people in specialized professions, carpenters, masons, blacksmiths, enchanters, and so on. Each of which, even supplemented by household gardening, would need a fair number of dedicated farmers/herders/other food-producing professions, except they live on the side (though probably more of a piedmont) of a mountain which increases the amount of effort needed and decreases the amount you get out of it.

...

You know putting more people there on second thought is probably a bad idea unless the Amazons have a lot of treasure sashed away.
 
Don't we have a bunch of people on Mercury that we want to get off there? Meaning the Amazons wouldn't be the only refugees we'll end up managing?
 
Sol Mark-1 said:
I wonder if the Chinese government will throw a fit/tantrum, that the Senshi decided to evacuate, the Amazons?

Seeing how, they at in RL, it is a almost guaranteed.
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The PRC in the quest threatened to bomb the Amazons because the Amazons told them they shouldn't bomb them since they're the only ones able to fight the Dark Kingdom and are doing so on behalf of the PRC.

In the hypothetical scenario that the Senshi denied Cologne's request the PRC would still throw a fit and blame the Senshi for the Amazons staying in mainland China.
 
RadiantPhoenix said:
We have a castle on the Moon, with no way in or out besides us personally carrying people to and from there.

There is no agriculture, no easy communication with Earth, I don't know if there's running water, and I'm not even sure if we've got automatically-renewing oxygen up there.

In order to get the Amazons settled on the Moon we will need to:
  1. Sort out which parts of the palace are reasonable for habitation
  2. Probably refurbish a bunch of the palace
  3. Make or reactivate a portal system
  4. Set up food and water supplies
  5. Possibly set up air supplies
  6. Set up communication
  7. Set up supply lines for other essentials
  8. Explain everything to the Amazons
  9. Probably work out some international relations along the way
  10. And then resolve whatever issues the Amazons have on top of that

And I'm probably missing some stuff too!


I'm saying this is a much larger step than what we've accomplished in the past month
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1,2,3,9 are not immediately necessary.
4 and 5 are resolved, given life support is running to the point that there is a garden up there and Senshi can teleport.
6 is resolved through Queen Serenity.
7 and 10 - amazons are used to live independently. Teleportation is easy for Senshi.
8 is trivial.
9 a luxury and can be done whenever.
 
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[X] Promise to help the Amazons flee China. Do not offer them clientage.
[X] Promise to help the Amazons flee China. Offer them clientage.
 
One crux thing that might be worth thinking about -

Taking them on as clients will almost guarantee that you guys have more actions that will require some work on. Which given the complaints that have been had about the AP hell as it is...
 
honestly we should ask the ROC government in Taiwan to help them. Its better than using our resources. They are de jure ROC Nationals. And less likely to have japanese headaches with the taiwanese government taking them. And technically they havent left china ;)
 
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