Threads Of Destiny(Eastern Fantasy, Sequel to Forge of Destiny)

Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
I feel the need to point out, that while the emerald seas sounds like a cool place before parts of it started to imperialise. There is something important to remember, that they were just as guilty of disliking those who were unlike them as those from the celestial peaks.

This is shown when Meizhen commented that the Weilu were very arrogant and inward looking. While she may be a more xenophilic Bai than is common, it does reflect upon the Bai's opinion of them. The fact that an ancient clan with a great deal of similarities to the Weilu remembers them poorly after they were supplanted by a movement supported by the Imperials, whom the Bai hate, is very telling. The Weilu seem to have been more free form than the Bai and perhaps less hierarchical, but it seems like there similarities outweigh there differences, especially since the celestial peaks looked down on both of them.

It lets us know that we should be careful about which parts of the past we should bring into the present and about the dangers of alienating potential allies. So far I'd say we are striking a good balance.
 
Bai dislike non Bai as a matter of principle, that the Bai had a bad opinion on the Weilu tells us approximately nothing about the Weilu.
That said, i'm sure the Weilu were not perfect and as we learn more of them we will no doubt discover in just what ways they were terrible.
Maybe they practiced human sacrifice and ritual cannibalism?
But there is an important distinction to be made between "i hate those who are different and wish they would leave me alone" and "i hate those who are different and will make them not different, or else".

And the Weilu are thousands of years gone, we are not talking of people who are thousands of years, possibly dozens of generations, removed from them and the old ways would probably be quite new, if not unknown, to the weilu themselves.
 
Bai dislike non Bai as a matter of principle, that the Bai had a bad opinion on the Weilu tells us approximately nothing about the Weilu.
That said, i'm sure the Weilu were not perfect and as we learn more of them we will no doubt discover in just what ways they were terrible.
Maybe they practiced human sacrifice and ritual cannibalism?
But there is an important distinction to be made between "i hate those who are different and wish they would leave me alone" and "i hate those who are different and will make them not different, or else".

And the Weilu are thousands of years gone, we are not talking of people who are thousands of years, possibly dozens of generations, removed from them and the old ways would probably be quite new, if not unknown, to the weilu themselves.

First point is very true, the Bai are isolationist so their clan's opinion should be taken with consideration. But since it was Meizhen saying it and she does not think we, the Cai and many others are inherently inferior to the Bai, nor does she dislike any of us I feel her and by extension the greater feelings of the clan are important to consider. If a clan known for its pride and isolationism thinks you are too proud and isolationist you've made a mistake somewhere.

Also I agree that the Weilu are long gone and that times have changed. I just wanted to inject into the conversation that keeping the fallibility of the ideology that descended from them in mind was important.

Above all I wanted to stress that the people of the Emerald Seas in the time period the omake was set in seemed to share a lot of similarities with The Thousand Lakes.

Ties with spirits so close that they are family, disliking the Celestial Peaks, disliking centralised imperial authority and probably others. If both had been a bit less inward looking they, could have together defied the Celestial Peaks as no emperor would be strong enough to anger two provinces. While it is hard to say and we would need a word of god statement on it, I believe that the Bai would have been pragmatic enough to do this but the Weilu disdained them for whatever reason. We must not make that mistake if we hope to bring the best of what they represented into our own clan.
 
Bai Meizhen never met a single Weilu, nor did anyone she met, or anyone they met.
With the possibly exception of granny snek, who probably has not had much to say on the subject in the past few thousand years?
And the Bai issue with Weilu pride and isolationism could easily be a case of "you have nothing to be proud of, and give me your stuff".

The best source of info on the Weilu might be the Zheng, if you can manage to hunt down an avatar of the stone ape and have enough booze to bribe him to tell you old stories.

Also, the idea that united Bai and Weilu might have withstood the empire is probably true.
But, Weilu were not a united polity themselves, they were a large group of independent tribes who existed in the region of Emerald seas at roughly the same time period.
It's like stating that united europe could have opposed the Romans.
True, but kinda pointless statement considering the reality of the time.
 
Fair points all. I suppose we'll just have to wait until Yrsillar reveals more about that period. I would certainly be interested.
 
Well if you want insights on the later Weilu, Yrs did write a commission about them and they don't seem great.

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Threads Of Destiny(Eastern Fantasy, Sequel to Forge of Destiny) Original - Users' Choice!

My High Lady, you have no doubt been bombarded by theories, requests and entreaties to intervene in the south. In this, my most respected sibling, I must counsel you to ignore such hotheaded calls. The war against the usurper emperor drags on and there is no call to divert forces to the savages...

Sure it's written from the perspective of an arrogant Bai so there will be biases, but she actually lived among them for a large period of time and they seem to have some of the same failings of the Hui. They ignore ruling only caring about their dream cults and leaving all of the work to the Xi, Meng and Hui. They seem to have their own hedonistic tendencies and they consider everything that influences the world impure. Including the great spirits.

They seem to disdain what the mother and father has wrought, very far from the early Weilu and Tsu. It makes sense why the Horned Lord would abandon them if they considered him and all the great spirits like Tsu impure.
 
That's very interesting, It seems like a long term interaction between the two of them would have done both provinces some good. The Bai could have opened up to new ideas and Weilu could have learned some discipline. It just required one group to be more pragmatic, the Weilu were apparently too inward looking to notice the need for it but I would have thought at least one Bai would have considered the potential.

Though I suppose the pragmatism we have seen recently has come of need and the arrogance of their forbears created that need. Even with need we are still seeing reticence from conservative elements so I suppose people who have no need to change are bound to reflect the worst of the present Bai.

I suppose I'm only going through these arguments because it's sad to see two people who should have been natural allies, with their similar views on the role of Imperial government, spirit human relations and other things be divided over things that are purely internal and correctable.

Though it does show the dangers of what our descendants could become. Hopefully alliances with more strict and hierarchical clans will temper that.
 
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Thats when the Hill Tribes and Cloud Nomads changed from sometimes friendly sometimes hostile to a more hostile facing, in the face of unrelenting hostility.

Meanwhile, there is likely no small amount of culture gap going on here - the pre-Imperial Emerald Seas practiced raiding culture, as did the Hill tribes and the Cloud Nomads. Some level of low level fighting would be practically constant...which as far as the Imperial culture is concerned would be banditry (yes, this is almost certainly still going on in Ebon Rivers, but they were never as weak as the Emerald Seas were, and joined voluntarily rather than by the sword), and responded to appropriately with extermination.
This is a point I've seen people bring up a few times and it really doesn't seem true. The only record we have of peaceful interaction between the Cloud Tribes and Emerald Seas that I know of was Tsu the Diviner personally going to ask them for help against the Beast Gods and being rebuffed. Then things changed to this:
Newer stories praised the sun and moon, and spoke of the Weilu more as strange neighbors than monsters in the dark, then as allies against the Cloud Tribes of the south. The songs took a turn for the dark though as they grew more modern. Songs of everyday life turned into melodies of war, and then subjugation, pages filled with venom for the conquering Xi, from there the stories began to disappear, and the songs and poems dwindled in number, growing more melancholy and full of nostalgia for the lost past with every year.
As far as I can tell the Weilu, Hill Tribes, Cloud Tribes, and proto-Polar Nation Mountain Tribes all fought each other fairly regularly, but weren't so hostile they couldn't meet and have civilized conversations now and then. Then long before the Empire was ever a thing the Weilu, Hill Tribes, and Mountain Tribes(?) all forged closer bonds and allied against the Cloud Tribes. The Empire's expansionist policies have definitely caused relations with the Cloud Tribes to deteriorate even further, but even back during Tsu's lifetime when they were at least on speaking terms with everyone things weren't sunshine and rainbows between them and their neighbors. The 'sometimes friendly' you speak of is supported solely by the fact Tsu had a single conversation with them and I can't recall anything else that wasn't some kind of conflict.
For all we know our 2 or 3 conversations with Jaromilla's husband are the greatest diplomatic breakthrough between the Emerald Seas and Cloud Tribes since the guy who made the Emerald Seas into an actual thing.

Edit: To be clear I'm not saying there was definitely no peaceful contact between the ES and CT between Tsu's lifetime and the Sage's, but we've got zero evidence there was and plenty evidence of conflicts, so putting them in the same category as the Hill Tribes and blaming the current state of things almost entirely on the Empire seems disingenuous to me.
Bai dislike non Bai as a matter of principle, that the Bai had a bad opinion on the Weilu tells us approximately nothing about the Weilu.
That said, i'm sure the Weilu were not perfect and as we learn more of them we will no doubt discover in just what ways they were terrible.
Maybe they practiced human sacrifice and ritual cannibalism?
But there is an important distinction to be made between "i hate those who are different and wish they would leave me alone" and "i hate those who are different and will make them not different, or else".

And the Weilu are thousands of years gone, we are not talking of people who are thousands of years, possibly dozens of generations, removed from them and the old ways would probably be quite new, if not unknown, to the weilu themselves.
The important bit of that conversation wasn't that the Bai disliked the Weilu, it was that the Weilu were considered overly proud and isolationist even when compared to the Bai, which doesn't say good things about their relations with neighbors even before the Empire came along.
 
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Guy with a dog who invited us to a hunting party, opinions on his skills as a host vary.
Is also trying to convince Bao Qingling to marry him and refuses to take no for an answer.
 
Lol. Scion of one of largest ES counties, solid 3 realm, master breeder = guy with dog. I do hope someone calls him that at the war games.

Side note re dogs: is it time to adopt Yu Nuan yet? Cause Biyu needs needs needs to meet that big friendly doof of a thunder hound.
 
Lol. Scion of one of largest ES counties, solid 3 realm, master breeder = guy with dog. I do hope someone calls him that at the war games.

Side note re dogs: is it time to adopt Yu Nuan yet? Cause Biyu needs needs needs to meet that big friendly doof of a thunder hound.
Are you saying Luo Zhong is only G3. I'm positive he's higher than us in cultivation...

Also trying to join the Wang club now that it has become a big thing.
Really? Where did it say that?
 
Are you saying Luo Zhong is only G3. I'm positive he's higher than us in cultivation...


Really? Where did it say that?
Here, turn 12 3-3.
"Yes, yes, I know we agreed that we could be spare about invitations," Wang Chao agreed. "But it isn't just some run of the mill disciples asking here."

"Who is it then?" Ling Qi asked, feeling the rumbling of the earth in her ears, she extended her own qi, cloaking their words in figments of inane small talk.

"It's that Luo," Wang Chao grunted. "It's true that we've got a handsome of his folk here, but I doubt its just benign interest. I can't fathom what he's up too, but I know that man is a plotter!"
Current theory is that Luo seems to have an ear to court and knows are little trip turned up some pretty big things. Wang's training group is the best shot he has to talk with us without directly asking to talk, or looking like a stalker by popping up at a random place.
 
Current theory is that Luo seems to have an ear to court and knows are little trip turned up some pretty big things. Wang's training group is the best shot he has to talk with us without directly asking to talk, or looking like a stalker by popping up at a random place.
I personally think he wants a back channel to Bao Qingling, as we're friends with her little project Li Suyin and getting courted by her cousin. That will give us an opportunity to delicately tell him he's barking up the wrong tree :V
 
That will give us an opportunity to delicately tell him he's barking up the wrong tree :V

Will he care though? He isn't looking for romance, but a pure political marriage. Even Shenhua has a husband.
If he finds out Qingling is gay he might use that to pressure her more into a marriage, and besides, outing someone to their pushy suiter is a massive dick move. I really hope Ling Qi doesn't do that
 
I don't literally mean outing Qingling as that would be a crazy violation of privacy and grudge worthy, just tell him his persistence is working against him. Also most importantly I wanted to make a dog joke.
 
Turn 13: Arc 7-3
Actually being on the tournament field at ground level was a little nostalgic, Ling Qi thought. It was here, just last year that she had taken her first real step in establishing herself before the eyes of the Empire. It was here, for the first time that she showed her strength without holding back. It was here, she supposed that the little seed of arrogance which had brought her near ruin in the dream of the Forest King, had been born. Yes, in many ways it was an important place.

She supposed it was the same for Gan Guangli.

"My apologies for not congratulating you earlier, Sir Gan," Ling Qi said cheerfully.

"My performance thus far has only been the minimum required to not besmirch our ladies name," Gan Guangli replied. "Nor that of our esteemed guests!"

"You have performed to my expectations," Cai Renxiang said evenly, stepping forward.

They stood beside one of the four arenas on the grassy field that filled the space between the platforms and the stands. Stands that were swiftly emptying as the audience went forth to partake in the other attractions of the Sect's tournament. With Gan Guangli stood that Gun Jun fellow and ma Jun, who looked as she were torn between bouncing on her heels in joy at her success, and frightened glances at their Bai guests.

"I am pleased to see my allies subordinates succeeding as well," Bai Meizhen said primly, looking up from Xiao Fen, who stood stiffly under Bai Meizhen's examination. She had received a few scratches in her fight, nothing worth the medicine hall, but Meizhen seemed inclined to fuss a little anyway. "I am certain you know Xiao Fen already, but with us today are Bai Xia Anxi, and Bai Lao Keung, my new subordinates."

Ling Qi caught a brief expression of thoughtfulness on Lao Keung's face as she introduced them. It was something she had noticed, first with Xiao Fen and now with these. When introducing her kin, Meizhen went out of the way to refer to them fully; Bai Xia, Bai Lao. Other white serpent Bai didn't do this.

Lao Keung spoke first, clapping his fists together and offered a formal military bow. "I am Lao Keung. As I will be heading MIss Bai's personal security, I expect we will be working together."

Xia Anxi offered a slightly condescending smile. "And I am Xia Anxi, part of the diplomatic attachment. I hope you will keep anything from troubling us while we work."

"Naturally!" Gan Guangli said, reaching out to clasp wrists with a slightly bemused looking Anxi. He either missed, or more likely ignored the tone Xia Anxi used. "I will look forward to working with you both in the name of advancing both of our Ladies interests."

"I am certain you will not disappoint me," Cai Renxiang said formally. "You have done good work, both in maintaining my project and raising your followers as well."
The other two with him bowed low in response to her words.

"Lady Cai is too kind," they said, almost in unison.

"A commander may only hope for talented officers," Gan Guangli said cheerfully. "If-"

It was a flash of red in the corner of her vision. No, rather it was a crimson that filled her spiritual senses. The coppery scent of blood mingling with freshly turned soil. Ling Qi turned her head toward the source of the sensation. There at the edge of another arena, with the victorious Lu Feng, stood Sun Liling. Had she been so tall when last they met?

Sun Liling glanced away from Lu Feng, briefly meeting her gaze before her eyes swept away to the rest of Ling Qi's party, who had noticed her as well. The princess of the west had changed since Ling Qi had last seen her. Her crimson hair held a streak of vibrant green, and the sharp edged smirk she wore seemed more literal than before. The biggest change was to her spirit though. She was a sink of power. Her skin drank in the qi of sun and water in the air, the power of the earth and soil flowed into her feet, visibly so, to Ling Qi's spiritual senses. Her dantian burned in Ling Qi's spiritual sight like a miniature sun, environmental qi churning, digesting into hungry crimson.

She was formation stage, the sixth step of the third realm, a full two stages above where she had been just a couple months ago.

"Yo! Looks like we're all here again huh?" Sun Liling called out cheerily, waving. She seemed totally oblivious to the stony silence of the Bai around them as she strolled over to them. Sun Liling wore the same loose black silk pants she always had, but her shirt was a pale cream color, embroidered with sunflowers, and over it she wore a loose and unsecured vest of crimson. It wasn't silk, but some plant fiber that seemed still alive. "This sure is nostalgic."

There was a beat of heavy silence, and in it, Ling Qi finally noticed Ji Rong, standing in her shadow. He hadn't grown explosively at least, stronger of course but not unreasonably so. His expression was stony, and she couldn't read him at all.

"Princess Sun," Cai Renxiang greeted politely. "I am glad your return was untroubled."

"Yes, it seems that the west has at least managed its transport infrastructure," Bai meizhen said in a voice as cold as Ling Qi's Hoatfrost Caress technique.

"Right?" Sun Liling laughed. "Roads right, how do those work? How're a buncha meatheads supposed to know?"

Bai Meizhen blinked, momentarily nonplussed.

"Well, I guess we managed on our own, just like always," the princess continued cheerfully. "Honestly things are goin pretty great back home! Gramps had some tips for me, and I got to see my people again."

"...I am pleased for you," Cai Renxiang said slowly.

"You sure are," Sun Liling said. "Anyway gota couple things to say! Mind if I have your ear for a second?"

Ling Qi was starting to feel unnerved looking at Sun Liling's half lidded eyes and wide smile. It felt unnatural, like the bright lure or sweet scent meant to lure prey.

"I do not see why not," her liege said. There wasn't really a reason to refuse.

"Right, so first, no hard feelings either way, regardless of which of our boys wins yeah?" Sun Liling said, slipping her hands into her pockets. "Just a fun lil challenge, right?"

"Of course," Cai Renxiang said slowly.

Sun Liling nodded cheerfully. "Other thing's a bit bigger. I need you to pass a message to your Mother. Gramps has decided, since we're all doing this imperial unity thing, he's gonna head south too, clear out our bits of the mountains! So, he's gonna be coming to meet the Duchess so they can talk coordination, yeah? Don't want to step on each other's toes!"

Silence hung in the air at her declaration, and Ling Qi glanced at Gan Guangli, who seemed bewildered too. The less said for Bai Meizhen and the other Bai the better.

"If that is King Sun's wish, I am certain mother will prepare to receive his simulacrum," Cai Renxiang replied, barely missing a beat. It is good to see such cooperation."

"Nah, he's gonna have his alternates overseeing the muster. General Lu's got that mostly in hand. He'll be coming in person. Ask your mother to open a line so we can figure out the date, yeah?" Sun Liling said.

Silence again, and this time, Sun Liling didn't give them time to reply, turning to saunter away. "C'mon boys, we got other people to see.

Ling Qi blinked, mortified as Sun Liling pulled her hands from her pockets to swat both Luf Feng and Ji Rong on the bottoms as she passed them by. She glanced to Ji Rong, who briefly met her eyes, looking conflicted before he hurried to follow.

"What." Lao Keung said.

"What." Bai Meizhen agreed, glaring at Liling's back.
Xiao Fen made a sound not unlike a furiously burning fuse.

"I do not even know where to begin," Xia Anxi muttered.

"And I do believe it would be best if you did not," another voice startled Ling Qi, and she glanced back to see Xia Lushen standing behind them, one hand on Bai Meizhen's shoulder. "This is not business for you."

"Lord Xia," they all swiftly greeted.

"Lady Cai, I hope you will deliver this message to your mother swiftly," Xia Lushen said pleasantly. "It does seem of great import."

"Naturally," Cai Renxiang said. "I must apologize to you my guests, this is most urgent-"

"It is nothing, we will meet again this evening," Bai Meizhen said, recovering

"Although, may I ask to borrow your retainer, Lady Cai?" Xia Lushen asked. "It was her note which originally brought me here."

Ling Qi blinked remembering that she had sent a missive indicating that she had made her decision on the sale. She hadn't expected such a prompt response.

"Of course, Lord Xia. Ling Qi you are free until we meet back with our guests this evening," Cai Renxiang said distractedly.

She nodded to her liege as the group broke up with a few more pleasantries, following after Meizhen's uncle as he walked toward one of the exits. She turned her attention inward toward Sixiang, the muse hadn't said a word in some time.

"...Yeah sorry, trying to figure out what I was looking at, got blocked by the princess' spirit. Who… I'm not sure if they were flirting or threatening, it was kinda both. That was a weird conversation," Sixiang muttered. "Please don't fight her again anytime soon. I don't wanna get involved with that."

Not planning on it, Ling Qi thought. "You honor me with your swift reply, Lord Xia," She said aloud.

"It is nothing," he said. "Merely a small favor. I suppose you would like to know what I have to offer."

"If you would please," Ling Qi said

"Most simply, I can offer stones. Two hundred green stones will go far for a young lady your age," He said pleasantly. "However, if mere stones will not interest I may offer some small studies I and my apprentices have done on soil and fertilization. Your spirit undoubtedly does good work, but given the constraints of your environment, it may be best to stack advantages."

Ling Qi nodded, either of those would be a boon.

"On the other hand," he mused. "Medicines. I am not an unskilled alchemist…"

Ling Qi perked up. "I did acquire the recipe for a cyan breakthrough drug recently, perhaps you could help me acquire some of its reagents?"

"Have you now? So resourceful," Xia Lushen chuckled. "Yes, that would be within my power. I take it you already have a maker in mind?"

"I mean no insult," Ling Qi said humbly.

"No, it is good to develop your own networks," he dismissed. "Aside from that I could offer some insightful conversation. Our ways are not particularly close, but some of my meditations may aid you."

[] 200 Green Stones
[] Soil Studies (+10 bonus development rolls in fief)
[] Rare reagents (Begin Forgotten Elixir Quest, complete Part 1 of 4 immediately)
[] Insight Sharing (+1 Isolation and Ending XP)
 
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Sun Liling glanced away from Lu Feng, briefly meeting her gaze before her eyes swept away to the rest of Ling Qi's party, who had noticed her as well. The princess of the west had changed since Ling Qi had last seen her. Her crimson hair held a streak of vibrant green, and the sharp edged smirk she wore seemed more literal than before. The biggest change was to her spirit though. She was a sink of power. Her skin drank in the qi of sun and water in the air, the power of the earth and soil flowed into her feet, visibly so, to Ling Qi's spiritual senses. Her dantian burned in Ling Qi's spiritual sight like a miniature sun, environmental qi churning, digesting into hungry crimson.

She was formation stage, the sixth step of the third realm, a full two stages above where she had been just a couple months ago.
Well okay then, I guess that's one advantage she received
 
Trying to decide if Sun Liling has intensfied her barbarian persona, or if her impulse control is completely shot.
...I'm thinking the former to cover for the latter.
 
Liling seems to be coping with all of this by diving into acceptance?

And Ugh, just one of the rewards? Can we pick 2, pretty please? aaaaaahhg

[X] Soil Studies (+10 bonus development rolls in fief)

This probably
 
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