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A Sword Without a Hilt: A Song of Ice and Fire/D&D 3.5 Crossover

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Crake said:
For the Devils, @Goldfish, when diving into accounts of their deeds, more context is necessary. For example, Viserys has been waging war against the Brazen Throne alongside his Shaitan and Djinn allies for the past couple years now. We could mention how the Erinyes faced the Brazen Throne's forces in battle and freed hundreds of people from slavery and torturous execution for failure to guard a convoy of Adamantine.

This does two things: Shows that Devils broke their own chains, and then broke the chains of others in return. And secondly, they were useful for seizing two million tons of Bullion equivalent, which neatly explains "how did Viserys bankroll a military buildup on this scale in so short a time?"

The answer being raw power, obviously, but people fill in the blanks on their own all the time.

We could also mention other fig leafs like their participation in the Sarnori campaign against the hordes of undead, their skirmishing with agents of Mammon over the past couple of years in Westeros...

We can have the Inquisition encourage people in the right places to spread stories along the lines of "taming a shadowcat to ward off the wolves", or other takes. The important part is to counter populists who are running on a platform for "getting Devils out of Government". And maybe ensure they're publicly disgraced. In fact you should explicitly add <---to your vote as a thing we'll be focusing on.
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Can you write this section up? I'll add it to my plan.
 
Crake said:
We could mention how the Erinyes faced the Brazen Throne's forces in battle and freed hundreds of people from slavery and torturous execution for failure to guard a convoy of Adamantine.
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one problem most people in westeros have no idea what the brazen throne actually is or that it even exists nor any understanding of the inner plains or its politics and history , so I don't think that example will really work if anything it will make things more confusing since the elemental plain of fire is what most people imagine when they think of hell
 
-[ ] There's a time for added context and depth to actions, and the Erinyes could certainly use them. Veterans from warring with Demons of the Pit, the Furies sworn to prosecute the enemies of the Imperator are in themselves firebrands who have cast off their own chains to Baator and in turn have cast of the chains of others shortly thereafter. (Account of the battle against the Brazen Throne and the raiding of an Adamantine convoy goes here, with interviews from some of those slaves freed.)
-[ ] But it is not just perdition or the more prosaic slavery that they have eschewed, but also abetting the enemies of all life, fighting and shedding blood by the Imperium's legions against ravenous hordes of the unliving. (Accounts of the battle before the walls of Sarnath, and before that Sallosh, with interviews from officers, preferably knights for an extra bit of zing, and regular troops).
-[ ] Lastly, they have even struck back at their former slaver, slaying and chasing his agents on the mortal plane wherever they might be found, most recently in Westeros. (Go into accounts of devils operating in the Vale, which has had rumors enough of infernal activity thanks to the Faith spreading how they were fighting them--which is true, though less effective at it had Viserys not intervened there multiple times through his agents and allies).

[ ] The important part is to counter all the populists coming out of the woodwork going for local and regional Councils, who are running on a platform of 'getting Devils out of Government'.
-[ ] And maybe ensure they're publicly disgraced.
--[ ] The Inquisition can spread a variety of advantageous rumors and spread the appropriate propaganda, but leaning on certain interests to push platforms in the Regional council to justify why Viserys can 'make even devils safe for popular consumption' is ideal. The populists can have their uses, if they're in our pocket.
 
Can they still be called devils or demons when we've severed their connections to the various hells?

I think we need something knew to call them.
 
Crake said:
-[ ] There's a time for added context and depth to actions, and the Erinyes could certainly use them. Veterans from warring with Demons of the Pit, the Furies sworn to prosecute the enemies of the Imperator are in themselves firebrands who have cast off their own chains to Baator and in turn have cast of the chains of others shortly thereafter. (Account of the battle against the Brazen Throne and the raiding of an Adamantine convoy goes here, with interviews from some of those slaves freed.)
-[ ] But it is not just perdition or the more prosaic slavery that they have eschewed, but also abetting the enemies of all life, fighting and shedding blood by the Imperium's legions against ravenous hordes of the unliving. (Accounts of the battle before the walls of Sarnath, and before that Sallosh, with interviews from officers, preferably knights for an extra bit of zing, and regular troops).
-[ ] Lastly, they have even struck back at their former slaver, slaying and chasing his agents on the mortal plane wherever they might be found, most recently in Westeros. (Go into accounts of devils operating in the Vale, which has had rumors enough of infernal activity thanks to the Faith spreading how they were fighting them--which is true, though less effective at it had Viserys not intervened there multiple times through his agents and allies).

[ ] The important part is to counter all the populists coming out of the woodwork going for local and regional Councils, who are running on a platform of 'getting Devils out of Government'.
-[ ] And maybe ensure they're publicly disgraced.
--[ ] The Inquisition can spread a variety of advantageous rumors and spread the appropriate propaganda, but leaning on certain interests to push platforms in the Regional council to justify why Viserys can 'make even devils safe for popular consumption' is ideal. The populists can have their uses, if they're in our pocket.
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Awesome, thanks dude. Added all of this.
 
Granted, if we performed "upgrades" after getting the Imperial Deity and a soulforge up and running, we could make them all into distinct beings.

Imperial Icons go!
 
DragonParadox said:
If you tell and Erinyes that she is not baatezu you are not likely to walk way happy, more to the point all their resistances and communities are the same so they are in many ways the same sort of being
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Are they banished to hell instead of dying?

If not then their something new, even more so as their very wings change to show as such.
 
lancelot said:
Are they banished to hell instead of dying?

If not then their something new, even more so as their very wings change to show as such.
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They're still Devils, which is a distinct subtype of Outsider. Even if their Alignment changes to Good or Chaotic, they will still have the Evil subtype, too.

We confirmed all of this a while back when it first came up.
 
lancelot said:
Are they banished to hell instead of dying?

If not then their something new, even more so as their very wings change to show as such.
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That is a good metaphysical point, not not one that is going to have any legal or general perception consequences. Also mechanically any spells that work on devils still work on them so it;s not like the magical point is clear cut.
 
If we're talking about devils, we should emphasize the mighty magics used to recruit them, free them, and make sure their words are true. Let's not accidentally convince every petty conjurer that Imp familiars are a good idea.
 
TalonofAnathrax said:
If we're talking about devils, we should emphasize the mighty magics used to recruit them, free them, and make sure their words are true. Let's not accidentally convince every petty conjurer that Imp familiars are a good idea.
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Crake said:
@Goldfish This is a good idea.
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Yeah, very good point.

Edited part of Crake's contribution to include this:

---[] There's a time for added context and depth to actions, and the Erinyes could certainly use them. Veterans from warring with Demons of the Pit, the Furies sworn to prosecute the enemies of the Imperator are in themselves firebrands who were able to cast off their own chains to Baator thanks to the potency of the magics wielded by the Imperator and his Companions and specialty crafted rituals which pushed the boundaries of mortal spellcraft. The Furies in turn took this opportunity to help cast of the chains of others shortly thereafter. (Account of the battle against the Brazen Throne and the raiding of an Adamantine convoy goes here, with interviews from some of those slaves freed.)
 
Azel said:
Add a caricature where we break the chains of an Erinyes and Mammon stands in the corner and is pissed.
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then we will have to add an explanation to who Mammon is as your average Westerosi peasant or even lord won't have the slightest idea to what an arch duke of the nine hells even is , else people won't understand the joke at best or it might leave people confused at worst
 
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Azel said:
Add a caricature where we break the chains of an Erinyes and Mammon stands in the corner and is pissed.
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I agree with @mmgaballah on this one. That's a bit more info than folks need.

What would be a good front page image, though? Viserys grasping the hand of the High Septon maybe, as the man acknowledges Viserys and established the Faith of the Seven as accepting our rule?
 
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