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Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest

Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
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[X] Loremaster-at-Large of Karak Eight Peaks
[X] Spymaster of Wissenland
[X] Bodyguard and Tutor to Prince Mandred

Vote update.
 
Derpmind said:
I'd be pretty surprised if Belegar hires a "traditional" loremaster. His biggest issues right now are economic and diplomatic problems, not legal issues. (And the Okral has already left, so that situation did end up being handled.) Even now that armed conflict has died down and with a lack of magical Weird Stuff to deal with, it's still a new hold that needs someone willing to find new solutions to new problems rather than look into legal precedent for old solutions to old problems. That's a call for an enterprising Runesmith or Engineer; heck, maybe Francesco Caravello would have a shot at the job since he's been leading the Undumgi and managing Karag Nar as Viceroy.
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Traditional Loremasters isn't just literally legal issues. It's traditions and precedents on all matters. Like he'd still be the one to deal with the Emperor Dragon, but he'd do it by looking up how other Dawi successfully dealt with various types of Dragons, compare and contrast the different solutions with the exact circumstances of the present situation and then try and solve the problem in a way that lets all the other Dawi go "that makes sense and I admire what he did whether he succeeds or fails" instead of "...crazy..."

This would clearly not always be the best approach to many problems, but it does give a lot of weight to a talented traditional Loremaster's decisions. I expect that some moderate Lorekeeper Loremasters (between radical and traditionalist) are really good at starting with whatever bottom line their King wants them to and cherry pick some more or less fitting and partially out of context solutions in a way that none can gainsay them. Would have been useful in all the dumb behavior from the KaK okral for instance.
Derpmind said:
heck, maybe Francesco Caravello would have a shot at the job since he's been leading the Undumgi and managing Karag Nar as Viceroy.
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I can't see it. Military Commander or Steward yes. Diplomat in a pinch. But he really isn't a fitting Loremaster.
Valmond said:
I believe they were described as scribes?
They might (or might not) be on the same professional track as a traditional loremaster, but wether they are undergrads, recent graduates, or someone who has got a PHD equivalent, we don't know.
And Belegars time is not infinite, time he spends loremastering is time he does not spend resting, or doing his actual duties.
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I think the career path is "Lorekeeper" (like the guy who was specialized in eusocial insects that tried and failed to educate the We) and that Loremaster is a word with the double meaning of either Master Lorekeeper or Learning Advisor to a Thane or King.
Murazor said:
[X] Markgraf of Eastern Stirland
[X] Spymaster of Wissenland
[X] Loremaster-at-Large of Karak Eight Peaks
[X] The Waystone Project

My preferences, in rough order
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Markgraf is currently in close second place to Waystones, so if that order of preference is at all substantial you might want to drop the Waystone vote for now.
 
WhiteNights said:
I think that people are very much Idealizing Sylvania.
It is miscast central, it has been stated multiple times in quest that the air is so choke full of Dhar that it sets even the most experienced spell casters on edge.
I don't believe it would be conductive to any magic research except Dhar.
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Might be worth mentioning, while not a secret, it isn't really advertised that the Empire is littered with a number of henges that feed into the greater waystone network. Including Sylvania.

Given the persistent habit of wizards, warlocks and necromancers to set up shop on/near such places of power, and the general nature of Sylvania, I think it's a safe bet that a lot of the local waystones are borked, not draining away the ambient magic the way they're meant to.

The reason it's so so choke full of Dhar is because a thousand years of vampires and amateur necromancers have been futzing about with the local magic-grid. Any long term improvements to the place will involve Mat learning about this IC and setting about fixing it.

... which has obvious tie-in potential with the greater Waystone project, if she goes for the Vampire-Land option.


When Sylvania was incorporated as part of Stirland, there was a mingling of the two peoples, though Stirlanders often say the Fennone blood won out in their dour Sylvanian cousins. Dark rumours circulated about the people dabbling in magic. The Winds blow strong in Sylvania, and not just the cold winds that whip down from the World's Edge Mountains. Sylvania's nobles built their homes on the points marked by ancient Waystones, nexuses of magical power, though what they used it for is uncertain.
 
Silver Gambit said:
I have a question, What are people that are voting for it expecting out of the waystone project?

Because maybe I am just not seeing what you guys are seeing, cause for me personally all I can see is the expansion of a side quest that we have been doing that I already found not that interesting but more of it while also herding Dwarves and Elves to not stab each other, Like I am legitimately curious about what I am missing to make this sound fun to read for the next multiple thousand pages.
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At first; a lot of running around talking to various groups (the Eonir, the Colleges in general, the Jades in particular, Belegar, Thorgrim maybe, Kragg, Thorek, etc.) convincing them to either contribute information, money, resources, or their time to the project. Then soem hashing out the limits and responsibilities of everyone we've roped in, establishing facilities, timetables, etc.

Then, a lot of running around looking for lost knowledge, disparate clues scattered around the world, studying known Waystones, responding to threats to Waystones, etc.

Eventually, performing limited experiments based what we've learned/determined. Maybe repairing some Waystones.

Mostly I expect to spend a lot of time in the middle phase, dipping out to the third and falling back to the second (and very occasionally even dropping back down into the first to bring in more people or shore up support). I see plenty of opportunity for adventure and galavanting about; visiting ruins, delving into tombs, driving off Beastmen warherds from corrupted Waystones, taking out vampires (they're old and they like to collect knowledge, decent chances of them having at least a few scraps of info). But also plenty of time just spent studying what we've gathered and having interesting conversations with interesting people (runesmiths and runelords, elven mages, Lady and Lord Magisters, possibly even the heads of various Cults).

And of course, doing other things (we've never had a job where we devoted 100% of our time to it and I don't see how such an open ended project would be any different, especially as there is likely to be calls on the time of our collaborators) that catch our interest.
 
Breadnaugt said:
The reason it's so so choke full of Dhar is because a thousand years of vampires and amateur necromancers have been futzing about with the local magic-grid. Any long term improvements to the place will involve Mat learning about this IC and setting about fixing it.
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Don't forget how saturated the soil is with tiny flecks and grains of Warpstone, left over from when the stuff fell down into Sylvania. Which is pointed to in Night's Dark Masters as the reason why Sylvania has the largest rate of mutation in their populace in the Empire.
 
Breadnaugt said:
The reason it's so so choke full of Dhar is because a thousand years of vampires and amateur necromancers have been futzing about with the local magic-grid. Any long term improvements to the place will involve Mat learning about this IC and setting about fixing it.

... which has obvious tie-in potential with the greater Waystone project, if she goes for the Vampire-Land option.
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Boney's word on the subject:

BoneyM said:
There are no more bits and pieces. Mathilde has all the information that she can reasonably acquire as a Grey Wizard. The only progress forward on understanding Waystones is by bringing in other sources of information, and the only reasonable way to do that is the Waystone Project.
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As in, the only reasonable way to progress forward on Waystones, is to work on the Waystone Project. What progress can be made as a side-quest, has been achieved. So going to Sylvania wouldn't do anything for the Waystone project, or at least shouldn't be voted on based on expectations of progress.

I just read a lot of these comments as people trying to have their cake, and eat it too.

Let people vote on what they vote. If they want Waystones, they should vote Waystones. If they want Sylvania, vote for Sylvania. If they're fine with both, then vote both. And so on.
 
[X] The Waystone Project
[X] Loremaster-at-Large of Karak Eight Peaks

I usually don't let other people's opinions affect me enough to approval vote against something that I would normally be fine with, but in this particular case, I'm dissatisfied enough with people's arguments that I'll be pushing exclusively for these two options.
 
Codex said:
[X] The Waystone Project
[X] Loremaster-at-Large of Karak Eight Peaks

I usually don't let other people's opinions affect me enough to approval vote against something that I would normally be fine with, but in this particular case, I'm dissatisfied enough with people's arguments that I'll be pushing exclusively for these two options.
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Ehh... Spite votes are ugly. Dumb comments can be ignored. Spite votes cannot.

Edit: And no, the particulars of your vote don't matter all that much to me. One of your votes is for one of my four favorites and one is for one in the second grade favored category. All my "never X" options are far to the bottom.
 
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SakSak said:
As in, the only reasonable way to progress forward on Waystones, is to work on the Waystone Project. What progress can be made as a side-quest, has been achieved. So going to Sylvania wouldn't do anything for the Waystone project.

I just read a lot of these comments as people trying to have their cake, and eat it too.

Let people vote on what they vote. If they want Waystones, they should vote Waystones. If they want Sylvania, vote for Sylvania. If they're fine with both, then vote both. And so on.
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The Sylvania job will likely involve fixing the local waystones. Which will probably involve reaching out to some Jades/others and getting them on the project.

AKA, it will involve making connections and forming a working relationship with people capable of safely futzing about with henges and waystones. This would have obvious uses if we later try to draw people into a larger waystone project.

Not voting for either, just pointing out the synergy.
 
torac said:
I think this vote really shows the limit of approval voting. I think a ton of people are voting strategically for things they are okay with just too avoid choices they dislike, rather than voting for those they really like.

At least that's how I do it (sort-of), as I'm frequently checking the tally to see whether Markgraf/Tutor might win if I remove my vote for Waystone research, and I've seen a few other posts saying they were doing similar.

The more people are voting strategically, the more the vote loses its value as an accurate measurement of which items votes want to win. The Waystone research is my foruth favourite item, but I'm voting for it alongside the three I prefer because I don't want the ~7th favourite to win. Letting everyone sort their 4 favourites from least to most should solve this conundrum.

…Well, in theory at least. There's always the chance voter fatigue if you have a second vote immediately after the first, or failing to vote in a more complicated system than the fairly foolproof approval voting.
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What can still be feasibly done to alleviate the issue is vote trading. It runs the risk of turning the thread into a weird bazaar, however. (and I hope there isn't already some ban on it hidden away in the ~100 pages this vote has so far generated :V)

Like, in your particular situation you could find a Markgraf/Tutor>Loremaster>>>Waystone voter and then make a deal with them to both only vote for the first two. Which I, coincitentally, would be totally willing to do btw.
 
Rafin said:
Ehh... Spite votes are ugly. Dumb comments can be ignored. Spite votes cannot.

Edit: And no, the particulars of your vote don't matter all that much to me. One of your votes is for one of my four favorites and one is for one in the second grade favored category. All my "never X" options are far to the bottom.
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I can choose to vote however I like. Those two options are my favorite anyway, I just happened to be fine with the others until I read the thread.
 
Breadnaugt said:
The Sylvania job will likely involve fixing the local waystones. Which will probably involve reaching out to some Jades/others and getting them on the project.

AKA, it will involve making connections and forming a working relationship with people capable of safely futzing about with henges and waystones. This would have obvious uses if we later try to draw people into a larger waystone project.

Not voting for either, just pointing out the synergy.
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If people knew how to fix waystones, we wouldn't need the Waystone Project to research how.
 
Rafin said:
Ehh... Spite votes are ugly. Dumb comments can be ignored. Spite votes cannot.

Edit: And no, the particulars of your vote don't matter all that much to me. One of your votes is for one of my four favorites and one is for one in the second grade favored category. All my "never X" options are far to the bottom.
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I mean, if an argument turns someone off an option, that's just the other side of the coin to an argument convincing someone to vote for it no?

Breadnaugt said:
The Sylvania job will likely involve fixing the local waystones. Which will probably involve reaching out to some Jades/others and getting them on the project.

AKA, it will involve making connections and forming a working relationship with people capable of safely futzing about with henges and waystones. This would have obvious uses if we later try to draw people into a larger waystone project.

Not voting for either, just pointing out the synergy.
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It very clearly will not involve doing that. It was clearly stated as such in the very quote they provided.
 
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