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Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest

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Byzantine said:
And we can come back with a better equipped, better suited team for figuring out what is going on here at some point in the future, if we wish.
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I mean, maybe our great grandchildren can, but Borek left for reinforcements with near infinite money and took 200 years to muster up this one.

Eldon said:
Ahhh ok. Still I doubt that. The Empire's leadership has no stake in this expedition. All the humans here are here under our invitation as Belegar's representative. They represent K8P not The Empire. Plus even with the horror of Cor-Dum, the lingering mysteries, the loss of Gotrek, and the main steamwagon with most of its hands, this expedition has been a resounding success. Karak Vlag reconnected to our world, basic intelligence on the skaven chaos dwarf war, and the fate of Karak Dum confirmed. We have accomplished the primary goal and more besides that.
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Yeah, when your tales of adventure on dwarven expeditions end with "and then the expedition leader fucked off and then we left because it looked scary" adventurers are going to be disinclined to embark on further expeditions, as compared to "and then we cleared the name of Karag Dum and returned triumphant," or "and then we delved into Karag Dum and found a darkness most foul so we returned to forewarn the empire and its allies."
 
@BoneyM How about something like this?
[X] This is clearly some Divine non-Chaos effect. And it's fighting Chaos and the Chaos Wastes. So you are obligated to try to help, but no more. Go the the edge of the forest and set up a table to wait till nightfall. Have a Dwarf either/and or carve the name, rank and station of Loremaster of K8Ps and the Karaz Ankor, or announce you(or whatever else the procedure is for a formal envoy approaching a friendly Karak in Karaz Ankor). If anyone does show up, thank them for their service against Chaos and ask what message/assistance they require and see what knowledge they might be willing to give back, to be preserved. Do not step one foot inside the forest without an invitation.

Treat them like an unknown Order faction. Wood Elves are dangerous and you do not tresspass on their turf. So we don't. We offer them a chance at diplomacy, and then leave if they don't take it, while everyone else digs in for the day/night. Leave tomorrow. Come in with an honor guard, probably, but don't tresspass. Even if Order Beastmen, they're still Beastmen. Don't threaten them.
 
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[x] Approach the Kul camp peacefully and attempt to discuss the Karak with them
[x] Approach the Kvellige camp peacefully and attempt to discuss the Karak with them
 
D.Rockstar said:
We all know that to travel here is way too dangerous to come back, just to maybe learn something that maybe in the future could affect the Empire or Karak Ankor.
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The issue is we aren't equipped to figure this out without magic. But Cor-dum being present makes using magic... dangerous, if his aura is at all still present. The dwarves aren't resppnding and it seems like we aren't going to get answers that way. Trying to bypass the desert and forest require either trying a supercharged smoke and mirrors or something else, and leaves us stuck on the other side with potentially no friendlies in the area and no ability to (safely) use additional magic.

We came with a group equipped for what amounts to a quick survey and rescue. We've done the quick survey and the rescue is nonviable.

A future expedition would prioritize speed and the ability to make sense of what we now know is here.
 
QTesseract said:
[X] Attempt to intercept a Kurgan war-party en route to attack the Karag and the Beastmen
[X] Leave

Sometimes you have to shut up and multiply. Take the expected utility of a success, times the likelihood of success, and subtract the expected disutility of failure times the likelihood of failure. Pretty much all of the other options have a payout that is not commensurate with the risks incurred, not with this entire expedition reliant on our mockery of death.
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This.

IF WE DIE EVERYONE ELSE ON THIS EXPEDITION BESIDES MAYBE ASARNIL AND HUBERT ARE GOING TO DIE THEMSELVES.
 
[x] Fortify here and see if anything interesting happens over the next day
[x] Attempt to intercept a Kurgan war-party en route to attack the Karag and the Beastmen
 
I wonder if we can use the Ghyran Acorn to... I dunno. bribe? distract and decoy? Morghur and the Beastmen. Use the Acorn as payment for safe passage. ((Assuming Cor-Dum and/or Beastmen can be talked to at all that is. Even Borek didn't talk to him, just was stared at by him and walked by him.))

Unfortunately we have no idea what it would do or if it would work. ((Also, weird worst-case scenario, Morghur devours it for energy and... I dunno, breaks free. Or uses it to form a new forest of/for Beastmen that is not under Karag Dum runemagic binding/influence.)) (Or maybe it just causes him to go berserk, or to revert to Old-style Morghur, upon sensing the familiar Ghyran energies. Like waving a red flag in front of a bull.)
 
I like the Nehekharan theories, but on the other hand Nehekhara isn't particularly known for its rich abundance of dark forests. Something elven-related still makes the most sense.


[] Fortify here and see if anything interesting happens over the next day

This is way too passive for my tastes, we'd be burning goodwill with the expedition just to sit around and hope something happens.


Taking advantage of the unique properties of the Protector is clever and proactive, but we might want to see if something can be gleaned from just talking before we start murdering them.

[x] Approach the Kul camp peacefully and attempt to discuss the Karak with them
[x] Approach the Kvellige camp peacefully and attempt to discuss the Karak with them

Byzantine said:
So leave now and come back with a small, fast group at some point in the (distant) future. Including Cython. See if he can make sense of it, or is willing to give us a lift to find out from the probable source.
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Asarnil and Deathfang were entirely unwilling to fly up to Karag Dum to have a lookie, because it broadcasts EPIC FIGHT HERE to anyone within a few hundred leagues. No matter how much Cython might be intrigued, it'd be a hard sell to come here without backup, say in the form of a bunch of dwarves with cannon and tenscore knights on monstrous cavalry.
 
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[X] Fortify here and see if anything interesting happens over the next day
[X] Leave
[X] Attempt to intercept a Kurgan war-party en route to attack the Karag and the Beastmen
[X] Approach the Kvellige camp peacefully and attempt to discuss the Karak with them
[X] Approach the Kul camp peacefully and attempt to discuss the Karak with them
[X] Ask for a volunteer to approach Morghur to see if he can be communicated with
[X] Ask for a volunteer to test Morghur's reputed ability to turn anyone using magic nearby into Chaos Spawns

Guys. Guys. Guys.

I get being curious, but if we're going to do something potentially incredibly lethal, can we at least ask for volunteers to test if it'll result in instant death first? If your position is that it won't then no harm should be done, and if you think there's a real risk then why should we be the one to take it first instead of someone (a) willing (because volunteer) and (b) objectively less valuable to the expedition (because Rite of Way & Mockery of Death are of serious logistical importance for the return trip, even if not absolutely necessary per WoG) (not to mention (c) not the PC of the quest)?
 
Strange9 said:
would be good for a being made of pure Hysh. Particularly since Cython doesn't have the belt.
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We do have favor to burn...

Guile said:
[X] Attempt to infiltrate the Karak with magic
-[X] Abort if the trees show signs of serious mutation up close that were not visible at distance.

Seriously guys, I have to know.
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Okay, find out using any of the far safer options we could take first before jumping to the most dangerous, last resort option?


The Phoenixian said:
Damn, he missed out. Though, given the potential squabbling that could occur between a Caledoran and Hysh dragon on the way here, perhaps that's for the best.
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Y'know how you're never supposed to get in the middle of a dog fight? Yeah. Squabbling is an understatement.


ninjafish said:
IF WE DIE EVERYONE ELSE ON THIS EXPEDITION BESIDES MAYBE ASARNIL AND HUBERT ARE GOING TO DIE THEMSELVES.
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Nitpick: They have enough food to make it home assuming they stock up with the Kurgan and don't lose a wagon during the descent. Not great, not impossible.
 
ninjafish said:
This.

IF WE DIE EVERYONE ELSE ON THIS EXPEDITION BESIDES MAYBE ASARNIL AND HUBERT ARE GOING TO DIE THEMSELVES.
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I can do you one better. The side that wants to act keeps paining pictures of transformative magic and cuddly beastmen so let me paint a picture too of what would happen if we die here.. It won't just be everyone starves cleanly. It will be a weakened doomed expedition trying to limp its way south. It will be raids and desperate last stands.

Imagine Max and Johan ending their days in a Moulder Pit or a Chaos Dwarf sacrificial blade and then compare that to the potential nebulous gains of vising Dun. Imagine Panoramia getting news of Mathilde's grisly death from a grim Asarnil and weeping.
 
Byzantine said:
The issue is we aren't equipped to figure this out without magic. But Cor-dum being present makes using magic... dangerous, if his aura is at all still present. The dwarves aren't resppnding and it seems like we aren't going to get answers that way. Trying to bypass the desert and forest require either trying a supercharged smoke and mirrors or something else, and leaves us stuck on the other side with potentially no friendlies in the area and no ability to (safely) use additional magic.

We came with a group equipped for what amounts to a quick survey and rescue. We've done the quick survey and the rescue is nonviable.

A future expedition would prioritize speed and the ability to make sense of what we now know is here.
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There won't be a future expedition.

Nobody is going to spend the money or effort to make another expedition after this.

Karaz Ankor will write Dum off so they won't bother.
The empire has enough problems to borrow any from the chaos wastes.
And Kief has no incentive to make one either.


Who is going to fund it, ourselves?
Who is going to acompany us to study this?
The colleges? They already did. A second call to come with us won't work any better.

So no, there isn't going to be another one.
Now or never.
 
Saidoro said:
[X] Fortify here and see if anything interesting happens over the next day

The clear worst option is attempting to infiltrate, but I'm not convinced we're actually done here yet. There's no indication we're on a pressing clock yet.


You can't prove a negative in this way. The observations we have of Borek not turning into a chaos spawn and the trees not being mutated in a way that's visible from a distance can't tell the difference between Morghur not having a mutagenic field and him either having one that he can turn off or having one that most strongly applies to spellcasters.
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Every moment spent in the chaos wastes is another moment the expedition spends exposed to the chaos wastes.

The dwarves in the Karag are not responding to any attempts at communication.

Nothing is gonna happen.

We have people we want to return too and things we want to live to do.

The best option for making sure we return to those people and live to do those things is leaving this cursed place behind.
 
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Byzantine said:
The issue is we aren't equipped to figure this out without magic. But Cor-dum being present makes using magic... dangerous, if his aura is at all still present. The dwarves aren't resppnding and it seems like we aren't going to get answers that way. Trying to bypass the desert and forest require either trying a supercharged smoke and mirrors or something else, and leaves us stuck on the other side with potentially no friendlies in the area and no ability to (safely) use additional magic.

We came with a group equipped for what amounts to a quick survey and rescue. We've done the quick survey and the rescue is nonviable.

A future expedition would prioritize speed and the ability to make sense of what we now know is here.
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By all accounts he has been here for hundreds of years and to our Jade wizard the forest looks like a forest. I doubt his aura is at all active. Being in the Karak would probably suffice even if it was, since stone is an excellent insulator of magic.

We haven't surveyed Karag Dum at all, since we haven't even set foot in it.

A future expedition would prioritize sieging ability unless we can prove to the dwarves satisfaction that Dum isn't eternal grudgeworthy, and either way, I doubt it will happen for at least another 200 years, since that's how long it took a dwarf prince with near infinite money and a consuming passion for travelling to Karag Dum to manage it.
 
[ ] Follow a kurgan warparty at a distance and attempt to witness a fight between them and Morghur.

@BoneyM , is this a possible option? I want to see how hostile near-humans are reacted to, and I want to see what we might be dealing with if we engage more closely.
 
Glau said:
[ ] Follow a kurgan warparty at a distance and attempt to witness a fight between them and Morghur.

@BoneyM , is this a possible option? I want to see how hostile near-humans are reacted to, and I want to see what we might be dealing with if we engage more closely.
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Unless they do so at the exact opposite side of Karag Dum, you can witness that from where you are.
 
Well I don't think we will resolve this mystery without taking a great risk so let's take our win and go home without more complication. We can wait a day maybe just to be sure and finishing a few experiment but no more.

[x] Fortify here and see if anything interesting happens over the next day
[x] Leave
 
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ninjafish said:
Every moment spent in the chaos wastes is another moment the expedition spends exposed to the chaos wastes.

The dwarves in the Karag are not responding to any attempts at communication.

Nothing is gonna happen.

We have people we want to return too and things we want to live to do.

The best option for making sure we return to those people and live to do those things is leaving this cursed place behind.
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It'll give time to run a few more complicated experiments and to observe the beastmen clashing with the tribes. We're not guaranteed anything actionable, but there are avenues of investigation remaining.
 
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