Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest

Rafin · Dec 20, 2020

@BoneyM Do we know whether there are any Slaaneshi Dwarf controlled areas left in Vlag? Or does it seem like there weren't any openly worshipping ones other than the small bunch of pink Slayers we shot to pieces?

vsh said:
I can just feel the glee. It's never going to get resolved, isn't it?

Let's be honest: Have we ever definitively confirmed that Max or Panoramia aren't Chaos sleeper agents?

ChronOblivion said:
THE DWARVEN INFECTION SPREADS.

Max grumbled too this update.

SaltyWaffles said:
And Mathilde was using the Protector side of the coin when she did this.

Good point actually. How long does it take for it to be effective? Because we definitely saved at least som Vlag Dawi from imminent danger.
Also, can the Coin's Protector effect be noticed and resisted by exceptional or specially trained individuals similar to how Mathilde resisted "Stone is an excellent insulator for magic"?

Kliden said:
I doubt this. Remember the interlude where we learned about Thorgrimm and the failing power levels of the Rune of Valaya. The power and connection didn't get recognized until the completed crown of K8P got within detection range of Karaz a Karak. I'm betting the same thing is going to be required here.

So no insta-notification, unfortunately.

But that was before, when we thought Karak Vlag was controlled by Slaaneshi forces. Turns out it never fell. It just got misplaced. Its King might still wear its Crown and its Waystone may have just been waiting for the phone line to be plugged in again.

BoneyM said:
Uzkulak has beings travelling across oceans and continents to trade there because the Chaos Dwarves have thousands of years of never compromising on keeping the trade flowing and enforcing the policy that all enmities end at the gates. No matter how much loot they could get from nabbing Mathilde, they'd lose more from trade deciding to go elsewhere. They'd absolutely kill or capture her in a heartbeat if they found her anywhere else, but not inside Uzkulak.

This extends to Karaz Ankor Dwarves and people directly working for Karaz Ankor Dwarves while being decked out in their top gear?
Also, how does Mathilde know this sure enough to be at all confident?

BoneyM said:
they're right there. So she could check them out and see if any opportunities knock while she's poking around.

Maybe it makes less sense to us because those stories were mostly off screen? All I remember is a summary of how Qrech used to fight the Chaos Dwarves from there.
Also, is there any expectation at all that going there will be anything other than a dangerous trip to visit the town where a prisoner-friend grew up?
I mean it's Moulder. It won't be pretty.

BoneyM said:
What the Daemons decided to do. 6 was 'murder each other'.

Which roll was the one that decided that Slaaneshi Dwarves are a thing?

Xilentxium · Dec 20, 2020

BoneyM said:
You grumble

Yep we really are turning into a dwarf

LockedMind · Dec 20, 2020

Omegahugger said:
I had the same thought, but I don't think it really fits. Dechala is the mortal leader of a mortal warband that's way off, so unless BoneyM has done some background rolls that changed her fate it doesn't really make sense that she would be leading a Daemonhost straight from the warp.

Plus the Higher Daemon evaporated into thin air upon death, which doesn't make sense if this was a mortal.

So more likely this is a Daemon Prince or the like who had similar "blessings" to Dechala.

Horium said:
I don't think that's her. Even the wiki lists her as a Chaos Chosen, not as a daemon.

And this waa definitely a daemon.

Also, snake motifs aren't exactly rare with Slaanesh.

If she offed Samael she could ascend as a Daemon Prince. I can totally see something like this happening in the background.

Kornet said:
It is given for greater demons, and we only killed lesser ones.

Which, by the way, tells that Snorri had a particulary interesting time in combat today.

Nope, Snorri got his trait after our initial encounter with daemonettes.

Techmarine · Dec 20, 2020

[x] Thane Borek Forkbeard
[x] Head Engineer Gotrek Gurnisson
[x] Asarnil the Dragonlord
[x] Deathfang
[x] Ice Crone Ljiljana
[x] Visit Uzkulak, the Chaos Dwarf equivalent to Barak Varr

Jyn Ryvia · Dec 20, 2020

DragonParadox said:
By that logic you can make anything Slaanesh's domain:

Reading the Liber Mortis? Slaanesh

Binding apparitions? Slaanesh

Bending the Vow of Poverty? Slaanesh

I think we may have already Fallen.

That is Slaanesh's biggest advantage in the great game dispite being the youngest and weakest of the dark gods.

"Though Khorne is the only god openly hostile to the Dark Prince, Nurgle and Tzeentch are also ill at ease in its presence, despite the fact that the most typical hierarchy of power between the four Chaos Gods sees Slaanesh at the bottom. Even they feel the magnetic pull of Slaanesh's matchless charisma, and are both attracted and repelled by their younger brother.

This is due, in part, to the fact that all the Chaos Gods embody the excess for which Slaanesh is known: Khorne with its bloodlust, Tzeentch with its scheming, and Nurgle with its spreading of plague. Each is an obsession that the Dark Prince can turn to its will with merely a whispered promise.

Lurking deep within the psyche of each of its brothers is the suspicion that the influence of the Dark Prince is rapidly growing, and that Slaanesh will perhaps one day eclipse them all in strength.

With this thought in mind, any alliance of convenience with Slaanesh is especially short-lived; while this could be attributed to simple distrust of one who changes sides at a whim, there is an argument that the Dark Prince's rivals fear the secret power it holds over them."

Now, this is a quote about the 40k version, but it still fits.

Slaanesh's domain is the most widespread, and even intrudes on the other chaos gods turf.

Rafin · Dec 20, 2020

I don't see how visiting Qrech's old home provides anything other than saying we did so and satisfying our excessive curiosity just because there's a chance to do so that won't be available later. It's also both a completely unnecessary risk and doesn't provide anything to anyone else, on the expedition or off (other than maybe bringing Qrech a little doodad from the souvenir shop).

[x] Visit Uzkulak, the Chaos Dwarf equivalent to Barak
[x] Thane Borek Forkbeard
[x] Head Engineer Gotrek Gurnisson
[x] Head Ranger Snorri Farstrider
[x] Preceptor Joerg von Zavstra
[x] Sir Ruprecht Wulfhart the Younger
[x] Citharus, Barbitus, and Timpania
[x] Ranging far ahead of the convoy
[x] Scouting near the convoy
[x] Visit Uzkulak, the Chaos Dwarf equivalent to Barak Varr

SCO · Dec 20, 2020

Alectai said:
Looks like while they're hurting, they're still fairly solid, I think they'll be okay unless a Waaagh! materializes from the aether or the Skaven suddenly emerge from nowhere.

What else do you think the Lord of Change was going to do by going west?

Boney · Dec 20, 2020

Rafin said:
@BoneyM Do we know whether there are any Slaaneshi Dwarf controlled areas left in Vlag? Or does it seem like there weren't any openly worshipping ones other than the small bunch of pink Slayers we shot to pieces?

None were encountered during the descent.

Rafin said:
Good point actually. How long does it take for it to be effective? Because we definitely saved at least som Vlag Dawi from imminent danger.

Mathilde has no idea.

Rafin said:
This extends to Karaz Ankor Dwarves and people directly working for Karaz Ankor Dwarves while being decked out in their top gear?

It extends to everyone.

Rafin said:
Also, how does Mathilde know this sure enough to be at all confident?

Everyone who's read about the Dark Lands or the Chaos Dwarves encounters this information before long.

Rafin said:
Also, can the Coin's Protector effect be noticed and resisted by exceptional or specially trained individuals similar to how Mathilde resisted "Stone is an excellent insulator for magic"?

This discussion has happened already, except it was the Deceiver versus the Grey College. Unstoppable force, immovable object, et cetera.

Rafin said:
Also, is there any expectation at all that going there will be anything other than a dangerous trip to visit the town where a prisoner-friend grew up?

The only way to know is to go there.

Rafin said:
Which roll was the one that decided that Slaaneshi Dwarves are a thing?

Neither, and I think that should be the end of questions on the subject. I've previously had problems with people using 'that was from a diceroll' as an argument against thinking about and discussing specific events.

DragonParadox · Dec 20, 2020

Jyn Ryvia said:
That is Slaanesh's biggest advantage in the great game dispite being the youngest and weakest of the dark gods.

"Though Khorne is the only god openly hostile to the Dark Prince, Nurgle and Tzeentch are also ill at ease in its presence, despite the fact that the most typical hierarchy of power between the four Chaos Gods sees Slaanesh at the bottom. Even they feel the magnetic pull of Slaanesh's matchless charisma, and are both attracted and repelled by their younger brother.

This is due, in part, to the fact that all the Chaos Gods embody the excess for which Slaanesh is known: Khorne with its bloodlust, Tzeentch with its scheming, and Nurgle with its spreading of plague. Each is an obsession that the Dark Prince can turn to its will with merely a whispered promise.

Lurking deep within the psyche of each of its brothers is the suspicion that the influence of the Dark Prince is rapidly growing, and that Slaanesh will perhaps one day eclipse them all in strength.

With this thought in mind, any alliance of convenience with Slaanesh is especially short-lived; while this could be attributed to simple distrust of one who changes sides at a whim, there is an argument that the Dark Prince's rivals fear the secret power it holds over them."

Now, this is a quote about the 40k version, but it still fits.

Slaanesh's domain is the most widespread, and even intrudes on the other chaos gods turf.

Eh you could make that argument for all of them.

The Dark Gods constantly fight, thus Khorne.
The Dark Gods are creatures of magic thus Tzeench.
The Dark Gods are cyclical yet stagnant in their ways thus Nurgle.

Hyborem · Dec 20, 2020

[x] Head Engineer Gotrek Gurnisson
[x] Journeywoman Alexandra Kohler
[x] Visit Uzkulak, the Chaos Dwarf equivalent to Barak Varr

HanEmpire · Dec 20, 2020

[x] Visit Uzkulak, the Chaos Dwarf equivalent to Barak
[x] Thane Borek Forkbeard
[x] Head Engineer Gotrek Gurnisson
[x] Head Ranger Snorri Farstrider
[x] Ice Crone Ljiljana
[x] Magister Egrimm van Horstmann
[x] Visit Uzkulak, the Chaos Dwarf equivalent to Barak Varr
[x] Visit the combes that Qrech told you about

Copperscale · Dec 20, 2020

[x] Thane Borek Forkbeard
[x] Head Engineer Gotrek Gurnisson
[x] Head Ranger Snorri Farstrider
[x] Citharus, Barbitus, and Timpania
[x] Visit Uzkulak, the Chaos Dwarf equivalent to Barak Varr
[X] Sir Ruprecht Wulfhart the Younger

Jyn Ryvia · Dec 20, 2020

DragonParadox said:
Eh you could make that argument for all of them.

The Dark Gods constantly fight, thus Khorne.

The Dark Gods are creatures of magic thus Tzeench.

The Dark Gods are cyclical yet stagnant in their ways thus Nurgle.

.... yes? That was what I was getting at?

(Are you aware you just 180'd the core of your argument against the search of knowledge as only a Tzeentch thing?)

DragonParadox · Dec 20, 2020

Jyn Ryvia said:
.... yes? That was what I was getting at?

(Are you aware you just 180'd the core of your argument against the search of knowledge as only a Tzeentch thing?)

My argument was that is is more Tzeench than Slaanesh (hence 'if anything it's Tzeench'). Both associations are however slight enough that they should reasonably ignored. The only way to never do anything that resonates slightly with the vast domains of the Four is to be dead (either actual dead or a litch or vampire).

Humbaba · Dec 20, 2020

Catching up on the thread and this conversation is hilarious.

"I still have no idea if Egrimm van Horstmann is a chaos worshipper. That dastardly trickster."
"Also, let's go to the Chaos Dwarf trade hub and come back after buying a bunch of suspicious books on magic. No way that could be seen as anything other than totally legit, right?"

Sooo... is Mathilde trying to become Malekith 2.0, this time with less burning?

I mean let's look at the signs:

Huge dwarf friend,
Beloved by a Dwarf King
Massive ego
Shady actions,
Slanneshi cults have "mysteriously appeared" among people who've never had them before (just dawi instead of elves).

I'm just saying, clearly the signs are there.

Nerdasaurus Rex · Dec 20, 2020

For people wondering about Slaanesh and the temptation of knowledge, there's a canon cult called the Bleak Society that started off as a philosophers guild wanting to understand the nature of reality, but their desire for knowledge turned them to Slaanesh worship in order to perfect their studies and academic research. They are fairly low-key, as secret cults go, but whenever a rare or forbidden tome turns up on the black market, they appear to claim it for themselves.
(Tome of Corruption, pg 76)

WhiteNights · Dec 20, 2020

[x] Head Engineer Gotrek Gurnisson
[x] Sir Ruprecht Wulfhart the Younger
[x] Magister Egrimm van Horstmann
[x] Citharus, Barbitus, and Timpania
[x] Journeyman Cyrston von Danling
[x] Thane Borek Forkbeard

Redshirt Army · Dec 20, 2020

I'm fine with going to Uzkulak... as long as we treat it like we're casing out a joint that we're later going to target.

Chaos dwarves are incredibly vile - their society is all the worst parts of industrialism and capitalism turned up to cartoonish extremes. As a Ranaldite and as a generally decent person, at some point - years or decades down the line, once we're no longer endangering the expedition - I want Mathilde to rob Uzkulak blind, free all the slaves, and generally set up a giant clusterfuck of Chaos Dwarf vs Skaven that sees the place razed to the ground.

DragonParadox · Dec 20, 2020

Nerdasaurus Rex said:
For people wondering about Slaanesh and the temptation of knowledge, there's a canon cult called the Bleak Society that started off as a philosophers guild wanting to understand the nature of reality, but their desire for knowledge turned them to Slaanesh worship in order to perfect their studies and academic research. They are fairly low-key, as secret cults go, but whenever a rare or forbidden tome turns up on the black market, they appear to claim it for themselves.
(Tome of Corruption, pg 76)

It also said that their particular path of study lead them to the 'understanding' that the goal of life it to maximize pleasure. Hedonistic philosophers in the original greek sense have every reason to fall to Slaanesh because of what knowledge they were searching and what answer they got.

WinterLantern · Dec 20, 2020

[x] Head Ranger Snorri Farstrider
[X] Thane Borek Forkbeard
[x] Citharus, Barbitus, and Timpania
[x] Magister Michel Solmann

torac · Dec 20, 2020

Is there any way to tell whether the Slayers were corrupted or under some sort of persistent illusion/enchantment? The fact that they acted as slayers has me believe the second one. I'm fairly sure the demons would prefer something more interesting than generic suicidal berserker troops if they had the choice.

Horium · Dec 20, 2020

Erm peeps, we haven't nearly finished checking out neither our own chain of command nor the expedition's.

I know that Chaos Dwarf trading post is a losing battle, the appeal of potential exotic shinies being too overpowering to ignore for questers in general...

But why are people voting for the combes?

DragonParadox · Dec 20, 2020

torac said:
Is there any way to tell whether the Slayers were corrupted or under some sort of persistent illusion/enchantment? The fact that they acted as slayers has be believe the second one. I'm fairly sure the demons would prefer something more interesting than generic suicidal berserker troops if they had the choice.

The daemons don't get to choose what path corruption takes and Slaanesh is about excess, making you more of what you already are. An painter who serves Slaanesh for instance, will still be a painter... only now he might be painting with the blood of his victims.

Fanhunter696 · Dec 20, 2020

Horium said:
But why are people voting for the creches?

Why not? Loot, books, intel, more papers, new research opportunities, even more Skaven smut...

Mopman43 · Dec 20, 2020

LockedMind said:
If she offed Samael she could ascend as a Daemon Prince. I can totally see something like this happening in the background.

Sure, but given we don't have any indication of that in-story, I think that it's fine to assume they weren't a canon character.

Like, if Boney was going to use an ascended Dechala, you'd figure that it'd come up somehow, you know? Not just be down to her appearance?

[X] Thane Borek Forkbeard

Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest

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