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A Sword Without a Hilt: A Song of Ice and Fire/D&D 3.5 Crossover

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Adhoc vote count started by Goldfish on Jun 6, 2020 at 6:13 AM, finished with 63 posts and 11 votes.
  • [X] Use Retrocognition on Monford's Solar, out of personal curiosity if nothing else. Meanwhile Dany will use Soulseeker targeted on the dead maid.
    -[X] Also cast Vision (times as necessary, estimated CL is 26 with buffs) on the gathered poison -
    -[X] Where was it created?
    -[X] Who died by it before?
    --[X] Use your Psionic Gloves of Object Reading to examine the sample.
    -[X] Have the Faceless Men consulted to see if not only this poison is ringing a bell, where it could be acquired, but generally also the mindset of an assassin. This one seems to be acting subtly, but they are also moving in and around private and guarded areas, so they have some capability in mundane wetwork or magic, or both.
    -[X] If they would be bold enough to attack Monford, arranging a clandestine meeting where they can be counter ambushed might be preferable, but if they will only move once they leave all trace of their presence erased, every attack on Monford might be conducted on a pre-arranged basis, or with at least a large enough gap.
    --[X] A better question would be perhaps what would tempt the assassin into a compromised position if they never conduct a killing face to face.
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DragonParadox said:
In a Stranger's Gaze ​

First Day of the Twelfth Month 293 AC

The Dimwell Delving, Plane of Earth


OOC: Another set up chapter with some characterization.
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Thanks for linking back @DragonParadox, it's nice to see the interactions but it's nicest of all to see Xor get to mingle with peers who value his insight and probably find him in ways more familiar and relatable than others in the party.

Looking forward to more of that.
 
Crake said:
Not stable enough.

Assume conceptually that they have good connection to local leylines by being firmly rooted on the ground, or failing that have room to grow continuously. All Heart Trees for example will keep growing and growing pretty much indefinitely. Even IRL, great redwoods will eventually die. These are magic trees. They will become as big as buildings after several thousand years, if you take your eyes off them, give or take a millennia or two. Quite a problem for dragons, you see. Cities changing names and entire languages diverging severely after just a handful of centuries.
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notbirdofprey said:
Darn. I wanted weirwoods that could have three effects at the top of the wall.
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You'd have to consider the other strategic concerns but there's nothing physically stopping us from making solid earth and stone ramparts of sufficient size to support them.
 
Vote closed.
Adhoc vote count started by Goldfish on Jun 6, 2020 at 6:13 AM, finished with 63 posts and 11 votes.
  • [X] Use Retrocognition on Monford's Solar, out of personal curiosity if nothing else. Meanwhile Dany will use Soulseeker targeted on the dead maid.
    -[X] Also cast Vision (times as necessary, estimated CL is 26 with buffs) on the gathered poison -
    -[X] Where was it created?
    -[X] Who died by it before?
    --[X] Use your Psionic Gloves of Object Reading to examine the sample.
    -[X] Have the Faceless Men consulted to see if not only this poison is ringing a bell, where it could be acquired, but generally also the mindset of an assassin. This one seems to be acting subtly, but they are also moving in and around private and guarded areas, so they have some capability in mundane wetwork or magic, or both.
    -[X] If they would be bold enough to attack Monford, arranging a clandestine meeting where they can be counter ambushed might be preferable, but if they will only move once they leave all trace of their presence erased, every attack on Monford might be conducted on a pre-arranged basis, or with at least a large enough gap.
    --[X] A better question would be perhaps what would tempt the assassin into a compromised position if they never conduct a killing face to face.
Click to expand...
 
BronzeTongue said:
Just to give my two cents here, I don't think Ur-Priests of our own gods are worth it. Yes it's a powerful class, but it's not like we're lacking in those and it doesn't offer anything we can't get elsewhere. Stealing from the 7 might be more viable, but if I'm not mistaken the Ur-priest fluff says something about almost all gods hating them.

We can probably get them from some of our closest divine allies, but why should we waste that kind of political capital on something we don't need. It'd be one thing if we needed this for something like the faceless men, but this will be ruinously expensive since we don't have a rebuttal to "why not just use a regular cleric multiclassed with wizard or something ?".
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While your concerns about reputation are valid Ur-Priests are very much something we do not have and they are very very much not equivalent to a multiclassed Cleric/Wizard.

The progression of spell levels is disgustingly fast compared to everything else in the rules that doesn't resemble Cirque Du Soleil to get running.


DragonParadox said:
Inquisitor 5/ Ur Priest 10
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Cheers, and the Master assassins?
 
Deliste said:
While your concerns about reputation are valid Ur-Priests are very much something we do not have and they are very very much not equivalent to a multiclassed Cleric/Wizard.

The progression of spell levels is disgustingly fast compared to everything else in the rules that doesn't resemble Cirque Du Soleil to get running.




Cheers, and the Master assassins?
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the master spy have a basis of rogues to qualify into the PRC the other Ur priests also inquisitor.
 
Deliste said:
While your concerns about reputation are valid Ur-Priests are very much something we do not have and they are very very much not equivalent to a multiclassed Cleric/Wizard.

The progression of spell levels is disgustingly fast compared to everything else in the rules that doesn't resemble Cirque Du Soleil to get running.




Cheers, and the Master assassins?
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I think that the class loses something by reducing it to its mechanical benefits. Ur priests steal power and are reviled by the gods for it, clerics make deals with them and are given their support. You shouldn't get to have the benefits of both without the detriments of either.

The only reason the faceless men get away with it is that the gods of death need to work together without actually working together to continue to exist. Substituting bribery for that motivation is a cheap way to power game.
 
BronzeTongue said:
I think that the class loses something by reducing it to its mechanical benefits. Ur priests steal power and are reviled by the gods for it, clerics make deals with them and are given their support. You shouldn't get to have the benefits of both without the detriments of either.

The only reason the faceless men get away with it is that the gods of death need to work together without actually working together to continue to exist. Substituting bribery for that motivation is a cheap way to power game.
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I didn't say anything about fluff dude I'm just trying to make it clear that comparing it to a Cleric/Wizard is not even a little bit valid, neither by mechanics nor fluff for that matter.

The class* very much offers something we can't get elsewhere, whether we want it is something else entirely.

My read of it so far isn't that it's bribery though but a topic that wouldn't even be broached if we weren't so close to our divine allies, with DP warning we should be careful about who we approach, how, and the costs that may come with it and half the comments immediately following were about stealing from the Seven drawing the ire you mentioned.

Any issues with "cheap powergaming" that you have would have to be taken up with DragonParadox.

*Typo
 
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Deliste said:
I didn't say anything about fluff dude I'm just trying to make it clear that comparing it to a Cleric/Wizard is not even a little bit valid, neither by mechanics nor fluff for that matter.

The fluff very much offers something we can't get elsewhere, whether we want it is something else entirely.

My read of it so far isn't that it's bribery though but a topic that wouldn't even be broached if we weren't so close to our divine allies, with DP warning we should be careful about who we approach, how, and the costs that may come with it and half the comments immediately following were about stealing from the Seven drawing the ire you mentioned.

Any issues with "cheap powergaming" that you have would have to be taken up with DragonParadox.
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It just seems silly to directly contradict the basis of a class to get out of the downsides of it. The fast casting progression is the reward you get for making yourself a target for the gods in general and typically one really pissed off deity in particular. Having to jump through hoops to match that makes sense, and is something we're capable of. Even if we don't bother with optimized builds we can play with the power of money to get minions good enough to do most of what they could for us.

They offer faster access to what we can already get, not a unique resource or ability. In light of that I don't think it's worth introducing them like this. If we were trying to steal power from the void on the basis of "pretty much everyone hates them so we won't get called on it" that'd be one thing, but not from regular gods during more or less normal operations.

Just because we can doesn't mean we should; it wouldn't be the first time we've informally decided to not abuse the shit out of something.
 
Inserted tally
Adhoc vote count started by Goldfish on Jun 6, 2020 at 6:13 AM, finished with 63 posts and 11 votes.
  • [X] Use Retrocognition on Monford's Solar, out of personal curiosity if nothing else. Meanwhile Dany will use Soulseeker targeted on the dead maid.
    -[X] Also cast Vision (times as necessary, estimated CL is 26 with buffs) on the gathered poison -
    -[X] Where was it created?
    -[X] Who died by it before?
    --[X] Use your Psionic Gloves of Object Reading to examine the sample.
    -[X] Have the Faceless Men consulted to see if not only this poison is ringing a bell, where it could be acquired, but generally also the mindset of an assassin. This one seems to be acting subtly, but they are also moving in and around private and guarded areas, so they have some capability in mundane wetwork or magic, or both.
    -[X] If they would be bold enough to attack Monford, arranging a clandestine meeting where they can be counter ambushed might be preferable, but if they will only move once they leave all trace of their presence erased, every attack on Monford might be conducted on a pre-arranged basis, or with at least a large enough gap.
    --[X] A better question would be perhaps what would tempt the assassin into a compromised position if they never conduct a killing face to face.
Click to expand...
 
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Part MMMDXXXII: Spider's Brew
  • Threadmarks
    • Spider's Brew​

    Twenty Third Day of the First Month 294 AC

    Taking one last look into the past of the solar itself offers no more answers that you had already gotten, not that you truly expected anything different given the disquieting amount of competence the assassin had shown. Almost as skilled as the Chosen of the Stranger... You shake the thought away. Quite apart from the Seven having little cause to trouble Monford who is still devoted to them if not particularly religious, you do not see them working with Cersei Lannister of all people.

    You watch with the eyes of mind and memory, a single black gloved hand emerging from the floor to deliver the solid stone wall thick enough to contain a man entirely to deliver the poisoned parchment right into the pile of letters. It would have been impossible to place it so well by touch alone. He must have used some manner of far-sight to see into the room without walking in.

    There is still the poison itself. As Tyene hands it back to you, the span of almost ten thousand leagues between you was nothing, you try to spy upon its history.

    Ghost grass swaying in the wind, its blades cutting the cold air as it passes over it, its roots drinking in what little life there was in the ash-lands as a vampire sups from mortal veins.

    Silver dust mined in places deeper than the deepest mortal pit sifted through ever finer nets, each marked with runes of death and endings until it has turned black as night.

    The tears of the dying, sorrowing and resigned distilled into one.

    You try to see the hands that mixed them, the mind that brewed the deadly venom, but there is only emptiness and silence. Yet even silence can have a timber, even emptiness a taste, and you have tasted its kind before.

    ***​

    For the fifth time you cross the threshold of the the House of Black and White as Tyene briefly takes you place playing the part of Lord Velaryon. Though you do not arrive wearing your own face the glamour is one known to the assassins and soon enough you find yourself in the inner chambers meeting the chillingly placid high priest, his eyes like pools of still venom staring back at you. Bluntly but without haste you recount all you have seen and learned of the assassin lurking near Driftmark, presenting your sample poison at the last.

    The priest of the Many Faced God glances at the vial once absentmindedly, then a second with more intense scrutiny just as silent. You feel the pulse of sorcery in the air but for the first time in years you cannot recognize it, as veiled as the one who cast it. Finally he speaks: "This is akin to a poison some of our own might brew, but transformed, there is the power of the Deep Earth in this."

    "Shaitan?" you guess, recalling your meeting with Tylar of the Lakes in the Opaline Vault, perhaps even that mage you left for the Peerless Empire to deal with, though it seems surprising that one mage of Mantarys could have escaped the attentions of investigators that have played the game of spies and subversion among the Broken Spheres.

    "No," the assassin replies. "The Dark Bellow, the Spider's Kin of which you have twin apostates in your service." There might perhaps have been a note of unease behind the eternally even voice.

    Personally you think this might be worth a bit more worry than that. "Someone is using drow poisons against my vassals?" Had you been in any other place you would have not even have uttered the word, but here you can practically feel the walls drinking in your words that no secret may escape the chamber.

    "The hand that brewed the poison need not be the one that coated it onto the blade," the says. "There are darker markets than those you have traveled to Dragon King, places where the Children of Ruin ply their trade openly, where withered souls and age old sorrows are traded like gold and silver in the bazaars of Braavos."

    "The poison used Ghost Grass," you point out tightly. "Accursed as it may be it still needs the light of day to grow."

    "Then there is trade to carry it into the depths," the grandmaster replies softly. A moment's pause passes, just long enough to be counted a hesitation. "We could send some of the servants of the Many Faced God to hunt down this troublesome shadow, the binding of souls through a needle's tip is no small thing."

    Do you accept the offer of the Faceless Men to send some of their assassins to Driftmark to protect Monford in exchange for access to any information, poisons or enchantments gathered?

    [] Yes, it would allow you to leave in a few days time without leaving the keep considerably weakened if no solution has been found until then

    [] No, you suspect Lord Velaryon would be deeply troubled at being guarded by assassins of such dark repute

    [] Write in

    OOC: Good call on asking the Faceless. Having your own order of assassins with encyclopedic knowledge of all things murderous can at times get you knowledge even the dragon dreams can't quite provide.
     
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  • Threadmarks
    • DragonParadox said:
    Spider's Brew​

    Twenty Third Day of the First Month 294 AC

    Taking one last look into the past of the solar itself offers no more answers than you had already gotten, not that you truly expect anything different given the disquieting amount of competence the assassin had shown. Almost as skilled as the Chosen of the Stranger... You shake the thought away. Quite apart from the Seven having little cause to trouble Monford, who is still devoted to them if not particularly religious, you do not see them working with Cersei Lannister of all people.

    You watch with the eyes of mind and memory as a single black-gloved hand emerges from the floor to deliver the poisoned parchment right into the pile of letters. It would have been impossible to place it so well by touch alone. He must have used some manner of far-sight to see into the room without walking in.

    There is still the poison itself. As Tyene handed it back to you, crossing the span of almost ten thousand leagues as if it were nothing, you try to spy upon its history.

    Ghost grass swaying in the wind, its blades cutting the cold air passing through it, its root drinking in what little life there was in the ash-lands as a vampire sups from mortal veins.

    Silver dust mined in places deeper than the deepest mortal pit then sifted through ever finer nets, each marked with runes of death and endings, until it has turned black as night.

    The tears of the dying, sorrowing, and resigned distilled into one.

    You try to see the hands that mixed them, the mind that brewed the deadly venom, but there is only emptiness and silence. Yet even silence can have a timber, even emptiness a taste, and you have tasted its kind before.

    ***​

    For the fifth time you cross the threshold of the the House of Black and White, as Tyene briefly takes your place playing the part of Lord Velaryon. Though you do not arrive wearing your own face, the glamor is one known to the assassins and soon enough you find yourself in the inner chambers meeting the chillingly placid high priest, his eyes like pools of still venom staring back at you. Bluntly but without haste, you recount all you have seen and learned of the assassin lurking near Driftmark, presenting your sample of poison at the last.

    The priest of the Many-Faced God glances at the vial once, absentmindedly, then a second more intense scrutiny just as silent. You feel the pulse of sorcery in the air but for the first time in years you cannot recognize it, as veiled as the one who cast it. Finally he speaks, "This is akin to a poison some of our own might brew, but transformed. There is the power of the Deep Earth in this."

    "Shaitan?" you guess, recalling your meeting with Tylar of the Lakes in the Opaline Vault, perhaps even that mage you left for the Peerless Empire to deal with, though it seems surprising that one mage of Manatarys could have escaped the attentions of investigators that have played the game of spies and subversion among the Broken spheres.

    "No," the assassin replies. "The Dark Below, the Spider's Kin of which you have twin apostates in your service." There might perhaps have been a note of unease behind the eternally even voice.

    Personally, you think this might be worth a bit more worry than that. "Someone is using drow poisons against my vassals?" Had you been in any other place you would not even have uttered the word, but here you can practically feel the walls drinking in your words so that no secret may escape the chamber.

    "The hand that brewed the poison need not be the one that coated it onto the blade," the says. "There are darker markets than those you have traveled to, Dragon King, places where the Children of Ruin ply their trade openly, where withered souls and age old sorrows are traded like gold and silver in the bazaars of Braavos."

    "The poison used Ghost Grass," you point out tightly. "Accursed as it may be, it still needs the light of day to grow."

    "Then there is trade to carry it into the depths," the grand-master replies softly. A moment's pause passes, just long enough to be counted a hesitation. "We could send some of the servants of the Many-Faced God to hunt down this troublesome shadow, the binding of souls through a needle's tip is no small thing."

    Do you accept the offer of the Faceless Men to send some of their assassins to Driftmark to protect Monford in exchange for access to any information, poisons, or enchantments gathered?

    [] Yes, it would allow you to leave in a few days time without leaving the keep considerably weakened if no solution has been found until then

    [] No, you suspect Lord Velaryon would be deeply troubled at being guarded by assassins of such dark repute

    [] Write in

    OOC: Good call on asking the Faceless. Having your own order of assassins with encyclopedic knowledge of all things murderous can at times get you knowledge even the dragon dreams can't quite provide. Not yet edited.
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    Here's an edited version of the chapter, DP.
     
    Duesal said:
    So the Drow have contact with the surface world. Lovely.
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    Probably not the same Drow we found down in the bowels of Sothoryos, at least, given the separation between the two continents and the ocean dividing them. It could be an entirely different Drow polity. That's good for us (and everyone else on the surface), because Drow communities war upon one another incessantly. If there is two or more Drow nations in the Underdark of Planetos, they're probably occupied fighting among themselves.
    LightLan said:
    Might our twin apostates be able to tell us more?
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    At first I thought that, too, but then I remembered our Drow minions are travelers on the sea of time. They were trapped in their cursed forms for many thousands of years before we freed them, so they aren't likely to be able to provide any useful information, beyond perhaps further details on the poison if they are familiar with it.
     
    [X] Yes, it would allow you to leave in a few days time without leaving the keep considerably weakened if no solution has been found until then
    -[X] Before Tyene returns to her mission in Slaver's Bay, ask her to speak with Morwyn and Tuin when she next sees them. The Drow assassins might be able to offer some insight into the poison, if they are familiar with it. Potential shelf life of the poison is of particular interest.
     
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    Does this mean we are finally going to have a road trip in the somewhat near future to the Underdark?
    I seem to recall that is one of the places we know about that we haven't actually properly (cough)(looted)(cough) visited yet.

    Edit:
    [X] Goldfish
     
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    Tomcost said:
    Okay. So we can gather that both the Drow and the Bloodstone Emperor gad a hand in this
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    It'd be really weird for the bloodstone emperor to be doing this kind of stuff across the world from his area of control. He'd be better served by using his resources in Yi-Ti than here. Even if he was doing something like this, the Velaryons are a weird target. They're important, but not critical, and have good defenses. If he wanted to set us back he could use the same or fewer resources killing other important people.

    If our mystery opponent's goal was just to distract or harm us then they could have really screwed up our schedule by killing Robert, for example. I think that the BE would probably be canny enough to do that, or stage some sort of false flag attack to kick off the war, before he'd go for something like this.

    I think it's reasonable to assume that this person has some sort of stake in Westeros specifically that stopped them from doing something more drastic.
    edit: fixed autocorrect errors.
     
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