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A Sword Without a Hilt: A Song of Ice and Fire/D&D 3.5 Crossover

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Goldfish said:
So what? They're getting paid more to do their job. Yay for them. The point is that we would be getting 10% for doing absolutely nothing!
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1) They shouldn't be told about our connection to the Shaitan.
2) They should have no earthly idea about whether what we pay them is some part of a greater whole or just a sum we came up with.

There's no reason not to say "I will pay you a bonus if you bring me proof of hurting Efreeti interests". That's it.

But first we got to confirm it with the Vizier.
 
Duesal said:
@DragonParadox, can we help it out? Possibly track it down from time to time and sacrifice Efreeti over it to make it stronger?
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DragonParadox said:
Er...maybe but being undead it does not like the the living so establishing meaningful communication would be quite difficult.
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Azel said:
Can't we just make a Adamantine fishing rod and dangle a unconscious Cornugon over the sea?
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Track it and leave it breadcrumbs in form of bound devils on the way to some place we don't like. Or reenact some good old Pet Leveling guide with it.

[x] TotallyNotEvil
 
Azel said:
@Goldfish, can we compromise on this by waiting a bit?

Let them tag along with Baella as I suggested for some easy marks and talk to the Shaitan if they pay for whalers attacked by pirates in our employ. I do not want to promise them money we might not get.

That's my only issue with your proposal. In my reading of the Shaitans intentions, you would be selling Yrten a cske that doesn't exist.
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As sub-contractors, the pirates would be our employees. When they raided Efreeti vessels, they would be acting in our stead. The Shaitan have already agreed to pay bounties for each Efreeti ship we capture. I don't think they will have any issues with us not personally attending each raid.
 
Azel said:
@TotallyNotEvil, please nudge them to work with Bealla. It's a win-win arrangement.

[X] TotallyNotEvil
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I don't want Baella dealing with these people at all. She's a gentle soul and they are pirates who have not only survived in the Plane of Fire, but appear to have thrived.

It would be all too easy for one of them to sell her out or decide a surprise attack on a friendly, pacifistic Fire Whale might make a nice payday.
 
Goldfish said:
As sub-contractors, the pirates would be our employees. When they raided Efreeti vessels, they would be acting in our stead. The Shaitan have already agreed to pay bounties for each Efreeti ship we capture. I don't think they will have any issues with us not personally attending each raid.
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The issue is that I have a different reading of that agreement.

As I perceived it, we would get no money for minor civilian vessels.

@DragonParadox, could you clear this up? Under what conditions do the Shaitan pay us?
 
Duesal said:
What it used to be doesn't really matter. It's because it's now so small and weak, and the fact that Yss is going to be the one offering the main source of protection, that I'm making this vote. This is not a meeting of equals, this is a lesser godling seeking aid and much-needed protection from a greater one. That's why it's fair to suggest the coatl become Yss' subordinate.

Besides, if the snakes consider the deal unfair, they will reject it. We're offering suggestions, not dictating terms.
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Being subordinate forever wouldn't be fair too, and both of them are obsessed with fair deals, so the deal will probably be that it is subordinate to Yss for a long time, but once the debt is paid, it can become independent if it wants to.
 
Goldfish said:
I don't want Baella dealing with these people at all. She's a gentle soul and they are pirates who have not only survived in the Plane of Fire, but appear to have thrived.

It would be all too easy for one of them to sell her out or decide a surprise attack on a friendly, pacifistic Fire Whale might make a nice payday.
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Because butchering the friend of an Adult Red capable of casting 8th levels, who is a personal friend of a god, is such a great life-choice to make.

I think they are clever enough to not commit suicide-by-dragon like that.
 
If we are going to leave with Baella, I think we should be explicit in how terrible a plan it would be to double cross her in any way. No offence but I would prefer not to put my faith in a Pirate's common sense.
 
So when we do get the red dragon orb what are we going to do with it because I for one would rather destroy it and be done with it. If using the thing get's every dragon who knows pissed the opposite should happen if it is destroyed.
 
Finally off the road!
Fehu said:
Alright, now that the deal with Yrten is finished. We never did add a first dibs buying loot clouse. But.

@DragonParadox @Duesal @Goldfish can Viserys ask if he can buy the Erinyes statue and Green dragonscale items? Please?

:(
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@TotallyNotEvil, I kind of also wanted a chance to buy those.
DragonParadox said:
  • Green Dragonscale Talisman set with Gold (1000 gp)
  • Ebony Statue of an Erinyes (5000 gp)
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It would be an expenditure of 1,200 IM overall. The Green Dragonscale Talisman especially I feel like we could turn into something neat. If we bought only that it'd be 200 IM.
 
So I am lying in my bed and suddenly one thing that slipped my mind when I was reading the chapter jumped to the front again.
DragonParadox said:
"So you take everything that'll freeze my fingers off?" Yrten smiles,
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@DragonParadox, that is an awesomeness that you bring to us your readers, a great example of real writer, to have such small details put here and there that create a live world!
Happy 9k to you!
 
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DragonParadox said:
Er...maybe but being undead it does not like the the living so establishing meaningful communication would be quite difficult.
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Garin feels less living than average, do that mean he has better chances of establishing communications with it, otherwise if it's dislike is for the living specifically, we can exchange messages with him though a construct, things like golems don't really count as alive.
Goldfish said:
@Duesal, @TotallyNotEvil, @Everyone I don't know about the rest of y'all, but I've worked for a business where we were both contactors at some points and sub-contractors at others.

You don't try to shortchange your sub-contractors, not if you want to keep them working for you. It's simply a bad business practice which encourages them to perform at a subpar level and to seek employment elsewhere.

The returns on such arrangements are not often anything spectacular, but you also have very little work or resources tied up in it, either. Often, a single contractor can have many sub-contractors working for them, earning only a small amount from each, but on the whole making serious money for next to no effort.
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I'm not sure if Yrten is trustworthy enough to let him know about the Shaitan's, but the deal you want to offer to Yrten, that's the deal I have wanted to offer to Amrelath for quite some time, though a version where he only get 70 or 80% of the bounty not 90%, but yeah the people actually doing all the work should get most of the pay, while we take a small cut, for putting them in contact with their new employers.
Abhishek M said:
But here is the thing though. I dont want them hitting targets for us that any four companies could have taken in their afternoon lunch break. I what them to scout real military targets like the Turtle ships and just call us in with some general information on the target. They would be doing less direct combat than they did here. And people were already hungup about the split.

Trackers and information brokers basically. You don't pay them over half the payout.
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separate deals then, a deal where they get 80% of the bounty when they hit targets by themselves, and 10% of the Loot and Bounty, when all they do is act as spotters for us, so we can come do all the combat.

But I'm not sure if offering them the light bounty work is a good idea, I don't think the Shaitan want us to hire pirates on the Sea of Flames to do bounty work for them, those guys are already being annoyances to the Efreeti for free, paying them to do so is just a loss of money for no gain for them, so while the Shaitan will be happy to pay any bounty hunters we bring in from far off, I don't think they will be as happy about us offering POF pirates the bounties, because that's just paying them extra to do what they do anyway.

So bringing in outsiders like Amrelath will please the Shaitan, adding extra expenses for no gains, by getting local pirates in on the deal, will not.

So yeah as they as they are local and already against the Efreeti, I don't think the Shaitans will want to pay them bounties, for light bounty hunting such as Whalers, but giving them spotting work for us, where they tell us when they see targets too hard for them to hit alone, for a small cut of the loot and bounty would be great.

Also @DragonParadox I have got to ask, you said the Shaitan's hunt fire whales because their internal furnaces produce gems, are those gems vital to Fire whales, or something they produce over time ,meaning an adult fire whale typically have more gems in them than their system need? Because if it's the second, we could probably arrange for a pod of whales to get a bodyguard ship in return for letting a trusted person take a small shape, be buffed up with immunities, and go into the adult whales stomach, and remove a small amount of gems every X amount of days, with X being the length it take to regenerate such gems.

If those gems are vital organs that don't regrow over time, or if they will spend a lot of time sick from this, then such a deal of course don't work, but if the gems are more like blood or stomach acid, then it shouldn't hurt them to have a few percent removed every few months because it should grow back, and 95% of the normal amount should be enough to live normally.
Goldfish said:
They are at war, dude. Why wouldn't they pay?

They won't give a flying fart about who is raiding the ships as long as the job gets done.
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They wouldn't pay because he's already doing it for free, paying a hunter to go kill hogs because you want them gone is a good idea, paying a hunter who's already spending all his time hunting hogs and selling them to a butcher, to hunt hogs is just a waste of money, he wont be killing more hogs because you are paying him, he's just suddenly being paid twice to hunt hogs instead of once.

So paying a deer hunter to switch to hogs is a good financial decision, paying a hog hunter to switch to hogs isn't, because he was already doing the work without you paying him, so if you can get away with hiring other hunters to hunt hogs, without having to pay him to continue, then that's the smart financial decision.
 
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Adhoc vote count started by TotallyNotEvil on Sep 10, 2018 at 11:13 AM, finished with 225584 posts and 15 votes.
  • [X] TotallyNotEvil
    [X] Offer Sorcerer's Deep as a new permanent residence for the Coatl much as you have done for Yss, as it will be easier to keep it safe from being hunted by devils and efreeti in the heart of our and Yss' power
    -[X] Afterwards speak with Yrten and Siduri
    -[X] In no particular order, try to learn the following from them;
    --[X] If they are enemies of the Efreeti, where do they make port, and in what markets do they conduct business?
    ---[X] Try to learn enough about these locations that we could find them without assistance, if possible. Maps would be ideal.
    --[X] Do they have any useful contacts they might be able to introduce us to? This wouldn't just be fences and employers, but black market traders, corrupt City of Brass officials willing to be bought, etc. We are willing to pay for good information.
    --[X] Can the Golden Wind Plane Shift in some manner?
    --[X] To what degree is their business tied to slaving?
    --[X] Would they be interested in a new line of work? Specifically, this would be as sub-contractors raiding Efreeti vessels, spying on them, and gathering information. We would pay them for each Efreeti vessel they capture (pay equal to 90% of the bounty the Shaitan pay us) and for each piece of useful information (rates depend on the value and reliability of the information).
    [X] Offer Sorcerer's Deep as a new permanent residence for the Coatl much as you have done for Yss, as it will be easier to keep it safe from being hunted by devils and efreeti in the heart of our and Yss' power
    --[X] Afterwards speak with Yrten and Siduri
    --[X] In no particular order, try to learn the following from them;
    ---[X] If they are enemies of the Efreeti, where do they make port, and in what markets do they conduct business?
    ----[X] Try to learn enough about these locations that we could find them without assistance, if possible.
    ---[X] While you're at it, learn of the peoples the Efreeti have subjugated, and which ones most chafe under their tyranny.
    ---[X] Do they have any useful contacts they might be able to introduce us to? This wouldn't just be fences and employers, but black market traders, corrupt City of Brass officials willing to be bought, etc. We are willing to pay for good information.
    ---[X] Can the Golden Wind Plane Shift in some manner?
    ---[X] To what degree is their business tied to slaving?
    ---[X] Most important of all, you need information. You've already seen one neutral port which gave you the intel you needed to attack the turtle ships and even this devil's ship, but you need intel immediately up-to-date. Whatever channel of information Yrten has in place, we want him to leverage it to give us a clear view of all potential targets in the Plane of Fire. He will of course get an informant's fee for his services.
    ----[X] Suggest a more long-term business arrangement, with them contacting us directly if a particularly valuable target happens to show up. The share of the treasure will be negotiated on a case-by-case basis.
    ---[X] For now, we suggest they work with a friend of ours here in the Plane of Fire if they are out to hunter whalers or such.
    ---[X] Buy the Greenscale Pendant and Erynies statue for 1200 IM.
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TotallyNotEvil said:
In this case, we'd be paying them a bonus to, essentially, keep doing their jobs.

The hunt itself is already a huge profit.
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No, we'd of course be asking them to do a little more. Go after targets that could attract them the wrong sort of attention, for one thing. Focus on merchants who deal with the Efreet army for example.
I would like to ask them to go after shared targets - that is, we give similar deals to other pirates and have them mob a ship or two to take down bigger targets.

Azel said:
Your plan hinges on the Shaitan being stupid.

We get paid for attacking military shipping, not random fishing vessels. Yrten can't take on military vessels by his own words.

So they are incapable of doing the job you want to hire them for.
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Maybe with extra money he'll be able to take on military ships. He did say that the main source of their strength is the depth of their pockets, after all.
Otherwise we could hire many pirates and make a fleet or two of them, and have them attack medium-priority targets.

DragonParadox said:
They pay you for causing chaos and bringing in ships in ways that make the Brazen Throne looks weak, how you do it is your business, as long as you do not negatively impact the Shaitans' own operations.
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Good. So all we need to do is focus on achieving results, if they don't really care about the methods! Do we know how much of a result we are expecting? Are we meant to cripple something, or just impede them and make things more expensive for them?


I think that outright reinforcing the pirates is nice but impractical. Let's focus on recruiting more and better organizing them for now.
 
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