No, they will not. They have resupply by water. We can't do shit to them.
Paths of Civilization II: Paths of Industrialization
- Location
- United States
Eh, that's fine with me.
- Location
- Panama City
ehh, missed the part where you wanyted to move away from state capitalism, which is why I deleted my post
HanEmpire
Delicious
Are Weihar's letters getting through now? What effects are they having on the Hung Imperial Court?
- Location
- Sweden
Not all their strongholds are by the sea and we might be able to reach not!Korea
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Steel railroads and the Trans-Kyberian Railroad. So at least another twenty years of development before you can start the project.
That's generally what you are already doing. It's not really working because anything significant was fortified with those sorts of attacks in mind. Sure, you're making the locals miserable, but the primary fortresses that make holding the territory impossible while they stand are all supplied by sea. While you have hit them harder than expected because you can get horse artillery out there, it isn't enough to reduce the fortresses in a timely manner before the Qeshyks have to run off to resupply themselves.
The important ones are, and the Chesun territories are protected by mountain fortresses built to withstand artillery. The Hung have taken tens of thousands of casualties doing nothing against those fortresses, which you have wisely most just stood back from.
Can we DO the Nohon and Hung to negotiate a three party peace deal?
At this point if we can peace the Nohon and Hung out from eachother and send the Khiberian forces to Hung to support our favored faction we can ensure the biggest hunk of Hung possible stays united.
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VoidZero
Passing Flan 布丁魔王
- Location
- Anywhere but RL
Which Hung? The crumbling imperial court or governor(s). Hung dynasty is better off dead for reformation of the Hung state.
Nohon won't take it unless they catch fire from another direction.
The Hung CAN act to fix it, but they're apparently in a political deadlock from the unprecedented situation of not being the baddest kid on the block so they're just screaming a lot while doing not much.
Which a theoretical Diplomatic Outreach might shake loose by giving them SOME kind of roadmap or persuasion. Or there might be more and louder screaming.
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Yes, although at this point neither side is ready to negotiate with each other, which is why the diplomats haven't pushed for it yet.
- Location
- Illinois
@Academia Nut what kind of losses are we seeing the Nohon take? Both on land and at sea?
Random Member
Gardener of Human Happiness
- Location
- Behind You
It might turn out that the best way to help the Hung would actually be to drop them and help the remnants rebuild from scratch.
[X][War] Uti possidetis - Peace out with limited gains (+1 Temp Happiness)
[X][Bill] 2 PW - King's Bill (+1 temp SoL, Boost Science Research, +2 Sell Crown Corp Uses)
[X][Rails] 1 PW - Yes please(Kielmyr Invest, gain +1 Railroads)
don't you people want to figure out what's going on with the the Green Light?
[X][Bill] 2 PW - King's Bill (+1 temp SoL, Boost Science Research, +2 Sell Crown Corp Uses)
[X][Rails] 1 PW - Yes please(Kielmyr Invest, gain +1 Railroads)
don't you people want to figure out what's going on with the the Green Light?
- Location
- Staring into the void
[X][War] Uti possidetis - Peace out with limited gains (+1 Temp Happiness)
[X][Bill] 1 PW - Veto (+1 temp Consciousness
[X][Rails] 1 PW - Yes please (Kielmyr Invest, gain +1 Railroads)
[X][Bill] 1 PW - Veto (+1 temp Consciousness
[X][Rails] 1 PW - Yes please (Kielmyr Invest, gain +1 Railroads)
Hm. The Nohon are either barely losing any ships, or they're able to endure attrition as well as the DC is, which is impressive either way.
Eh. I have been hoping the war would fraction the Hung from the start, so I don't really mind that "winning" isn't possible. What is still possible is to use this war to position the DC favourably in Hung internal politics (whether those politics are between semi-independent provincial governors or within an Imperial Court that manages to re-assert central control).
Which is something I really, really don't want to see. There is a world of difference between losing a war and making conditional peace and being crushed in a war and giving the enemy anything if only they'll make it stop.
There are plenty of ways we can cut off ports on a sea we don't control. Now, most of them do involve artillery. So either you need to pre-position enough supplies to complete a siege or you need the logistics to bring new canon and shot as fast as the siege consumes them.
What about moving things by steam boat over what I would assume are the plentiful rivers in Kyberia?
fasquardon
At this point I support staying in the war and a DO for a three way peace. We take a faction of Hung we like and offer them millitary support. We offer the Nohon allowing them to turn Khiberia back into something other than a food and money pit to keep supplied.
Basically we are in the position of offering both sides something they want badly in return for going along with our peace.
We would be giving up those "minor gains" most likely, but a Hung dependant on us for reunification and a faster start to that would be Very nice.
Basically we are in the position of offering both sides something they want badly in return for going along with our peace.
We would be giving up those "minor gains" most likely, but a Hung dependant on us for reunification and a faster start to that would be Very nice.
This is reminding me a lot of the Trelli war.
Odds are, the Sketch are also making a killing selling war material to the Nohon just so we keep bleeding while they make mad dosh from it.
So either peace out or try and build a coalition against Nohon. The problem is, anyone relevant has little to gain except maybe some racism to motivate it.
Asymmetric attacks via espionage might work as well. We don't have the groundwork for it, though. Although I suppose we could try and manipulate the Sketch. Either spread panic that the Nohons actions cause the Silk and Tea to dry up soon or that the Nohon will be unable to pay. Or something that gets the Sketch public into an outrage demanding action to be taken.
@Academia Nut
How aware is the Sketch public about the genocide cordon and how much could we make them care about it? Do they have enough influence on politics that they could force the government to take action?
Have the Black Sheep resolved the Kus situation sufficiently that they could survive us dropping the subsidy? Would dropping it (or the threat of such) give the Sketch and Halvyni a reason to take a swing at Nohon? Or at least give us basing rights in exchange?
Odds are, the Sketch are also making a killing selling war material to the Nohon just so we keep bleeding while they make mad dosh from it.
So either peace out or try and build a coalition against Nohon. The problem is, anyone relevant has little to gain except maybe some racism to motivate it.
Asymmetric attacks via espionage might work as well. We don't have the groundwork for it, though. Although I suppose we could try and manipulate the Sketch. Either spread panic that the Nohons actions cause the Silk and Tea to dry up soon or that the Nohon will be unable to pay. Or something that gets the Sketch public into an outrage demanding action to be taken.
@Academia Nut
How aware is the Sketch public about the genocide cordon and how much could we make them care about it? Do they have enough influence on politics that they could force the government to take action?
Have the Black Sheep resolved the Kus situation sufficiently that they could survive us dropping the subsidy? Would dropping it (or the threat of such) give the Sketch and Halvyni a reason to take a swing at Nohon? Or at least give us basing rights in exchange?
[x][War] Continue War - Royalists Pleased
[x][Bill] 1 PW - Veto (+1 temp Consciousness
[x][Rails] 1 PW - Yes please (Kielmyr Invest, gain +1 Railroads)
[x][Bill] 1 PW - Veto (+1 temp Consciousness
[x][Rails] 1 PW - Yes please (Kielmyr Invest, gain +1 Railroads)
- Location
- Panama City
for some reason missing the two parentheses at the end of those votes is causing the tally to bug out a little, can you fix your vote please?
- Location
- Meycauayan, Bulacan, Philippines
[X][War] Uti possidetis - Peace out with limited gains (+1 Temp Happiness)
[X][Rails] 1 PW - Yes please (Kielmyr Invest, gain +1 Railroads)
[X][Bill] 2 PW - Proper Living Bill (-1 Temp IC, -1 SoL, Settle Kyberi Action, +3 Temp SoL, +1 Edu, +1 Innovation, +4 Sell Crown Corp Uses, Conservatives Pleased Twice[+2 Temp Happiness])
@Academia Nut, how old is Weihar and Yenyna right now? And what are they doing?
[X][Rails] 1 PW - Yes please (Kielmyr Invest, gain +1 Railroads)
[X][Bill] 2 PW - Proper Living Bill (-1 Temp IC, -1 SoL, Settle Kyberi Action, +3 Temp SoL, +1 Edu, +1 Innovation, +4 Sell Crown Corp Uses, Conservatives Pleased Twice[+2 Temp Happiness])
@Academia Nut, how old is Weihar and Yenyna right now? And what are they doing?
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- Location
- Voidbetweenstars
[X][War] Continue War - Royalists Pleased
[X][Rails] 1 PW - Yes please (Kielmyr Invest, gain +1 Railroads)
[X][Bill] 2 PW - Proper Living Bill (-1 Temp IC, -1 SoL, Settle Kyberi Action, +3 Temp SoL, +1 Edu, +1 Innovation, +4 Sell Crown Corp Uses, Conservatives Pleased Twice[+2 Temp Happiness])
[X][Rails] 1 PW - Yes please (Kielmyr Invest, gain +1 Railroads)
[X][Bill] 2 PW - Proper Living Bill (-1 Temp IC, -1 SoL, Settle Kyberi Action, +3 Temp SoL, +1 Edu, +1 Innovation, +4 Sell Crown Corp Uses, Conservatives Pleased Twice[+2 Temp Happiness])
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Complicated. On land you are securing many more victories, but because of their shorter lines to their core and the fact that you are mostly ravaging fishing and logging villages you aren't really causing much in the way of damage.
At sea, the primary issue is that when you have a battle the Nohon retreat to their ports and are repaired within a month, while when you take damage you are out for a six months to a year. You also suffer more attrition and can't be as bold because the risk of a damaged ship sinking or being ambushed on its way back to a port where it can repair is much greater due to the longer times at sea. At this point you are mostly just protecting shipping.
