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Paths of Civilization II: Paths of Industrialization

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[X] [Peace] 2 PW - Negotiate with the rest of the Coalition for the Dissolution of Tortun (Gain Wyrmyn lands, remove Humiliating Loss, Tortun Republic broken up into six Constitutional Grand Duchies, various powers gain small amounts of Tortun land, Ochruhr utterly humiliated by all powers)
[X] [Guilds] 1 PW - Allow the dissolution but do not address the larger issue of the guilds (-1 Temp Happiness, +1 Temp Consciousness, remove Recent Constitutional Changes status)
[X] [Research] Modern Nationalism (0/???) [Social]
 
[X] [Peace] 0 PW - Take the Wyrmyn territories you have conquered and let everyone else figure things out (-2 Temp Trust, gain Wyrmyn lands, may not count as avenging Humiliating Loss)
[X] [Guilds] 4 PW Invested - Begin a new constitutional convention to address these issues (1819 is a constitutional turn)
[X] [Research] Modern Nationalism (0/???) [Social]
 
HanEmpire said:
Nationalism will come without our intervention anyways. If we invent it ourselves we'll get to pick the rhetoric.
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Pretty sure thats not how it's works, if anyting we most likly get to pick a side and decide on the dominant nationality, which then will try to stamp out the others leading to social unrest unless our social Stats are good enough to tank it, which means we should probably invest more into SoL, Happiness & Education if we are able to

[X] [Peace] 0 PW - Take the Wyrmyn territories you have conquered and let everyone else figure things out (-2 Temp Trust, gain Wyrmyn lands, may not count as avenging Humiliating Loss)
[X] [Guilds] 4 PW Invested - Begin a new constitutional convention to address these issues (1819 is a constitutional turn)
[X] [Research]Academic Freedom (0/???) [Social]
 
[X] [Peace] 0 PW - Take the Wyrmyn territories you have conquered and let everyone else figure things out (-2 Temp Trust, gain Wyrmyn lands, may not count as avenging Humiliating Loss)
[X] [Guilds] 4 PW Invested - Begin a new constitutional convention to address these issues (1819 is a constitutional turn)

[X] [Research]Academic Freedom (0/???) [Social]
 
[X] [Research] Modern Nationalism (0/???) [Social]
[X] [Peace] 0 PW - Take the Wyrmyn territories you have conquered and let everyone else figure things out (-2 Temp Trust, gain Wyrmyn lands, may not count as avenging Humiliating Loss)
[X] [Guilds] 4 PW Invested - Begin a new constitutional convention to address these issues (1819 is a constitutional turn)
 
4 Political Will isn't enough to fully break the guilds. We're a half turn away from getting more PW for the convention, we should do it then so we can be sure we get what we want from it.
 
Faron, you madman!

[X] [Peace] 0 PW - Take the Wyrmyn territories you have conquered and let everyone else figure things out (-2 Temp Trust, gain Wyrmyn lands, may not count as avenging Humiliating Loss)
[X] [Guilds] 4 PW Invested - Begin a new constitutional convention to address these issues (1819 is a constitutional turn)
[X] [Research]Academic Freedom (0/???) [Social]
 
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[X] [Peace] 2 PW - Negotiate with the rest of the Coalition for the Dissolution of Tortun (Gain Wyrmyn lands, remove Humiliating Loss, Tortun Republic broken up into six Constitutional Grand Duchies, various powers gain small amounts of Tortun land, Ochruhr utterly humiliated by all powers)
[X] [Guilds] 1 PW - Allow the dissolution but do not address the larger issue of the guilds (-1 Temp Happiness, +1 Temp Consciousness, remove Recent Constitutional Changes status)
[X] [Research] Modern Nationalism (0/???) [Social]
 
Academia Nut said:
You never made it to Tortun territory, while they were only lightly squeezed into their own territory through a magnificent but ultimately doomed series of defenses. Everyone has paid considerable blood, enough that a good peace now will appease everyone but the Ochruhr. Some are kind of annoyed that you took so long dealing with the Wyrmyn, but acknowledge that keeping them out of the fight was a key component in making sure the Tortun could not throw the Coalition back.
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So hmm, looks like if we had taken lesser options the Tortun would have had the potential capability to keep going on because they didn't need to deal with the tide from our side.
Sivantic said:
Question, which direction do we want to take our third Academy in? Of the four options we have seen (Social, Military, Industrial, Science) we have two of Social and Military. While having one of each is nice, specializing in Social or Military would not necessarily be a bad thing.
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Science personally. It's already doing Optics and we also want Logic soon.
We should have a 4th slot opening up next turnish?
Academia Nut said:
With 4 you can probably break the guilds, but it really isn't enough. Then again taking a few more years to let things continue to fester could have negative consequences as well.
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So the ideal solution is to put it off one year, gather up the PW to 8, and then go in for another kegger?
Plus of course, let the Precision Guilds Corporations grossly outcompete their former Guilds and see if they prefer Tradition or Money.
The more Guilds that can see the way the wind is blowing, the easier when we push
 
[X] [Peace] 2 PW - Negotiate with the rest of the Coalition for the Dissolution of Tortun (Gain Wyrmyn lands, remove Humiliating Loss, Tortun Republic broken up into six Constitutional Grand Duchies, various powers gain small amounts of Tortun land, Ochruhr utterly humiliated by all powers)
[X] [Guilds] 1 PW - Allow the dissolution but do not address the larger issue of the guilds (-1 Temp Happiness, +1 Temp Consciousness, remove Recent Constitutional Changes status)
[X] [Research] Modern Nationalism (0/???) [Social]

Guys? Don't forget that last time we had a 'Break the Guilds' option it cost 6 PW... And whilst it might be cheaper, it might also be more expensive. We also can't be certain of getting +PW Options in the constitution options that we'll want to take, even to allow the breaking of the guilds.
 
[X] [Peace] 2 PW - Negotiate with the rest of the Coalition for the Dissolution of Tortun (Gain Wyrmyn lands, remove Humiliating Loss, Tortun Republic broken up into six Constitutional Grand Duchies, various powers gain small amounts of Tortun land, Ochruhr utterly humiliated by all powers)
[X] [Guilds] 1 PW - Allow the dissolution but do not address the larger issue of the guilds (-1 Temp Happiness, +1 Temp Consciousness, remove Recent Constitutional Changes status)
[X] [Research] Modern Nationalism (0/???) [Social]
 
[X] [Peace] 2 PW - Negotiate with the rest of the Coalition for the Dissolution of Tortun (Gain Wyrmyn lands, remove Humiliating Loss, Tortun Republic broken up into six Constitutional Grand Duchies, various powers gain small amounts of Tortun land, Ochruhr utterly humiliated by all powers)
[X] [Guilds] 1 PW - Allow the dissolution but do not address the larger issue of the guilds (-1 Temp Happiness, +1 Temp Consciousness, remove Recent Constitutional Changes status)
 
sidestory said:
Pretty sure thats not how it's works, if anyting we most likly get to pick a side and decide on the dominant nationality, which then will try to stamp out the others leading to social unrest unless our social Stats are good enough to tank it, which means we should probably invest more into SoL, Happiness & Education if we are able to
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Unlikely, that grossly violates our Stewardship ethos and goes against the Haddyth's recognition of the strength of Wyrmyn nationalism. Whatever choices we get, they will include some accommodation for Wyrmyn culture and identity.
Our empire will likely adopt a form of supranationalism, or perhaps mundane nationalism under a federal structure. A central administrative/business language is a must in all education, but we will give the provinces a lot of autonomy. We have to.
 
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[X] [Peace] 2 PW - Negotiate with the rest of the Coalition for the Dissolution of Tortun (Gain Wyrmyn lands, remove Humiliating Loss, Tortun Republic broken up into six Constitutional Grand Duchies, various powers gain small amounts of Tortun land, Ochruhr utterly humiliated by all powers)
[X] [Guilds] 1 PW - Allow the dissolution but do not address the larger issue of the guilds (-1 Temp Happiness, +1 Temp Consciousness, remove Recent Constitutional Changes status)
[X] [Research] Modern Nationalism(0/???) [Social]

If we can do the constitution next turn anyway.
 
HanEmpire said:
Our empire will likely adopt for a form of supranationalism, or perhaps mundane nationalism under a federal structure. A central administrative/business language is a must in all education, but we will give the provinces a lot of autonomy. We have to.
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I vote for US-style civic nationalism. It can absorb like forty different ethnicities from dozens of language groups and only emerge the stronger for it. And our civilization already has tons of precedent for it.
 
[X] [Peace] 0 PW - Take the Wyrmyn territories you have conquered and let everyone else figure things out (-2 Temp Trust, gain Wyrmyn lands, may not count as avenging Humiliating Loss)
[X] [Guilds] 1 PW - Allow the dissolution but do not address the larger issue of the guilds (-1 Temp Happiness, +1 Temp Consciousness, remove Recent Constitutional Changes status)
[X] [Research]Academic Freedom (0/???) [Social]

Changing my vote to stockplie PW for the Convention.
 
[] [Peace] 2 PW - Negotiate with the rest of the Coalition for the Dissolution of Tortun (Gain Wyrmyn lands, remove Humiliating Loss, Tortun Republic broken up into six Constitutional Grand Duchies, various powers gain small amounts of Tortun land, Ochruhr utterly humiliated by all powers)

@Academia Nut Chance that the Ochruhr will keep going if we pick this?

Also, what's the chance Faron manages to pull a "Napoleon from Elba"?
 
[X] [Peace] 2 PW - Negotiate with the rest of the Coalition for the Dissolution of Tortun (Gain Wyrmyn lands, remove Humiliating Loss, Tortun Republic broken up into six Constitutional Grand Duchies, various powers gain small amounts of Tortun land, Ochruhr utterly humiliated by all powers)
[X] [Guilds] 1 PW - Allow the dissolution but do not address the larger issue of the guilds (-1 Temp Happiness, +1 Temp Consciousness, remove Recent Constitutional Changes status)
 
[X] [Peace] 0 PW - Take the Wyrmyn territories you have conquered and let everyone else figure things out (-2 Temp Trust, gain Wyrmyn lands, may not count as avenging Humiliating Loss)
[X] [Guilds] 1 PW - Allow the dissolution but do not address the larger issue of the guilds (-1 Temp Happiness, +1 Temp Consciousness, remove Recent Constitutional Changes status)
[X] [Research] Modern Nationalism(0/???) [Social]
 
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[X] [Peace] 2 PW - Negotiate with the rest of the Coalition for the Dissolution of Tortun (Gain Wyrmyn lands, remove Humiliating Loss, Tortun Republic broken up into six Constitutional Grand Duchies, various powers gain small amounts of Tortun land, Ochruhr utterly humiliated by all powers)
[X] [Guilds] 1 PW - Allow the dissolution but do not address the larger issue of the guilds (-1 Temp Happiness, +1 Temp Consciousness, remove Recent Constitutional Changes status)
[X] [Research] Modern Nationalism (0/???) [Social]
 
[X] [Peace] 0 PW - Take the Wyrmyn territories you have conquered and let everyone else figure things out (-2 Temp Trust, gain Wyrmyn lands, may not count as avenging Humiliating Loss)
 
HanEmpire said:
Unlikely, that grossly violates our Stewardship ethos and goes against the Haddyth's recognition of the strength of Wyrmyn nationalism. Whatever choices we get, they will include some accommodation of the Wyrmyn culture and identity.
Our empire will likely adopt for a form of supranationalism, or perhaps mundane nationalism under a federal structure. A central administrative/business language is a must in all education, but we will give the provinces a lot of autonomy. We have to.
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So what you're telling me is that the end state here is a United People's Front :V
 
One good thing about splitting Tortun might be that we can basically choose who'll unify Tortun by putting our weight behind the duchy that best represents our interests.
 
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sidestory said:
A quick question, which of these two leads to the guilds being turned into crown coperations?
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Definitely the first can turn some guilds into crown corporations of their own accord, the second maybe depending on what you do.

Random Member said:
Negotiate with the rest of the Coalition for the Dissolution of Tortun (Gain Wyrmyn lands, remove Humiliating Loss, Tortun Republic broken up into six Constitutional Grand Duchies, various powers gain small amounts of Tortun land, Ochruhr utterly humiliated by all powers)

@Academia Nut Chance that the Ochruhr will keep going if we pick this?

Also, what's the chance Faron manages to pull a "Napoleon from Elba"?
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If you pick the second you are throwing your weight behind the negotiations, and if the Ochruhr want to keep going it will be alone and potentially with other Great Powers backing up the Tortun in order to get them to dissolve in short order rather than them potentially peacing out with everyone but the Ochruhr and then not dissolving because that part of the agreement was never fulfilled by the Coalition.

It depends on where you exile him and the circumstances surrounding it. If you treat him with good faith and don't abuse the Tortun People he may be content to stay wherever you stick him.
 
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