Honest question, I'm struggling to conceive this.
It just works. You DID accept the class as is during design process.

It's a true dickmove to later go and say "Just kidding, that's not true due to arbritary reasons".

I mean, the class itself points out the discrepancies and correct that "flaw" at around 8th level, why should we be punished by it?
 
That's not both that's neither. They are not the same.



What would those 'strong opinions' be though?

Honest question, I'm struggling to conceive this.
True Neutral Outsiders without elemental or other Subtypes are a thing. If Good and Evil couldn't exist in a balance, they would be impossible.

The intend of the 8th level feature was actually to get closer to making true mortals instead of outsiders by balancing their impulses through counterweighting them with their opposites.

Having to come up with some arbitrary brand of disability for them feels odd, when the goal was to make something that is better suited to experience the whole width of mortal experience.
 
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I don't see it that way. A True Neutral being is capable of both great Good and great Evil. They're less bound by their alignment and more by their personal goals. I feel like that was a big part of the intent of combining opposing alignments in an Arcanum. We can avoid making someone too far Good or too far Evil. I don't get why making them insane is the only option here.

It just works. You DID accept the class as is during design process.

It's a true dickmove to later go and say "Just kidding, that's not true due to arbritary reasons".

I mean, the class itself points out the discrepancies and correct that "flaw" at around 8th level, why should we be punished by it?

You are right, I missed the implication then and it would be unfair to punish you guys for it. Perfect balance it is.
 
So, what's our next "point of interest due to extreme time constraints" after Tyrosh?

Our "peace" with illithids will, optimistically speaking, last for at most a year from now.

Is it going to be the whole "Resurrection" business due to that one promise we made to Dorne and trying to squeeze at least something out of our 'alliance', which will hopefully get much more rewarding for us once it's done?

I am going to hope beyond all hope that thread will see the necessity of removing Dracolich from ST, this thing just grates on my nerves, being a constant reminder of an approximately 50% chance to lose our everything in there if it gets pissy.

Btw, when we talked about supplying FRenly for his... Enthusiastic walk through the Feywilds, what was the time he was going to start it? We'll have to make a bunch of things for him, if low-level.
And then there's getting Bronn some sweet sweet magic shit he aches so much for and getting at least some loyalty from him.
 
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Vote tally
Adhoc vote count started by dpara on Jan 28, 2018 at 2:35 PM, finished with 87 posts and 6 votes.

  • [X] Use your staff's commune with nature to try and find a suitable place for the CotF.
    -[X] Preferably some distance away from the planned borders of your city so they are not bothered, but still close enough for visitation. Perhaps half a days walk.
    -[X] A large hill bordered by streams would be ideal, but a place with hills and streams suitable for growing a forest will do.
    -[X] Use a second casting to make sure the area doesn't have mineral deposits close to the surface that might tempt future conflict.
    -[X] Once a location is narrowed down, tell the CotF about it so that they might check it out for their own approval in the coming days.
 
[X] Diomedon

I'm thinking of putting Calm Emotion on their tree.
Do we have the sacrifices for a tree now? It depends on us getting new ones in Tyrosh/ needing all of them for the Doomblob?

edit: now that I think of it.. a Calm Emotion tree could probably planted very near or even in the city walls proper.
 
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We wanted to send Maelor, Glyra and Aradia to Tyrosh for some invasion preparations.

We could switch out Maelor for Azema. It seems Aradia is level-headed enough to be the voice of reason in that group and those three together should leave quite a trainwreck for the magisters.
And Azema could ... play with any summoned demons ...
 
I don't suppose there are any votes about the CotF around?
None though I did work out a plan on how we could begin to repopulate their species.

It depends on how you rule Polymorph work though, just making men polymorphed into CotF impregnate female CotF obviously wont work, seeing as body parts turn back to normal when separated from the body, but polymorphing a woman into a CotF and having her bear a child could work, that depends on whether you rule that only the initial cell that's the egg transform back, or all cells transform back, so the offspring becomes a half-CotF.

Can you tell me if Viserys spell knowledge has anything to say about which of those are the case?

I know Polymorph don't normally last long enough for that, but between persistence spells and recasting, keeping a woman polymorphed for her entire pregnancy should be possible, it would of course be volunteer only, but I'm sure more than a few of the whores in SD would volunteer if the pay was high enough, and saving the CotF is easily worth a 100 IM per child.
 
None though I did work out a plan on how we could begin to repopulate their species.

It depends on how you rule Polymorph work though, just making men polymorphed into CotF impregnate female CotF obviously wont work, seeing as body parts turn back to normal when separated from the body, but polymorphing a woman into a CotF and having her bear a child could work, that depends on whether you rule that only the initial cell that's the egg transform back, or all cells transform back, so the offspring becomes a half-CotF.

Can you tell me if Viserys spell knowledge has anything to say about which of those are the case?

I know Polymorph don't normally last long enough for that, but between persistence spells and recasting, keeping a woman polymorphed for her entire pregnancy should be possible, it would of course be volunteer only, but I'm sure more than a few of the whores in SD would volunteer if the pay was high enough, and saving the CotF is easily worth a 100 IM per child.

*rolls for it*

Viserys is cautiously optimistic about the notion.

Vote closed.
 
You are right, I missed the implication then and it would be unfair to punish you guys for it. Perfect balance it is.
Mind you that it doesn't have to be perfect. The idea was that Good / Evil gives them choice. A pure elemental Arcanum is stuck on his blue-orange morality and singular alignment would lock them into a given viewpoint. Having both and neither dominant would allow them to fully comprehend morality but without dictating a certain behaviour.
 
*rolls for it*

Viserys is cautiously optimistic about the notion.

Vote closed.
Yay we have a plan to revitalize the CotF, that at least has a chance at working and don't need multiple wishes.

We should get started on this right now, optimally we would need a runestaff of Polymorph, so any of our high level casters can keep up the transformation, but we can make do with just a scroll so Lya can learn it, that's just riskier since then we will need Lya to stay in SD until the child is birthed.

But we should get started as soon as possible, the sooner we have tried it once, the sooner we can find out if it works, and so whether it's worth investing the resources to do it multiple times.

First we should speak with a male CotF, hopefully they don't have heavy stigmas against bastards, that would seriously complicate things.

If the CotF don't have cultural objections that make this plan unworkable, acquiring a means of casting polymorph should be put high on our priority list.
 
I don't know how you'd go about keeping someone polymophed for nine months, or more. Polymoph is a minutes/CL spell. If every one of our casters spent their spell slots on it, I doubt it'd last a full day.

A simpler solution would be to merely introduce a handful of half-Children into their population by good ol' insterspecies fornication. Then have those half breeds mate solely with full-blooded Children as to thicken their offspring's blood so they would be considered full CotF, but you keep the gene diversity.
 
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So, we'd better invest in the magic analogue of a Skin of Proteus. Not exactly cheap.
Nah Lya can learn to cast polymorph, and scribe a few scrolls with it for when she has to leave SD for a time.
I don't know how you'd go about keeping someone polymophed for nine months, or more. Polymoph is a minutes/CL spell.

A simpler solution would be to merely introduce a handful of half-Children into their population by good ol' insterspecies fornication. Then have those half breeds mate solely with full-blooded Children as to thicken their blood again so the spawn would be considered full CotF again, but you keep the gene diversity.
I thought it was hours/CL? And that we could improve it with persistence.

But if not we will just have to buy scrolls of the greater version of Polymorph, that's a lot more expensive, but still much more reasonable than wishes.
 
Introducing hybrids for their gene diversity and having them mate with the original population sounds much easier.

I think Vee will get PaO at 16th, so that might work.
 
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The CotF are Fey, aren't they? Shouldn't Lya be able to derive a method from her Arcanums to grow fully formed CotF in her lab?
 
Introducing hybrids for their gene diversity and having them mate with the original population sounds much easier.

I think Vee will get PaO at 16th, so that might work.
That depends entirely on how CotF work, some magical species in some works only counts totally purebloods, even 90% CotF blood might not count as a CotF as opposed to a halfbreed, personally I would guess that's the case since they haven't done that themselves.

In some works full blood elves are immortal, but whether you are half elf or 99% elf, if you're not ful elf you're mortal, seeing as the CotF is a magical race, I could easily believe racial purity is a requirement for some of their features.

But I still have to ask if we can't use persistence on the polymorph?

I'm sure there's some way of enhancing the time the polymorph last, if nothing else we can probably sacrifice something to the OG, for them extending the polymorph until the child is born, considering the CotF is their subjects, it shouldn't be that expensive.
 
So, what's our next "point of interest due to extreme time constraints" after Tyrosh?

Our "peace" with illithids will, optimistically speaking, last for at most a year from now.

Is it going to be the whole "Resurrection" business due to that one promise we made to Dorne and trying to squeeze at least something out of our 'alliance', which will hopefully get much more rewarding for us once it's done?

I am going to hope beyond all hope that thread will see the necessity of removing Dracolich from ST, this thing just grates on my nerves, being a constant reminder of an approximately 50% chance to lose our everything in there if it gets pissy.

Btw, when we talked about supplying FRenly for his... Enthusiastic walk through the Feywilds, what was the time he was going to start it? We'll have to make a bunch of things for him, if low-level.
And then there's getting Bronn some sweet sweet magic shit he aches so much for and getting at least some loyalty from him.

Tyrosh is going to tie us down a bit after we take it, but we have an elastic period there unless something dramatic happens. We can appear to be preparing for our invasion of Westeros and normalize relations with Lys and Myr, etc. Once our watchmen/garrison troops (need to go back over that and provide a "not rushed" version of them) are ready we can move forward, but we don't have to. Again, unless something changes really drastically about the situation (the recent quiet coup in Lys is concerning, since Maelor and Glyra started getting spotted regularly afterwards, for example).

The resurrection thing is due to Doran needing some justification to himself and to his bannermen as to why he's risking their lives and his kingdom to restore the Targs. A marriage alliance is self-explanatory, but we didn't go for that. He's already Prince of Dorne, so we're not elevating him at all. Bringing back Elia is worth it to Droan...and with her first hand testimony he can generate enough anger at the Lannisters to go to war.

I'm seriously going to try my best to see someone dedicated to trying to ferret the dracolich out. It just wont be Viserys time.

Fenly will be another month or two as he smooths out the transition to Stannis, and Bronn will be getting his sweet magic loot next turn.
 
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