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A Sword Without a Hilt: A Song of Ice and Fire/D&D 3.5 Crossover

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egoo said:
On an unrelated note, after a month of struggle, it seems I finished searchin for info on theoretical part of my term paper and i can't think straight anymore.
Yay me?
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Bah, school. Just slog through it so that you can enjoy working on term paper equivalents everyday which will be your next decade of life...

That reminds me of this odd dream I just had of recieving a letter of college acceptance and my family pushing me to go through it. Meanwhile, I unsuccessfully moan that I already graduated and has been working without any accomplishment for 10 years now... Oh wait, the latter part about work is not a dream :confused:
 
[X] True? No, for the Red God claims all as his slaves, and he means it as no metaphor, yet many live their lives entire free from even hearsay of his existence, much less any shackle of his. Does he exist? Yes, as do many, many other gods, some who are good, some who are bad.
-[X] The way I see it, a god is to men as a lord is to a hedge knight. Just like a lord, different gods have different domains and lands which are theirs, so it is unwise to disrespect them there, just like it would not be wise to speak ill of a lord on his own lands. But unless a hedge knight pledges himself to a lord, and is accepted into that lord's household, that lord has no special power over him, and similarly gods do not have special power over us unless we pledge ourselves to them. Nor can they claim our souls, we can only hand them over to be judged by our own wills.
-[X] Just as lords differ, so too it seems that gods do. Some are greater, some are lesser, some accept certain types into their household, some others. Some are demanding and overbearing, like the Red God, and some have very few demands.
-[X] The place where that analogy breaks down is unlike having more than one Lord, one can worship more than one god, unless one of their demands is your sole worship. Full devotion is likely a surer route to favor, of course.
-[X] However, we are a king, so our place is a bit different than others. We have seen that god's interests can run counter to the good of men, and their judgement is not infallible, nor their power in the world unbeatable, so we cannot afford to shirk our duty and simply put our trust in gods. It will not be the gods who beat back the coming darkness, but the strength of mortals, through steel and sorcery.
-[X] While we do not serve gods, we have found favor with some gods, like the old gods of earth and steam and stone, and enmity with others whose demands and desires are dark, like the Drowned God of the Ironborn, who as far as we have seen, seems to see mankind as mere chattel for it's true servants in the deep.
-[X] If at any point Dany speaks up or interrupts, let her. She has spent more time studying and thinking on this than you.

Thoughts?
 
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In my opinion the ship has sailed on this protecting her from reality business.

I really didn't want to speak about this at all until we got to SD but just tell her the truth, misconceptions are deadly and we're near deliberately leading her into them.

I also obviously don't want to downplay Viserys' accomplishments any further than they have been already just because they sound a bit ridiculous, having her consider the ridiculous plausible in all situations should be a goal if anything.
 
Diomedon said:
[X] True? No, for the Red God claims all as his slaves, yet many live their lives entire free from even hearsay of his existence. Does he exist? Yes, as do many, many other gods, some who are good, some who are bad.
-[X] The way I see it, a god is to men, as a lord is to a hedge knight. Just like a lord, different gods have different domains and lands which are theirs, so it is unwise to disrespect them there, just like it would not be wise to speak ill of a lord on his own lands. But unless a hedge knight pledges himself to a lord, and is accepted into that lord's household, that lord has no special power over him, and similarly gods do not have special power over us unless we pledge ourselves to them.
-[X] Just as lords differ, so too it seems that gods do. Some are greater, some are lesser, some accept certain types into their household, some others. Some are demanding and overbearing, like the Red God, and some have very few demands.
-[X] The place where that analogy breaks down is unlike having more than one Lord, one can worship more than one god, unless one of their demands is your sole worship. Full devotion is likely a surer route to favor of course, but we are a king, so our place is a bit different than others.
-[X] So we have found favor with some gods, and enmity with others whose demands and desires are dark, like the Drowned God of the Ironborn, who as far as we have seen, seems to see mankind as mere chattel for it's true servants in the deep.

Thoughts?
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Definitely a good start - I'm prying my way free of the other matters which had drawn my attention. @Azel do you think you'll have time for a GLORIOUS SPEECH this evening or no?
 
Diomedon said:
[X] True? No, for the Red God claims all as his slaves, yet many live their lives entire free from even hearsay of his existence. Does he exist? Yes, as do many, many other gods, some who are good, some who are bad.
-[X] The way I see it, a god is to men, as a lord is to a hedge knight. Just like a lord, different gods have different domains and lands which are theirs, so it is unwise to disrespect them there, just like it would not be wise to speak ill of a lord on his own lands. But unless a hedge knight pledges himself to a lord, and is accepted into that lord's household, that lord has no special power over him, and similarly gods do not have special power over us unless we pledge ourselves to them.
-[X] Just as lords differ, so too it seems that gods do. Some are greater, some are lesser, some accept certain types into their household, some others. Some are demanding and overbearing, like the Red God, and some have very few demands.
-[X] The place where that analogy breaks down is unlike having more than one Lord, one can worship more than one god, unless one of their demands is your sole worship. Full devotion is likely a surer route to favor of course, but we are a king, so our place is a bit different than others.
-[X] So we have found favor with some gods, and enmity with others whose demands and desires are dark, like the Drowned God of the Ironborn, who as far as we have seen, seems to see mankind as mere chattel for it's true servants in the deep.

Thoughts?
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At the moment it implies we worship multiple gods. We don't worship, others do obviously but we actually don't and have not ever.

Old Gods expressly don't care for it, Yss is a partnership, Burny we have an antagonistic relationship with among others.

Every Godly dealing we've had has been just that, a deal.
 
Deliste said:
At the moment it implies we worship multiple gods. We don't worship, others do obviously but we actually don't and have not ever.

Old Gods expressly don't care for it, Yss is a partnership, Burny we have an antagonistic relationship with among others.

Every Godly dealing we've had has been just that, a deal.
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It's also important to note that every god we've courted has their own apocalypse that they fight.

Old Gods vs Long Night
Merling King vs Deep Ones
Yss vs Underdark & Lolth

It honestly is a business deal for us. Beyond that we don't worship.
 
Deliste said:
At the moment it implies we worship multiple gods. We don't worship, others do obviously but we actually don't and have not ever.

Old Gods expressly don't care for it, Yss is a partnership, Burny we have an antagonistic relationship with among others.

Every Godly dealing we've had has been just that, a deal.
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I'd argue sacrificing things is worship (and in many ways the oldest and purest form of worship), but I'll try to make that clearer.

Duesal said:
It's also important to note that every god we've courted has their own apocalypse that they fight.

Old Gods vs Long Night
Merling King vs Deep Ones
Yss vs Underdark & Lolth

It honestly is a business deal for us. Beyond that we don't worship.
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It's not a bad point, but I'd prefer her to wrap her head around the mind-bending revelation that the gods are real, and the very soon to come up issue of The Seven being on the list of gods we don't exactly get on with, before we go piling apocalypses on her.
 
Takesis said:
@DragonParadox, @Wheel of time still has not titled his omake yet.

I suggest: Dreams of Rage and Blood if you are to threadmark it.
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I was out for a bit and I like the name a lot it fits the narrative very well:D Also I did not intend for it to come off as Barbarin Wuxia but if it did that is awesome and @DragonParadox any hope of being sorta canon? I did have a hope the Old Gods would get a PC to act as their warrior champion for the conflict with the Seven that like Captain America they could make inspiring propaganda about

Response of our Berserker to Knights of the Seven.
The propaganda bit is a joke by the way:V
In universe it even makes sense in a way as balance between the Divine. The Old Gods create a Berzerker champion that might have some kind of monstrous rage transformation and so later the Warrior creates a Paladin from a young girl as well.
Now @Takesis I saw your question on what I thought of the Inn being looted on a reread and as for what I thought. I could not stop laughing and chuckling almost to death with mirth bubbling and frothing out of me at what you guys were saying with every post on the subject:lol:rofl:
 
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This whole train of discussion has set my imagination to that history books making speech we shall deliver atop the Dragonpit a few days after we win Westeros, sorrounded by the commons and nobles of the city.

A speech so buffed up it could make Burny take Spartacus as his new Head Cleric. A thing of beauty and awe crafted by Azel, Diomedon, Snowfire and all the other speech makers (plus my own modest contributions) during the Thread's night shift. A speech of dreams of Empire, dreams to herald a new era of might, prosperity and the exaltation of Man...

It will be Azel's greatest speech yet. My greatest creation. Diomedon's most well thought out speech. Snowfire's greatest insight... the Thread's moment of glory...

So good a single tear shall fall from Artemis' eye, so good even him shall share, if for a single second, the dreams of Empire.
 
Diomedon said:
It's not a bad point, but I'd prefer her to wrap her head around the mind-bending revelation that the gods are real, and the very soon to come up issue of The Seven being on the list of gods we don't exactly get on with.
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I don't want to tell Rhaella this, certainly not now, I was just noting the reality of our arrangements to the thread.
DragonParadox said:
200 lb.

'Night guys.
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:D

We are going to make so many great things out of this. And, like Mithral, Blue Ice weighs half as much as normal armor.

Weight of Blue Ice Breastplate: 15 lbs
Weight of Blue Ice Fullplate: 25 lbs
Weight of Segmented Reinforced Blue Ice Fullplate: 27.5 lbs

We can make that armor for the Starks no problem.
 
Wheel of time said:
I was out for a bit and I like the name a lot it fits the narrative very well:D Also I did not intend for it to come off as Barbarin Wuxia but if it did that is awesome and @dragon Paradox any hope of being sorta canon? I did have a hope the Old Gods would get a PC to act as their warrior champion for the conflict with the Seven that like Captain America they could make inspiring propaganda about

Response of our Berserker to Knights of the Seven.
The propaganda bit is a joke by the way:V
In universe it even makes sense in a way as balance between the Divine. The Old Gods create Berzerker champion that might have some kind of monstrous rage transformation and so later the Warrior creates a Paladin from a young girl as well.
Now @Takesis I saw your question on what I thought of the Inn being looted on a reread and as for what I thought. I could not stop laughing and chuckling almost to death with mirth bubbling and frothing out of me at what you guys were saying with every post on the subject:lol:rofl:
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It's not that a champion embodying the Old Gods' rage could not arise in theory, it's that Bloodraven would would retroactively throttle such a champion's grandfather before allowing him to exist.

As he said himself Bloodraven was once the Master of the Whisperers and there he excelled, a man of indirect approach. He would view a barbarian champion much as a chess player might view a chunk of masonry falling from the ceiling onto the board. It's enough that he has to listen to the rage of the Old Gods, the last thing he would wish is to make it manifest.
 
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I wonder how the Lord Commander will react to us and if people will end up hearing how we are helping out the Night Watch.
 
DragonParadox said:
It's not that a champion embodying the Old Gods' rage could not arise in theory, it's that Bloodraven would would retroactively throttle such a champion's grandfather before allowing him to exist.

As he said himself Bloodraven was once the Master of the Whisperers and there he excelled, a man of indirect approach. He would view a barbarian champion much as a chess player might view a chunk of masonry falling from the ceiling on to the board. It's enough that he has to listen to the rage of the Old Gods, the last thing he would wish is to make it manifest.
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What about another Green Seer or Agent of the Old Gods doing their own thing? If it doesen't work it doesen't work but did you like the Omake? As for Bloodraven even in sublity there must some times be brute force guided by a skilled hand.
 
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Massgamer said:
I wonder how the Lord Commander will react to us and if people will end up hearing how we are helping out the Night Watch.
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I would expect a mixed reaction.

1. We're a Targaryen and Mormont was on the rebel's side of Robert's Rebellion. More than that he was loyal to the Starks, and the Mad King's legacy hangs over us. -- obviously negative
2. On the other hand we're Aemon's relative, and he would vouch for us. -- significant positive
3. The Night's Watch is desperate, and we show up offering aid in magic, gold, supplies, manpower, etc, because we know the Long Night is coming. -- huge positive
4. We have seventeen Children of the Forest in our company -- legendary positive

While he might have his reservations, there is no way in hell the Night's Watch visit turns into anything less than an astonishing success by simple virtue of what we offer and who we have with us.
 
Diomedon said:
[X] True? No, for the Red God claims all as his slaves, yet many live their lives entire free from even hearsay of his existence. Does he exist? Yes, as do many, many other gods, some who are good, some who are bad.
-[X] The way I see it, a god is to men as a lord is to a hedge knight. Just like a lord, different gods have different domains and lands which are theirs, so it is unwise to disrespect them there, just like it would not be wise to speak ill of a lord on his own lands. But unless a hedge knight pledges himself to a lord, and is accepted into that lord's household, that lord has no special power over him, and similarly gods do not have special power over us unless we pledge ourselves to them.
-[X] Just as lords differ, so too it seems that gods do. Some are greater, some are lesser, some accept certain types into their household, some others. Some are demanding and overbearing, like the Red God, and some have very few demands.
-[X] The place where that analogy breaks down is unlike having more than one Lord, one can worship more than one god, unless one of their demands is your sole worship. Full devotion is likely a surer route to favor, of course.
-[X] However, we are a king, so our place is a bit different than others. We have seen that god's interests can run counter to the good of men, and their judgement is not infallible, nor their power in the world unbeatable, so we cannot afford to shirk our duty and simply put our trust in gods.
-[X] We have found favor with some gods, like the old gods of earth and steam and stone, and enmity with others whose demands and desires are dark, like the Drowned God of the Ironborn, who as far as we have seen, seems to see mankind as mere chattel for it's true servants in the deep.

Thoughts?
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Made some edits.
 
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