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With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Twelve)

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RichardWhereat said:
If he's getting on his knees in front of her, he better do a damn sight more than grovelling.
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Hey, phrasing!

Arafell said:
Let me put it in programming terms.

Love != Sex.

I suspect what he said was somewhat true (though very blunt) as far as emotional dependency goes.
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As a demi, not true for all people, but Harleen is just a normie.

Lubaf said:
While I won't object to the "harem protagonist" dig, I must object to "unrealistic". I've seen that level of denseness sometimes in the Real World.

And in this case, I'd also add "justifiable": Paul's leaning on his empathy vision is obviously doing weird things to his ability to get a read on a situation.

Thanks
Luc "Paul's Not Oblivious To Love, Just Oblivious To Pure Sexual Attraction" French
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As somebody who just had a lady friend tell him that she's liked him for 3+ years, this level of dense is, in fact, a thing.

Draconikus said:
Damn, Paul. Normally, i'd consider empathy-vision an out and out invasion of privacy... but normally people have some understanding of how they're affecting others. For you, Paul, I'm willing to consider it a crutch... or, rather, a prosthetic, because you just plain don't seem to understand how people work at all.
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I'm considering putting forth that either Zoat is or Paul became a sociopath*, able to "fake"** emotions via enlightenment.

*Sociopath as in can't understand social motivation
**Is it really fake at that point though?

Cheap Orange Knofe said:
Has a power tailor made for becoming a pick up artist.
Does not get laid.

Has empathic vision.
Still fails social roll.
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There is a 1 on the die.
 
HadesHerald said:
I'm considering putting forth that either Zoat is or Paul became a sociopath*, able to "fake"** emotions via enlightenment.

*Sociopath as in can't understand social motivation
**Is it really fake at that point though?
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He wasn't half as bad before enlightenment, though, and Grayven for all his many, varied, exhaustive list of faults doesn't seem to be nearly as dense nor as blunt except when he does it on purpose.
 
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Mr Zoat said:
I was also trying to depict the SI as having trouble relating to regular people, but I think I may have overshot the mark a little.
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FTFY. Anyway, what I don't get is if the SI has so much trouble why he doesn't just fix it (does he not want to be able to relate to people?), cause unlike a lot of people, he actually can.
 
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I think the people who quoted me missed the part where I said it's alright, as long as he at least tries to clean up his social act ASAP. This is a completely believable mistake for someone to make. But if there's no followup, and he stays exactly as-is without any attempt to learn from it, that makes SI an asshole.

SI Paul is a reasonable person. He sees problems, he finds solutions. That's what he's been doing since he landed. He just found a big ass new problem. Turns out he doesn't think like a human anymore. Where's the solution?
 
aeqnai said:
He wasn't half as bad before enlightenment, though, and Grayven for all his many, varied, exhaustive list of faults doesn't seem to be nearly as dense nor as blunt except when he does it on purpose.
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Well he's been merged with the embodiment of greed, has a artificial soul, screws with his own brain chemistry and attained a form of enlightenment.
To be honest Paul may no longer have the capacity to understand romantic relations beyond a purely academic fashion.

Romance is Paul's Dump stat.
 
Simmr001 said:
hello their, im apparently an unrealistic caricature *offers hand*
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Yeah, I'm pretty damn dense too.

Pinklestia said:
And Grayven scores yet another point vs Paul.

Bad Zoat when I saw the red I thought it was Renegade.
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arromdee said:
Two people have said this is a Grayven story. I really don't think it is, despite the red line at the start.
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It's a Renegade focused Episode (as shown by the red title). This chapter is looking at Paul (just like there are occasional Grayven chapters in the Paul focused Episodes) as is shown by the white time stamp.
 
Hakazin said:
Yes. These concerns are really quite reasonable for a character who, in their first appearance, quite literally hooked up with the fucking Joker. The presentation, of course, is horrible.

Dammit, it's the "Pointy-Stick Launchers are a Bad Idea" situation all over again, isn't it?
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The problem isn't having concerns as they are somewhat valid. It's taking the concern and beating it to the point where you have not only lost any high ground but are actively being a dick and making things worse.

One thing the SI character has never been good at or shown any improvement is moderating his responses in social situations. Frankly his emotional sense and power ring are crutches that have prevented him from developing a critical skill-set.
 
HAH! Called it! Kinda.. didn't expect the SI interrupt.

I should do nonsensical segueways more often!

As for Paul...

Right, so Paul was an unintentional dick there. Completely unintentional, but the issue is he's being too... emotionally logical about it. A few people called it before, about how due to his emotion sight, he couldn't see her interest in him. He isn't dense per se, but overly reliant on the visible emotional spectrum. I do wonder what we'd see if he activated his snake eyes, but that's a thought for another day.

I mean, Harley didn't desire Paul. Didn't love him or show any other powerful emotions, though we saw a tiny bit of orange there. I think part of it is due to Harley's views on sex more than anything, that it doesn't really have any emotional attachment for her, she only thinks it's nice or something to do with nice people. If Paul didn't constantly see the world in various shades of emotions, he might have picked up on it and reacted accordingly. And this is why he worries for her, not because she's some kind of sub or anything, but due to her views on sex which is alien to Paul and his avarice-based views. If she wanted/needed sex? Then he'd pick up on it and still be worried, but at least it wouldn't have been subtle to him. But that apparently isn't the case either.

Now, did he phrase things WRONG? Hell yes. Paul is used to speaking to concerned parties, heroes, villains and business people in order to get what he wants. WHen what he wants involves the well being of the person themselves? THAT is when things get tricky, like with Harley here.

How can he fix this? Social interactions without the rings. Or, learning how to social interact while paying attention to MORE than just the emotional spectrum. Body language, vocal pitch, everything. In short?

He needs tips from Batman on how to be Bruce Wayne.
 
For those who were saying there wasn't any emotional spectrum in Harleen, not even the orange light of desire, you might want to reread the section where Eris cockblocked Paul.

Harleen's dialogue turned orange right when she was beginning to ask him if he wanted to come inside her home for some sex. Eris chose that exact moment to cockblock.

So Harleen actually did want to have sex with Paul. It wasn't just her thinking she needed to attach herself to a nice guy, attraction be damned.
 
karmafalcon said:
How can he fix this? Social interactions without the rings. Or, learning how to social interact while paying attention to MORE than just the emotional spectrum. Body language, vocal pitch, everything.
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In short he needs to develop his empathy. Not in the sense of giving a damn but in the dictionary sense:
  1. the ability to understand and share the feelings of another.
Not being able to see things from other points of view (from a emotional not logical frame of reference) is the SIs main weakness and one he's ignored because he has a do-anything-button that he relies on to do everything. Only it can't handle social-fu.
 
Hi! I just found this last week and I finally caught on story wise. This is an amazing work of art and I must congratulate you on your fine writing.
I'll try to read all the other threads before commenting again: I know that my questions have already been ask/answered and I'm sorry about that.

Do you have a patreon for donation?

For my fellow readers: Is OL X Zatanna dead? Can I still cheer on?

Anyway, I'm sorry I don't have anything relevant to say. (I'm too overwhelmed by your story, read it in 3 days non-stop)

You have a new fan in France now. And I'll try to convert others. Take care. :coolbeans:

Edit: Do you accept omake for your QQ thread?
 
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Jarrik32 said:
Not being able to see things from other points of view (from a emotional not logical frame of reference) is the SIs main weakness and one he's ignored because he has a do-anything-button that he relies on to do everything. Only it can't handle social-fu.
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Sure it can, he's just not willing to use it that way.
Aagkard said:
For my fellow readers: Is OL X Zatanna dead? Can I still cheer on?
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... He's like more than double her age and she's not even at the age of consent.
 
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