We don't know the rate of increase so I'm not too concerned that it will immediately start doubling. I was in favour of 2x Propaganda Office last turn, I'm good if your Maphara plan wins now, I'll add a vote to it.
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Sterbelicht - One Sacrifice At A Time Against The Galaxy (40K)
ConfusedCanuck
Where did it all go wrong?
- Location
- Neverland
[X] Plan: Buying More Time And Setting Goals, Maphara Version v2
Has there been any thoughts of using the propaganda department once it's up and running to create/spread rebellions across Van Duchy space? So when we launch our attack Van Duchy forces are pinned down and cant react as fast as their dealing with uprisings across various worlds?
Like to be clear if we do this or if this is even viable we're probably not going to be able to save every single one of these uprisings as we'll have to secure Voxx system first then send our SBG's down the space lanes further into Van Duchy space. And I understand people generally find it distasteful to leave uprisings to die like that but QM has more or less stated that the Van Duchy is our greatest foe yet. We need every advantage we can get when we do launch the Voxx revolution, cause once we do we're at war with the whole Duchy. And I feel if we seed uprisings across their various worlds and not just Voxx it'll slow down there wider response giving us more time to handle Voxx itself and consolidate. And if that means letting some uprisings be crushed to give us that breathing room I feel that's something we should seriously consider.
Has there been any thoughts of using the propaganda department once it's up and running to create/spread rebellions across Van Duchy space? So when we launch our attack Van Duchy forces are pinned down and cant react as fast as their dealing with uprisings across various worlds?
Like to be clear if we do this or if this is even viable we're probably not going to be able to save every single one of these uprisings as we'll have to secure Voxx system first then send our SBG's down the space lanes further into Van Duchy space. And I understand people generally find it distasteful to leave uprisings to die like that but QM has more or less stated that the Van Duchy is our greatest foe yet. We need every advantage we can get when we do launch the Voxx revolution, cause once we do we're at war with the whole Duchy. And I feel if we seed uprisings across their various worlds and not just Voxx it'll slow down there wider response giving us more time to handle Voxx itself and consolidate. And if that means letting some uprisings be crushed to give us that breathing room I feel that's something we should seriously consider.
Looks like some Maphara action is off to a strong start *wipes sweat away*. Would people be open to start terraforming Git (Pop: 36 billion, Time: ~160 yr) in 3 to 4 turns?
Other targets would be Nurn (27B; ~170yr) or Yeogawa (46B; ~220yr) or Nushar (22B; ~150yr) but those are harder asks.
I think we can cover about half of the projected housing needs so far. Building Space Habitats looks like a better option than renovating Voxx Prime but we might still be able to squeeze some juice from terraforming.
Other targets would be Nurn (27B; ~170yr) or Yeogawa (46B; ~220yr) or Nushar (22B; ~150yr) but those are harder asks.
I think we can cover about half of the projected housing needs so far. Building Space Habitats looks like a better option than renovating Voxx Prime but we might still be able to squeeze some juice from terraforming.
I would say one other planet besides Maphara before we focus on the space habitats as those give us the void industry development as well. killing two birds with one stone as we use to build small use of more habitation in stations and getting Void Industry at the same time.
- Pronouns
- Ermaras
[X] Plan: Buying More Time And Setting Goals, Maphara Version v2
I'm on board with this. Those planets are so much more efficient than any other option, and we can just do one or two of them a turn to sync up their end times. And they've been confirmed to overall be more productive than the stations.
The habitats are just awful efficiency though for both things. If we don't terraform any more planets we'd need 15 actions at least, which is more than we've put into Voxx so far. And the population in them just isn't as productive as it is on planets (see above quote). Terraforming is where the game is at.
- Pronouns
- They/Them
We're already sweating for actions we need to do important shit, and we're finding another Terraforming action? I don't see where it'd come out of, except our chances of success at actually conquering Voxx Primus in the first place.
So taking all the worlds I mentioned would add 131 Billion housing for a cost of 4 actions. That would leave something like 50 billion remaining to cover.
The housing needs to be built at some point. If you have a better solution and timeline lets hear it. It can be fitting in up to 4 actions over the next several turns plus some later, or like 15 actions right before or during the Duchy War.
- Location
- colombia
i honestly expect us to fail voxx primus,but we gotta try,we made the bed and now we lie on it
- Location
- Canada
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Yeah we do need to start investing in places to actually house the population of Vox Primus as well at some point. Minmaxing our military and technology development is all well and good until we reach the end of the campaign and still have 200 billion people we need to rehome fast.
I'm personally in favor of spinning up large numbers of space stations, but part of that is the double-value we get in both housing and Void Industry. In a perfect world I'd like to invest about 9 actions into the space stations, but I doubt we'll get that option.
I'm personally in favor of spinning up large numbers of space stations, but part of that is the double-value we get in both housing and Void Industry. In a perfect world I'd like to invest about 9 actions into the space stations, but I doubt we'll get that option.
Eh, I think we'll do alright. I legit think that if we get down to it and are stuck with an extra 50 billion we can reach out to the Shipwright's Alliance and the Mashan and go "Hey, you want some immigrants?" and the Mashan at least will take us up on that.
Something we could do to prep for that is another diplomatic action trying to make a mutual defense pact, based on the recognition that anything that conquers any one of us is likely to be nastier for the other two than what currently exists. The ultimate goal there would be to prep for the awfulness that's coming in a few hundred years.
- Pronouns
- They/Them
With the actions already, we'll (eventually) have 150 billion in Terraforming, we were told that with major societal disruption we could fit 64 Billion in where we already are, and we can take actions to make things reasonably liveable by Hive Standards, if not ours, on the planet itself without that much effort.
The situation honestly isn't that bad? I guess I could see Terraforming one more thing, but even Git isn't a great buy.
It's 1/3rd the cost of just Space Stationing it in Actions, while taking considerably longer and not giving us a VI for our troubles. And that's the BEST deal I can see in terms of time to population.
E: To be clear, it might be a good enough deal to take, but beyond that, that's... about it?
The situation honestly isn't that bad? I guess I could see Terraforming one more thing, but even Git isn't a great buy.
It's 1/3rd the cost of just Space Stationing it in Actions, while taking considerably longer and not giving us a VI for our troubles. And that's the BEST deal I can see in terms of time to population.
E: To be clear, it might be a good enough deal to take, but beyond that, that's... about it?
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Thats why I suggested:
We just got told making Voxx Prime long term livable would eat both Development and have an action cost for ~30 billion population.
We were also told planets are more productive than Habitats but we don't have the specifics.
Thats also over 10 actions in Habitat building your planning for, where do those fit in the timeline? I don't see why thats brushed off while a few more terraforming actions unacceptable.
I'm open to one or a combination of the above. We could take all of them then get VI XV in just Development actions for less total actions than doing it with Habitats.
We just got told making Voxx Prime long term livable would eat both Development and have an action cost for ~30 billion population.
We were also told planets are more productive than Habitats but we don't have the specifics.
Thats also over 10 actions in Habitat building your planning for, where do those fit in the timeline? I don't see why thats brushed off while a few more terraforming actions unacceptable.
I think this is a very short sighted idea. Its open to interpretation right now what the QM means by "heavy unrest" but I imagine it will have an action cost. And if we go from a 50 year Emergency Mobilization called for an offensive war into "heavy unrest" from settling over double our population on our worlds then I hope Cooky punishes us.
- Pronouns
- They/Them
I could fit one or two, maybe, but the big difficulty is that the terraforming stuff has to be incredibly, massively frontloaded if it's going to matter, as compared to other options that would involve stress building them over time while keeping the population alive. It pretty actively punishes planning with an awareness that we probably don't have THAT long. I can try to fit it in, but I'm not sure where the hell it'll go, honestly?
Like we're actively pushing off even having the ships to do any of this shit in favor of it, and we haven't started the Ag World stuff either...
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- Location
- Goose Land
[X] The Laurent
Can anyone confirm whether or not Free Research actions build up the Free Research Stockpile? I doubt it does but I'd like to know for sure.
Can anyone confirm whether or not Free Research actions build up the Free Research Stockpile? I doubt it does but I'd like to know for sure.
- Pronouns
- They/Them
Nope, it doesn't. But next turn I plan on doing the Skulls (because it apparently helps Infiltration) and the Industrial Throughput (0/2), which will get me the free action to do it in one, since hopefully that'll improve our ship production and production in general!
Kpatrol88
Cloud Hopper
[X] Plan: Buying More Time And Setting Goals, Maphara Version v2
I think we should also try and find some space to research the 'Free Duchy Shipwreck And Battle Studies' and the 'Tetratek ARc Cannonade' (plus the obligatory design action for the siege cruiser to fit it onto). Those can only help us in the coming space battle to crack the Duchy's defenses to actually get to Voxx Primus.
I think we should also try and find some space to research the 'Free Duchy Shipwreck And Battle Studies' and the 'Tetratek ARc Cannonade' (plus the obligatory design action for the siege cruiser to fit it onto). Those can only help us in the coming space battle to crack the Duchy's defenses to actually get to Voxx Primus.
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I still think we are several turns away from the start of the war, lots of ship building time. We're only 2 letters into the countdown.
So if we terraform Git and Nurn on the 3rd and 4th turn from now they come online the same time Maphara does. Thats 63 billion pop for 2 actions.
Yeogawa is really pushing it for how long it takes to make so drop it, and Nushar is almost not worth the cost, but can also be put off til a bit later if we decide we need it.
Maybe next turn we can take Civilian Fleet Design, and double Research to get Production Lines +1 Free (SAG equipment or drones would be my pick) to see how many actions we will need to do SBG/Civilian building and plan for that. Theres lots of nice to have but not essential actions we can hold off until our SBGs are built.
Or Civ Fleet/SBG build/Research for the next two turns to spread it out. Then finish off building while picking up Songs/Holy Symbols/other research and slowly stock up on Habitats.
I don't think we need the Agriworld infiltration until close to the Voxx Revolution box filling up.
I think ship building will go quickly while housing actions will hit us like a bomb if we let it sit until we need it.
edit:
As much as I want to design ships I think this needs to wait til the SBGs are built at least. Also we might be able to have the Lamenters board and take control over the Orbital Defences so we wouldn't want to destroy them.
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A Legacy Of War - [Canon]
The Shipwright's deserve some love - and I had an idea.
The Jubilation of the People was quiet.
The flagship of the Shipwright's Alliance, the pride of their fleet, the seven-plus kilometer warship was in truth a city full to the brim with people. They worked and played and raised children throughout the massive hull. There was always at least one raucous party, one drunken bash, one angry fight going on within its bowels.
But not today. Today, The Jubilation of the People was losing its captain, and the people who called the ship home were respectfully silent, waiting for the captains' words of farewell. Many had tried to beg her to stay, to continue her duty towards the Alliance and rule over their ship. But she had politely replied to every message that reached her. The bone-chilling fatigue in those replies had convinced those who received them to hold any further entireties and spread the word not to bother the captian in her last days.
Jessina was tired. She'd outlived her children, and her children's children. She had captained this ship for a hundred and ninety years, ever since her last ship, the light cruiser Torch of the Worthy had been destroyed at the hands of the United Cults. The previous Capitan of the Jubiliation had been assassinated by a cult inside the Alliance at the same time, and she'd taken command of the flagship and pride of the fleet in the following attack. It hadn't been a matter considered by committee as was standard today, but rather a case of being in the right place at the right time with the right skills. And after that, she'd been the Captain.
She mused on that war as she considered her speech. She'd written and discarded dozens of drafts of this speech in preparation for today. Though 'written' was the wrong word. She hadn't held anything physical for the last hundred and twenty years. At this point she was little better than a brain in a vat, though at least the vat was still her skull. So many parts of her had been merged into the ship that it was hard to tell where it ended and she began. Many of the technologies involved were not understood, pieces found in old mechanicus stockpiles and assembled from vague instructions by genius technicians who still didn't understand how they worked.
Indeed, for the last hundred years Jessina had considered herself to be the ship. She listened through its sensors and networks, felt the burning fires of the engines and communed with the Jubilation's machine spirit in a way that made her feel... whole. Like she'd been missing a half of herself, and by joining to the righteous joy of the Jubilation of the People had been made whole.
But the process was not perfect. Mars' technology had done wonders to sustain her, to allow her to control this ship as if it was an extension of her own body far past when her flesh body had failed her. But it was not perfect, and she knew that. Her emotions were dulled now, and she could not name one new thing she had learned in the last hundred years. And she was just so tired. Her people deserved a captian who could change with the times, one who shared their emotions, looked forward to each new day and served for a reason other than duty. They deserved a last speech from her that looked to the future, instead of looking to the past.
However, that was one thing that Jessina could not deliver. She had been molded by the Cult Wars, the apocalyptic struggle that had defined the military of the Shipwright's Alliance. None of the new blood could see it, but Jessina saw the traces of that war everywhere she looked. The promotion by merit, to prevent smooth-tongued cultists from becoming leaders. The lance-heavy frigates, to match the daemon-ships without allowing them to close the distance. The war against the Cults was baked into the very foundation of the Alliance's military practices.
Still, she would do her duty this one, last time. Without much of a plan, she clicked open the ship-wide channel.
"My crew." The words rumbled down the passages of the entire ship, a gentle thunder compared to the harsh crash of battle orders.
"I have served our Alliance for Two hundred and fifty years. I fought in the Cult Wars, against pirates and Xenos and rebels. In that time, I have commanded many crews." She paused, memory shifting over faces long dead. She remembered her first officers from her first ship, as well as those aboard when she'd taken command of the Jubilation of the People so long ago. But she did not know any of the officers of her ship today. She could not remember any of the people who'd served in the last fifty years. There was only the ship and its operations. To them, she was the ship.
"I am a veteran of the Cult Wars. I know all of you have learned of it, and I am not speaking to give you a history lesson. But I am the last surviving veteran of that... struggle. It was not truly a war. To call it as such is to do the dead a disservice. It was a brawl, a vicious no-holds-barred fight against an enemy beyond imagination. An enemy that was a furnace, consuming everything fed to it as fuel, every life and every death fueling the flame higher and burning us all to ash."
Her voice grew pained. "I was also burned. I watched all but two of my siblings die in that war, on the ground or in the void. It was a crushing thing, a fight unending against a foe unstoppable. It changed us, all those who fought in those times. We were veterans of horror, survivors of Chaos. For a hundred years after the war my crew bore the scars, as elder passed those lessons and traumas off to junior. But you have lost those lessons, that burn-scar hardness that my crews once had."
Throughout the ship people looked lost, wounded at being told they would not measure up against their ancestors by one of those ancestors.
But Jessina was not done. "I would not have it any other way. We are a proud people, who hold the legacy of our victories dearly. But those victories have bought us peace. You and your parents and your children have been untroubled by by the furnace of total war. And here I speak, as a voice from our past, to remind you that it exists, and may come again.
"For the veterans of yesteryear would be proud to see you. You are what we fought for. Your ability to live, and be happy. For children to learn their letters and numbers instead of practice their aim and count their rounds. My first crew cried tears of blood to fight for you, and if they saw you now they would cry joyful tears of salt.
"Take pride in yourself, and your luxuries. Do not think yourself worse than your ancestors because they lived harder times than you. Be comfortable in your lives, for that was what our heroics purchased."
She fell silent, and considered leaving it there. That was a good message. It would be a good parting gift to her final crew. But her duty propelled her onwards. It was not a duty to these children, not really. It was a duty to their ancestors, those she'd originally served with. They would want their children to carry one more lesson with them. Learn one more thing from her, before she passed.
"But do not forget. Your lives were bought with blood and fire and sacrifice. The great enemy will come again. I speak from the past to tell you to never grow complacent. This Galaxy is harsh, and if we are not prepared for it then our people will once more be required to sacrifice everything to ensure our future. I give you my final command, before I die. Be ready. Find every advantage against any foe that would see us burned, and know which enemies must be fought.
"Do not mistake me. Against normal foes, fight normally. Fight and speak and live your lives happily, for to find joy in this Galaxy is a victory. I do not speak of the enemies of today. I warn against the enemy that cannot be tolerated, those who would corrupt our homes and our people and kill all we hold dear. Against those enemies, every weapon is to be used, every ally is to be courted. Do not make the error we made, distrustful and scared as we were. Find those you can make common cause with, for they are one more weapon to fight your true enemies.
"The Mashan are tolerable, for Xenos, and the Federation are as kind a neighbor as we could ask for. Do not keep them distant. We may disagree with them, but they will never scour us from our worlds as a true enemy would. A loss against them is not a true loss. Bring them close, so that when another War to the End approaches, there are those who would stand with us against it." Her mind drifted back, to arguments made centuries past. "If we had done that from the start, the wars would have been better. Less would have been lost. Less would have been sacrificed."
Jessina winced internally. She'd started to ramble, to vent internal thoughts she had not spoken aloud in living memory. Her message was being diluted. It was time to end things, once and for all.
"Take heart, my crew. You have lived softer lives than crews of the past, but I would have it no other way. Live your lives well, respect your new Captain as if they spoke with my voice, and be ready if ever a True Foe should intrude upon us again. A War to the End is a terrible thing, and you will know it when it comes for you."
Jessina turned off the vox, then directed her attention elsewhere. When she'd been placed into this tube, she'd demanded to have the controls to switch it all off placed inside. With every additional procedure, she'd maintained the capability to disable her life-support if necessary. Now, she finally used that capability. It was calm, and she finally, finally drifted off to a restful sleep.
Unbeknownst to her, hundreds of people had individually recorded her words, and they winged their way through the Alliance as quickly as they could be carried. After all, the words of the elders were to be respected, and who had been wiser than the Captain?
The Jubilation of the People was quiet.
The flagship of the Shipwright's Alliance, the pride of their fleet, the seven-plus kilometer warship was in truth a city full to the brim with people. They worked and played and raised children throughout the massive hull. There was always at least one raucous party, one drunken bash, one angry fight going on within its bowels.
But not today. Today, The Jubilation of the People was losing its captain, and the people who called the ship home were respectfully silent, waiting for the captains' words of farewell. Many had tried to beg her to stay, to continue her duty towards the Alliance and rule over their ship. But she had politely replied to every message that reached her. The bone-chilling fatigue in those replies had convinced those who received them to hold any further entireties and spread the word not to bother the captian in her last days.
Jessina was tired. She'd outlived her children, and her children's children. She had captained this ship for a hundred and ninety years, ever since her last ship, the light cruiser Torch of the Worthy had been destroyed at the hands of the United Cults. The previous Capitan of the Jubiliation had been assassinated by a cult inside the Alliance at the same time, and she'd taken command of the flagship and pride of the fleet in the following attack. It hadn't been a matter considered by committee as was standard today, but rather a case of being in the right place at the right time with the right skills. And after that, she'd been the Captain.
She mused on that war as she considered her speech. She'd written and discarded dozens of drafts of this speech in preparation for today. Though 'written' was the wrong word. She hadn't held anything physical for the last hundred and twenty years. At this point she was little better than a brain in a vat, though at least the vat was still her skull. So many parts of her had been merged into the ship that it was hard to tell where it ended and she began. Many of the technologies involved were not understood, pieces found in old mechanicus stockpiles and assembled from vague instructions by genius technicians who still didn't understand how they worked.
Indeed, for the last hundred years Jessina had considered herself to be the ship. She listened through its sensors and networks, felt the burning fires of the engines and communed with the Jubilation's machine spirit in a way that made her feel... whole. Like she'd been missing a half of herself, and by joining to the righteous joy of the Jubilation of the People had been made whole.
But the process was not perfect. Mars' technology had done wonders to sustain her, to allow her to control this ship as if it was an extension of her own body far past when her flesh body had failed her. But it was not perfect, and she knew that. Her emotions were dulled now, and she could not name one new thing she had learned in the last hundred years. And she was just so tired. Her people deserved a captian who could change with the times, one who shared their emotions, looked forward to each new day and served for a reason other than duty. They deserved a last speech from her that looked to the future, instead of looking to the past.
However, that was one thing that Jessina could not deliver. She had been molded by the Cult Wars, the apocalyptic struggle that had defined the military of the Shipwright's Alliance. None of the new blood could see it, but Jessina saw the traces of that war everywhere she looked. The promotion by merit, to prevent smooth-tongued cultists from becoming leaders. The lance-heavy frigates, to match the daemon-ships without allowing them to close the distance. The war against the Cults was baked into the very foundation of the Alliance's military practices.
Still, she would do her duty this one, last time. Without much of a plan, she clicked open the ship-wide channel.
"My crew." The words rumbled down the passages of the entire ship, a gentle thunder compared to the harsh crash of battle orders.
"I have served our Alliance for Two hundred and fifty years. I fought in the Cult Wars, against pirates and Xenos and rebels. In that time, I have commanded many crews." She paused, memory shifting over faces long dead. She remembered her first officers from her first ship, as well as those aboard when she'd taken command of the Jubilation of the People so long ago. But she did not know any of the officers of her ship today. She could not remember any of the people who'd served in the last fifty years. There was only the ship and its operations. To them, she was the ship.
"I am a veteran of the Cult Wars. I know all of you have learned of it, and I am not speaking to give you a history lesson. But I am the last surviving veteran of that... struggle. It was not truly a war. To call it as such is to do the dead a disservice. It was a brawl, a vicious no-holds-barred fight against an enemy beyond imagination. An enemy that was a furnace, consuming everything fed to it as fuel, every life and every death fueling the flame higher and burning us all to ash."
Her voice grew pained. "I was also burned. I watched all but two of my siblings die in that war, on the ground or in the void. It was a crushing thing, a fight unending against a foe unstoppable. It changed us, all those who fought in those times. We were veterans of horror, survivors of Chaos. For a hundred years after the war my crew bore the scars, as elder passed those lessons and traumas off to junior. But you have lost those lessons, that burn-scar hardness that my crews once had."
Throughout the ship people looked lost, wounded at being told they would not measure up against their ancestors by one of those ancestors.
But Jessina was not done. "I would not have it any other way. We are a proud people, who hold the legacy of our victories dearly. But those victories have bought us peace. You and your parents and your children have been untroubled by by the furnace of total war. And here I speak, as a voice from our past, to remind you that it exists, and may come again.
"For the veterans of yesteryear would be proud to see you. You are what we fought for. Your ability to live, and be happy. For children to learn their letters and numbers instead of practice their aim and count their rounds. My first crew cried tears of blood to fight for you, and if they saw you now they would cry joyful tears of salt.
"Take pride in yourself, and your luxuries. Do not think yourself worse than your ancestors because they lived harder times than you. Be comfortable in your lives, for that was what our heroics purchased."
She fell silent, and considered leaving it there. That was a good message. It would be a good parting gift to her final crew. But her duty propelled her onwards. It was not a duty to these children, not really. It was a duty to their ancestors, those she'd originally served with. They would want their children to carry one more lesson with them. Learn one more thing from her, before she passed.
"But do not forget. Your lives were bought with blood and fire and sacrifice. The great enemy will come again. I speak from the past to tell you to never grow complacent. This Galaxy is harsh, and if we are not prepared for it then our people will once more be required to sacrifice everything to ensure our future. I give you my final command, before I die. Be ready. Find every advantage against any foe that would see us burned, and know which enemies must be fought.
"Do not mistake me. Against normal foes, fight normally. Fight and speak and live your lives happily, for to find joy in this Galaxy is a victory. I do not speak of the enemies of today. I warn against the enemy that cannot be tolerated, those who would corrupt our homes and our people and kill all we hold dear. Against those enemies, every weapon is to be used, every ally is to be courted. Do not make the error we made, distrustful and scared as we were. Find those you can make common cause with, for they are one more weapon to fight your true enemies.
"The Mashan are tolerable, for Xenos, and the Federation are as kind a neighbor as we could ask for. Do not keep them distant. We may disagree with them, but they will never scour us from our worlds as a true enemy would. A loss against them is not a true loss. Bring them close, so that when another War to the End approaches, there are those who would stand with us against it." Her mind drifted back, to arguments made centuries past. "If we had done that from the start, the wars would have been better. Less would have been lost. Less would have been sacrificed."
Jessina winced internally. She'd started to ramble, to vent internal thoughts she had not spoken aloud in living memory. Her message was being diluted. It was time to end things, once and for all.
"Take heart, my crew. You have lived softer lives than crews of the past, but I would have it no other way. Live your lives well, respect your new Captain as if they spoke with my voice, and be ready if ever a True Foe should intrude upon us again. A War to the End is a terrible thing, and you will know it when it comes for you."
Jessina turned off the vox, then directed her attention elsewhere. When she'd been placed into this tube, she'd demanded to have the controls to switch it all off placed inside. With every additional procedure, she'd maintained the capability to disable her life-support if necessary. Now, she finally used that capability. It was calm, and she finally, finally drifted off to a restful sleep.
Unbeknownst to her, hundreds of people had individually recorded her words, and they winged their way through the Alliance as quickly as they could be carried. After all, the words of the elders were to be respected, and who had been wiser than the Captain?
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