Ymaryn Successor Quest (Paths of Civ AU)
- Location
- Earth
- Pronouns
- She/Her/They/Them
[X] Submit (20 Prestige transferred to KMT, -.2 Treasury, -4 Influence, -1 Authority, Revaunchists gravely weakened, personal action unavailable next turn)
[X] Submit (20 Prestige transferred to KMT, -.2 Treasury, -4 Influence, -1 Authority, Revaunchists gravely weakened, personal action unavailable next turn)
I've already expounded at length how we cannot win a war against WW, BS, and Khem all at once. Since we can survive this demand, we must submit.
Look to the long view. This is annoying but manageable. Once we're united and we put out all our fires we're going to rocket back up; for now, take the blows and move on.
In the future we can try to become friends again, as a pair of ancient nations who share the same region and are going to want to stick together against those Damned Syffronites when they get their shit together and the colonial thing starts, or we can butt heads and become proper rivals with long lasting enmity. It can go either way; this is honestly a token submission and far, far less terrible than I thought it would be. (All that influence and authority is our negative traits, not Khem's fault. What they're actually asking for is basically nothing.)
I would personally prefer if we can become friends again because that means our southern flank and most of the water isn't a concern. With Amber Road becoming Russia and covering our northern flank we'll be highly protected and open for options to screw with Syffron or Kus.
They would be right.
I've already expounded at length how we cannot win a war against WW, BS, and Khem all at once. Since we can survive this demand, we must submit.
Look to the long view. This is annoying but manageable. Once we're united and we put out all our fires we're going to rocket back up; for now, take the blows and move on.
In the future we can try to become friends again, as a pair of ancient nations who share the same region and are going to want to stick together against those Damned Syffronites when they get their shit together and the colonial thing starts, or we can butt heads and become proper rivals with long lasting enmity. It can go either way; this is honestly a token submission and far, far less terrible than I thought it would be. (All that influence and authority is our negative traits, not Khem's fault. What they're actually asking for is basically nothing.)
I would personally prefer if we can become friends again because that means our southern flank and most of the water isn't a concern. With Amber Road becoming Russia and covering our northern flank we'll be highly protected and open for options to screw with Syffron or Kus.
They would be right.
[X] Submit (20 Prestige transferred to KMT, -.2 Treasury, -4 Influence, -1 Authority, Revaunchists gravely weakened, personal action unavailable next turn)
I am unconcerned about other nations realizing that the million man army is nearly imposible to sustain. It is. We can only pull it out if we have our people reeeing at someone.
That's fine. We are still more militarily poweful than all but the Hung, and historically the Hung wasn't really that powerful.
Though if we can get the Hung into the modern millitary game they could be very ahistoric.
I am unconcerned about other nations realizing that the million man army is nearly imposible to sustain. It is. We can only pull it out if we have our people reeeing at someone.
That's fine. We are still more militarily poweful than all but the Hung, and historically the Hung wasn't really that powerful.
Though if we can get the Hung into the modern millitary game they could be very ahistoric.
Updated for reunification of Teheryn and new projections:
1617 Khemetri-Interrupt Snapshot of frequently-changed stats (1617 Initial Results)
Additional Stats (1617 Khemetri Interrupt)
Prestige:: 65 (-20 projected)
Authority: 2 (-1 projected)
Influence: 4 (+2 pending, -4 projected)
Estimated Stress (unknown start point): 9.0
Other Notables: Personal action unavailable in 1618 (projected)
Revaunchists Appeasement: Mass Levy
Txollan Concerns Met: War with Black Sheep
Num Profitable Markets: 3 (2 without Probable -Amber Road Opinion)
Num Semi-Profitable Markets [Estimated Treasury]: 4 [1.875]
(These estimates are probably out of date. see 1613 Start for latest updates)
Next Guild Income Within: 1618
Treasury: 5.5 (-0.2 projected) (+0.3 mid-1620,1625... ; +1 mid-1618,1620,...; -1 mid-year from Mass Levy)
Unoccupied Banner Companies: Both on Western Wall front
Action [Investment]: Scheduled Investment Return Year (Estimated Return Year)
Spreading the Warding, Amber Road [1 Influence]: 1620 (1621)
Create Sleeper Cells, Black Sheep [2 Influence]: our choice
Counter Espionage [2 Influence]: ???
Train Thunder Plateau Administrators, Elective [1 Influence]: (1.4 * [Length of Black Sheep War + 2 years])
Revaunchists Weakenings: 4 (-1) = 3? (+1 "gravely weakened" projected)
Sacred Warding Notes: Can provide to three nations after Hung delegation returns (1616-1618). (Source)
All dates are tentative estimates; they can change in response to circumstances (e.g. failures, crits). +/-1 in [year] means that an extra +/-1 will be available for us during Turn [year]. I believe that income is added during the Initial Results part of a year, though the exact ordering within that stage is unclear.
1617 Khemetri-Interrupt Snapshot of frequently-changed stats (1617 Initial Results)
-
Opinions of you:
Khemetri: 4/10 [C] R
Magyar: 7/10
Ealam: 7/10
Vynta: 6/10
Ruma: 5/10
Pamplona: 8/10
Abyss: 5/10
Hung: 8/10 [C]
Rexum Germanum: 5/10
-Hasum 4/10
-Behryvar 4/10
-Ochrur ?/10
Tarta: 5/10
Styrmyr: 5/10
Amber Road: 8/10 [C], 2/5 [A]
Norsca: 4/10
Berba: 5/10
Hellas: 3/10 [C] R
Pulska: 3/5
Prestige Rankings:
<30 = Minor Power
30-59 = Major Power
60-99 = Great Power
100+ = Super Power
Melkut Ymaryn: 65
Additional Stats (1617 Khemetri Interrupt)
Prestige:: 65 (-20 projected)
Authority: 2 (-1 projected)
Influence: 4 (+2 pending, -4 projected)
Estimated Stress (unknown start point): 9.0
Other Notables: Personal action unavailable in 1618 (projected)
Revaunchists Appeasement: Mass Levy
Txollan Concerns Met: War with Black Sheep
Num Profitable Markets: 3 (2 without Probable -Amber Road Opinion)
Num Semi-Profitable Markets [Estimated Treasury]: 4 [1.875]
(These estimates are probably out of date. see 1613 Start for latest updates)
Next Guild Income Within: 1618
Treasury: 5.5 (-0.2 projected) (+0.3 mid-1620,1625... ; +1 mid-1618,1620,...; -1 mid-year from Mass Levy)
Unoccupied Banner Companies: Both on Western Wall front
Action [Investment]: Scheduled Investment Return Year (Estimated Return Year)
Spreading the Warding, Amber Road [1 Influence]: 1620 (1621)
Create Sleeper Cells, Black Sheep [2 Influence]: our choice
Train Thunder Plateau Administrators, Elective [1 Influence]: (1.4 * [Length of Black Sheep War + 2 years])
Revaunchists Weakenings: 4 (-1) = 3? (+1 "gravely weakened" projected)
- Tin Tribes Independence
- White Peace with Hellas
- Amber Road Independence
- Refrain from conquering Stymyr to mountains
- Strengthening: Blame Western Wall
- "Gravely weakened": Khemetri Concession (projected)
Sacred Warding Notes: Can provide to three nations after Hung delegation returns (1616-1618). (Source)
All dates are tentative estimates; they can change in response to circumstances (e.g. failures, crits). +/-1 in [year] means that an extra +/-1 will be available for us during Turn [year]. I believe that income is added during the Initial Results part of a year, though the exact ordering within that stage is unclear.
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In days of yore, when the Melkut Ymaryn was mighty but not yet foolish, it would occasionally happen that a warlord would arise on the steppes. They would unite a few tribes, use that to force more nomads to their banner, until they had a horde that could threaten more settled lands. And so the barbarians would swagger down from the north making demands.
The wise Ymaryn would send a most splendid embassy to meet them. They would present gifts both rich and kingly, they would call them Emperor or Khan howsoever they wished to be styled, they would smile and they would bow. The warlord would ride away boasting of the tribute and submission he had extracted, the Ymaryn would shrug and go back to more important business.
It is unusual that the king of our most ancient peer in civilisation should demand to be treated like an upstart horse lord but these things sometimes happen with new dynasties. They'll probably get over it in a couple of generations.
[X] Submit (20 Prestige transferred to KMT, -.2 Treasury, -4 Influence, -1 Authority, Revaunchists gravely weakened, personal action unavailable next turn)
The wise Ymaryn would send a most splendid embassy to meet them. They would present gifts both rich and kingly, they would call them Emperor or Khan howsoever they wished to be styled, they would smile and they would bow. The warlord would ride away boasting of the tribute and submission he had extracted, the Ymaryn would shrug and go back to more important business.
It is unusual that the king of our most ancient peer in civilisation should demand to be treated like an upstart horse lord but these things sometimes happen with new dynasties. They'll probably get over it in a couple of generations.
[X] Submit (20 Prestige transferred to KMT, -.2 Treasury, -4 Influence, -1 Authority, Revaunchists gravely weakened, personal action unavailable next turn)
You misunderstand the point here.
The point is THEY want to be rivals to US. From their perspective, us being powerful is in and of itself bad for their set-up. You want to make friends with a power that does not see friendship as being in their interest.
Trying to be friends with people who don't want friendship is a good way to waste alot of energy.
How exactly does that leave us "exposed"? Exposed to who and what? So far Arabia has been so insignificant it hasn't even come up in PoC and even in the real world, the great empires of the region had nothing to gain by controlling Arabia and nothing to fear from leaving the locals mostly to their own devices. Except for that one time when the Romans and Persians beat the stuffing out of each-other so bad that a new Arabian polity was able to conquer most of both in a couple generations...
And yes, conquering all the way to not!Suez is the path of least resistance here. The geography of the world has shifted and in this new world we are missing one of the most important areas for an Anatolian or Mesopotamian empire to control, and we are both.
Now, it would be nice to complete our economic and strategic geography by creating a pre-modern customs union an alliance system, but those are very modern ideas and the Ymaryn empire is still working in a late iron age context.
fasquardon
Chimeraguard
We do deserve to exist.
[X] Submit (20 Prestige transferred to KMT, -.2 Treasury, -4 Influence, -1 Authority, Revaunchists gravely weakened, personal action unavailable next turn)
- Location
- Pennslyvania
- Pronouns
- She/They
[X] Submit (20 Prestige transferred to KMT, -.2 Treasury, -4 Influence, -1 Authority, Revaunchists gravely weakened, personal action unavailable next turn)
This is so true. We should do the traditional thing and pay the tribute in nothing but salt.
Short to middle term I actually really want us to settle Cyprus - it is neutral on the map, so we should be able to get it per diplomacy, and is ideally positioned for a naval base.
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- Location
- Southampton, Great Britain
- Pronouns
- He/Him
While technically independent, it is a de facto client state of the Khem.
Aranfan
Team Plasma Grunt
Cyprus is a petty kingdom currently sphered by KMT. It passes back and forth between the suzerainty of them and Hellas.
Well, this is bad.
And would make this war even more of a nightmare than I thought - Khem have a naval base basically on our doorstep.
Well, the next time we are in conflict with either of them I know whom we should try to get into our sphere of influence.
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Rivalry isn't a thing one wants (maybe with rare exceptions). The Khem didn't start off as rivals--in fact they had positive opinion--despite our conflicting trade interests. It's only when they took serious damage from those interests that they actually considered us a rival.
A rival is one who is a serious threat to you. They may have significant advantages over you, and that is frightening. But they can also make a peace offering (as with the 1608 trade deal). Show enough goodwill over a long period of time, and their strength ceases to be a threat, and becomes an asset: the former rival is firmly in your corner.
The Ymaryn caused them damage during the Kus famine without any consideration, without so much as throwing them a bone. This will make a resolution harder, but we have a 500 year timeline. Befriending them is inevitable as long as we don't give up at the start, or worse, intentionally piss them off at the start for no good reason.
Remember the Ymaryn issues with pride? This is part of that equation.
The fewer the natural boundaries (and the more stretched out our territory), the more exposed we are. We can conquer not!Arabia to get those boundaries, but the QM has already warned us of that.
Furthermore, watch out for nationalism. Aranfan has said that conquering the not!Ukrainian tribes would lead to eventually getting screwed over; how much worse would it be with Khemetri-owned lands.
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This should be the speech that our king gives.
- Location
- Southampton, Great Britain
- Pronouns
- He/Him
No, it shouldn't because it might provoke the Khem and we don't want that right now.
Can only add my voice to what everyone said - this was beautiful.
On the other hand, the fact they view us as a rival WILL color their actions, along with perspective, and honestly I don't know how to change that status.