- Location
- usa
It's possible they just exported a bunch of people to keep pops in check, easy way to rapid colonize, tho most are probably broken facilities and stuff, it may have been kept sub-optimal if it served interests in the modern millennia.
Vox Vitae: Warhammer AI quest
- Thread starter Neablis
- Start date
- Mature Sci-Fi
To back Prime up, here's some maths relevant to this, using the results table from Mechanics:
0-15 Fail
16-35 Poor success
36-65 Success
66-90 Good success
91+ critical success
The chances are
Auto-fail 1%
Fail 14%
Poor success 20%
Success 30%
Good success 25%
Critical success 10%
With worst of 2, they're:
Auto-fail 1.99%
Fail 25.76%
Poor success: 30%
Success 30%
Good success 11.25%
Critical success 1%
With best of 2, they're:
Auto-fail 0.01%
Fail 2.24%
Poor success 10%
Success 30%
Good success 38.75%
Critical success 19%
As you can see, worst of 2 almost doubles the crit fail chance, makes fail or worse 12% more likely, and poor success or worse 22% more likely (in fact, it becomes a comfortable majority probability).
I think it should be emphasized that psyker hoods/other dampeners are largely about dousing psychic energy affecting the subject's body. So if Cia's peril was something that turned on her, it would weaken as it entered her personal space and especially as it got close to her head.
Given what we are, reaching that level of protection isn't too shabby. If a bot can plug her half-charred decapitated head into a fresh blood supply a few seconds after it happens, we can probably get her all the way back from that with current or near-current medical tech.
Given what we are, reaching that level of protection isn't too shabby. If a bot can plug her half-charred decapitated head into a fresh blood supply a few seconds after it happens, we can probably get her all the way back from that with current or near-current medical tech.
The Froggy Ninja
The Blade Will Never Die
Honestly the biggest engineering issue with arcologies is heat dissipation. Issac Arthur had a pretty good two-parter on arcologies and ecumonopoli about how incredibly easy it would be to house and feed the kinds of numbers listed for hive worlds in significant comfort, with modern or near-future (depending on how you view fusion power) tech. Space ends up being a total non-issue compared to stopping the atmosphere from catching fire just from the raw heat output of the human body, assuming zero-waste-heat from the actual tech of it all.
- Pronouns
- She/Her
We hope anyways
F0lkL0re
Officially not an Inquisitor
- Location
- Shetland
To add on to this here are the two videos Froggy mentions:
Also he has a video on arcology design:
And a video on hive worlds:
Issac also has videos about other 40k worlds and concepts like forge worlds so it worth giving his channel a look.
Occurs to me that I didn't add the version with +10
Auto-fail 1%
Fail 4%
Poor success 20%
Success 30%
Good success 25%
Critical success 20%
Worst of 2:
Auto-fail 1.99%
Fail 7.76%
Poor success: 34%
Success 36%
Good success 16.25%
Critical success 4%
Best of 2:
Auto-fail 0.01%
Fail 0.24%
Poor success 6%
Success 24%
Good success 33.75%
Critical success 36%
avatar11792
Et Sic Incipit
- Location
- Planet Earth, North America
[X] Plan: Enriching Exclave Establishment V3
[X] Plan: Preparing to Digest Alien Data
[X] Plan: Teach them and you feed them for a lifetime
[X] [Necron] Take them
[X] Plan: Preparing to Digest Alien Data
[X] Plan: Teach them and you feed them for a lifetime
[X] [Necron] Take them
Dmol8
The Undead Unhinged Lunatic of the Web
- Location
- Belgrade,Serbia
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
OK very briefly:- That isn't how population pressures work. Yes in lower tech societies as pop culture knows them and in modern post-industrial societies there is a low level of population growth, but that isn't actually caused by some random natural occurrence. It's caused by human nature.
- Malthusian politics in the late 19th century were actually instrumental in the whole switching from 13-15 kids to 2-5 thing when the more successful of the political movements inspired by Malthus' writing advocated for reliable birth control. This is never brought up in popular culture so it is almost never considered by sci-fi writers.
- As for the current post-industrial population decline you can blame that directly on the current capitalistic exploitation and "efficiency" which over-stresses the population to the point of causing a demographic implosion. Something similar happened in parts of the world back in the mid-19th century. Once the exploiters burn trough the exploitable part of the population all that is left is the part of the population willing to fight.
Basically once the current capitalistic system is dealt with either trough people successfully overthrowing it or trough a demographic implosion causing it to no longer be able to function birth rates will bounce back. If it is the former you can expect the human population to blaze past that 11 Billion mark that is usually tossed around in pop culture and if it is the latter well WWII casualties will look quaint in hindsight.
Either way Hive Worlds specifically are the Imperium exploiting broken designs to fuel its wars.
- Location
- Chicago
- Pronouns
- She/They
I maintain that we cannot say why with any real confidence because we've only got one run of the experiment and no way to do any controls. There are too many variables to even name.
We have to guess because we have to make policy IRL, but it's still guesswork and, I think, out of scope for this thread.
Dmol8
The Undead Unhinged Lunatic of the Web
- Location
- Belgrade,Serbia
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
I know what wicked problems are and as such this argument is actually not outside of the scope of this thread as such wickedness very much applies to a setting like 40k.
- Pronouns
- He/Him
OK very briefly:
OK very briefly:
I don't know why you came in to this discussion guns blazing, but since you did I don't think you really get to criticize other people's reasons for not wanting to discuss the subject you decided to shoot them over.
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- Location
- Somewhere on Earth
Talk about eurocentrism, man. You know the steady reduction of population growth is a universal trait across all developing countries, right? Universal education and access to birth control in any form drops fertility rates, and we know this because the european government and church opposed birth control despite Neo-Malthusian proponents, seen here:
This sort of behaviour didn't start getting widely repealed until the mid-20th century. The demographic transition from high birth and death rates to low birth and death rates happened in spite of the actual prevailing political movement at the time, because the population simply adapted as they do whenever they experience this sort of technological revolution.
If that was true then developed countries with better qualities of life and undeveloped countries that still maintain an abusive work standard should have a higher and lower rate of births respectively, which they don't. The Netherlands has the lowest average working hours among first world countries, full maternity leave, and it has a lower fertility rate than the US.
Edit: To be clear, there is absolutely a correlation with a culture of overwork and a lack of personal free time outside of work and lowered birth rates, but whatever impact they have are matched if not exceeded by the natural shift human populations undergo when infant mortality drops.
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meianmaru
The Devourer of Fiction
Okay, this has cleared at least the worst of my fears when it comes to Cia and active psyker development. Still not in favor of it without mitigation measures, but now it is more of a preference rather than an absolute need for me.
Dmol8
The Undead Unhinged Lunatic of the Web
- Location
- Belgrade,Serbia
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
The first paragraph your argument is utterly confusing me. You quoted an obvious French propaganda piece as seen here:
Article: In other words, birth control can notably be explained by the evolution of ways of thinking. This is why it developed first in France, a country that distinguished itself less for its economic level, than for its intellectual movements and advanced state of secularization.
and in the fact that there is no German translation on that site for this article. And the argument here is that I am being eurocentric
Also the very article you quoted talks about how it was the Neo-Malthusian ideas that gained more of an audience during the 19th century and well into the 20th:
Article: Neo-Malthusian ideas gained more of an audience, driven by representatives who were small in number but effective in diffusing their ideas, such as Annie Besant (1847-1933), and George Bradlaugh (1833-1891) in Great Britain. The Swedish economist Knut Wicksell (1851-1926), for instance, believed that the number of a household's children should be related to its financial resources. Unlike Thomas Malthus, who supported population regulation through the development of celibacy and delayed marriage, neo-Malthusians advocated the use of contraceptive methods, thereby offering another representation of marital relations, including the notions of romantic feeling and pleasure, which had previously been absent from the representation of marriage.
which just leaves me scratching my head as to what even your argument is here. I can't reply to something I genuinely don't understand.
The same applies to the second part of your post where you edited in something about a natural shift human populations undergo when infant mortality drops. Which natural shift? There are multiple ones that don't all agree with each other.
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
[X] Plan: Enriching Exclave Establishment V3
[X][Necron] Take them.
[X][Necron] Take them.
Dmol8
The Undead Unhinged Lunatic of the Web
- Location
- Belgrade,Serbia
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
[X] Plan: Enriching Exclave Establishment V3
[X][Necron] Take them.
One of these days we will have a neck and neck vote, but probably not today. What even is this quest when it comes to the plan making?
[X][Necron] Take them.
One of these days we will have a neck and neck vote, but probably not today. What even is this quest when it comes to the plan making?
- Location
- Somewhere on Earth
...you know Germany is european, right? It's in the european union. Yes you are being eurocentric, because you took Malthusian politics, a European ideology with at most mild crossover with non-European countries, and declared that that was instrumental in all fertility rates dropping.and in the fact that there is no German translation on that site for this article. And the argument here is that I am being eurocentric
They also remained not the primary position of the european governments, who, again, kept trying to ban contraception. So in order for them to have this level of influence they'd have had to have a massive cultural impact without actually shifting the position of the government much if at all. Now, there was a Neo-Malthusian revival that was deeply influential in about the 1940s, especially in 1968 with The Tragedy Of The Commons, but this was long after the main drop in fertility levels that had already occurred. So could they have had influence in the late 19th century population drop? Sure. But more likely the primary cause was what happened to every country that undergoes a demographic transition, which come to mention it:
This one, apologies. Whenever a culture undergoes a rapid modernisation- like the industrial revolution -mortality rates go way down, and fertility rates follow at a delay. The work culture it develops as it goes seems to impact the result somewhat, but otherwise it happens pretty consistently.
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- Location
- Don't know
- Pronouns
- Whats/That
People agree on a plan of action. Some people make a plan everyone agrees on, that's all there is to it.
I'm fairly shocked my plan is the one in the lead honestly. It didn't seem to be picking up much support or discussion during the moratorium, so it's been a pleasant surprise!
- Location
- Utrecht
Well, if nothing else, challenging the Ork to a fist fight will be hilarious.
Lots of people don't discuss but vote. Sometimes after reading back, sometimes just by looking at the options. Your plan has a few differentials such as capturing the orks and returning to Denva immediately.
I really dislike the latter, both because I think we should finish our projected survey and because I want them to have time to develop befofe we collect on those favours (also because I think there will be a tonne of disputes once we get to Denva), but I can see people wanting to get back there to get those.
Don't put your plan down; you clearly have the pulse of the silent majority.
- Location
- Near Freiburg in South-West Germany
The thread seems to agree on the broad strokes about what we should do, your plan builds on that with details a lot of people want and also got the it would be funny factor by challenging the orks to a fist fight. IMO it should be Cia challenging them so it actually looks like it might be a decent fight (and in case the orks manage to force the fight to happen), but thats just details.