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Victoria Falls: A Post-Collapse American Nation Quest [Down With Victoria!]

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[x][ISLANDS] Assault. You are not actually sanguine about the possibility of resupply. You fear Victorian-flagged Russian weapons landing on those islands. Sure, Vicks aren't qualified to use those weapons, and rainy with a chance of artillery shells is not the ideal environment under which to learn, but they might get lucky. Of course, you will black out the sky with your artillery shells, but you will do so while landing troops as swiftly as possible.

[x][NEWS] Spread the word as far as it will go. Inform the world that you lived up to your promises. Ensure that everybody know that you beat Victoria. See if that shakes something loose from this embargo, and or perhaps motivates those foreign observers and spies to make recommendations at home.
 
[X][ISLANDS] Siege. Under constant, focused, withering artillery bombardment from naval and shore-based batteries, on soft, level ground, and with no real entrenching gear, the islands will be unable to hold out even if given an untouched supply line by air. Erode them over weeks of artillery bombardment, landing only once all activity has either ceased or been thoroughly suppressed.
[X][NEWS] Spread the word as far as it will go. Inform the world that you lived up to your promises. Ensure that everybody know that you beat Victoria. See if that shakes something loose from this embargo, and or perhaps motivates those foreign observers and spies to make recommendations at home.
 
PainRack said:
So yes, Westmoreland adopted a losing strategy.
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To be fair to Westmoreland, I don't think he picked a bad strategy given the political restrictions. Just... Well... The political restrictions pretty much doomed him to lose. The only way the US could really win in Vietnam was to have different aims.

Which is probably the biggest reason why no-one should want to repeat North Vietnam's experience in that war. They were fighting an enemy that had contradictory aims, and them losing was not the most important priority for the US. Not exactly something one can count on when going into a war.

Try 4th Generation warfare against anyone for whom winning is further up their priority list and don't have mutually exclusive goals, and, uh, the results would not be pretty.

Anyway, great analysis and I enjoyed the omake. ^_^

fasquardon
 
[x][ISLANDS] Assault. You are not actually sanguine about the possibility of resupply. You fear Victorian-flagged Russian weapons landing on those islands. Sure, Vicks aren't qualified to use those weapons, and rainy with a chance of artillery shells is not the ideal environment under which to learn, but they might get lucky. Of course, you will black out the sky with your artillery shells, but you will do so while landing troops as swiftly as possible.

[x][NEWS] Spread the word as far as it will go. Inform the world that you lived up to your promises. Ensure that everybody know that you beat Victoria. See if that shakes something loose from this embargo, and or perhaps motivates those foreign observers and spies to make recommendations at home.
 
[X][ISLANDS] Siege. Under constant, focused, withering artillery bombardment from naval and shore-based batteries, on soft, level ground, and with no real entrenching gear, the islands will be unable to hold out even if given an untouched supply line by air. Erode them over weeks of artillery bombardment, landing only once all activity has either ceased or been thoroughly suppressed.
[X][NEWS] Spread the word as far as it will go. Inform the world that you lived up to your promises. Ensure that everybody know that you beat Victoria. See if that shakes something loose from this embargo, and or perhaps motivates those foreign observers and spies to make recommendations at home.
 
fasquardon said:
To be fair to Westmoreland, I don't think he picked a bad strategy given the political restrictions. Just... Well... The political restrictions pretty much doomed him to lose. The only way the US could really win in Vietnam was to have different aims.

Which is probably the biggest reason why no-one should want to repeat North Vietnam's experience in that war. They were fighting an enemy that had contradictory aims, and them losing was not the most important priority for the US. Not exactly something one can count on when going into a war.

Try 4th Generation warfare against anyone for whom winning is further up their priority list and don't have mutually exclusive goals, and, uh, the results would not be pretty.

Anyway, great analysis and I enjoyed the omake. ^_^

fasquardon
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Westmoreland strategy was ultimately based on one calculation..

America can kill Vietnamese faster than Vietnam can throw insurgents at Americans. Copying Falkenhyn , well, Verdun didn't win the war.

It's also led to a contradiction in strategy. When Westmoreland was in Vietnam, he consistently asked for more troops so he could not only fight the attritional battles he wanted (Battle of Hamburger hill), he needed troops to guard the border. When Abrahms requested troops to help the AVN secure the Hamlet program and guard the border, Westmoreland as a member of the chief of staff said no because overall strategic situation prevented sending more troops and the war was politically supposed to be winding down under Nixon.



Also, it looks like get the news out is winning.

We have comic books being a long lasting medium and radio as our primary means of comns. So.. I imaging this as the new theme song, except set to a major key to make it more celebratory.



It seems... Appropriate. The Nazis tried to stamp the blacks out, Detroit and Chicago both has this long history of blacks surviving against oppression ...
 
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PainRack said:
Westmoreland strategy was ultimately based on one calculation..

America can kill Vietnamese faster than Vietnam can throw insurgents at Americans. Copying Falkenhyn , well, Verdun didn't win the war.

It's also led to a contradiction in strategy. When Westmoreland was in Vietnam, he consistently asked for more troops so he could not only fight the attritional battles he wanted (Battle of Hamburger hill), he needed troops to guard the border. When Abrahms requested troops to help the AVN secure the Hamlet program and guard the border, Westmoreland as a member of the chief of staff said no because overall strategic situation prevented sending more troops and the war was politically supposed to be winding down under Nixon.
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Yes, but that doesn't negate @fasquardon 's point, and if anything confirms it- namely, that Westmoreland's military strategy was dictated by political considerations and contradictory priorities. "Defeat North Vietnam and break its communist government" was never actually a realistic option for the US in Vietnam, because the US would be insane and stupid to escalate the war to the point where it was likely to draw in the Chinese (Korea 2: Electric Boogaloo) or risk the Soviets starting to rattle the sabre if, say, a Russian freighter got blown up in Hanoi harbor.

And this wasn't even a case of "the US could have won if it had had the will," it was a case of the US legitimately having higher strategic priorities that could not be met by the US doing certain things in Vietnam... because they would result in "win the battle, lose the war" scenarios for the US in its overall global conflict with the Soviets.

And so the US lost in Vietnam.

But that point is basically exactly what fasquardon is saying- that without those very specific geopolitical circumstances in your favor, or under different circumstances (i.e. you are fighting an enemy whose survival depends on winning, or who has no more pressing goal than to conquer you), the same strategies that served North Vietnam would tend to fail or at least not work out anywhere as satisfactorily as they did for the North Vietnamese- who paid a very, very heavy price for their victory as it was.
 
[x][ISLANDS] Assault. You are not actually sanguine about the possibility of resupply. You fear Victorian-flagged Russian weapons landing on those islands. Sure, Vicks aren't qualified to use those weapons, and rainy with a chance of artillery shells is not the ideal environment under which to learn, but they might get lucky. Of course, you will black out the sky with your artillery shells, but you will do so while landing troops as swiftly as possible.

[x][NEWS] Spread the word as far as it will go. Inform the world that you lived up to your promises. Ensure that everybody know that you beat Victoria. See if that shakes something loose from this embargo, and or perhaps motivates those foreign observers and spies to make recommendations at home.
 
[X][NEWS] Spread the word as far as it will go. Inform the world that you lived up to your promises. Ensure that everybody know that you beat Victoria. See if that shakes something loose from this embargo, and or perhaps motivates those foreign observers and spies to make recommendations at home.
[X][ISLANDS] Siege. Under constant, focused, withering artillery bombardment from naval and shore-based batteries, on soft, level ground, and with no real entrenching gear, the islands will be unable to hold out even if given an untouched supply line by air. Erode them over weeks of artillery bombardment, landing only once all activity has either ceased or been thoroughly suppressed.
 
Oppressing the poor.

Thats a paddlin bombardin.

[X][ISLANDS] Siege. Under constant, focused, withering artillery bombardment from naval and shore-based batteries, on soft, level ground, and with no real entrenching gear, the islands will be unable to hold out even if given an untouched supply line by air. Erode them over weeks of artillery bombardment, landing only once all activity has either ceased or been thoroughly suppressed.
[X][NEWS] Spread the word as far as it will go. Inform the world that you lived up to your promises. Ensure that everybody know that you beat Victoria. See if that shakes something loose from this embargo, and or perhaps motivates those foreign observers and spies to make recommendations at home.

According to Victorian propaganda, we are all issued hammers and sickles at birth that we are required to keep on our person at all times. We have no architecture, just functional giant concrete blocks. We all speak in thick yet unspecific eastern european accents, are required by law to call each other Comrade, and according to some, Papers Please is always playing in the background.
 
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[X][ISLANDS] Assault. You are not actually sanguine about the possibility of resupply. You fear Victorian-flagged Russian weapons landing on those islands. Sure, Vicks aren't qualified to use those weapons, and rainy with a chance of artillery shells is not the ideal environment under which to learn, but they might get lucky. Of course, you will black out the sky with your artillery shells, but you will do so while landing troops as swiftly as possible.
[X][NEWS] Spread the word as far as it will go. Inform the world that you lived up to your promises. Ensure that everybody know that you beat Victoria. See if that shakes something loose from this embargo, and or perhaps motivates those foreign observers and spies to make recommendations at home.

PoptartProdigy said:
I love it! Non-canon, of course, but still good.
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How would you do the traits of the Union, the Confederates and Articles of Confederacy USA?
 
kilopi505 said:
How would you do the traits of the Union, the Confederates and Articles of Confederacy USA?
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I would personally specify that the Confederacy is offended not by any of Victoria's general badness, but by specific acts. For instance, the sheer scale of the murder; even Confederates would not happily characterize themselves as mass murderers, and it strains credulity to call Victoria a state that does anything but. The ethnic cleansing, the enslavement, the savagery in battle, the utter disregard for women's rights- the Confederacy can find a government that'll filter that for their public. They won't even have to really strain for it. But the fact that Victoria is so gleefully, eagerly destructive to the very notion of American civilization is not something any sane government on the continent can tolerate. To a returned Confederacy, Victoria is a snake on their shoulder. It seems to like them, but at any moment it could strike at them.

So, y'know, same spirit as what you had, but be specific with it. They object to very little of what Victoria does, but that still leaves a lot.
 
victoria dropped into a world where they had such crushing technological advantage would probably collapse. They would go on a conquest spree and expand like mad, but they are exactly the wrong kind of nation to not fall apart under rapid expansion and lots of clever desperate spies looking for ways to chip away at their advantages, and having to patch holes in their supply chain and technological base.
 
random_npc said:
victoria dropped into a world where they had such crushing technological advantage would probably collapse. They would go on a conquest spree and expand like mad, but they are exactly the wrong kind of nation to not fall apart under rapid expansion and lots of clever desperate spies looking for ways to chip away at their advantages, and having to patch holes in their supply chain and technological base.
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I meant how the USA would react to the Future, like the Quest Idea said.

Speaking of witch how would the FOUNDING FATHERS react to america, and would Russia try killing them all.
 
Cyberphilosipher said:
That would be the first responce...also manafest destany would be aproved for once.

So Founding fathers how would Victoria react, and How would they react?
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Poorly, on both ends? Victoria would die, though. Most of their military would be gone along with their best ports and most of their loyal population. Canada is suppression town for them and when only Canada was left things'd get messy in a hurry.
 
PoptartProdigy said:
Poorly, on both ends? Victoria would die, though. Most of their military would be gone along with their best ports and most of their loyal population. Canada is suppression town for them and when only Canada was left things'd get messy in a hurry.
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Thanks...also would the Founding Fathers reaction to everyone be hilarious sad, and would people up and actually worship them.
 
Cyberphilosipher said:
Thanks...also would the Founding Fathers reaction to everyone be hilarious sad, and would people up and actually worship them.
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I mean, bear in mind that a good portion of the Founding Fathers themselves would be a little curious on the topic of why slavery wasn't kosher anymore. So hilarious in the sense that they'd have intense reactions, certainly.

Some people would start. Fewer people would continue.

Now, though, let's focus on the quest we have.
 
PoptartProdigy said:
I mean, bear in mind that a good portion of the Founding Fathers themselves would be a little curious on the topic of why slavery wasn't kosher anymore. So hilarious in the sense that they'd have intense reactions, certainly.

Some people would start. Fewer people would continue.

Now, though, let's focus on the quest we have.
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Okay but one more question on Lore. "How is Liberia doing?"
 
Professor Vesca said:
According to Victorian propaganda, we are all issued hammers and sickles at birth that we are required to keep on our person at all times. We have no architecture, just functional giant concrete blocks. We all speak in thick yet unspecific eastern european accents, are required by law to call each other Comrade, and according to some, Papers Please is always playing in the background.
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Sara Goldblum:

"Also, apparently the central committee has issued me an ushanka and a big bushy beard."
 
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