Threads Of Destiny(Eastern Fantasy, Sequel to Forge of Destiny)

Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
Yeah, but I'll choose the danger that we know isn't going to actively seek our destruction over the one that will absolutely annihilate us if it gets the slightest opening.

If we have to pick our poison, I'll pick the one that's only a matter of dosage and timing, not the one that's actively going to kill you if it gets into you at all.
 
Shu Yue is still present in the battlespace incidentally

So while the danger is extreme, theres still potentially two more elements setting up the coup de grace
 
Yeah I think it's better and easier for Xia Ren to avoid hurting us if we work with her methods. She naturally burns out the dark, meanwhile she's a general used to people fighting alongside her.

Let's not do what SWD expects we'd do.
 
Shu Yue is still present in the battlespace incidentally

So while the danger is extreme, theres still potentially two more elements setting up the coup de grace

Yeah.

More importantly, the Choices we've made have led to this outcome, as have the Choices of others. We need to own that, take responsibility for that. We can't avoid our own culpability at unleashing Xia Ren when SWD's actions and ours have led to this outcome as being the only way out.

Taking responsibility for the bad things you've done is also a part of life.

But even a poison can become medicine when the right dosage and the right time are in kind. That's what we're trying to do here. Because if SWD gets his way, a hell of a lot of people are going to die.
 
I mean at the same time, being a spark in a conflagration, a voice of fire and steel, also feels a little bit off. Ling Qi was, a little exaggeratedly but understandably, horrified when she saw thousands of swords raised in perfect unison, thousands of voices raised without difference or etc, etc.

Becoming part of that chorus, metaphorically, also sounds kinda dangerous to be honest.

...as the text says, it really is a choice of dangers.

We're not one for Unity, but Multitude. Many distinct individuals coming together to accomplish something.

[ ] She would skulk as was her wont, her nature. In the boiling mist and the burning labyrinth, she would be as a shadow, a voice singing unseen.

Let's stick to with our Way, in a battle against Sovereigns in the deep Liminal, where a personality override is one moment of inattention away.
 
None had ever been worthy. Each seeking merely to crack the shell of the last and chosen people, the final stewards of the diviner's legacy. Conquerors and Kin of Beasts!

Thieves and despoilers all, that would taint even the kin, take from them the last vestiges of pride and identity. Still waters deep and cold would bear no more, would drown it all, before surrender. Ten thousand years of history sang in the foundations and the depths, and would not go quiet into the night

Sovereigns really are Ideas taken to logical extremes. This reeks of desperation, arrogance, and copious amounts of seething rage.

I can understand his point of view, but traditions should only be kept if they continue to work.

We're not one for Unity, but Multitude. Many distinct individuals coming together to accomplish something.

It is also time to do our duty as an Artist
8. It is the artist's duty to question. The trickster's role to make fools of the mighty. Hold the mirror to history and tradition, and reveal their absurdities.(Creation, Expression, Truth)

[ ] She would skulk as was her wont, her nature. In the boiling mist and the burning labyrinth, she would be as a shadow, a voice singing unseen.

EDIT: I'm not fully convinced on the soar option, but I've read some good points. I'll wait to hear more, before the vote opens.

[X] She would soar, one spark among the conflagration. Today she was a voice of fire and steel, better to embrace that

Edit pt 2: I've been convinced. We need more methods for destruction rather than choosing. Traditions can be the Glue that binds communities together, but it too can be a Chain that prevents any meaningful progress and lead to stagnation.
 
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Really hard to [COMMUNICATE] if you're doing your best to avoid being noticed too. There's a time for subtlety, while you're trying to learn about who you're trying to speak to, but there's also a time to own your actions, we are firmly in the latter case right now.
 
I feel like the vote is not about the optimal path to survival and I don't see any indication one path is particularly safer than another.

The focus is about which philosophical ideas is LQ taking away from this. Is she an unseen singer, subtly influencing the society and its rules in the shadows or a voice of a revolutionary, boldly defaming traditions and establishing new rules?
 
Hmm, it really feels like a choice of whether we want to stick to our Way and risk danger now, or not risk danger but possibly have an effect on Way.

[ ] She would skulk as was her wont, her nature. In the boiling mist and the burning labyrinth, she would be as a shadow, a voice singing unseen.
 
I think the first one still might be the better choice... but, like.

I do think we need to her danger rating up a few degrees based on what we've seen. Not danger in power, that was never in doubt, but danger in the sense of, "Holy shit, this is basically just proto-fascism." Like, it's remarkable that Ling Qi has managed to accomodate herself to her as well as she has, because the differences in their Ways seem only to grow starker the closer one looks.
 
Gotta agree with Mr. Kittens, I don't think this is only a "how are we going to survive" question, it's how are we going to shape our understanding of power. Are we in the center of attention demanding that the world hears us, or are we going to stick to the shadows and remain unseen.

To me this boils down to what we see Ling Qi turning into, do we want to be the 100% secret spy that does the dirty work for CR like Shu Yue? Or are we going to stand tall and try and COMMUNICATE with whoever needs be, trying to incentivize harmony, like Tsu?

I hope that we can get away from the vision of us in the dark like a rat, we are trough this, we've made it our own and accepted it. Now we're in the Sun and we're going to try to make it so what we went trough never happens again. Sooo, let's go like the Moon in the sky! First option lets go lets gooooo
 
I think the first one still might be the better choice... but, like.

I do think we need to her danger rating up a few degrees based on what we've seen. Not danger in power, that was never in doubt, but danger in the sense of, "Holy shit, this is basically just proto-fascism." Like, it's remarkable that Ling Qi has managed to accomodate herself to her as well as she has, because the differences in their Ways seem only to grow starker the closer one looks.
Same theme of bringing people together but for wildly different reasons?

I might just be talking out of my butt though.
 
i guess the vote informs Ling Qi's mindset about this situation and it probably influences how she will grow from this situation: she did mention a power insight in this chapter after all.

i guess 1. is about openly embracing the fact that she is pushing the progress
while 2. is about how she made this happen from the shadow/background

and honestly, I don't think we should be like jiao, who wanted to be the supporting shadow for someone elses vision.
and currently, we are not: this summit is our vision too. we are pushing it. we are making it happen. If some reactionary tries to prevent it, then yeah, we gonna burn his ass
 
[ ] She would soar, one spark among the conflagration. Today she was a voice of fire and steel, better to embrace that

We need to not be silent in this fight. To challenge this monolith you must be in its presence and not turn away from it. We will not be meek, our Way doesn't stand for meekness
 
If some reactionary tries to prevent it, then yeah, we gonna burn his ass
More like, freeze him to death :V

[X] She would soar, one spark among the conflagration. Today she was a voice of fire and steel, better to embrace that.
 
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[X] She would skulk as was her wont, her nature. In the boiling mist and the burning labyrinth, she would be as a shadow, a voice singing unseen.

This choice is 100% a trap.

If we choose to "soar," we are giving up our individuality, tendencies, and identity. It sounds good but we're throwing ourselves into the Crucible. Xi Ren's whole thing is assimilation (or annihilation) and the soar choice is voluntarily walking into the fire.
Ling Qi is a skulker. This choice is couched to sound unappealing and maybe even cowardly but I think it is embracing and refining our nature. We're about community but as a symphony of individuals, not a homogenous mass of slag like Xia Ren produces.
 
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I think if anything this shows how dangerous it is to become a sovereign based around a certain way and philosophy. If you're not exceedingly careful and fully embrace a certain idea you'll lose all sense of nuance and slide into extremism by default. Nearly any untempered ideology can lead to a dystopian future when taken to its logical conclusion.
 
[ ] She would soar, one spark among the conflagration. Today she was a voice of fire and steel, better to embrace that.

Do as we should have done in the Bloody Moon's trial-stand, and be better when all around you collapses into darkness.
 
[ ] She would skulk as was her wont, her nature. In the boiling mist and the burning labyrinth, she would be as a shadow, a voice singing unseen.
 
[ ] She would soar, one spark among the conflagration. Today she was a voice of fire and steel, better to embrace that.

LQ is more than Skulking.
The time for that is over. She is now engaged in open combat against an anti-skulking expert. LQ repeatedly mentioned how out of her league she is. Let's use the biggest stick we have to hammer down this nail of rage and desperate tradition.

If that mouse adventure in the dream taught me anything. You need to work with titans to influence them. Skulking about in a place where her personality might not even be noticed by the fighting titans makes that difficult.
 
[ ] She would skulk as was her wont, her nature. In the boiling mist and the burning labyrinth, she would be as a shadow, a voice singing unseen.

This choice is 100% a trap.

If we choose to "soar," we are giving up our individuality, tendencies, and identity. It sounds good but we're throwing ourselves into the Crucible. Xi Ren's whole thing is assimilation (or annihilation) and the soar choice is voluntarily walking into the fire.
Ling Qi is a skulker. This choice is couched to sound unappealing and maybe even cowardly but I think it is embracing and refining our nature. We're about community but as a symphony of individuals, not a homogenous mass of slag like Xia Ren produces.

That... is kinda my worry.

[ ] She would soar, one spark among the conflagration. Today she was a voice of fire and steel, better to embrace that.

LQ is more than Skulking.
The time for that is over. She is now engaged in open combat against an anti-skulking expert. LQ repeatedly mentioned how out of her league she is. Let's use the biggest stick we have to hammer down this nail of rage and desperate tradition.

If that mouse adventure in the dream taught me anything. You need to work with titans to influence them. Skulking about in a place where her personality might not even be noticed by the fighting titans makes that difficult.

I'm not sure if the General really is someone we can work with in any but the most immediate term... which is fine in one sense because that's what we're doing now, but doing so around Sovereigns feels like it could have an impact on Ling Qi's Way that's, uh... potentially kinda devastating.

I don't really like either of the options, but one definitely seems to shuck aside individuality more fully.
 
I would make the argument that Ling Qi has never really been 'a voice singing unseen.'

She's undistinguishable, unpredictable and weird, someone full of surprises and refuses to things you would expect, but she has never really gone unnoticed. The closest is when she is a thief, but her thefts are great, grand things that have immediate and noticeable impacts that are clearly the result of her choices.

The girl who somehow got a recommendation form Sima Jiao of all people? It was Ling Qi.

Yan Renshu's entire operation collapsing under one night? Yeah that was Ling Qi.

That giant snow storm because the Cyan spirit atop the mountain was disturbed? Ling Qi again.

The three villages saved from Cloud Tribe depredations in the opening movements of the war? Ling Qi.

The person who spoke to and received invitation from foreign barbarians? Ling Qi.

The one who went to the frozen bottom of the world and has brokered a truce with people as strong as the Empire? Do I need to say it?

Ling Qi uses stealth as a tool, but even then she has never gone unseen.

Edit: and let's not forget the whole ass city she saved from an ith'ia attack.
 
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Ling Qi has been at the center all through the Summit.
Skulking at the end seems counter to theme?

Its trying really hard to sell that "this is who you really are", but is she not the voice calling for change through the entire event here?
 
She had thought long on the nature of power of what it meant, what wielding it was for.

She knew now that she had the core of it right in the beginning.

Power was change. Power was resisting change. All boiled down to that. Power was the exertion of your will upon the world, of making your beliefs reality, of making them matter.

The wisest philosopher's wisdom was nothing if it did not reach ears that could take up their cause. The most diligent ruler's reforms were nothing without the power to enforce them.

…That was what she had done. What her songs did. She sang, and sometimes, the world listened. Small as she was meager as her personal power was…

She had wrought this, without her, a titan, a Sovereign, would not be screaming.

Power did not have to come from within. Winter was not one voice, one single thing, but the movements of countless forces in unison wrought by the turning of the world, set in motion by voices long, long gone.

How many of those voices had been forgotten, mighty or not?

Ling Qi rose from the boiling muck like a flickering star as the firmament exploded under her feet, a thousand thousand roots and filaments of power reaching to strangle her, touching her, leaving welts and tears upon her skin before they burned to ash and seared her too in doing.

Yeah, I think this vote is about Power and the direction we want to take FFS, just like how we voted on the direction we'd take SNR.

Looking at the text, there's an interrogation of Power here. Specifically, these lines here.

Power did not have to come from within. Winter was not one voice, one single thing, but the movements of countless forces in unison wrought by the turning of the world, set in motion by voices long, long gone.

How many of those voices had been forgotten, mighty or not?

Winter (Endings and Change) aren't one singular thing, the power of one person. It's rather the effects of many different things coming together to change the world, set by people of power long gone. So, looking at the options, I think we're either going to focus on the mighty or the not mighty. With soaring high, we'll focus on the power of the mighty and soar high in the sky, and be a voice leading. Or we'll be one of the not-mighty, still working to drive change on the ground no matter the meagre effect we have.

Based on our talk with Jiao before the summit and our focus on Community and the little people on the ground, I think focusing on Power as one of the little people would work best. Plus, I feel like the best way to resolve our issues of Sovereignty and enforcing our Way on people is by being the person whom we fear we'll affect.

But without understanding power and why you wield it, there can only be brittleness and self deception. Seek the Want, the black lightless darkness from which all else emanates, and understand yourself.

And since Winter's Crown talks about better understanding oneself, I would prefer to go with the option that doesn't unify us with someone else.

[ ] She would skulk as was her wont, her nature. In the boiling mist and the burning labyrinth, she would be as a shadow, a voice singing unseen.
 
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