EternalObserver
eYe Gaze baCk
- Location
- The Void
Okay yeah, I'm sorry but I cannot agree to that. I'm open to listening to many things, but ditching Cold is one that I'm never agreeing on.
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Threads Of Destiny(Eastern Fantasy, Sequel to Forge of Destiny)
- Thread starter yrsillar
- Start date
- Original Users' Choice!
Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
It is not just about damage. It is about how LQ is shown. Like how things get deathly cold and wintery when she gets mad or releases her power, how her dantian looks. Her winter/cold/ice thing is deeply intergrained in both her outward and inward presentation that trying to remove it would shit on her aesthetics.
- Location
- California
Ok but, like, why? What reason do we have to want to change away from Cold when we have such history with it?
dpara
slightly confused ascendant
That part can (and should) stay, cold is what LQ is but I don't think "better elemental cold" is what LQ should work toward.
super simple I want FSS+ to not be
"I freeze you to death by making it really really cold"
and instead be
"Your own hypocrisy/lies/contradictions doom you to death/stagnation"
Or to quote Zeqing "What is mere physical discomfort beside humiliation."
(sry again for making you think I want my FSS+ plans to be about growth, I mean it kinda is if you survive/can counter it and removing cold from her entirely (which is a rather valid read))
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dpara
slightly confused ascendant
Then we are weak against them and probably loose.*
But imagine. A well adjusted high realm cultivator.
Preposterous.
Maybe hypocritical/contradictory** are not right vectors, maybe "Where do you/the world end up if all your wants are satisfied?"
I admit with FSS+ I have rather a direction than a specific target.
(*As a member on a website dedicated to the optimization of weapon systems I know I have to consciously stop myself but I think having clear weaknesses is good for tension/action scenes/storytelling in general)
(**I chose those words because of our last insight)
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dpara
slightly confused ascendant
Ice spirits presumably evolve from "it's cold" to dropping you in a dreamworld where all your dreams come true (while you "freeze" to death), so we are not really diverging from legacy there.
I reiterate the visual theme of LQ can stay the same, but I want FSS+ to kill you with your wants/dreams/dreamflakes/argl and not "my ice beam is level 100".
Yes I explicitly want weaknesses, a high degree of specialization should produce situations it is not applicable to, I do not want to decide a fight by power levels alone.
Think of the problems with Superman/Dragonball-Z fight scenes.
- Location
- Finland
I feel that you are doing a severe disservice to the story by saying that the fights are (or would be if we don't do as you say) by power level alone.
Not seeing any evidence that ice spirits, evolve, to become somekind of dreamworld creators, instead of it just being an outgrowth of anything really powerful creating a subjective reality around them.
We do the same thing already, Zeqing did the same thing, there is no need to drop our core element to be able to do that.
Not seeing any evidence that ice spirits, evolve, to become somekind of dreamworld creators, instead of it just being an outgrowth of anything really powerful creating a subjective reality around them.
We do the same thing already, Zeqing did the same thing, there is no need to drop our core element to be able to do that.
dpara
slightly confused ascendant
Combat stealth was dropped because it would trivialise combat scenes too much due to "stealth power level".
The stealth drain tank meta is powerful but, I daresay, does not make yrs life easier.
We make decisions that make it easier and harder to write combat scenes, "having enemies you can't meaningfully hurt" is a weakness we already have just gated by "power level"/raw cultivation.
Defeating enemies by engaging with them/trying to find their weakpoints/story will probably more interesting to read (and write) than (I overstate) "can attack overcome armor art", there is just more room for interaction.
Zheqin and the Caldera spirit both could have just "you're a cold corpsicle now" but instead dropped us into dream/nightmare-worlds, it made for good scenes and I think we should focus FSS+ on doing that.
The stealth drain tank meta is powerful but, I daresay, does not make yrs life easier.
We make decisions that make it easier and harder to write combat scenes, "having enemies you can't meaningfully hurt" is a weakness we already have just gated by "power level"/raw cultivation.
Defeating enemies by engaging with them/trying to find their weakpoints/story will probably more interesting to read (and write) than (I overstate) "can attack overcome armor art", there is just more room for interaction.
Zheqin and the Caldera spirit both could have just "you're a cold corpsicle now" but instead dropped us into dream/nightmare-worlds, it made for good scenes and I think we should focus FSS+ on doing that.
- Location
- FR
- Pronouns
- He/Him
That's because they both had in common the "slow hypothermia causing hallucination" theme, that LQ explicitly doesn't have. That was the other art Zeqing proposed to teach us, and we chose frozen soul serenade instead. hanyi's the one using it regularly.
Cold isn't going anywhere, because it's integral to LQ's understanding of Endings. Any FSS+ concept that doesn't start with the concepts enshrined in the FSS insight (Endings, Beginnings, Cycles) is an automatic failure.
I've said it before, I'll say it again, FSS+ isn't going to be FSS but Bigger, Colder and Endier, and the thread would do well to keep that in mind. The nature of the insight simply doesn't allow for that, because it was a rejection of the original FSS.
I've said it before, I'll say it again, FSS+ isn't going to be FSS but Bigger, Colder and Endier, and the thread would do well to keep that in mind. The nature of the insight simply doesn't allow for that, because it was a rejection of the original FSS.
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- Location
- Rivendell
Cold is related to entropy, isolation, and endings, which are related to motion, freedom and cycles, which are pretty much all core concepts at this point. Like, dream is great, and I get wanting to do more with dream, but cold is just so important to our cultivation. I would say that learning FSS was the point where Ling Qi moved beyond just being another new talent and really became a threat.
Reflections in the Wasteland
Lady_Story
Humble Teller of Stories, Villainess of Legend
- Pronouns
- She/Her/They/Them
Reflections in the Wastelands - an omake
Ling Qi stared out at the vast expanse of badlands before her.
Sickly spirits and irradiated zombies shambled amongst ruins of ancient buildings in droves. Beasts with glowing fur and… what could only be described as fleshy mutations, stalked the shadows.
There was also the occasional creature that stood out. Fleshy amalgamations of beasts and spirits that left corruption in their wake. It was those the Ling Qi disliked the most.
It wasn't all doom and gloom here though, despite how far they'd come into these scarred lands. From her perch on the cliff, she saw what lay around and beyond the former settlement. It was a comfortingly familiar sight.
Sand, as she'd come to accept, wasn't all that much different from the drier types of snow. They both blew in the wind, each grain drifting around endlessly until it was buried beneath others. Grains that were like the choices made in the past, stuck in place forever as the others yet to be determined wandered.
To most, the endless hum of the wind blowing over the sparse plants and cracked earth was mindlessly droning. A small facet of the utterly alien environment they'd found themselves in. Ling Qi thought otherwise.
Every dead bush had a slightly different sound, every pit of sand its own shape. Though it didn't seem to amount to much for most, the sounds produced by shifts in the wind told a tale. A tale of a land from before the Cataclysm when life thrived here as it did in the Emerald Seas.
It was also a mournful tale of the fall that had come. Of the massive scale of death and destruction wreaked in the Twilight King's wake. But that was only another part of the whole.
Taking it all in, the truth of the Golden Field's story unfolded itself before her. It was one of sadness, of hard-fought battles and blood-drenched earth. One that was beginning to change. Spirits it would take years but before they met their End they would reclaim as much ground as they could.
Two pairs of footsteps— one pair soft and quick, the other long and unhurried— stirred Ling Qi from her musings on the state of the Golden Fields.
The quiet pattering of footsteps too small to understand the gravity of this mess quickly grew louder. Stretching her arm out, the pattering turned into a skid, a gasp escaping Gu Xifeng's lips. They may not have been at the edge of the cliff, but Ling Qi wasn't certain how much she trusted the steal artifacts they were wearing.
She glanced down toward her daughter. Xifeng's expression was one of shock, with hints of fear beginning to leak in. Mixed emotions churned deep within her, but Ling Qi didn't feel the need to say anything just yet.
Today they would not go into settlement and fight. This was a lesson meant to be instilled, one that they'd failed to do properly before and ended up paying dearly for.
It'd been a long time since the bitter memories welled up within her unbidden. They'd broken her before, more than once. She was stronger now though, and though she could accept her sorrow, she would not let it dominate her.
A moment later the slower footsteps joined them. Ling Qi glanced to the side, and offered a sad smile to the one who she fought through it all with.
Xiulan had aged a bit since they'd first met. Her fiery spirit was brighter than ever, though far more controlled now, the passion clear in her eyes. Her light blue scar was faintly glowing, a quirk that Ling Qi had come to recognize as her lover being prepared for a fight.
They would not make the same mistake again.
"Why are there so many monsters here," her too young daughter asked quietly, the fear thick in her voice.
Xifeng would be turning thirteen this year. It was, in Ling Qi's opinion, still too early for her to be faced with the terrible reality of the Golden Fields' lands. It couldn't be put off forever, but even so, she deserved to enjoy her childhood innocence.
She couldn't help but reluctantly give into Xiulan when she'd argued for this though. They'd lost their last daughter because of their recklessness, and they could not afford to lose another.
She stayed silent, letting Xiulan speak instead.
"This place was once a town full of thousands of people," Xiulan said quietly, pausing to let their daughter think, as she'd started to do. She'd joked about it once, played it off as following in her father's footsteps. "It had started off small, and grew larger over time thanks to the fields and trade."
She didn't finish, instead letting their daughter have the chance to ask questions. Another hard lesson learned.
A gentle hand intertwined with hers, hidden beneath their sleeves as they awaited the difficult questions to come. This time, they would not shelter their daughter too much.
If you all want more of this let me know. I've got quite a few things going on but I wouldn't mind sparing some time to continue running with this idea. I'd probably go back to around when LQ leaves the sect and slowly work my way from there though. I have a whole chart outline of what to do because aaaaaa I love the idea of Xiulan and Ling Qi dating so much eheheheh.
Ling Qi stared out at the vast expanse of badlands before her.
Sickly spirits and irradiated zombies shambled amongst ruins of ancient buildings in droves. Beasts with glowing fur and… what could only be described as fleshy mutations, stalked the shadows.
There was also the occasional creature that stood out. Fleshy amalgamations of beasts and spirits that left corruption in their wake. It was those the Ling Qi disliked the most.
It wasn't all doom and gloom here though, despite how far they'd come into these scarred lands. From her perch on the cliff, she saw what lay around and beyond the former settlement. It was a comfortingly familiar sight.
Sand, as she'd come to accept, wasn't all that much different from the drier types of snow. They both blew in the wind, each grain drifting around endlessly until it was buried beneath others. Grains that were like the choices made in the past, stuck in place forever as the others yet to be determined wandered.
To most, the endless hum of the wind blowing over the sparse plants and cracked earth was mindlessly droning. A small facet of the utterly alien environment they'd found themselves in. Ling Qi thought otherwise.
Every dead bush had a slightly different sound, every pit of sand its own shape. Though it didn't seem to amount to much for most, the sounds produced by shifts in the wind told a tale. A tale of a land from before the Cataclysm when life thrived here as it did in the Emerald Seas.
It was also a mournful tale of the fall that had come. Of the massive scale of death and destruction wreaked in the Twilight King's wake. But that was only another part of the whole.
Taking it all in, the truth of the Golden Field's story unfolded itself before her. It was one of sadness, of hard-fought battles and blood-drenched earth. One that was beginning to change. Spirits it would take years but before they met their End they would reclaim as much ground as they could.
Two pairs of footsteps— one pair soft and quick, the other long and unhurried— stirred Ling Qi from her musings on the state of the Golden Fields.
The quiet pattering of footsteps too small to understand the gravity of this mess quickly grew louder. Stretching her arm out, the pattering turned into a skid, a gasp escaping Gu Xifeng's lips. They may not have been at the edge of the cliff, but Ling Qi wasn't certain how much she trusted the steal artifacts they were wearing.
She glanced down toward her daughter. Xifeng's expression was one of shock, with hints of fear beginning to leak in. Mixed emotions churned deep within her, but Ling Qi didn't feel the need to say anything just yet.
Today they would not go into settlement and fight. This was a lesson meant to be instilled, one that they'd failed to do properly before and ended up paying dearly for.
It'd been a long time since the bitter memories welled up within her unbidden. They'd broken her before, more than once. She was stronger now though, and though she could accept her sorrow, she would not let it dominate her.
A moment later the slower footsteps joined them. Ling Qi glanced to the side, and offered a sad smile to the one who she fought through it all with.
Xiulan had aged a bit since they'd first met. Her fiery spirit was brighter than ever, though far more controlled now, the passion clear in her eyes. Her light blue scar was faintly glowing, a quirk that Ling Qi had come to recognize as her lover being prepared for a fight.
They would not make the same mistake again.
"Why are there so many monsters here," her too young daughter asked quietly, the fear thick in her voice.
Xifeng would be turning thirteen this year. It was, in Ling Qi's opinion, still too early for her to be faced with the terrible reality of the Golden Fields' lands. It couldn't be put off forever, but even so, she deserved to enjoy her childhood innocence.
She couldn't help but reluctantly give into Xiulan when she'd argued for this though. They'd lost their last daughter because of their recklessness, and they could not afford to lose another.
She stayed silent, letting Xiulan speak instead.
"This place was once a town full of thousands of people," Xiulan said quietly, pausing to let their daughter think, as she'd started to do. She'd joked about it once, played it off as following in her father's footsteps. "It had started off small, and grew larger over time thanks to the fields and trade."
She didn't finish, instead letting their daughter have the chance to ask questions. Another hard lesson learned.
A gentle hand intertwined with hers, hidden beneath their sleeves as they awaited the difficult questions to come. This time, they would not shelter their daughter too much.
- Ling Qi and Gu Xiulan are approximately 225 in this fic and both are late indigo/early violet realm cultivators
- Ling Qi's cultivation is much the same as it was. She's still the dark little snow fairy that dreams.
- Gu Xifeng's name was originally Ling Ruolan but Ruolan is a pretty name and I want to use it in another one of my projects.
- Xifeng means 'Flourishing Phoenix' in Mandarin
- Xifeng has an affinity for mist that self-ignites or is already on fire.
- Xiulan could heal her scars away if she wanted to, but they've become a part of her and she takes pride in them
- Yanmei is the head of the clan, whilst Gu Xiulan and Ling Qi are considered heroes in the east for their tireless work to salvage lands in the scar. This may or may not have to do with the loss of their first daughter because that has consequences.
- Lakegate did happen, but by the time LQ could reconcile her feelings about intimacy Meizhen was already seeing Qingling and things got... messy. As of this fic Meizhen and Ling Qi aren't talking but Meizhen has a girl about the same age as Xifeng's, though a year or two older because yours truly wants chaos.
- Ling Qi was given the potential to become CRX's retainer but things got a bit... messy with Liling and Xiulan butting heads at one point, which thoroughly sunk Ling Qi into wanting to go with Xiulan when she returned home but that's a mess ahaha. They still remain friends via letters and the occasional visits. Ling Qi has provided CRX with a rare treasure or three that are suited to her radiance, whilst Ling Qi has received juniors to bully and assist her and Xiulan in their endless quest against the scar. It's more of an odd give-and-take relationship based on trade with friendship involved.
-
- Ling Qi's cultivation is much the same as it was. She's still the dark little snow fairy that dreams.
- Gu Xifeng's name was originally Ling Ruolan but Ruolan is a pretty name and I want to use it in another one of my projects.
- Xifeng means 'Flourishing Phoenix' in Mandarin
- Xifeng has an affinity for mist that self-ignites or is already on fire.
- Xiulan could heal her scars away if she wanted to, but they've become a part of her and she takes pride in them
- Yanmei is the head of the clan, whilst Gu Xiulan and Ling Qi are considered heroes in the east for their tireless work to salvage lands in the scar. This may or may not have to do with the loss of their first daughter because that has consequences.
- Lakegate did happen, but by the time LQ could reconcile her feelings about intimacy Meizhen was already seeing Qingling and things got... messy. As of this fic Meizhen and Ling Qi aren't talking but Meizhen has a girl about the same age as Xifeng's, though a year or two older because yours truly wants chaos.
- Ling Qi was given the potential to become CRX's retainer but things got a bit... messy with Liling and Xiulan butting heads at one point, which thoroughly sunk Ling Qi into wanting to go with Xiulan when she returned home but that's a mess ahaha. They still remain friends via letters and the occasional visits. Ling Qi has provided CRX with a rare treasure or three that are suited to her radiance, whilst Ling Qi has received juniors to bully and assist her and Xiulan in their endless quest against the scar. It's more of an odd give-and-take relationship based on trade with friendship involved.
-
If you all want more of this let me know. I've got quite a few things going on but I wouldn't mind sparing some time to continue running with this idea. I'd probably go back to around when LQ leaves the sect and slowly work my way from there though. I have a whole chart outline of what to do because aaaaaa I love the idea of Xiulan and Ling Qi dating so much eheheheh.
That was lovely! I'd definitely be interested in more!
Yes. And that's the whole point. She subjects her enemies to the worst things she knows, starving alone in the cold.
The fact she has such a personal relationship with it is what makes it impactful (in a narrative sense) and powerful (in a cultivation sense).
The harshness of Winter is your End. You will be made into a new Beginning. Your flesh, your qi, your soul, your dreams frozen solid and shattered into a hundred shards, seeds for something new - something beyond you. Phantoms catching what you have lost to devour them. In rebirth, something is lost even as new things are begun, or it would merely be continuation. And you, who stand in Ling Qi's path, you agent of the calcified and corrupt powers that be, you who would let children starve for your own vainglory, who would not stir as a thousand evils devour the ones you were supposed to protect? Your End will be for so many a Beginning. Later, we will attend to the growth of new possibilities, the sprigtime, the dreams of something beautiful. But this is the art of a winter storm that tears down the mountain and rips your house to frozen splinters.
- Location
- the internet
She uses Cold, Isolation and Endings as her offensive attack, inflicting that fate onto others. She makes her enemies feel the trauma and loneliness she felt in that stagnating city, the Winter that was privation to her.
However, that's inflicting it onto others, not accepting that fate for herself. She cultivates Motion because motion is freedom to her. Motion, moving forward and progressing has also been a core theme for LQ because that's how she escaped that stagnating city. Her whole shtick is exactly that--the duality between stagnation and progress, Movement and Stillness, living and Ending.
Yrsillar even said on Discord once, when asked about the Stillness keyword in SNR opposing LQ's concepts of Motion and freedom, that she would simply focus on other aspects of the art like Void and Darkness.
- Pronouns
- He/Him
So I've been thinking: we should set out where our fief is on the map. Now, we know three things stated.
- First, it's part of one of the Cai holdings on the southern border.
- Second, in Turn 14: Arc 2-1, Ling Qi states that they took the furthest south region, presumably of whatever viscounty/district this is being carved out of.
- Third, in Arc 2-1 of the following turn, we learn that, of the two Wang roads built for us, one runs north to the Argent Sect, and the other south-east to the Summit location.
Using these facts, and comparing them to the Political Map of the Emerald Seas created by Inferno Vulpix, I present to you my conclusion for the location of the Ling barony:
The southeast salient of the Cai holding to the Argent Peak Sect's left flank meets all the requirements. It is not only the south-most of its region, but further south of the other Cai region to the sect's east. We can reasonably say a road from it would run north towards Argent lands, where elsewhere such a road would have to be described more as going northeast or northwest. And of course, its orientation fits with the road towards the White Sky heading southeast.
All hail our magnificent fief!
EDIT: I've just been informed that it's actually part of newly conquered land not present on the political map. CURSES!
- First, it's part of one of the Cai holdings on the southern border.
- Second, in Turn 14: Arc 2-1, Ling Qi states that they took the furthest south region, presumably of whatever viscounty/district this is being carved out of.
- Third, in Arc 2-1 of the following turn, we learn that, of the two Wang roads built for us, one runs north to the Argent Sect, and the other south-east to the Summit location.
Using these facts, and comparing them to the Political Map of the Emerald Seas created by Inferno Vulpix, I present to you my conclusion for the location of the Ling barony:
The southeast salient of the Cai holding to the Argent Peak Sect's left flank meets all the requirements. It is not only the south-most of its region, but further south of the other Cai region to the sect's east. We can reasonably say a road from it would run north towards Argent lands, where elsewhere such a road would have to be described more as going northeast or northwest. And of course, its orientation fits with the road towards the White Sky heading southeast.
All hail our magnificent fief!
EDIT: I've just been informed that it's actually part of newly conquered land not present on the political map. CURSES!
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- Location
- Colorado
I think we're also neighbors with the Wang, so that could narrow down what as-yet unmarked part of the Wall we're in.So I've been thinking: we should set out where our fief is on the map. Now, we know three things stated.
- First, it's part of one of the Cai holdings on the southern border.
- Second, in Turn 14: Arc 2-1, Ling Qi states that they took the furthest south region, presumably of whatever viscounty/district this is being carved out of.
- Third, in Arc 2-1 of the following turn, we learn that, of the two Wang roads built for us, one runs north to the Argent Sect, and the other south-east to the Summit location.
Using these facts, and comparing them to the Political Map of the Emerald Seas created by Inferno Vulpix, I present to you my conclusion for the location of the Ling barony:
The southeast salient of the Cai holding to the Argent Peak Sect's left flank meets all the requirements. It is not only the south-most of its region, but further south of the other Cai region to the sect's east. We can reasonably say a road from it would run north towards Argent lands, where elsewhere such a road would have to be described more as going northeast or northwest. And of course, its orientation fits with the road towards the White Sky heading southeast.
All hail our magnificent fief!
EDIT: I've just been informed that it's actually part of newly conquered land not present on the political map. CURSES!
- Location
- Washington
IIRC it's part of NEW Cai holdings on the southern border, carved out by the recent campaigns by the argent sect. So, probably actually part of the "emerald seas" as it exists in THAT map.
dpara
slightly confused ascendant
I think I now have the proper metaphor,
A sword cultivator starts out with a sword cultivation art. He evolves it to the Art of Cutting.
He still carries a sword and it is what taught him to cut, but it's perfunctory now to what he is about.
For LQ, just replace sword with Cold and Cutting with <concept of your choice>.
This is why I think dropping Cold from FSS+ or FSS++ is feasible/desirable, it is where she comes from but not the defining part of where she is going.
A sword cultivator starts out with a sword cultivation art. He evolves it to the Art of Cutting.
He still carries a sword and it is what taught him to cut, but it's perfunctory now to what he is about.
For LQ, just replace sword with Cold and Cutting with <concept of your choice>.
This is why I think dropping Cold from FSS+ or FSS++ is feasible/desirable, it is where she comes from but not the defining part of where she is going.
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- Location
- Washington
Everyone agrees it's feasible it just sucks.