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Threads Of Destiny(Eastern Fantasy, Sequel to Forge of Destiny)

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Li Suyin is also likely getting insights from her crafting, while Meizhen is less likely to do so.
As said, she is doing things from a book, not having personal revelations.
Meizhen is a competent cook from a family of competent cooks following family recipies, and using top of the line tools.
Li Suyin is someone trying (and succeeding) to become a 3 michelin star chef using an old frying pan and laddle.

I'd expect someone on the production tract is expected to be trying to build their own tech tree (or atleast reinvent the wheel), because that is how you advance. There's a reason why formations are so personal and non standardized, it's because they have to be.
Yes, students of a single teacher will be similar in style, and will have some level of compatibility with their works, but i would guess that higher you go, less compatible those works become as the cultivators in question get deeper and deeper into their personal insights and ways.
 
Valmond said:
Li Suyin is also likely getting insights from her crafting, while Meizhen is less likely to do so.
As said, she is doing things from a book, not having personal revelations.
Meizhen is a competent cook from a family of competent cooks following family recipies, and using top of the line tools.
Li Suyin is someone trying (and succeeding) to become a 3 michelin star chef using an old frying pan and laddle.

I'd expect someone on the production tract is expected to be trying to build their own tech tree (or atleast reinvent the wheel), because that is how you advance. There's a reason why formations are so personal and non standardized, it's because they have to be.
Yes, students of a single teacher will be similar in style, and will have some level of compatibility with their works, but i would guess that higher you go, less compatible those works become as the cultivators in question get deeper and deeper into their personal insights and ways.
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Oh this is explicit - The Empire relies upon apprentices following the paths of their teacher, because that way the student can maintain the teacher's works after the teacher passes, and its entirely feasible to follow another's Way - thats what basically most Clans and Sects do after all.

Most people trailblazing fail. They never make it anywhere, they just mass produce low value medicinal pills and cultivation drugs for Reds and Yellows. The Red Guardmen and Farmers churn their economy into them.
Most people apprenticing under a teacher or following a Clan's Way tend to achieve reasonable success. They continue the tradition of useful services. However, teachers are picky, they'd choose only those of ability and temperament.

And very rarely, someone trailblazing succeeds, creating a new lineage for people to follow.
 
veekie said:
Oh this is explicit - The Empire relies upon apprentices following the paths of their teacher, because that way the student can maintain the teacher's works after the teacher passes, and its entirely feasible to follow another's Way - thats what basically most Clans and Sects do after all.

Most people trailblazing fail. They never make it anywhere, they just mass produce low value medicinal pills and cultivation drugs for Reds and Yellows. The Red Guardmen and Farmers churn their economy into them.
Most people apprenticing under a teacher or following a Clan's Way tend to achieve reasonable success. They continue the tradition of useful services. However, teachers are picky, they'd choose only those of ability and temperament.

And very rarely, someone trailblazing succeeds, creating a new lineage for people to follow.
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Yes, you need students to keep maintaining someone elses works.
But does it actually mean just maintaining, or constantly remaking, because i could see the works changing over time ship or theseus style until, after few generations, the original maker would not be able to make heads or tails of it.

And, yes, most people don't make it anywhere, they are the ones that remain at red, yellow, or even green. I don't think you can get past green by just following a cookbook in any reasonable time (that said, cookbooks can probably accelerate your progress compared to someone working with nothing but an old frying pan and a laddle).

Anyway, my point was more about how Meizhen, as she is, is probably not really getting insights from her crafting, she does what she knows, and has been thought, but does not really focus on it like Li Suyin, if she did, i have no doubts she would excell at it, but that would take time from combat cultivation.
It's kinda difficult to make a case on how average cultivators do things, because we are surrounded by geniusses, prodigies, or just people with plenty of family priviledge, so lot of what is going on probably seems lot easier than it is.
 
Valmond said:
Yes, you need students to keep maintaining someone elses works.
But does it actually mean just maintaining, or constantly remaking, because i could see the works changing over time ship or theseus style until, after few generations, the original maker would not be able to make heads or tails of it.
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It could be like maintaining code? Like, the Bai could pull out an old war machine they've kept since the dawn of time, turn it on and it would still work 'correctly' in the sense that it would create a poison from the qi of a version of decay that was phased out 5000 years ago and concepts of human anatomy that assume a different configuration of organs than the modern standard, target it using an IFF that became obsolete in the days of the Sage Emperor, and deliver it with fangs that are no longer pointy under the present day's spatial geometry. Physical law changes every time a new Great spirit ascends after all, and there are other civilizations that ascend people occasionally as well as Ling Qi's own.
In practice this would mean constantly remaking it but usually in pretty small ways under realistic timescales unless you want to actively expand its capabilities.
 
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Saidoro said:
It could be like maintaining code? Like, the Bai could pull out an old war machine they've kept since the dawn of time, turn it on and it would still work 'correctly' in the sense that it would create a poison from the qi of a version of decay that was phased out 5000 years ago and concepts of human anatomy that assume a different configuration of organs than the modern standard, target it using an IFF that became obsolete in the days of the Sage Emperor, and deliver it with fangs that are no longer pointy under the present day's spatial geometry. Physical law changes every time a new Great spirit ascends after all, and there are other civilizations that ascend people occasionally as well as Ling Qi's own.
In practice this would mean constantly remaking it but usually in pretty small ways under realistic timescales unless you want to actively expand its capabilities.
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...oh nameless parents this is far, far too accurate.
 
Saidoro said:
It could be like maintaining code? Like, the Bai could pull out an old war machine they've kept since the dawn of time, turn it on and it would still work 'correctly' in the sense that it would create a poison from the qi of a version of decay that was phased out 5000 years ago and concepts of human anatomy that assume a different configuration of organs than the modern standard, target it using an IFF that became obsolete in the days of the Sage Emperor, and deliver it with fangs that are no longer pointy under the present day's spatial geometry. Physical law changes every time a new Great spirit ascends after all, and there are other civilizations that ascend people occasionally as well as Ling Qi's own.
In practice this would mean constantly remaking it but usually in pretty small ways under realistic timescales unless you want to actively expand its capabilities.
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Could be, in some cases?
My understanding was that students of a particular formation master could, to an extent, maintain and replace his formations, and so could their students, and their students, and their students, but with each new generation of artisans, the extent would become less, so eventually you have to just outright replace it.
Where the trailblazer vs follower dichotomy comes handy.
You need those who follow the pathways laid to them to keep stuff working, but you also need the next trailblazing genius who can just redo the thing wholesale eventually.
 
Valmond said:
Could be, in some cases?
My understanding was that students of a particular formation master could, to an extent, maintain and replace his formations, and so could their students, and their students, and their students, but with each new generation of artisans, the extent would become less, so eventually you have to just outright replace it.
Where the trailblazer vs follower dichotomy comes handy.
You need those who follow the pathways laid to them to keep stuff working, but you also need the next trailblazing genius who can just redo the thing wholesale eventually.
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Doesn't degenerate to that extent explicitly.
Heavenly Peaks relies upon a set of city-formations which had been laid down multiple dynasties ago, and the almost loss of inheritance at some point. They're still there, and still maintained

The problem, such as it is, is more to do with adding new things - the population base will only produce so many new craftsmen, of which only a smaller selection are willing and able to continue the inheritance, and in turn the exclusivity gives crafting lineages very real political and economic power, they don't want to spread it too widely lest they lose their privileged position.
Trailblazers actually add to the problem if anything. They further reduce the recruiting pool for more craftsmen, unless their innovation is such that the result supports more prospective cultivators than it consumes to maintain.
 
Faceless said:
I thought they were Not!russia
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Not!Russia isn't connected to Not!Europe as far as we're aware. See the Map. We have southeast Asia to the west with India further thataway, Mongol steppes to the south with Not!Russia on the other side. Japan is to the north with the Xuan and the west is populated though we don't know by whom. This entire continent is China-centric, Not!India isn't connected to the middle-east and Not!Russia is cornered between the others and the south pole. European culture analogies are across the sea to the north while the northwest has Egypt and Africa.
 
dycouza said:
Not!Russia isn't connected to Not!Europe as far as we're aware. See the Map. We have southeast Asia to the west with India further thataway, Mongol steppes to the south with Not!Russia on the other side. Japan is to the north with the Xuan and the west is populated though we don't know by whom. This entire continent is China-centric, Not!India isn't connected to the middle-east and Not!Russia is cornered between the others and the south pole. European culture analogies are across the sea to the north while the northwest has Egypt and Africa.
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Ah, so a usual game of civ
 
It's so weird to see people talking about Russia like a mysterious ice land when all of it that I've grown up with is warmer than fucking England.

...In the summer.

Anyway, my point is, I think unlike a game of Civ, here cultures are actually somewhat matched to climates?
 
Liliet said:
It's so weird to see people talking about Russia like a mysterious ice land when all of it that I've grown up with is warmer than fucking England.

...In the summer.

Anyway, my point is, I think unlike a game of Civ, here cultures are actually somewhat matched to climates?
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Climates are forced into matching the local spirits, and vice versa.
A place where powerful Ice cultivators arose frequently, would tend to be cold, and if it wasn't cold when they started it is now.
 
Elsecaller said:
According to the tutorial making a completely new art is a requirement to reach green 8 so I assume that the ability to make a new one is unlocked in green 7.
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Not neccesarily, as creating succesor art is a requirement for green 6, but you can do it from green 3, not 5(you do need to master that art, though)

Also, we might want to create a succesor art sooner than turn 13, as we dont know how much time will it take to master it, and we cant afford to get stuck. I would even say next turn instead of 13, which might also give us an advantage in the end of the year
 
Blademaster said:
So formation actually. You cant pass to fortification without the quest, but I am pretty sure that you can complete it before getting 8400 xp in formation
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Probably, I suspect the Art Construction bottleneck is the Domain Name Quest. The other caveat of course is that your first self-created Art is Special, in that it has an enormous influence on your Way. So just whipping something out at random is a bad idea.
 
Alectai said:
Probably, I suspect the Art Construction bottleneck is the Domain Name Quest. The other caveat of course is that your first self-created Art is Special, in that it has an enormous influence on your Way. So just whipping something out at random is a bad idea.
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It is your first formal step into being a being of more narrative than flesh after all. The first story sets the path, though it may be subverted, contrasted or built upon, everything will be using that for context.
 
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