Funny you say that.
www.sarna.net

War of the Tripods

War of the Tripods
In the lore this is effectively the ROS covertly testing tech and crushing decent. But if the GM wants to....they could have aliens somewhere in the innersphere laying in wait with Dark age technology at their finger tips.

Based on those Tri-Pod specs, I would love for us to get Plasma Rifle / Cannon and Hyper Laser techs for us, eventually.
 
So uh. Any word on wether we can have the GDL before they end there contract do a series of battle tests on our new and improved MAWLR's? Because i admit i am in Desperate need of witnessing how our shiny, incredibly stompy mechs stand up to an Elite unite like the GDL.

Also this quest has gone Completely without a single description if abig stompy robot fight vs our own impossibly larger stompy robots. Our one chance at seeing that happen was offscreened due to being a pirate battle, and i have been waiting ever since to reveal our God Machines to someone important and seeing there opinion.
 
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So uh. Any word on wether we can have the GDL before they end there contract do a series of battle tests on our new and improved MAWLR's? Because i admit i am in Desperate need of witnessing how our shiny, incredibly stompy mechs stand up to an Elite unite like the GDL.
no , we shouldn't revel that until something major comes along to be worth it ,cause once we lose the element of surprise of a war changing super mech from hell of which no one has a counter for yet we can't get it back , so we will wait until a major war to show it off lest we risk someone getting wise to what the MAWLER really is and getting appropriately prepared which they have time to do so
 
no , we shouldn't revel that until something major comes along to be worth it ,cause once we lose the element of surprise of a war changing super mech from hell of which no one has a counter for yet we can't get it back , so we will wait until a major war to show it off lest we risk someone getting wise to what the MAWLER really is and getting appropriately prepared which they have time to do so

Dude. If people don't know about the MAWLR's it's out of willful ignorance. Helghast isn't a closed system, we have people from across the Outer and Inner Sphere studying at our universities. Purchasing goods from our mega corps, studying our technology.

Hell, one of our Megacorps built a pair of Horuses for the Taurians to help recycle and repair the biosphere of that one junk planet. Those were proper Titan grade constructs, designed for ecological work. Not war.

That alone should have told anyone who bothered to think about it that we have Titan scale constructs.

Refusing to test our MAWLR's when we have the literal Perfect opportunity to do so in controlled circumstances, when they have Literally never been in battle, is a god send.

Seriously! Do you think our Wunderwaffe super walkers will just plow through our enemies with Zero experience in combat? Even simulated experience would be better than the complete Lack that they currently have! Putting them up against the GDL is a Perfect test! And hell, we Need to start moving MAWLR packs to our other worlds. They are literal mobile planetary fortresses, and we have so far Only deployed them to Helghan. They are fuck Huge, take an Ass load of time to move, and Cannot be deployed directly into combat. It could take Hours after transit to get them back up and running properly.

So yeah. I think now, after the 5th War would be the Ideal time to not just reveal our MAWLR's, but actually stRt forward deploying them to defend our planets.
 
Dude. If people don't know about the MAWLR's it's out of willful ignorance. Helghast isn't a closed system, we have people from across the Outer and Inner Sphere studying at our universities. Purchasing goods from our mega corps, studying our technology.

Hell, one of our Megacorps built a pair of Horuses for the Taurians to help recycle and repair the biosphere of that one junk planet. Those were proper Titan grade constructs, designed for ecological work. Not war.

That alone should have told anyone who bothered to think about it that we have Titan scale constructs.

Refusing to test our MAWLR's when we have the literal Perfect opportunity to do so in controlled circumstances, when they have Literally never been in battle, is a god send.

Seriously! Do you think our Wunderwaffe super walkers will just plow through our enemies with Zero experience in combat? Even simulated experience would be better than the complete Lack that they currently have! Putting them up against the GDL is a Perfect test! And hell, we Need to start moving MAWLR packs to our other worlds. They are literal mobile planetary fortresses, and we have so far Only deployed them to Helghan. They are fuck Huge, take an Ass load of time to move, and Cannot be deployed directly into combat. It could take Hours after transit to get them back up and running properly.

So yeah. I think now, after the 5th War would be the Ideal time to not just reveal our MAWLR's, but actually stRt forward deploying them to defend our planets.

With regards to MAWLRs stationed on republic worlds i believe the action is passive. We dont need to spend AP. It's outside HR space that wed need to spend AP to set up supply lines, permission to pass friendly territory, assign escorts in neutral/hostile territory, etc. So no worries on that point i think.
 
well every day It looks more certain that we are going to kick the davions in the teeth better start preparing now.
To be fair, there is a potential path where diplomancy might be able to chart a course forward without the kicking of teeth, but it's... well, RNGesus will need to be very kind for it to work. Like, kinder than just letting the Taurian alt-right pop like a soap bubble kind.

To tl;dr things, the Republic would need to get a) somebody that the protestors will accept as a unifying leader, b) Taurian representatives with actual dealmaking authority and c) Morgan Davion in a room together with Helghan diplomats and hammer together a deal that gives the Taurian Outback[1] a shot at self-determination. Probably a plebiscite of some kind where the Outback worlds choose whether or not they want to stick to the status quo, become a totally new Outback March within the FedSuns, join the Concordat or shove off and become their own new state, enforced by the Republic and maybe somebody else as a neutral observer.

Now LIS, this requires not just an absolutely iron-clad plan but also you'll need to roll multiple criticals in close succession, because even if you don't start a general war with the FedSuns you're probably going to spark a civil war within the FedSuns because Michael Hasek is too much the petty tyrant to let this shit slide even if his son and liege tells him to. But a low-violence solution to the Outback problem is, in theory, doable.


[1] Setting aside that the description suggests that the whole protest movement is endemic to the entire Outback, it's just that things are getting violent in the Taurian Outback because Hasek is a douchebag and the Taurians are obviously stirring the pot.
 
To be fair, there is a potential path where diplomancy might be able to chart a course forward without the kicking of teeth, but it's... well, RNGesus will need to be very kind for it to work. Like, kinder than just letting the Taurian alt-right pop like a soap bubble kind.

To tl;dr things, the Republic would need to get a) somebody that the protestors will accept as a unifying leader, b) Taurian representatives with actual dealmaking authority and c) Morgan Davion in a room together with Helghan diplomats and hammer together a deal that gives the Taurian Outback[1] a shot at self-determination. Probably a plebiscite of some kind where the Outback worlds choose whether or not they want to stick to the status quo, become a totally new Outback March within the FedSuns, join the Concordat or shove off and become their own new state, enforced by the Republic and maybe somebody else as a neutral observer.

Now LIS, this requires not just an absolutely iron-clad plan but also you'll need to roll multiple criticals in close succession, because even if you don't start a general war with the FedSuns you're probably going to spark a civil war within the FedSuns because Michael Hasek is too much the petty tyrant to let this shit slide even if his son and liege tells him to. But a low-violence solution to the Outback problem is, in theory, doable.


[1] Setting aside that the description suggests that the whole protest movement is endemic to the entire Outback, it's just that things are getting violent in the Taurian Outback because Hasek is a douchebag and the Taurians are obviously stirring the pot.

The biggest decisive factor i believe is how the feds react. If they crack down heavily on their "citizens", we might not even get a choice for diplomacy if our citizens' get too riled up about what happens. I do think we might get to see more refugees from the outback either fleeing from the crackdowns or just deciding their homes arent homes anymore.
 
On the bright side have yet to see a moment where the Inner Sphere finally had enough of us and wants to invade Helghan Prime to take our stuff. I say even though the latest update has Helghans managing to steal tons of extremely expensive data and them unable to figure out who it is.
 
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With regards to MAWLRs stationed on republic worlds i believe the action is passive. We dont need to spend AP. It's outside HR space that wed need to spend AP to set up supply lines, permission to pass friendly territory, assign escorts in neutral/hostile territory, etc. So no worries on that point i think.

Is it? We needed to manually assign Colony ships and cruisers, and manually Build both as well as MAWLR's. Without direction i figure the MAWLR's just don't move unless we specify deploying them, given we haven't actually Had anything that could carry them before getting the ROKH's.

Is there an info chart somewhere with the locations of our military units? I know we're pumping out a frankly incredible number of Battlemechs for the Outer Rim, especially since we never had any before coming here, and i would Love to know what our military unit deployment locations are.
 
Is it? We needed to manually assign Colony ships and cruisers, and manually Build both as well as MAWLR's. Without direction i figure the MAWLR's just don't move unless we specify deploying them, given we haven't actually Had anything that could carry them before getting the ROKH's.

Is there an info chart somewhere with the locations of our military units? I know we're pumping out a frankly incredible number of Battlemechs for the Outer Rim, especially since we never had any before coming here, and i would Love to know what our military unit deployment locations are.

I mean for military assets within HR space i believe theyre all passive/automated tho ofc that doesnt mean the bulk of our armies/navies are suddenly on a certain border world if it gets suddenly attacked. But that we have assets automatically spread out to strategic locations/bases and theyll respond automatically in the event of an attack because thats what our military should be doing/planning as par for the course.

Still, I might be wrong on some aspects so safe bet's to clarify with prometheus either here or on discord.
 
Terra Group (Automated):
[X] Water Seeding (Caliban) [Progress: 2/8 Turns]
[Progress: 2/8 turns] → [Progress: 3/8 turns]
This should be 3/6, not 8. The terraforming tech bonus should apply.
--[X] Gene Tailoring [0.25/8]
[Progress: 0.25/8] → + 1 (base research) + 0.2 (20% ORDI Research Agreement) + 0.5 (50% Helm Core Copy) + 2 (25% Major Society Research Bonus) → [Progress: 3.95/8]
Should be 4. Missed the Canopian graduates bonus.
Contact has been made with the Capellan Maskirovka. By all accounts, they've played a large role in stirring up the initial protests and supporting the Republic's efforts, and they have a proposal…
Well we kinda knew they were doing that, but it's nice to have a proposal.
  • Attempt to steal capital lasers succeeds (just barely)
  • Fed Suns was unaware of theft until after the Republic has cleaned up its trail
  • Federated Suns nonetheless increases watchfulness and will likely remain extra alert for additional thefts for a good while yet (a year)
A seccess is a seccess, and since we don't plan to steal anything else the extra security is a non-issue. For us.
  • Lock in Connect FTL Comms To Alphard [Progress: 1/2]
  • WCC FTL Comms Expansion AP goes from 10 to 12
  • Niops agrees to join the WCC (-30,000,000 C-Bills). Completion estimated for 3046.
Hmm, maybe help Niops connect up faster? I really would like that science bonus I'm sure they have.
Reports indicate that local manufacturing capabilities have advanced to the point that they can assist the effort (+1 Progress per turn)
Cappellan industry reconstruction is officially self sustaining! Slow as hell on their own, but they can.
Effect
  • -1,000,000 C-Bills
  • -1 Influence
  • Uptake is currently slow as people favour treatments they're familiar with (barring extreme injuries where the solution is amputation, naturally). It's expected to change over the next year or two as people grow familiar with modern medicine.
That's unfortunate. Really wanted to bring in the whole of New Oslo next turn.
Effect
  • +6,000,000 C-Bills
  • A number of valuable mineral deposits have been discovered across Tiverton and marked for near-term exploitation
I really have enjoyed the transformation of Tiverton from pirate port to clean yet industrializing planet. They've come so far so fast.
Effect
  • Work begins on Highwater's water seeding
You love to see it!
At the direction of the so-called 'Ministry for the Future', the Helghan Republic assembled a host of research teams dedicated to exploring which species could serve as suitable livestock on its namesake homeworld. Composed of the best scientists, agronomists, and behaviourists in the Republic, Helghan researchers began pouring over data covering more than 10,000 alien species; genetic samples and behavioural data provided by friendly governments... for a price. Cloistered in 40 research farms across Helghan, these research teams eliminated thousands of species from their list of suitable candidates for all manner of reasons and advanced hundreds more for the same.
Oh, huh. I completely misunderstood this project. I thought it was about trying to domesticate Helghan wildlife for use in agriculture and ranching, not finding aliens to bring to Helghan. Cool. Unexpected, but cool.
SLDF-grade Neurohelmets are being phased in for MechWarriors and ASF pilots
We've done it! We've saved the necks and backs of all our mechwarriors and ASF jockeys!

So we had a good turn and lots of good set up, can't wait to capitalize on it next turn.
 
Since someone wanted a Rex expy. The Tag, Recon camera and Communications gear in the left arm are meant to approximate an enhanced targeting system, if a Rex sees you their entire lance sees you. The mass production models are intended to be buildable by any ORDI memeber

Mass production models:
Code:
Rex Mass Production (Model A)
Base Tech Level: Standard (IS)
Level          Era
-------------------
Experimental    -
Advanced      3145+
Standard        -
Tech Rating: E/X-X-X-D

Weight: 70 tons
BV: 1,468
Cost: 6,646,433 C-bills

Movement: 4/6
Engine: 280 Fusion
Double Heat Sinks: 10 [20]
Gyro: Standard Gyro

Internal: 107
Armor: 160/217
                     Internal  Armor  
----------------------------------------
Head                        3      9  
Center Torso               22     24  
Center Torso (rear)                7  
Right Torso                15     19  
Right Torso (rear)                 5  
Left Torso                 15     19  
Left Torso (rear)                  5  
Right Arm                  11     15  
Left Arm                   11     15  
Right Leg                  15     21  
Left Leg                   15     21  

Weapons        Loc  Heat
--------------------------
Gauss Rifle    RA     1  
Medium Laser  None    3  
Medium Laser  None    3  
MML 5         None    3  
MML 5         None    3  
Laser AMS      CT     7  
TAG            LA     0  

Ammo                   Loc  Shots
-----------------------------------
Gauss Rifle Ammo [IS]   RA      8
Gauss Rifle Ammo [IS]   RA      8
MML 5 LRM Ammo          LT     24
MML 5 SRM Ammo          RT     20

Equipment                         Loc
---------------------------------------
Recon Camera                       LA
Communications Equipment (1 ton)   LA
Code:
Rex Mass Production (Model B)
Base Tech Level: Standard (IS)
Level          Era
-------------------
Experimental    -
Advanced      3145+
Standard        -
Tech Rating: E/X-X-X-D

Weight: 70 tons
BV: 1,417
Cost: 7,023,833 C-bills

Movement: 4/6
Engine: 280 Fusion
Double Heat Sinks: 10 [20]
Gyro: Standard Gyro

Internal: 107
Armor: 208/217
                     Internal  Armor  
----------------------------------------
Head                        3      9  
Center Torso               22     33  
Center Torso (rear)               10  
Right Torso                15     22  
Right Torso (rear)                 7  
Left Torso                 15     22  
Left Torso (rear)                  7  
Right Arm                  11     21  
Left Arm                   11     21  
Right Leg                  15     28  
Left Leg                   15     28  

Weapons       Loc  Heat
-------------------------
Medium Laser   LT    3  
Medium Laser   RT    3  
MML 5          RT    3  
MML 5          LT    3  
Laser AMS      CT    7  
TAG            LA    0  
LB 10-X AC     RA    2  

Ammo                  Loc  Shots
----------------------------------
MML 5 LRM Ammo         LT     24
MML 5 SRM Ammo         RT     20
LB 10-X AC Ammo        RT     10
LB 10-X Cluster Ammo   RT     10

Equipment                         Loc
---------------------------------------
Recon Camera                       LA
Communications Equipment (1 ton)   LA
CASE                               RT
CASE                               LT
Code:
Rex Mass Production (Model C)
Base Tech Level: Standard (IS)
Level          Era
-------------------
Experimental    -
Advanced      3145+
Standard        -
Tech Rating: E/X-X-X-D

Weight: 70 tons
BV: 1,577
Cost: 6,989,833 C-bills

Movement: 4/6
Engine: 280 Fusion
Double Heat Sinks: 12 [24]
Gyro: Standard Gyro

Internal: 107
Armor: 208/217
                     Internal  Armor  
----------------------------------------
Head                        3      9  
Center Torso               22     33  
Center Torso (rear)               10  
Right Torso                15     22  
Right Torso (rear)                 7  
Left Torso                 15     22  
Left Torso (rear)                  7  
Right Arm                  11     21  
Left Arm                   11     21  
Right Leg                  15     28  
Left Leg                   15     28  

Weapons       Loc  Heat
-------------------------
Medium Laser   LT    3  
Medium Laser   RT    3  
MML 5          RT    3  
MML 5          LT    3  
Laser AMS      CT    7  
TAG            LA    0  
PPC            RA   10  
PPC            RA   10  

Ammo            Loc  Shots
----------------------------
MML 5 LRM Ammo   LT     24
MML 5 SRM Ammo   RT     20

Equipment                         Loc
---------------------------------------
Recon Camera                       LA
Communications Equipment (1 ton)   LA
CASE                               RT
CASE                               LT
Helghan Army Model Standard:
Code:
Rex Helghan Army Model Standard (model D)
Base Tech Level: Standard (IS)
Level          Era
-------------------
Experimental    -
Advanced      3145+
Standard        -
Tech Rating: E/X-X-X-D

Weight: 70 tons
BV: 1,606
Cost: 7,337,483 C-bills

Movement: 4/6
Engine: 280 Fusion
Double Heat Sinks: 10 [20]
Gyro: Standard Gyro

Internal: 107 (Endo-Steel)
Armor: 160/217
                     Internal  Armor  
----------------------------------------
Head                        3      9  
Center Torso               22     24  
Center Torso (rear)                7  
Right Torso                15     19  
Right Torso (rear)                 5  
Left Torso                 15     19  
Left Torso (rear)                  5  
Right Arm                  11     15  
Left Arm                   11     15  
Right Leg                  15     21  
Left Leg                   15     21  

Weapons       Loc  Heat
-------------------------
Medium Laser   LT    3  
Medium Laser   RT    3  
MML 5          RT    3  
MML 5          LT    3  
Laser AMS      CT    7  
TAG            LA    0  
Gauss Rifle    RA    1  
Small Laser    LT    1  
Small Laser    RT    1  

Ammo                   Loc  Shots
-----------------------------------
MML 5 LRM Ammo          LT     24
MML 5 SRM Ammo          RT     20
Gauss Rifle Ammo [IS]   RA      8
Gauss Rifle Ammo [IS]   RA      8

Equipment                         Loc
---------------------------------------
Recon Camera                       LA
Communications Equipment (1 ton)   LA
CASE                               RT
CASE                               LT
ECM Suite (Guardian)               LA
Helghan Army Elite:
Code:
Rex Helghan Army Model Standard
Base Tech Level: Standard (IS)
Level          Era
-------------------
Experimental    -
Advanced      3145+
Standard        -
Tech Rating: E/X-X-X-D

Weight: 70 tons
BV: 1,465
Cost: 14,011,683 C-bills

Movement: 5/8
Engine: 280 Irradiated Petrusite Reactor
Double Heat Sinks: 11 [22]
Gyro: Standard Gyro

Internal: 107 (Endo-Steel)
Armor: 160/217
                     Internal  Armor  
----------------------------------------
Head                        3      9  
Center Torso               22     24  
Center Torso (rear)                7  
Right Torso                15     19  
Right Torso (rear)                 5  
Left Torso                 15     19  
Left Torso (rear)                  5  
Right Arm                  11     15  
Left Arm                   11     15  
Right Leg                  15     21  
Left Leg                   15     21  

Weapons       Loc  Heat
-------------------------
Medium Laser   LT    3  
Medium Laser   RT    3  
MML 5          LT    3  
MML 5          RT    3  
Laser AMS      CT    7  
TAG            LA    0  
Gauss Rifle    RA    1  
Small Laser    LT    1  
Small Laser    RT    1  

Ammo                   Loc  Shots
-----------------------------------
MML 5 LRM Ammo          LT     24
MML 5 SRM Ammo          RT     20
Gauss Rifle Ammo [IS]   RA      8
Gauss Rifle Ammo [IS]   RA      8

Equipment                         Loc
---------------------------------------
Recon Camera                       LA
Communications Equipment (1 ton)   LA
CASE                               RT
CASE                               LT
ECM Suite (Guardian)               LA
Energy Shield                      RT
as a bonus with us having Star league Nerohelms we can cram our mechwarriors and ASF pilots into Pilot armor. This means it takes an extra 2 damage to headshot one of our mechs and they can better surive ejecting

Code:
Dragoon Pilot Armor
Base Tech Level: Standard (IS)
Level          Era
-------------------
Experimental    -
Advanced        -
Standard      3145+
Tech Rating: E/X-X-X-E

BV: 41
Cost: 1,548,020 C-bills

Movement: 1/1/3

Internal: 4
Armor: 8 BA Standard (Basic)
           Internal  Armor  
------------------------------
Trooper 1         1      2  
Trooper 2         1      2  
Trooper 3         1      2  
Trooper 4         1      2  

Weapons                     Loc   Heat
----------------------------------------
Swarm Mek                  Squad    0  
Attack Swarmed Mek         Squad    0  
Stop Swarm Attack          Squad    0  
Leg Attack                 Squad    0  
Flare Pistol (APM)         Squad    0  
Submachine Gun (APM)       Squad    0  
Machine Gun (Light) (APM)  Squad    0  

Equipment                                      Loc  
-----------------------------------------------------
Fuel Tank (Right arm)                         Squad
Extended Life Support (Body)                  Squad
Power Pack (Body)                             Squad
BA Manipulators [Armored Gloves] (Left arm)   Squad
BA Manipulators [Armored Gloves] (Right arm)  Squad
Anti Personnel Weapon Mount (Left arm)        Squad
Anti Personnel Weapon Mount (Right arm)       Squad
Mission Equipment Storage (35 kg) (Left arm)   Squad
 
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Honestly i am sort of hoping for war with the Feds to be derailed by Myndo doing some super psycho shit with the Draconis Combine.

Admittedly, if there is Anyone who could contain her insanity, it would be the Combine, but this is the bitch who helped found the Word of Balke. So literally anything is possible.



Shit, wait, Is this the quest where she wasn't made Primus and decided to fuck off back to Combine space, leading to Combine taking over there own HPG stations?
 
Honestly i am sort of hoping for war with the Feds to be derailed by Myndo doing some super psycho shit with the Draconis Combine.

Admittedly, if there is Anyone who could contain her insanity, it would be the Combine, but this is the bitch who helped found the Word of Balke. So literally anything is possible.



Shit, wait, Is this the quest where she wasn't made Primus and decided to fuck off back to Combine space, leading to Combine taking over there own HPG stations?
yep
 
While I have difficulty finding the site I originally got the numbers from, I think the FS at this point of the timeline has somewhere in the ballpark of 120-150 RCTs, in total, with their ability to increase those numbers severely limited by their economy and industry. By contrast, we could currently stand up about 77 Armies - or ~770 RCTs' worth - of conventional troops in total before we hit our peacetime recruitment limit of 1% of our population.
You know something I linked that mentioned is supply. We have never fought a war for more then a single turn with out full military might behind it. Not have we truly supplied a massive military for a long time.

If we did somehow raise over 77 armies, if they all went into battle and loses started to mount in terms of parts and ammo, we most likely wont be able to maintain them all for long.

That's out biggest threat, we can slap an enemy across the face, but even at max production we can't maintain that momentum for long as attrition sets in and production falls behind the need for replacement.

Weirdly we end up in the same situations that clans did, even with perfect supply limes, they just can't produce enough material to replace what's lost.

Going to the RCT comparison. 77 armies would cost, in comparison to the other factions, would cost 6,160 rp to maintain...in peacetime. That number increases to an amount that I won't even place here when even 10 are in combat. For comparison, right now each successor state should easily have 2000 rp or more each, baring the cappelans. And each spend roughly 2/3ds of that on military alone.

So you except me to believe that somehow, Helghan alone has enough RP to raise that 77 armies, and then somehow have rp left over to do other projects, and then send out a drawn out protracted campaign?

Now this game works on an AP system so conversion is hard, however I bring this up since RP is the closest metric we have to quantify the Great houses scale of economy without the chaft.

I would do math but, its 11 pm so ill just drop the chart so you can do some math your on the costs of the IS militaries, and of our own. It gets crazy once you start to try and figure out how much Helghan must make in RP per year.

Its a rabbit hole that gets very crazy the higher you go on it.
 
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Technology Gained: Advanced Cybernetics
I can't believe I forgot about this on my first go at this post! Advanced Cybernetics! We can now make cyborg super soldiers!

Or something more beneficial to society as a whole, but that sounds boring.
I think this was the trade-off for a no-AP terraforming ability. They're slower and rule-wise they don't get bonuses. But again im not sure. Ive been asking but nobody's really given me an answer why new tech wont discount terra group progress.
If that was the case it should cost 16, not 8. 8 was the original cost for Water Seeding, which would've then cost 16 for the Terra group to do it. Panner Class cut that in half, so 4, then Ecological Adaptation knocked off another AP, so 3, which is what it's costing to do Highwater. Terra Group takes twice as long, so it should be 6.
 
If that was the case it should cost 16, not 8. 8 was the original cost for Water Seeding, which would've then cost 16 for the Terra group to do it. Panner Class cut that in half, so 4, then Ecological Adaptation knocked off another AP, so 3, which is what it's costing to do Highwater. Terra Group takes twice as long, so it should be 6.
Maybe its because Helghan is so barely habitable that even with our modifers it still takes ages?

Makes me dread how long it would have take without all our new tech.
 
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