Remove ads

The Long Night Part One: Embers in the Dusk: A Planetary Governor Quest (43k) Complete Sequel Up

Investigate the Sea?

  • Yes

    Votes: 593 80.4%

  • No

    Votes: 145 19.6%
  • Total voters
    738
Reader mode
Elder Haman said:
So I think the first thing to ask is how does the rest of the player base feel? Are there any strong feelings about this?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I'm not sure I agree with the one colony per system cap. I would instead suggest that every System is entitled to one colony at a time, and with high council approval they may add more. The council would have to make absolutely sure that the individual system could handle the additional strain. We also might want to add the ability for the Trust as a whole to colonize systems. There may be times where the it makes more sense to make the Trust deal with colonizing important defensive positions. We also might want to leave some room in the wording of the bills so that our future protectorates can colonize, but only enough room so that we can bring it up in the future.
 
Elder Haman said:
So I think the first thing to ask is how does the rest of the player base feel? Are there any strong feelings about this?

That will probably drive how we approach the issue.

The most obvious approach would be to talk to Vanaheim over the break. They are the ones who first raised the issue. They are the ones most invested in the question. We also want to help their first colony on Fjol IV to be successful.

So the straight forward approach would be to talk to Vanaheim during the break. Present all our information on what the rest of the Imperial Trust is thinking. Present our initial draft of proposals that tries to synthesize those feelings into concrete action and see if they want any changes, and if we can achieve a united front on the issue.

Note that Vanaheim appears to not want Independence of colonies, but that the difference between resource colonies and full colonies might provide us a persuasive argument for full colony eventual independence.

We could also discuss other issues with Vanaheim as a sidebar to the main conversation:

Give them some details of the fleet graveyard, and get their thoughts.
Discuss the need for your pilots to get more training, and suggest that Vanaheim is the expert in this area
Discuss the need for an adviser to help with the Administration aspects of the Avernite Shipyards.
Discuss what aid Avernus can give to make the Vanaheim colony on Fjol IV thrive.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

1. For the colony stuff, I think we should mainly include everyone else's concerns and get his modified thoughts based around them. We don't have a first draft yet, exactly. Just some rough ideas. I think the colony proposal thing is going to be handled similarly to the constitution.

2. I think we should include Admiral Freyr in the discussion, as the Security Council's opinion matters a lot on this. Further, when we're discussing the ship graveyard his opinion will matter as he'll have a better understanding of what is needed, specifically in terms of what kind of ships the Imperial Navy needs most at this time and what ship classes he'd most like us to survey to make available for repair.

3. I don't think we need an adviser for the admin aspects of shipyards. Parnell himself isn't an expert administrator, but Freya was pretty well trained in that aspect so her various staff should already be familiar with it. It's more that he just isn't good at admin work. Though @durin could probably expound on this.

Other than that I agree with all of this.
 
drewski346 said:
I'm not sure I agree with the one colony per system cap. I would instead suggest that every System is entitled to one colony at a time, and with high council approval they may add more. The council would have to make absolutely sure that the individual system could handle the additional strain.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

That clause would be easy enough to add

drewski346 said:
We also might want to add the ability for the Trust as a whole to colonize systems. There may be times where the it makes more sense to make the Trust deal with colonizing important defensive positions.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

I think doing something like that would require a vote of the High Council anyway, so I don't think anything currently proposed would prevent that.

drewski346 said:
We also might want to leave some room in the wording of the bills so that our future protectorates can colonize, but only enough room so that we can bring it up in the future.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

I think we should avoid mentioning it at all right now. The xenos protectorate is a sensitive subject, and permitting them to colonize would be very controversial.

We can always bring it up later when it becomes an issue.

Enjou said:
1. For the colony stuff, I think we should mainly include everyone else's concerns and get his modified thoughts based around them. We don't have a first draft yet, exactly. Just some rough ideas. I think the colony proposal thing is going to be handled similarly to the constitution.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

So still present what we have, but as rough ideas not a draft? That's fine by me.

Enjou said:
2. I think we should include Admiral Freyr in the discussion, as the Security Council's opinion matters a lot on this. Further, when we're discussing the ship graveyard his opinion will matter as he'll have a better understanding of what is needed, specifically in terms of what kind of ships the Imperial Navy needs most at this time and what ship classes he'd most like us to survey to make available for repair.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

So you suggest a meeting with both Admiral Freyr and Governor Olaf?
 
Elder Haman said:
So you suggest a meeting with both Admiral Freyr and Governor Olaf?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Yes. While Olaf is a former admiral himself he hasn't been practicing for a long time, and Freyr is more connected with the needs of the Imperial Navy itself since he's at the head of it. Freyr is also a superior Admiral in general, so I would value his opinion more on the matter.
 
Enjou said:
1. For the colony stuff, I think we should mainly include everyone else's concerns and get his modified thoughts based around them. We don't have a first draft yet, exactly. Just some rough ideas. I think the colony proposal thing is going to be handled similarly to the constitution.

2. I think we should include Admiral Freyr in the discussion, as the Security Council's opinion matters a lot on this. Further, when we're discussing the ship graveyard his opinion will matter as he'll have a better understanding of what is needed, specifically in terms of what kind of ships the Imperial Navy needs most at this time and what ship classes he'd most like us to survey to make available for repair.

3. I don't think we need an adviser for the admin aspects of shipyards. Parnell himself isn't an expert administrator, but Freya was pretty well trained in that aspect so her various staff should already be familiar with it. It's more that he just isn't good at admin work. Though @durin could probably expound on this.

Other than that I agree with all of this.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Parnell will have no problems with administering Helheim Void Command as it is now
 
Ok, just based on the stuff that Elder Haman listed that I agreed with, here's the meeting plan.

[X] Arrange a meeting with Governor Olaf and Admiral Freyr. You will discuss a few different subjects.
-[X] Discuss the feedback we got from the other worlds and organizations regarding colonization and hear what they think about the concerns and ideas raised.
--[X] Further, discuss the ideas brought up here.
-[X] Ask if there is anything they think Avernus could help with regarding the colonization of Fjol IV. Given Avernus was able to build up itself as a colony very quickly, we feel that our experience may be relevant.
-[X] Give them details about what has been found out about the ship graveyard thus far and ask for their thoughts regarding possible deals for further collaboration on the repair of wrecks should be handled as well as asking what their thoughts on which ships should be considered high priority to make available for repair.
-[X] Mention that you have evaluated your air force and found it in need of retraining in some areas, and would like to see about getting some of their experts sent to Avernus to help with the retraining.
 
Last edited:
Enjou said:
Ok, just based on the stuff that Elder Haman listed that I agreed with, here's the meeting plan.

[X] Arrange a meeting with Governor Olaf and Admiral Freyr. You will discuss a few different subjects.
-[X] Discuss the feedback we got from the other worlds and organizations regarding colonization and hear what they think about the concerns and ideas raised.
-[X] Ask if there is anything they think Avernus could help with regarding the colonization of Fjol IV. Given Avernus was able to build up itself as a colony very quickly, we feel that our experience may be relevant.
-[X] Give them details about what has been found out about the ship graveyard thus far and ask for their thoughts regarding possible deals for further collaboration on the repair of wrecks should be handled as well as asking what their thoughts on which ships should be considered high priority to make available for repair.
-[X] Mention that you have evaluated your air force and found it in need of retraining in some areas, and would like to see about getting some of their experts sent to Avernus to help with the retraining.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I would suggest having them look over Elder Hamans points as well
 
Enjou said:
Which ones? The ones in his big quote block?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
These ones
1: Thank Svartalfheim for pointing out the possibility of a difference between full and resource colonies. Discuss the suggested differences. Propose that any system containing a human habitable planet must be established as a full colony. Propose that this Council only concern itself with establishing rules for full colonies as we have a series of questions to still answer on resource colonies. Rules for resource colonies (including if they are allowed) will be decided at a future Council after we have answers to the following questions:

a. What level of defenses are acceptable for a resource colony? Must the resource colony be setup so abandonment can occur easily? To what extent can we create resource colonies without overextending the Imperial Trust military? Propose the Security Council be given the task to evaluate these issues and present their findings and recommendations to the Council in ten years.

b. What STCs can be safely extended to a resource colony? Which ones cannot? How will this impact resource production? How viable will the resource colonies be? Propose that the Mechanics be given the task to evaluate these questions, with the assistance of Trust Administorum experts on efficiency. That the findings and recommendations be presented to the Council in ten years.

c. What would be required to protect resource colonies from rebellion threats and Chaotic infiltration? Propose the Inquisition, Ministorum, and representatives from the various Arbites organizations form a committee to review this question, and present their findings and recommendations to the Council in ten years.

d. What if resource colonies want to become full colonies? Some inhospitable and resource extraction planets can become major systems. Look at Nilfheim and Muspelheim. Will there be a method for resource colonies to advance if they prove themselves viable? Will they have the right to petition? Propose that the Governors consider these questions and that we discuss it again in ten years.

e. Point out that we need to know more about the density and distribution of resources in the surrounding systems to help us in evaluating this idea. Method to gain this knowledge to be addressed in a different proposal.

2: Propose that when a system wishes to establish a full colony they must seek initial approval from the Security Council, which shall evaluate both the extent to which it would extend the military resources of the Imperial Trust, and if there are any competing claims by outside powers that could entangle us in conflicts. Security Council decisions are preliminary until the next High Council meeting which will either approve or overrule the Security Council decision. The High Council must always approve the settlement of a system claimed by an outside power prior to colonization efforts beginning. (Point out Fjol IV as an instance where we would support colonization despite being claimed by an outside power - the Dark Eldar - because we'd be fighting them anyway.)

3: Propose that full colonies must have a minimum level of defenses, with STC availability tied to those defense levels. That there are required defense improvements that must happen by a certain number of years after colonization.

4: Propose that each system in the Imperial Trust can sponsor no more than one full colony at a time. However, systems that are uninterested in colonization may trade their sponsorship slot to another system. Or cooperate with another system in a joint settlement of their colony. This will prevent us from becoming overextended and limit us to nine full colonies at most at one time. It also provides incentives for colonizers to help their colonies achieve independence.

5: Propose that full colonies have protections: maximum taxation rate, a minimum portion of a colony's taxes that must be spent on it, a local government drawn from local residents, and right to petition the High Council (by the local government).

6: Propose that full colonies shall be established with the expectation of independence within one hundred years, at which point they will gain a seat on the Low Council. However, a favorable long term trade agreement may be established between the colony and colonizer, that can extend for no longer than 100 years after independence. If a colony has not achieved independence within one hundred years of its founding, it may petition the High Council to be moved from the colonizer's control and be directly administered by the Imperial Trust instead. In such cases the Trust will act to improve the colony to full independence as soon as possible.

7: Propose that full colonies must have at least one secondary sponsor (selected by the primary sponsor with agreement by the secondary), who, if the primary sponsor is cut off by warp storm, will take on responsibility for the defense and maintenance of the colony. If all the sponsors are cut off, then the Imperial Trust shall appoint a temporary sponsor until such time as the original sponsors are available.

8: Propose that over the next ten years, each system begin an initial exploration of their nearby systems for an assessment of resources and ease of colonization. And to establish Imperial Trust claims prior to the collapse of the Warp Storm. With aid by the Imperial Trust Navy to systems proportionate to the size of their system navy (offering more help to those with smaller fleets). Information gained to be shared at the next Council in ten years, when we assess the feasibility of resource colonies. Any current information (based on old records or more recent Navy scouting) to be shared with all Trust members at the conclusion of this Council so as to allow more efficient exploration over the next ten years.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
 
What do you guys think about having colony worlds send their resource tithes to it's parent world instead of the trust, then after it gains it's low council seat it starts sending to the trust as normal?
 
Riggnarock said:
What do you guys think about having colony worlds send their resource tithes to it's parent world instead of the trust, then after it gains it's low council seat it starts sending to the trust as normal?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
drewski346 said:
Would the resources taken from the colony be tithe exempt? If not it really make zero difference.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Colonies might have lowered tithes in the first few years, and before independence trade tithes might be exempted fully when it's between the parent world and the colony.
 
Enjou said:
Ok, just based on the stuff that Elder Haman listed that I agreed with, here's the meeting plan.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Looks good. I'll post the same thing (just going add in a couple spoilers to collect information in an easy to read place to make it easier on durin).

Riggnarock said:
What do you guys think about having colony worlds send their resource tithes to it's parent world instead of the trust, then after it gains it's low council seat it starts sending to the trust as normal?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Sounds sensible for resource colonies. Not so sure about full colonies.

Enjou said:
Colonies might have lowered tithes in the first few years, and before independence trade tithes might be exempted fully when it's between the parent world and the colony.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

That sounds sensible.
 
[X] Arrange a meeting with Governor Olaf and Admiral Freyr. You will discuss a few different subjects.
-[X] Discuss the feedback we got from the other worlds and organizations regarding colonization and hear what they think about the concerns and ideas raised.
durin said:
The main concern of Midgard about colonisation is that each colony will be another location that needs to be defended. From what you can gather they would prefer there to be minimum levels of military forces and static defences that you need to build a colony with and that a colony must have after certain periods of time.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

durin said:
The main concern of Muspelheim is that there be some method for a colony to gain independence from the planet that colonised it over time and gain a seat on the Low Council and even the High Council given enough time. This combined with several oversights to prevent colonies being overly exploited should prove to be enough to prevent colonies from growing to resent their motherworld or the Imperial Trust and becoming rebellious.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

durin said:
Governor Garp of Jotunheim believes that each colony should be the responsibility of the coloniser, with them having near total control but being required to follow a set of laws put into place by the Imperial Trust. This would provide the Nine Worlds with major incentive to heavily invest in their colonies while providing checks on the powers of the coloniser.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

durin said:
Like Governor Garp the view of Vanaheim is that the coloniser should maintain control over the colony with the Imperial Trust providing limits on the power of the coloniser. Some of the limits that are suggested is a maximum taxation rate, a minimum portion of a colony's taxes that must be spent on it and some method for colonists to complain to the Imperial trust and be heard.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

durin said:
Lord Marshal Sigurd of the Aesir proposes a feudal model in which each colony would be independent but subordinate to the coloniser and would give up its independence and tax in exchange for protection and other aid. While this may seem a bit primitive the feudal model proved to be rather effective in the Imperium and so should not be discounted.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

durin said:
he most simple was King Zaren of Alfheim whose main worry is that there be some mechanism to prevent too many colonies being founded and the Imperial Trust becoming militarily overextended and vulnerable. While at first this seems to be a very simple issue, when you think on it you can see how care will have to be taken to avoid this problem.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

durin said:
The opinion of Svartalfheim is not quite as simple as that of Alfheim. First Artisan Granalf tells your diplomats that he believes that there should be two types of colonies, resource colonies and full colonies. A resource colony exists purely to provide a certain resource to the coloniesr and should be the responsibility of the coloniser. These colonies would be required to be small and to have limited information of the more advanced Imperial Trust technologies to make attacks on them less damaging then attacks on normal colonies, they would usually be on inhospitable worlds with high promethium or metal reserves. Full colonies on the other hand should be able to reach independence from their coloniser within a hundred years of founding. These colonies would be expected to be able to defend themselves from determined attacks, survive long periods cut off from trade, provide military forces to the Imperial Trust and otherwise act as full members of the Imperial Trust. First Artisan Granalf believes that full colonies should be viewed as children of their coloniser and therefore expected to break out on their own after reaching adulthood, though not without maintaining ties of gratitude and kinship to their parents.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

durin said:
Much to your surprise not only does Niflheim actually have an opinion on this matter but your diplomats are able to get it out of Lower Councillor Ulric the Lesser. He tells you that Niflheim is worried that the Nine Worlds will colonise a world that another species or organisation has a claim over and get into a war that we might not be able to win because of it. The solution that he proposes in thoroughly exploring each world for signs of previous habitation and ensure that none of the other local powers have a claim before colonising a world.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

durin said:
While he had trouble determining the opinion of the Security Council on colonisation Inquisitor Klovis-Ultan was unsurprisingly able to give you the current views of the Inquisition and the Mechanicus. He tells you that the Inquisition believes that there has to be some way of the colonies to make their opinion heard, even if it is not agreed with and that otherwise cares little about this issue.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

durin said:
The main concern of the Mechanicus is that each new colony site is carefully chosen so that the most resources are accessible. They also insist that each world have minimum level of defences before they are given access to each level of STCs in order to prevent the Holy STCs falling into the hands of the unworthy.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

durin said:
Inquisitor Klovis-Ultan was able to gather the general opinion of the security council on colonisation this year. He tells you that as expected the main concern of the security council is defence. In particular they believes that each colony must have a minimum level of ground and orbital defences as well as a minimum garrison which can be provided by the coloniser. They also believe that permission should be requested of the Security Council before founding a new colony in order to ensure that it can be properly defended.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
--[X] Further, discuss the ideas brought up here.
-[X] Ask if there is anything they think Avernus could help with regarding the colonization of Fjol IV. Given Avernus was able to build up itself as a colony very quickly, we feel that our experience may be relevant.
-[X] Give them details about what has been found out about the ship graveyard thus far and ask for their thoughts regarding possible deals for further collaboration on the repair of wrecks should be handled as well as asking what their thoughts on which ships should be considered high priority to make available for repair.
-[X] Mention that you have evaluated your air force and found it in need of retraining in some areas, and would like to see about getting some of their experts sent to Avernus to help with the retraining.
 
[X] Arrange a meeting with Governor Olaf and Admiral Freyr. You will discuss a few different subjects.
-[X] Discuss the feedback we got from the other worlds and organizations regarding colonization and hear what they think about the concerns and ideas raised.
--[X] Further, discuss the ideas brought up here.
-[X] Ask if there is anything they think Avernus could help with regarding the colonization of Fjol IV. Given Avernus was able to build up itself as a colony very quickly, we feel that our experience may be relevant.
-[X] Give them details about what has been found out about the ship graveyard thus far and ask for their thoughts regarding possible deals for further collaboration on the repair of wrecks should be handled as well as asking what their thoughts on which ships should be considered high priority to make available for repair.
-[X] Mention that you have evaluated your air force and found it in need of retraining in some areas, and would like to see about getting some of their experts sent to Avernus to help with the retraining.
 
Reader mode
You must login or register to reply here.
Remove ads
Back
Top