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Super Robot Quest G

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The Perseus is a punching Super Robot That can use other weapons like a Missile pod or the sword it comes with. If we want to build a Melee Super Robot than we are probably going to have to design and build one from the ground up. it'd have to be lithe and agile enough to make good use of the Spear while keeping it's enemies at range. The super robots do come with a blade automatically so we don't really have to design one for that ability. It's probably going to be a few in game years before we get to building the Voltron/Megazord 5 combination Super robot form. We just cracked triple combination and Beowulf will be the first Super Robot to do that.

I can see Ichiro doing a triple combination if he is paired correctly. The argonauts on the other hand can't since their chassis are incompatible unless we change it up, Something I am against since their mech forms allow them to do what they do so well. While technically Axiom is the first Triple combination Mech, he's not a Terran but a Kausen or a Makean if you want to get technical and call him by his species name. He is also the reason we can even do the Triple Combination anyway iIRC.

One thing I feel that must be pointed out is that the enemy factions are now starting to cooperate. The Westphalians had Kausen tech when Ichiro fought them at Brest. We know that Sheol has been talking to the Westphalians and might be talking to the Free Brothers. Hence this is why the DFRI needs to better coordinate with the other programs plus any others that we don't know about right now. General Peters hinted that there might be other Super Robot programs out there other than Ground Pound and the DFRI.

As for Mass Production, We already have something like that in the form of the Phalanx and Seeker Formations. they might not be at the level of Super Robots but they are based on our tech. If we want to design a Super Robot for Mass production. It can't have K-tech in them in any way as well as any other tech that is classified.
 
Basarin said:
You say 'less likely to devour all space and time.' That just sounds like lowering standards!

That said I do have a soft spot for mass production models...in a real robot setting. The MP supers always are there seemingly to highlight how unstoppable the next villain escalation is (or part of a conspiracy to end the world).
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Yeah I guess so! Still, liked Arc more than I thought I would. Is a cool machine, neat story around it, good stuff.

And yeah, MP Supers rarely ends well. Even in Mazinger ZERO, all the other machines the various nations made are obiterated by Mycenae like a page after introduction... but that's Mazinger ZERO for ya.
 
Thors_Alumni said:
The Perseus is a punching Super Robot That can use other weapons like a Missile pod or the sword it comes with. it'd have to be lithe and agile enough to make good use of the Spear while keeping it's enemies at range. The super robots do come with a blade automatically so we don't really have to design one for that ability.

The argonauts on the other hand can't since their chassis are incompatible unless we change it up, Something I am against since their mech forms allow them to do what they do so well.
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Again: If Perseus is a puncher, why have we not invested anything into making it punchier instead of giving it weapons that take away from punching time? As-is, he's worse at punching than Beowulf (actually has a dedicated punching finisher) and Banner (whose first resort is punching enemies). No, Perseus is not a punching Super Robot; it's just a Super Robot that can punch. There is a distinct difference; let's compare, say, Black Getter to Gundam Maxwell- Black Getter is a Super Robot that can punch, thanks to the spiked knuckles, but it's basically Getter 1 so it prefers an axe; Gundam Maxwell, on the other hand, is a Super Robot themed after a boxer, and is thus a punching Super Robot.

...Spear needs more agility than sword? Absurd. Spears are, at their core, a linear weapon; the most efficient, and most frequently used both in fiction and history, attack they have is the thrust, aka just shoving the pointy end at the target (which does not require much range of motion). Furthermore, by their very nature of "stick with a knife on the end," they tend to have more reach than any other melee weapon, which mitigates the need for mobility beyond "step beck as the enemy approaches." Swords, on the other hand, are versatile, and thus require versatility from their wielders in turn. You need to be strong enough to pick one up and swing it, while simultaneously being small enough that you don't get in your own way doing so. This is on top of the greater footwork required to avoid getting killed due to the shorter range. Honestly, just looking at the basic natures of the weapons, all I see is that you have their relation 100% backwards.

It's not hard: Swords need you to be able to attack from every conceivable angle to avoid losing effectiveness because there are situations where you will need to swing from any given angle to hit your target. Spears, on the other hand, are designed for one specific attack with minimal movement, and thus you only need enough mobility to aim and push to use them effectively. With that in mind, which requires a more "lithe and agile" design?

Also, to turn your own argument back on you: Perseus is too bulky to fistfight well. Go look at a boxer in real life; see how they generally aren't gigantic musclebound behemoths like certain pro wrestlers we could no doubt name? In addition to weight classes, that's because being too big restricts your movement, which means they can't avoid getting punched, while additionally preventing them from punching correctly.

Argonauts are only combine-incompatible because we haven't specifically upgraded them for it; the Duo have already started talking about doing it, which is sufficient proof that it's at least theoretically possible in my eyes (biggest question being what role Iris will serve in their combined form- I'm betting "shoulder-mounted weapon of some kind" personally, but could buy "backpack" or "the head" or "a helmet"). I'd rather assign Ignatov to that project, obviously, but if the Duo thinks we can do it I don't see why we can't. And before you bring up their chassis swap: I'm arguing under the assumption that they had already made the transfer, or were currently in the process of doing so, or that it was at least scheduled so the Duo would know exactly what robots they're talking about combining.

("How should Perseus fight" is becoming a longwinded, repetitive, and apparently quite controversial topic, so I'm spoilering that part.)
 
Why are we arguing about whether Perseus should use punching or the halberd, like it has to be an exclusive choice for some reason? It's already proved its punch-gun chops in the latest fight as everything it had was steadily whittled away by the acid. And we just made the K-Fang halberd for it* as our first K-Fang produced weapon, we just need to give it a chance to shine and I'm sure it'll be badass in its own way. Giving our Super Robots multiple weapon options just gives Basarin more to work with to make Rule of Cool fight scenes. The Perseus has already established itself as a bruiser that keeps fighting through whatever damage and losses it suffers, so I can easily see it starting its first melee phase with the halberd and shield, then giving just as good with its fists after the enemy manages to finally disarm it and starts the next phase.

*I mean technically it's wieldable by any of our Super Robots. But c'mon, the Perseus is a Phalanx-derived chassis that's already equipped with a shield, what else is more thematically suited for a polearm to go with it?
 
NaanContributor said:
Why are we arguing about whether Perseus should use punching or the halberd, like it has to be an exclusive choice for some reason?
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I have already said that I'm fine with Perseus punching as a last resort. Problem is, everyone else is going so hard on "Perseus should punch stuff" that it gives the impression that they believe he shouldn't wield weapons at all.
 
@Sir Plusse please drop the subject. your not going to convince us to change our minds and vice versa. I do agree that we need a super robot that can use Melee. I just don't agree with using the Perseus or the other two Super Robots to do it. If we want a Melee Super Robot that uses weapons than we should build it not repurpose our existing super robots to do it.
 
I kinda stepped away from the argument because I didnt trust myself to not escalate it further with how touchy Plusse is with his weird ass hangups.

So yeah, let's leave it on the table until he gets provoked by the Combination Sledders plan when it inevitably gets proposed
 
Thors_Alumni said:
If we want a Melee Super Robot that uses weapons than we should build it not repurpose our existing super robots to do it.
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And what, exactly, would a "purpose-built melee super robot" look like, exactly? But that's beside the point: My big hangup is the idea that Tellison and Zhang would want to fight unarmed if they could avoid it.

Look, can we at least compromise by giving Perseus weapons so the pilots have the option of using them? That way, if they want or need to fistfight, they will be able to, but if they don't they will have weapons they can use.
 
Plusse literally the only person who ever acted like it was a binary is you. Don't pretend it's some great compromise when you're finally dragged kicking and screaming into what the rest of us wanted in the first place.

Its nakedly dishonest
 
TehChron said:
Plusse literally the only person who ever acted like it was a binary is you. Don't pretend it's some great compromise when you're finally dragged kicking and screaming into what the rest of us wanted in the first place.

Its nakedly dishonest
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I literally said that if you had given the slightest indication that you weren't objecting to giving Perseus weapons I would've shut up a long time ago, so the fact that you didn't say so earlier is on you.

As I said, the whole Jojo comparison and stating that "Perseus was meant to punch" implied that you were arguing for an unarmed-exclusive build, and you did literally nothing to dispel my apparent misunderstanding.
 
I envision something like Vardant from Linebarrels of Iron for a melee Robot. Perseus is too slow, Beowulf is too General, Thunderbolt is too missile oriented, and Seekers are too .... Well small for the Sword loadout I envision.

What if we made the Vardant A Seeker that connected to 4 VMUs for the arms and Legs? Five pilot psychic Theater With K Fang Blades Galore acorss the body. Jets all over for mobility?
 
Sir Plusse said:
I literally said that if you had given the slightest indication that you weren't objecting to giving Perseus weapons I would've shut up a long time ago, so the fact that you didn't say so earlier is on you.
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That presupposes I objected to giving the Perseus weapons in the first place. Which is something that you completely made up on your own?

I'm not going to waste time disproving a negative you threw up to move the goalposts. Especially when you're the one who started the vitriol.
 
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Sir Plusse said:
Look, can we at least compromise by giving Perseus weapons so the pilots have the option of using them? That way, if they want or need to fistfight, they will be able to, but if they don't they will have weapons they can use.
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Perseus does have weapons. It has the Arc Blade which is a sword and it used it quite effectively in its fight with the two crockalisks in Tokyo. Stop suggesting that Perseus doesn't have any.

Now I'll ask you again. please drop this discussion.

Crazyone47 said:
I envision something like Vardant from Linebarrels of Iron for a melee Robot. Perseus is too slow, Beowulf is too General, Thunderbolt is too missile oriented, and Seekers are too .... Well small for the Sword loadout I envision.
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ooh that sounds interesting.

Crazyone47 said:
What if we made the Vardant A Seeker that connected to 4 VMUs for the arms and Legs? Five pilot psychic Theater With K Fang Blades Galore acorss the body. Jets all over for mobility?
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we're not there yet. we've only just cracked triple combination with Beowulf.
 
TehChron said:
That presupposes I objected to giving the Perseus weapons in the first place. Which is something that you completely made up on your own?

I'm not going to waste time disproving a negative you threw up to move the goalposts. Especially when you're the one who started the vitriol.
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You did nothing to disprove my assumption. Isn't that something you're literally obligated to do in every debate- make sure that everyone knows exactly what is being discussed at the time? Thus, isn't this entire argument your fault for refusing to clarify your position instead of doubling down on upgrading Perseus' punchiness at every opportunity?

A simple "I don't mind giving Perseus weapons" would've been enough to stop the whole thing on the spot, or at least defuse it to "weapon focus vs. unarmed focus" difference-of-opinion agree-to-disagree levels. How the hell is it my fault that you never told me what you were actually wanting?

(To be absolutely clear in case you somehow misunderstand that: What I am pissed about now is that you never told me I was mistaken.)

Thors_Alumni said:
Stop suggesting that Perseus doesn't have any.
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Given how the Arc Blade in question was destroyed? No, it does not currently have any weapons- or, at least, it didn't until the spear.
 
Sir Plusse said:
You did nothing to disprove my assumption. Isn't that something you're literally obligated to do in every debate- make sure that everyone knows exactly what is being discussed at the time? Thus, isn't this entire argument your fault for refusing to clarify your position instead of doubling down on upgrading Perseus' punchiness at every opportunity?

A simple "I don't mind giving Perseus weapons" would've been enough to stop the whole thing on the spot, or at least defuse it to "weapon focus vs. unarmed focus" difference-of-opinion agree-to-disagree levels. How the hell is it my fault that you never told me what you were actually wanting?

(To be absolutely clear in case you somehow misunderstand that: What I am pissed about now is that you never told me I was mistaken.)


Given how the Arc Blade in question was destroyed? No, it does not currently have any weapons- or, at least, it didn't until the spear.
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Um. Pretty sure we replaced that as part of the repairs man. Maybe you should calm down a bit? All we're doing is screaming at each other. Same to you, chron - you two are just having a shouting match and getting nowhere. Just cool off until it's relevant, alright?
 
Sir Plusse said:
Given how the Arc Blade in question was destroyed? No, it does not currently have any weapons- or, at least, it didn't until the spear.
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The Arc Blade was not destroyed. the blade part of the Arc Blade was dissolved and snapped off. It's still intact enough to be easily repaired. The blade was brought back with the Perseus and is no doubt being repaired as well. Stop suggesting things that are not true.
 
TehChron said:
It was brought back with that one Kaijus head specifically, wasnt it?
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The head would have dissolved but yes. The hilt was intact when Perseus threw it as a distraction. It's the blade that was dissolved and broken.

I am going to drop this subject. Pluss isn't going to and I am frankly sick of talking about this.
 
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FallenTemplar86 said:
In a High Tech Sword where the actual important components like the battery is located in the hilt? Yeah the blade is disposable.
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Only true if the blade is easily replaceable- as in, plug-and-play easily replaceable. If it's built like a high-tech version of a real-life sword (as in, the blade is permanently affixed to the hilt), destroying the blade means you're left with nothing but a high-tech paperweight.

In such a sword, I expect you'd need to scrap the whole thing and rebuild it in its entirety to properly replace the blade.

TehChron said:
Considering how swords are constructed, a hilt is generally at least 15% sword by raw mass you know.

Balancing matters.
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Must we resort to pedantry to classify a nigh-useless hunk of metal as a sword despite the actual sword part being lost?
 
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