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Springtime of Nations II: A European Republic Quest

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Niksol said:
[x] [X] [FED] We will propose a Danubian Federation and an Illyrian Federation.
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You should eliminate one of the [x], so that your vote is counted properly.

Adhoc vote count started by SilentSpaniard on Jul 23, 2023 at 6:25 AM, finished with 132 posts and 120 votes.
[fed] [x]
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This one is going to be a nailbiter!
 
I think a single federation is a risk worth taking and a necessary step we have to take if we want to have any hope of achieving our long term ambitions.

I think the risk of ethnic and religious tensions tearing the Danubian Federation apart is not as big as some people might worry. Nationalism had less time to fester in the Habsburg Empire and our war saw less of a gradual unwinding of Habsburbgian statehood and authority.

Nationalist groups haven't eroded the multiethnic and multicultural foundation of Danubian society as much as they have in OTL in 1918. For once tradition works in our favor because multicultural and multiethnic coexistence in a shared polity has been a lived and uninterrupted reality for centuries. With the Hungarian nobility being defanged Maygarization likely was much weaker if it gained any traction at all at this point in the timeline.

Its also worth considering we are right over the border and have more than a decade for hands-on reconstruction. We can create a joint economic and security framework with the Danubian Federation which is going to create the prosperity and stability to make it work. Unlike the successive disasters the Balkans saw IOTL after the dissolution of the Danube monarchy that were in large part enabled by a power vacuum and competing great power interests which won't be the case for our part of Transleithania.

A stable Danubian Federation would be a highly valuable ally on our flank shoring up the Balkans and likely forcing the Entente to commit significant forces there to shore up their dysfunctional allies in the region. Unlike the two Federation solution the Danubian Federation would be a serious and valuable participant in the Alliance that can participate on an equal footing.
 
Anchises said:
I think a single federation is a risk worth taking and a necessary step we have to take if we want to have any hope of achieving our long term ambitions.

I think the risk of ethnic and religious tensions tearing the Danubian Federation apart is not as big as some people might worry. Nationalism had less time to fester in the Habsburg Empire and our war saw less of a gradual unwinding of Habsburbgian statehood and authority.

Nationalist groups haven't eroded the multiethnic and multicultural foundation of Danubian society as much as they have in OTL in 1918. For once tradition works in our favor because multicultural and multiethnic coexistence in a shared polity has been a lived and uninterrupted reality for centuries. With the Hungarian nobility being defanged Maygarization likely was much weaker if it gained any traction at all at this point in the timeline.

Its also worth considering we are right over the border and have more than a decade for hands-on reconstruction. We can create a joint economic and security framework with the Danubian Federation which is going to create the prosperity and stability to make it work. Unlike the successive disasters the Balkans saw IOTL after the dissolution of the Danube monarchy that were in large part enabled by a power vacuum and competing great power interests which won't be the case for our part of Transleithania.

A stable Danubian Federation would be a highly valuable ally on our flank shoring up the Balkans and likely forcing the Entente to commit significant forces there to shore up their dysfunctional allies in the region. Unlike the two Federation solution the Danubian Federation would be a serious and valuable participant in the Alliance that can participate on an equal footing.
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....Well, I'm Convinced.

[x] [FED] We will propose a single Danubian Federation.
 
Come on, let's show the world the internationalist project can work! Vote for a single Danubian Federation!
 
Vote for the Illyrian federation if you want another allied nation that finds investment in navies worthwhile!
A vote to improve on our greatest weakness!
 
Not sure why people think having a separate Illyrian federation will somehow make Serbians want to join it or something, they will be hardline opposed to us because of our radicalism anyway so what's the point?
 
StarMaker764 said:
Not sure why people think having a separate Illyrian federation will somehow make Serbians want to join it or something, they will be hardline opposed to us because of our radicalism anyway so what's the point?
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The people in Serbia that are advocating for Yugoslavia are not made up of just reactionaries. As far as I can tell the Yugoslav movement was quite widespread in Serbia during this time, and it quite possibly crosses the Right/Left border of politics.
 
StarMaker764 said:
Not sure why people think having a separate Illyrian federation will somehow make Serbians want to join it or something, they will be hardline opposed to us because of our radicalism anyway so what's the point?
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The same principle that the Soviets attempted to utilize with Soviet Ukraine, the Piedmont principle. Basically the idea is that we would be establishing a state which would be regarded as potentially the national homeland of a neighboring population. The idea that republican panslavism, particularly one that is not tied to Croatian nationalism (I think it will be in practice but it isn't officially), would be a force in Serbian politics that would be allied with German interests. The dream of unification with Bosnia with its large Serb and Bosniak populations will persist and can be expressed either as a form of Serb revanchism or as a desire to enter into an existing panslavic federation among the intelligentsia.

I'm skeptical of this working, but I was opposed to any Federation at all so I am trying to at least secure one reasonable state even if we must suffer a strange Hungarian led Federation in the far north of SE Europe.
 
[X] [FED] We will propose a single Danubian Federation.
If we can't do it in 12 years, with as much control as possible, making a new nation to do this. Then what about the US? Should they just dissolve into states when they change? Is it truly unbelievable that people could come together in the search of freedom and happiness?
The nations of now are built on the ideological foundations and institutions of Tyrants and Kings. If we don't attempt risk now, when? Will the revolution always be tomorrow because it's too hard? If 12 years can't change a people than what can?
Vote for the single Federation, prove we can.
 
Killerbot2002 said:
[X] [FED] We will propose a single Danubian Federation.
If we can't do it in 12 years, with as much control as possible, making a new nation to do this. Then what about the US? Should they just dissolve into states when they change? Is it truly unbelievable that people could come together in the search of freedom and happiness?
The nations of now are built on the ideological foundations and institutions of Tyrants and Kings. If we don't attempt risk now, when? Will the revolution always be tomorrow because it's too hard? If 12 years can't change a people than what can?
Vote for the single Federation, prove we can.
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I don't think the Balkans and US states are comparable situations.
 
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