[] Let Neph take over for a little while.
-[] Tell the others this is happening.
-[] Remind her to tell you what she's supposed to be.
-[] Finish your apology and justifications while you're at it. You'd love to do the construct thingie, you really would, but you'd prefer do it at a better time and where there aren't people at risk.
I like Filraen's vote idea, but it seems like the sort of thing one should test in a safe environment first, then move from there.
 
[X] Let Neph take over for a little while.
-[X] Tell the others this is happening.
-[X] Finish your apology and justifications while you're at it. You'd love to do the construct thingie, you really would, but it has problems.
-[X] Remind her to tell you what she's supposed to be.

All aboard the good ship reckless!
 
"Deite" would be the more accurate spelling, if you want to chop off the first section of "jadeite". So long as you alter the pronounication, it sounds slightly more like a name, albeit a pretentious one.
I just spelt it how I think it would be pronounced, rhymes with height.
 
[X] Let Neph take over for a little while.
-[X] Tell the others this is happening.
-[X] Finish your apology and justifications while you're at it. You'd love to do the construct thingie, you really would, but it has problems.
 
@Alivaril , this is a bit confusing to me. I may have missed this on two readings, but why does Neph think she can handle the healings better than Jade if we're doing this the slow way?
 
@Alivaril , this is a bit confusing to me. I may have missed this on two readings, but why does Neph think she can handle the healings better than Jade if we're doing this the slow way?
I've been assuming that her greater skill with Red (as evidenced by her being able to turn Magnostadt Red via Rukh ) would let her do it more efficiently. She may even have an entirely different method of healing with Red than the one we're using.
 
@Alivaril , this is a bit confusing to me. I may have missed this on two readings, but why does Neph think she can handle the healings better than Jade if we're doing this the slow way?

Ninja'd, but you assume she's just plain better at this whole "Red Disease Removal" thing than you are.
 
[X] Let Neph take over for a little while.
-[X] Tell the others this is happening.
-[X] Finish your apology and justifications while you're at it. You'd love to do the construct thingie, you really would, but it has problems.
-[X] Remind her to tell you what she's supposed to be.

That might actually explain at least parts of Indira - if you need certain mindset to benefit from prayer as a power source, then deliberately cultivating in oneself at least a bit of a god complex to maximize that (for quite possibly good, moral reasons) seems reasonable.

No matter what the reason, managing to trick yourself into a god complex is no easy feat, so I'm impressed regardless.
 
Is it a complex if you're actually a God?

I mean, part of the problem with the "am I really a god" question is that... well, what is a god? a miserable pile of miracles Is being a god an innate thing, where you're either born a god or not? If so, what characteristics are required, and are they the type that someone can determine about themselves? Alternatively, is being a god more just a way of quantifying individuals who have reached a certain level of immense personal power? If so, where's the threshold? Just with these few questions, you can muddy the definitional waters sufficiently that the only thing you can say for certain is that a given individual either definitely isn't a god, or that they might be a god. Which means the question of whether you can have a god complex if you're a god is a somewhat academic question until a clear definition of what a god is gets established.

That being said, in general, if being a god still allows you to have peers, then my opinion is that yes, a god can have a god complex, at least among the subset of your peers.
 
[X] Let Neph take over for a little while.
-[X] Tell the others this is happening.
-[X] Finish your apology and justifications while you're at it. You'd love to do the construct thingie, you really would, but it has problems.
-[X] Remind her to tell you what she's supposed to be.
 
I mean, part of the problem with the "am I really a god" question is that... well, what is a god? a miserable pile of miracles Is being a god an innate thing, where you're either born a god or not? If so, what characteristics are required, and are they the type that someone can determine about themselves? Alternatively, is being a god more just a way of quantifying individuals who have reached a certain level of immense personal power? If so, where's the threshold? Just with these few questions, you can muddy the definitional waters sufficiently that the only thing you can say for certain is that a given individual either definitely isn't a god, or that they might be a god. Which means the question of whether you can have a god complex if you're a god is a somewhat academic question until a clear definition of what a god is gets established.

That being said, in general, if being a god still allows you to have peers, then my opinion is that yes, a god can have a god complex, at least among the subset of your peers.
Several of these settings have hard enough definitions to answer that question, like Velgarth or Fairy Tale. Meeting those requirements or at least reaching a similar level should be enough to justify such an attitude on other Planes. Right now, Jade can justify thinking of herself as objectively superior to most people she meets in most settings, and is justified in thinking of herself as a nascent God (or Godling, to use the Velgarth term) which is a mindset conducive to making use of the Divine advantages we'd want Jade to think of herself as a God for.
 
Several of these settings have hard enough definitions to answer that question, like Velgarth or Fairy Tale. Meeting those requirements or at least reaching a similar level should be enough to justify such an attitude on other Planes. Right now, Jade can justify thinking of herself as objectively superior to most people she meets in most settings, and is justified in thinking of herself as a nascent God (or Godling, to use the Velgarth term) which is a mindset conducive to making use of the Divine advantages we'd want Jade to think of herself as a God for.

I mean, I'm not convinced we do want that (to me, thinking of herself as inherently superior is inherently inimical to the empathy we've been trying to keep alive in her), but the rest of your reasoning seems sound.
 
I mean, I'm not convinced we do want that (to me, thinking of herself as inherently superior is inherently inimical to the empathy we've been trying to keep alive in her), but the rest of your reasoning seems sound.
Empathy that is the ability to empathize is not inherently inimical to being inherently superior. For Jade to think anything else would be an a failure of self evaluation.
 
I mean, part of the problem with the "am I really a god" question is that... well, what is a god? a miserable pile of miracles Is being a god an innate thing, where you're either born a god or not? If so, what characteristics are required, and are they the type that someone can determine about themselves? Alternatively, is being a god more just a way of quantifying individuals who have reached a certain level of immense personal power? If so, where's the threshold? Just with these few questions, you can muddy the definitional waters sufficiently that the only thing you can say for certain is that a given individual either definitely isn't a god, or that they might be a god. Which means the question of whether you can have a god complex if you're a god is a somewhat academic question until a clear definition of what a god is gets established.

As @Deathbybunnies said, we actually have a good idea of what constitutes a God, in-story.

Agni seem to naturally possess a Divine Spark, which means they'd probably be classified as Godlings or Demigods by Velgarth standards. With sufficient worship, a strong enough Spark, and maybe some other secret factors, some of them likely have a shot at fully ascending. Indira's probably farther along with this than Jade is (assuming she hasn't ascended already), what with the Empire and all. Not that we'll ever tell Indira that. :V
 
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Empathy that is the ability to empathize is not inherently inimical to being inherently superior.

I strongly disagree, unless you're just talking about physical superiority and/or mystical superiority; the fact that she's superior in those areas is undeniably true but doesn't matter as much for empathy purposes. What worries me is that Jade might get to the point where she decides that her decision-making is inherently better than everyone else's, and that therefore she is better than everyone else. As things stand right now, her decisions matter more than most people's because she has more power to make it happen and to prevent pushback. Nothing inherently wrong with that, so I'm fine with Jade understanding that dynamic, as long as she doesn't start to think that because her decisions matter more that they deserve to matter more. That other people's decisions are worth less than hers just because she has power. That because Jade is who she is, she can disregard everyone outside of her little ingroup and consider them expendable. As long as Jade doesn't start thinking her decision-making is superior, I'm good, because that allows her empathy to be preserved. But I see no compatibility between "I am superior" and "I feel your pain", because the first inherently considers themselves to be a step above what everyone else feels and thinks.
 
Ah, I wasn't aware that could happen.

I had wondered how an experienced red mage like him, plus the planeswalker power-up, could have died without leaving behind signs. So when you indicated the self-sacrifice of a planeswalker between Sylvester and us, that was a potential fate for Surya.

A single-use Spark, if such a thing exists, is a much better explanation, though.
Normally, it can't. But normally, planeswalkers don't fragment and distribute their Spark amongst their relatives. I've heard of Spark transplants, and spells that consume the Spark, but not whatever Sylvester did. We're trending on completely new ground here.

That said, we know Suryastra experimented with gathering and fusing weaker Agni Sparks to make a stronger one. So it's possible he got to a point somewhere between a full Planeswalker Spark, and an Agni Spark, when he inevitably applied his technique to Surya. There's no one else he'd have done this for, since he was probably as dedicated to Surya as Astra is to us.
I just spelt it how I think it would be pronounced, rhymes with height.
Mine would be more like "day-ite". Which is fairly close to "deity". Same with the spelling.
I mean, part of the problem with the "am I really a god" question is that... well, what is a god? a miserable pile of miracles Is being a god an innate thing, where you're either born a god or not? If so, what characteristics are required, and are they the type that someone can determine about themselves? Alternatively, is being a god more just a way of quantifying individuals who have reached a certain level of immense personal power? If so, where's the threshold? Just with these few questions, you can muddy the definitional waters sufficiently that the only thing you can say for certain is that a given individual either definitely isn't a god, or that they might be a god. Which means the question of whether you can have a god complex if you're a god is a somewhat academic question until a clear definition of what a god is gets established.

That being said, in general, if being a god still allows you to have peers, then my opinion is that yes, a god can have a god complex, at least among the subset of your peers.
In this setting, it has a lot to do with gaining power from worship, from what I understand. You can be a power to rival the gods without being one, see also; Siofra's ascent to godhood and superiority over a goddess in combat, or Natsu defeating a god in Fairy Tail canon.
I strongly disagree, unless you're just talking about physical superiority and/or mystical superiority; the fact that she's superior in those areas is undeniably true but doesn't matter as much for empathy purposes. What worries me is that Jade might get to the point where she decides that her decision-making is inherently better than everyone else's, and that therefore she is better than everyone else. As things stand right now, her decisions matter more than most people's because she has more power to make it happen and to prevent pushback. Nothing inherently wrong with that, so I'm fine with Jade understanding that dynamic, as long as she doesn't start to think that because her decisions matter more that they deserve to matter more. That other people's decisions are worth less than hers just because she has power. That because Jade is who she is, she can disregard everyone outside of her little ingroup and consider them expendable. As long as Jade doesn't start thinking her decision-making is superior, I'm good, because that allows her empathy to be preserved. But I see no compatibility between "I am superior" and "I feel your pain", because the first inherently considers themselves to be a step above what everyone else feels and thinks.
I can think my reasoning is superior without losing empathy. Same with decision-making. Lord knows, I have empathy for babies, despite being fairly sure my decision-making is better. Same for teens who have their minds bathing in hormones.

Empathy is a bit more complex than you're making it out to be. It's the ability to put yourselves in their shoes, to consider the what-if of being in that person's situation, and how you'd react. It's never a complete understanding, even for Empaths, who aren't able to experience any emotions preceeding their reading of the person's emotions. But it's enough to make you sympathize.

What you're worried about isn't about empathy or superiority, but arrogance and an unwillingness to consider that what you're doing might not be the optimal course of action. That you always know best. That's related to empathy, in that it makes it harder to put yourself in other people's position sometimes, or means you run roughshod over them, but it's somewhat different, as well.
 
Jade is currently at "worship by people whose life I improved is okay, but optional".

I'd prefer not to push her further for a while:
  • To accept prayers, worship and divinity, Jade primarily needs to thinks she deserves them. In the coming month, we'll found a kingdom for the former slaves and give them a quality of life far beyond the standard in this plane. At that point, ascension should come by itself.
  • Humanity has time and again slid down the slippery slope from benevolence to apathy, from superiority to oppression, from pride to segregation. I'd rather avoid that by keeping our self-image based on actual deeds instead of potential power.
    Jade isn't immune to hubris:
    I could overthrow any Earth government I wanted, couldn't I? ...Yes, yes I could.
  • Jade is 16. Over less than six months, she mostly recovered from
    depression, mild paranoia, demophobia, iophobia, mild atychiphobia, and [...] loneliness
    Despite all that progess, she hasn't fully accepted her new circumstances and personality. Her growth as a goddess might very well stunt her growth as a person. No amount of power is worth that.
  • For now, staying a godling has better perks on Velgarth where those get the full protection without the restrictions full gods are under.

Don't think we need to include a mention about tapping Magnostadt and Agneyastra, because Neph should already know that. The more time we spend dawdling, the greater the chance of the trance becoming undone.
Because it might have gotten lost in the shuffle:
Jade (and the voterbase) frequently forget about land tapping and Agneyastra's mana, and as Jade didn't seem to consider them IC yet, it can't hurt to mention them.
Besides, requesting the help of Agneyastra before she considers us under a personality overlay is merely good sense.
 
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I mean, part of the problem with the "am I really a god" question is that... well, what is a god? a miserable pile of miracles Is being a god an innate thing, where you're either born a god or not? If so, what characteristics are required, and are they the type that someone can determine about themselves? Alternatively, is being a god more just a way of quantifying individuals who have reached a certain level of immense personal power? If so, where's the threshold? Just with these few questions, you can muddy the definitional waters sufficiently that the only thing you can say for certain is that a given individual either definitely isn't a god, or that they might be a god. Which means the question of whether you can have a god complex if you're a god is a somewhat academic question until a clear definition of what a god is gets established.

That being said, in general, if being a god still allows you to have peers, then my opinion is that yes, a god can have a god complex, at least among the subset of your peers.
The answer is fairly unambigously 'basically', assuming you don't try to muddle it to hard. The whole 'godling' thing, as well as the divine spark thing, make it fairly clear.
The definition used in-universe doesn't nesscarily have to make sense elsewhere. For example, in Marvel, Storm isn't a goddess, despite having occasionally been empowered by worship.
 
[X] Let Neph take over for a little while.
-[X] Tell the others this is happening.
-[X] Finish your apology and justifications while you're at it. You'd love to do the construct thingie, you really would, but it has problems.
-[X] Remind her to tell you what she's supposed to be.
 
For now, staying a godling has better perks on Velgarth where those get the full protection without the restrictions full gods are under.
Is that a for being a God, or for having worshippers and agreeing to a treaty on that Plane that every native God is bound by? If no one worships us there and we don't stick our nose too far into local divine business, we might not have to be under those same restrictions.
 
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