Green Sun, Black Shadows (CG/Exalted)

By that same token, it again shows she's someone suited to following someone else, at least to an extent. Also, putting herself in such danger is the perfect opportunity for Lunar Exaltation - when normally she would die, a Lunar Exaltation gives her the extra oomph needed to survive when it would otherwise be impossible. A Solar Exaltation could come in the same situation, but as you said survival is a Lunar thing.
Notably though the Solars were not necessarily all leaders, the Dawn caste were as much glorious champions of the host as they were the commanders that led it. And I think you misunderstand my point, while Kallen certainly gets into enough situations where it's "survive or die" she doesn't prioritize her survival. See her battle when confronting those Refrain dealers for example, when put in a precarious situation she goes balls to the walls and doesn't stop for anything when withdrawing might be a better idea.
 
Notably though the Solars were not necessarily all leaders, the Dawn caste were as much glorious champions of the host as they were the commanders that led it. And I think you misunderstand my point, while Kallen certainly gets into enough situations where it's "survive or die" she doesn't prioritize her survival. See her battle when confronting those Refrain dealers for example, when put in a precarious situation she goes balls to the walls and doesn't stop for anything when withdrawing might be a better idea.

Point, though "survival" is a broad concept overall.

Like I said, she could go either way in the grand scheme of things, but I think she fits a Lunar role better. You think she's a better Dawn Solar. Ultimately it's just opinion on what traits we want to emphasize as being more core to her character.
 
Point, though "survival" is a broad concept overall.

Like I said, she could go either way in the grand scheme of things, but I think she fits a Lunar role better. You think she's a better Dawn Solar. Ultimately it's just opinion on what traits we want to emphasize as being more core to her character.
Fair enough.
How about Lost Egg Kallen?
Horribly unlikely, while there seems to be some hint of Brittanian=Dragonblooded here her father was only minor nobility and she's passed the traditional exaltation age. I mean it's possible but it's only slightly more likely then her being an unnoticed Sidereal candidate.
 
It's from a drama CD. See her character outline on her wiki page - http://codegeass.wikia.com/wiki/Kaguya_Sumeragi
Much as I like Kaguya, if she even remembers this (she was 4), I'm not seeing that it would definitely incline her positively towards us. From the summary it seems like we stood there and insulted her. She might realise it helped her develop emotionally but I don't think that will certainly engender a positve reaction to us. Then again Kaguya is weird so who knows.

I foresee a lot of potential humor from both sides regarding the whole 'demon of the forest' thing.

So, one thing we need to think about because she'll show up soon enough, likely tomorrow - how do we deal with Kallen?

Even in canon Lelouch was able to recognize her, and we've had even more chance to do so since we heard her name over the radio. In canon Lelouch uses Geass and trickery to convince her he's not Zero after he learns that his Geass only works on a person once, and when she eventually does it's quite a shock to her and she abandons him at a critical moment. While things most certainly won't go down the same way as in canon since we've already changed what happens with Clovis, do we want to be deceptive with her?

Considering that...

1. We have a charm that fascinates people, so making her more interested in Lelouch than in canon is bound to happen. Fascination by itself is really a neutral Intimacy, but it's bound to make any positive or negative Intimacies she gains towards Lelouch more pronounced, so any big shocker moments regarding Zero being Lelouch could similarly be affected.

2. She is going to be a member of the Student Council (Milly's grandfather requests it due to her 'frail constitution' preventing her from joining other clubs) so she's going to be around a lot anyways. We're likely to have enough trouble working around Lelouch's inevitably enlarged group of stalker fangirls that is going to come about due to his being more attractive and fascinating than in canon.

3. The Shinjuku incident went better overall. Zero really saved the day. Not only did Britannia suffer terrible losses, but her group got five Sutherlands. Also, Zero personally stuck out his neck for her in order to let her withdraw from fighting the Lancelot, heavily damaging it and allowing her group to help a lot of innocent people escape. I'd say she owes Zero more than in canon, so probably already be more positively predisposed towards him. (especially since she's got a name already, and he's not just a voice over the radio)

4. Lelouch has different options to deal with her than in canon, such as an oath to keep his secrets or if it came to it assassin demon spiders, so the risks are different.

...might it be better to deal with her more honestly and either come out as Zero or at least an agent of Zero? I wouldn't say that we're a Britannian prince, but at least being honest to a degree might work better for us in the long run.
We can certainly lessen the shock as the cirumstances that made her suspicious that we were Zero in the first place should never arise, thus we won't need to manipulate her into thinking we aren't. But I think your forgetting the other reason it was so shocking was that the personal Lelouch projects is a brilliant, but apathetic cynic, with no desire to change how horrible the world is. She saw her hero revealed as the man who said to her face to not do anything about a japanese shopkeeper being beaten up in front of her because it would make his situation worse, that's the way the world works.

Beyond that I also don't think Lelouch would want to reveal his connection to 'Zero' easily:
  • First and foremost, whilst he might not think of them as useless, they are terrorists. I want you to forget everything you know about Kallen for a minute and focus on this. Kallen is a terrorist. That is all Lelouch knows of her IC. That and she's partially responsible for the sequence of events that got Suzaku and a lot of people killed (AFAIK Lelouch doesn't yet realise Suzaku's alive), though it did lead to our exaltation. It's actually more of an incentive not to tell her, a competent, motivated terrorist is a lot more dangerous to trust.
  • His public identity is connected to Nunnally, and giving a terrorist reason to dig into his background, or potentially threaten his sister as a bargaining chip is a huge no no.
  • Oath sanctification is imperfect. A true believer who is prepared to die or lose everything can break their oath. Meta wise Kallen is the sort of person who's prepared to die for their beliefs.
  • On a more Meta note, Kallen can be, and I say this while liking her a lot, stupidly impulsive. I think the best example is the shower scene, where she grabs Lelouch's hand, believing he might be the voice from Shinjuku, and threatens him with a knife pressed into his wrist. While Lelouch playing dumb allowed the situation to end without bloodshed, imagine if the scene had played out with someone else. Kallen would have had to kill someone to prevent them talking about her threatning them with a knife, or disappeared, losing her cover identity (or relied on the Stadfeld name to sweep it under the rug, but I don't think she'd have done that). Another example of this can be seen when (iirc) she is ready to stab Euphemia in the middle of a school event if Lelouch hadn't stppped her. This makes anything we do regarding revealing ourselves a bit more risky.
  • Kallen isn't really the best at Social understanding. This is both positive and negative. She will be easier for us to deal with, but she has trouble empathising or seeing things from other people's point of view (see her not understanding why japanese people would accept humilitation to work in the Britannian settlement, or her inability to understand her mother staying as a maid). This can make her prone to snap judgements which might have unpleasant effects if we aren't careful, especially combined with her impulsive nature.
  • Lelouch isn't a trusting person.
So overall I think we'd at least need a decent amount of time (weeks at least) IC getting to know her before we would risk that. Revealing ourselves of our own free will is something we can do, but will require a substantial amount of time to build trust. We might be able to cut this down a bit given our build but it's something that will take time and effort to set up.

EDIT: Some corrections.

Read the interlude. Glad the horrible thought I had earlier today, with C.C.'s 'corpse' being eaten by one of our minions turned out to be untrue.
 
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Add that to the fact that unless we go around covering our face 24/7 she'll have an Intimacy of Rapt Fascination towards us and...yeah we really need to find a way to stop people on Lelouch's school side from forming a cult around him.
Could we use loom-snarling deception to assume our own pre-exaltation appearance and fate?
Much as I like Kaguya, if she even remembers this (she was 4), I'm not seeing that it would definitely incline her positively towards us. From the summary it seems like we stood there and insulted her. She might realise it helped her develop emotionally but I don't think that will certainly engender a positve reaction to us. Then again Kaguya is weird so who knows.

I foresee a lot of potential humor from both sides regarding the whole 'demon of the forest' thing.


We can certainly lessen the shock as the cirumstances that made her suspicious that we were Zero in the first place should never arise, thus we won't need to manipulate her into thinking we aren't. But I think your forgetting the other reason it was so shocking was that the personal Lelouch projects is a brilliant, but apathetic cynic, with no desire to change how horrible the world is. She saw her hero revealed as the man who said to her face to not do anything about a japanese shopkeeper being beaten up in front of her because it would make his situation worse, that's the way the world works.

Beyond that I also don't think Lelouch would want to reveal his connection to 'Zero' easily:
  • First and foremost, whilst he might not think of them as useless, they are terrorists. I want you to forget everything you know about Kallen for a minute and focus on this. Kallen is a terrorist. That is all Lelouch knows of her IC. That and she's partially responsible for the sequence of events that got Suzaku and a lot of people killed (AFAIK Lelouch doesn't yet realise Suzaku's alive), though it did lead to our exaltation. It's actually more of an incentive not to tell her, a competent, motivated terrorist is a lot more dangerous to trust.
  • His public identity is connected to Nunnally, and giving a terrorist reason to dig into his background, or potentially threaten his sister as a bargaining chip is a huge no no.
  • Oath sanctification is imperfect. A true believer who is prepared to die or lose everything can break their oath. Meta wise Kallen is the sort of person who's prepared to die for their beliefs.
  • On a more Meta note, Kallen can be, and I say this while liking her a lot, stupidly impulsive. I think the best example is the shower scene, where she grabs Lelouch's hand, believing he might be the voice from Shinjuku, and threatens him with a knife pressed into his wrist. While Lelouch playing dumb allowed the situation to end without bloodshed, imagine if the scene had played out with someone else. Kallen would have had to kill someone to prevent them talking about her threatning them with a knife, or disappeared, losing her cover identity (or relied on the Stadfeld name to sweep it under the rug, but I don't think she'd have done that). Another example of this can be seen when (iirc) she is ready to stab Euphemia in the middle of a school event if Lelouch hadn't stppped her. This makes anything we do regarding revealing ourselves a bit more risky.
  • Kallen isn't really the best at Social understanding. This is both positive and negative. She will be easier for us to deal with, but she has trouble empathising or seeing things from other people's point of view (see her not understanding why japanese people would accept humilitation to work in the Britannian settlement, or her inability to understand her mother staying as a maid). This can make her prone to snap judgements which might have unpleasant effects if we aren't careful, especially combined with her impulsive nature.
  • Lelouch isn't a trusting person.
So overall I think we'd at least need a decent amount of time (weeks at least) IC getting to know her before we would risk that. Revealing ourselves of our own free will is something we can do, but will require a substantial amount of time to build trust. We might be able to cut this down a bit given our build but it's something that will take time and effort to set up.

EDIT: Some corrections.

Read the interlude. Glad the horrible thought I had earlier today, with C.C.'s 'corpse' being eaten by one of our minions turned out to be untrue.
Also, our act of villany is to pointlessly conceal secrets from our allies and henchmen.
 
Also, our act of villany is to pointlessly conceal secrets from our allies and henchmen.
You know, when I first read that, I realized we could just set up a bunch of harmless but important looking mysterious things for our friends to be confused and ask about in order to farm anti-limit.

It's also a wonderful excuse to use that Concealing Grin charm we have, as well as an encouragement to act as an inscrutable chess master.
 
Much as I like Kaguya, if she even remembers this (she was 4), I'm not seeing that it would definitely incline her positively towards us. From the summary it seems like we stood there and insulted her. She might realise it helped her develop emotionally but I don't think that will certainly engender a positve reaction to us. Then again Kaguya is weird so who knows.

I foresee a lot of potential humor from both sides regarding the whole 'demon of the forest' thing.

I'm pretty certain she remembers it - the article says "At the end of her tale, she says that she believes that she's changed since then." which implies she's recounting the tale from memory. The end description to me makes me think she views the whole event in a positive light, which would mean she'd take Lelouch's scolding as actually being an attempt to help her. Kaguya, while a bit strange, is rather mature for her age, so even if she didn't view the 'demon of the forest' positively in that role I think she'd recognize that Lelouch was also a child at the time and probably let it go. I'm also thinking she would have occasionally interacted with Lelouch and Nunally after that, given the Lelouch was among the friends of Suzaku she couldn't play with before asking.

We can certainly lessen the shock as the cirumstances that made her suspicious that we were Zero in the first place should never arise, thus we won't need to manipulate her into thinking we aren't. But I think your forgetting the other reason it was so shocking was that the personal Lelouch projects is a brilliant, but apathetic cynic, with no desire to change how horrible the world is. She saw her hero revealed as the man who said to her face to not do anything about a japanese shopkeeper being beaten up in front of her because it would make his situation worse, that's the way the world works.

Beyond that I also don't think Lelouch would want to reveal his connection to 'Zero' easily:
  • First and foremost, whilst he might not think of them as useless, they are terrorists. I want you to forget everything you know about Kallen for a minute and focus on this. Kallen is a terrorist. That is all Lelouch knows of her IC. That and she's partially responsible for the sequence of events that got Suzaku and a lot of people killed (AFAIK Lelouch doesn't yet realise Suzaku's alive), though it did lead to our exaltation. It's actually more of an incentive not to tell her, a competent, motivated terrorist is a lot more dangerous to trust.
  • His public identity is connected to Nunnally, and giving a terrorist reason to dig into his background, or potentially threaten his sister as a bargaining chip is a huge no no.
  • Oath sanctification is imperfect. A true believer who is prepared to die or lose everything can break their oath. Meta wise Kallen is the sort of person who's prepared to die for their beliefs.
  • On a more Meta note, Kallen can be, and I say this while liking her a lot, stupidly impulsive. I think the best example is the shower scene, where she grabs Lelouch's hand, believing he might be the voice from Shinjuku, and threatens him with a knife pressed into his wrist. While Lelouch playing dumb allowed the situation to end without bloodshed, imagine if the scene had played out with someone else. Kallen would have had to kill someone to prevent them talking about her threatning them with a knife, or disappeared, losing her cover identity (or relied on the Stadfeld name to sweep it under the rug, but I don't think she'd have done that). Another example of this can be seen when (iirc) she is ready to stab Euphemia in the middle of a school event if Lelouch hadn't stppped her. This makes anything we do regarding revealing ourselves a bit more risky.
  • Kallen isn't really the best at Social understanding. This is both positive and negative. She will be easier for us to deal with, but she has trouble empathising or seeing things from other people's point of view (see her not understanding why japanese people would accept humilitation to work in the Britannian settlement, or her inability to understand her mother staying as a maid). This can make her prone to snap judgements which might have unpleasant effects if we aren't careful, especially combined with her impulsive nature.
  • Lelouch isn't a trusting person.
So overall I think we'd at least need a decent amount of time (weeks at least) IC getting to know her before we would risk that. Revealing ourselves of our own free will is something we can do, but will require a substantial amount of time to build trust. We might be able to cut this down a bit given our build but it's something that will take time and effort to set up.

You make good points - waiting to get to know her a bit before making a big reveal is probably more in character.

The apathetic Lelouch that Kallen despised was ultimately part of his mask, so we should definitely present a different side to Lelouch so she's more positively inclined. Maybe do something like what Lelouch did in canon to attract Shirley's attention if an opportunity presents itself.

Also, the shopkeeper incident may not happen since we didn't kill Clovis - the anti-Eleven sentiment will be at 'normal' levels rather than heightened due to that. And if it does, we can actually interfere, but use social bullshit to convince the thugs to walk away.

Read the interlude. Glad the horrible thought I had earlier today, with C.C.'s 'corpse' being eaten by one of our minions turned out to be untrue.

Well, I was always pretty certain she wouldn't have been eaten, or at least it wouldn't have killed her due to the bullshit level of immortality she has. My guess the scene was her waking up right after Lelouch was cocooned, her looking at it, then the demons, cursing her luck, and then walking away as the demons just stared blankly at her since she wasn't threatening.


Also, our act of villany is to pointlessly conceal secrets from our allies and henchmen.

Which doesn't mean it's a good idea to conceal all secrets all the time or from every ally possible. Also, we have the option of asking our henchmen to do something without giving them context or explanation - this is actually pretty easy, as we can just fuck with Tamaki and send him on missions to create diversions so Lelouch can get away from his fangirls, just with no explanation.

Also, given our Urge is something that isn't far off from our Motivation, we're not exactly going to disobey it regularly enough to generate a lot of Limit.

Add that to the fact that unless we go around covering our face 24/7 she'll have an Intimacy of Rapt Fascination towards us and...yeah we really need to find a way to stop people on Lelouch's school side from forming a cult around him.

No we don't! That's crazy talk.

1. An actual cult isn't likely to form. The Intimacy is rapt fascination rather than reverence. They won't see him as a god-like entity, so actual worship isn't likely. It's more likely Lelouch will have a fan club with a crapload of fangirls, which given he's super handsome and in high school wouldn't really be all that noteworthy. Given all the other crazy shenanigans that go on at Ashford Academy due to what Milly arranges it probably wouldn't even rate as the strangest thing going on there. Most adults would just blame everything on them being teenagers and ignore it.

2. If Lelouch's fanclub did count as a cult, it would only be to our benefit, as their 'prayer' actions would actually give mechanical benefits to Lelouch.

3. Think of the lulz! We absolutely must have the lulz!

Could we use loom-snarling deception to assume our own pre-exaltation appearance and fate?

The GM confirmed we can do that, but as mentioned it's expensive in motes to do that regularly. Plus it's not amusing.
 
We've talked about how Lelouch will react to Milly having exalted, and the fact he wasn't there to help her, but how will Milly react? doesn't she know Lelouch is a prince? and for all of her "PARTIES!!!11!" Milly has always tried to stick up for her friends.
 
Hm...so Lelouch's fate was to obtain a geass. Makes sense....wow

Canon CG was just as planned....in this one we avoided it

interesting
 
We've talked about how Lelouch will react to Milly having exalted, and the fact he wasn't there to help her, but how will Milly react? doesn't she know Lelouch is a prince? and for all of her "PARTIES!!!11!" Milly has always tried to stick up for her friends.

Hm, likely tell him that it was ok that he didn't know. Mily is good at hiding things when she wants to so if she hid it intentionally then she can't get bad at him for not knowing it.
 
Hm, likely tell him that it was ok that he didn't know. Mily is good at hiding things when she wants to so if she hid it intentionally then she can't get bad at him for not knowing it.
But how will she react to seeing Lelouch's exaltation? particularly if her demon informs her he is serving Oramus eg; the primordial embodiement of lovecraftian horror. She knows he was a former prince and that probably is qualification enough for failing but I still not sure she will be thrilled he sold his soul to the forces of hell.
 
But how will she react to seeing Lelouch's exaltation? particularly if her demon informs her he is serving Oramus eg; the primordial embodiement of lovecraftian horror. She knows he was a former prince and that probably is qualification enough for failing but I still not sure she will be thrilled he sold his soul to the forces of hell.

Don't forget, she also sold her soul to hell before us, so she can't get upset without being a hypocrite.

As for being Oramus's champion...depending on the demon it may tell her to be wary...or not-

remember no one has EVER gotten Oramus' favor before. The Dragon Beyond the World is a paradox...you have no idea how he's going to react to something.

So all in all...it fits Lelouch as he's a paradox in of himself.

Edit: But yes...she could be worried but she herself is a whirlwind of chaos herself :D

edit 2: forgot to capitalize his title woops.
 
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@Alexander89 - I came up with a Heretical Charm. Let me know what you think.

Infernal x-ray vision. :p
Milly: "Quick! Look through there!"
Lelouch: "Why is-GODDAMN! Milly, that's the female's locker room!"
Milly: "I know. Now tell me their three sizes!"

All of the Infernals in our Coven have already Exalted. Kallen isn't one of them, otherwise her terrorist group would be doing a lot better.

Who our Slayer is isn't known yet, but we know that they have the favor of Isidoris.
I am fairly certain you will approve of my Slayer, or at least they fit the role. They're also bringing a little extra.

While I'm thinking of it:
@Alexander89
Are we limited to just three specialties per Ability, or can we have as many as we want, but only use 3 per roll?
3 specialties for Ability, and you can use only one for roll. I already saw this question made before, and this is the only fair way.

Alright, I have a starting possible Charm:
Words Hurt Like Clubs
Cost: 5m; Mins: Essence 3; Type: Reflexive
Keywords: Combo-OK, Obvious, Sorcerous
Duration: One scene
Possible upgrade: Words Cut Like Swords. For lethal damage.

It works similar to Mind-Hand Manipulation, but the gist of it is that Lelouch can use, for example, Manipulation+Presence rolls to inflict physical damage instead of Dexterity+Martial Arts, following the concept of crossing the border between social and normal combat.

I also thought of using the various Shinma, with Oramus crossing the borders they define for a set of seven Charms.
 
Milly: "Quick! Look through there!"
Lelouch: "Why is-GODDAMN! Milly, that's the female's locker room!"
Milly: "I know. Now tell me their three sizes!"


I am fairly certain you will approve of my Slayer, or at least they fit the role. They're also bringing a little extra.

That is exactly what I expect her to do lol.

Hm...my interest for this Slayer increases...as he/she is going to smash everything with those charms with rampaging hate fire and gravity wells.
 
Milly: "Quick! Look through there!"
Lelouch: "Why is-GODDAMN! Milly, that's the female's locker room!"
Milly: "I know. Now tell me their three sizes!"

Yes! You get it! The Charm was designed with both utility and lulz in mind.

I am fairly certain you will approve of my Slayer, or at least they fit the role. They're also bringing a little extra.

I look forward to finding out who it is.

Alright, I have a starting possible Charm:

Possible upgrade: Words Cut Like Swords. For lethal damage.

It works similar to Mind-Hand Manipulation, but the gist of it is that Lelouch can use, for example, Manipulation+Presence rolls to inflict physical damage instead of Dexterity+Martial Arts, following the concept of crossing the border between social and normal combat.

I also thought of using the various Shinma, with Oramus crossing the borders they define for a set of seven Charms.

I like it. A further Heretical extension to this could combine with the Green Nimbus Flare tree to make Insults Burn Like Fire, so that successful insults, wisecracks, or other humiliating social attacks against the target that succeed actually burns them literally rather than metaphorically.
 
I like it. A further Heretical extension to this could combine with the Green Nimbus Flare tree to make Insults Burn Like Fire, so that successful insults, wisecracks, or other humiliating social attacks against the target that succeed actually burns them literally rather than metaphorically.
How would you make a clinch then?
 
I've got an idea for a charm concept.
Namely, item interrogation.
We exploit Oramus' ability to go to other realities where he's different, to instead go to one where the items are different - to the point where they could be a person who could talk to us about what they've experienced.
Would that be workable?

Could be an incredible information-gathering tool.
 
you know I was thinking about charms and I realized something , Malfeas is about imposing his personality (Charisma) , the Ebon Dragon tricks people into doing what he wants (Manipulation) an Oramus seen to affect peoples minds simple be being (Aparence) ,then wouldn't the natural progression be one or more overpowered Malfeas-Ebon Dragon -Oramus Social Charms ?
I don't know much of charm design , but I was thinking of first something like using Oramus paradox to Synergize the other two so that we could get ar least part of the bonuses lost when we combined their charms , and then a few more charms building on this to alow us to easily apraise our targets intimacies ,motivations or virtues and change them like a sculptor with clay
So thoughts ?
 
A social attack that would normally give someone pause, even momentarily? Say, like revealing a shocking secret of theirs or someone else, showing you have evidence for blackmail material, tell them you have someone important hostage.
Would calling Suzaku "parricide" works? (cruel I know, but that's the truth)
I've got an idea for a charm concept.
Namely, item interrogation.
We exploit Oramus' ability to go to other realities where he's different, to instead go to one where the items are different - to the point where they could be a person who could talk to us about what they've experienced.
Would that be workable?

Could be an incredible information-gathering tool.
There is a Malfeas Charm for that.
you know I was thinking about charms and I realized something , Malfeas is about imposing his personality (Charisma) , the Ebon Dragon tricks people into doing what he wants (Manipulation) an Oramus seen to affect peoples minds simple be being (Aparence) ,then wouldn't the natural progression be one or more overpowered Malfeas-Ebon Dragon -Oramus Social Charms ?
I don't know much of charm design , but I was thinking of first something like using Oramus paradox to Synergize the other two so that we could get ar least part of the bonuses lost when we combined their charms , and then a few more charms building on this to alow us to easily apraise our targets intimacies ,motivations or virtues and change them like a sculptor with clay
So thoughts ?
I like the way you think :p

Alright, the next post will be posted tomorrow. Maybe, since there are other things on schedule. For now I leave you to brain-storming Charms and other shinies. Bye bye :cool:
 
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