Likely we'll throw them some scraps to keep them from falling too far behind. We don't want to make them too advanced, but part of the benefit from working with us is the W-0 unit would get access to stuff made by Rakshata.
Green Sun, Black Shadows (CG/Exalted)
- Thread starter Alexander89
- Start date
- Crossover
Likely we'll throw them some scraps to keep them from falling too far behind. We don't want to make them too advanced, but part of the benefit from working with us is the W-0 unit would get access to stuff made by Rakshata.
Love the idea of bringing hell-support into active service. Not armies of demons since that would cause problems, but stuff like Infernal cannons instead of giant guns. One day, the only real resistance to Britannia will be the hard-bitten soldiers of the EU. Then suddenly there's an army of burnished-brass knightmares charging out of Japan shooting laserbeams everywhere and nobody has a fucking clue where we're pulling this stuff from.
chocolote12
A Penguin Flailing Against The Keyboard Of Life.
We just activated all of the Gundam transformation sequences* in our cars, of course. They have a special lever for it and everything.
*
Ok, got everything into voteable format.
[X] Plan Get The Gang Together
Arguments and points to bring up (not necessarily in this order):
- Because the survival and training of the future Infernals is a key part of the group's objectives, obviously the survival of the current Infernals is of paramount importance to make that possible. Survival is more likely if everyone here is working together, rather than scattered. Kaguya, Milly, and yourself are all currently in Japan and should be able to work together readily. Rakshata has already shown interest in coming to Japan, and we are more than willing to have Kallen be the test pilot for the Guren Mk-II. That leaves the matter of Akito and Leila.
-- You believe it to be essential for Akito to be near the rest of the Coven in order to fight any kill-teams sent after your group. Akito is a Slayer, from his and Lord Ligier's comments is a warrior of great power who will only become even greater. While you can easily make yourself an elite Knightmare pilot thanks to your Caste's favored abilities, you are limited in the time and effort you can spend making yourself personally capable in other areas of combat given your other responsibilities. You suspect the others are in a similar situation, being focused on political efforts in the case of Milly and Kaguya or scientific pursuits in the case of Rakshata. To balance this out the four of you need Akito close by.
-- Now, unless Akito and Leila are willing to abandon their positions in the EU military and their W-0 unit - something you suspect at least Leila will be strongly against - their superiors would need to be convinced to send their unit to Japan to work your own forces towards the goal of liberating Japan from Britannia. Akito is somewhat hard to read, but his general attitude and rapport with Leila Malcal suggest he's likely personally loyal to her rather than the EU's military, and as such it is Major Malcal you will need to convince.
--- Given her own treatment of Akito she does not seem to discriminate against the Japanese. As such you doubt she'd approve of her unit being sent on suicide missions. Convincing her that working with you is more likely to ensure their survival, as you would not treat her people as disposable. Further, given her unit is using prototypes you would think she's working closely with scientists and engineers. You are certain that Rakshata would be eager to see their work, and could likely help them improve upon it, which would further increase the chance of her people surviving any conflict.
--- If she seems particularly sympathetic to the status of the Japanese refugees in the EU, which you suspect is not good given what you've learned, point out that with Japan being liberated they could return to their home nation. There they would not be unjustly discriminated against, and could lead happier lives.
- As an extension of that, you need to speak about how Japan fits into your plans as the ideal beachhead for the Reclamation as well as a vital linchpin to any effort for defeating Britannia.
-- Japan contains 70% of the world's known Sakuradite reserves. This makes Japan a strategic location with few equals in the world.
--- By freeing Japan from Britannia's control it severely weakens their ability to wage war abroad. From Knightmares to common guns, the Britannian war machine runs on Sakuradite. Similarly, that advantage could become that of the Reclamation if Japan comes under its control.
---- This is also a good negotiation point with the EU for sending the W-0 unit to Japan. The geographic location of Japan makes it impossible for the EU to gain control it, as they'd have to go through either Britannia or the Chinese Federation, neither of which is possible. An independent Japan is therefore better for them, especially if they have friendly relations. Britannia would be weakened, and their other rival wouldn't gain an advantage either, but by helping the revolution they could gain an advantage from increased Sakuradite sent to them. Also, just for completeness of the argument to present to the EU, if your revolution were to fail (something you assure Lord Ligier will not happen) the EU already views W-0 as disposable and could simply claim the group went rogue, but still get the combat data for the Alexanders. Participation is a win-win situation for them.
-- With Japan freed, showing that an Area can liberate itself, rebellion will increase in other places conquered by Britannia, further weakening it.
-- Japan is an ideal location to lay the foundation for achieving the objective Oramus has given you - creating an empire greater and more unique than Britannia. While greatness and uniqueness are somewhat subjective in nature, it should very much be possible to eventually meet both criteria. This is also a good platform that may be helpful for meeting the orders of the other Infernals here. For example, Milly has been ordered to have people renounce the rigid laws of Area 11, and so you could make your empire more unique by encouraging a more free thinking, fun loving culture among the citizens of your empire. You are certain you can work in other goals as well.
--- Very importantly, addressing this final point to Lord Ligier specifically, is that any empire you build must encourage it's people to worship the Yozis. Japan is, again, ideal for this, as there are many disenfranchised people and cults have already begun being built. The cursed and corrupt gods have done nothing to help them, so the Yozis and their champions are obvious alternatives. With Japan under your rule and worshiping the the Yozis, your empire will become a subordinate kingdom to Hell, one that recognizes the world's True Masters and serves their ends.
Charm Use: Three uses of Second Oramus Excellency to convince Leila.
Stunt: "Peer Akito, Major Malcal, I would like to propose that we convince your superiors to send the W-0 unit to Japan. I believe it will be a much better environment for your pilots to operate in." While you still have a hard time getting a good read on Akito, Leila is clearly hesitant, but you can see that her interest is piqued. "How so?" she asks. Giving your Essence a push, you state your case. "For seven years Japan and its people have been oppressed by Britannia, and from what Peer Akito has said about your unit doesn't indicate things are all that much better for the Japanese refugees within the EU if they have not been granted citizenship after that long. Given their lack of citizenship and the use of prototypes, I have little doubt that they are intended for suicide missions." You can tell she's upset, in spite of her efforts to stay calm. She's aware of the matter, but she doesn't like it. "I can tell you don't approve of this notion, and neither do I. An enlightened world has no place for such discrimination. If you work with me, I can assure you that your subordinates would be valued as much as my own." The look on her face says she's interested. Perhaps just a bit more bait. "Also, I'm certain that Peer Rakshata would be willing to look over the Alexanders with your friend - with the advances that come of it, I'm sure their chances of survival in battle will increase greatly." The Indian scientist smiles confidently. "So, what do you say?"
@Alexander89 - let me know if there are any issues.
[X] Plan Get The Gang Together
Arguments and points to bring up (not necessarily in this order):
- Because the survival and training of the future Infernals is a key part of the group's objectives, obviously the survival of the current Infernals is of paramount importance to make that possible. Survival is more likely if everyone here is working together, rather than scattered. Kaguya, Milly, and yourself are all currently in Japan and should be able to work together readily. Rakshata has already shown interest in coming to Japan, and we are more than willing to have Kallen be the test pilot for the Guren Mk-II. That leaves the matter of Akito and Leila.
-- You believe it to be essential for Akito to be near the rest of the Coven in order to fight any kill-teams sent after your group. Akito is a Slayer, from his and Lord Ligier's comments is a warrior of great power who will only become even greater. While you can easily make yourself an elite Knightmare pilot thanks to your Caste's favored abilities, you are limited in the time and effort you can spend making yourself personally capable in other areas of combat given your other responsibilities. You suspect the others are in a similar situation, being focused on political efforts in the case of Milly and Kaguya or scientific pursuits in the case of Rakshata. To balance this out the four of you need Akito close by.
-- Now, unless Akito and Leila are willing to abandon their positions in the EU military and their W-0 unit - something you suspect at least Leila will be strongly against - their superiors would need to be convinced to send their unit to Japan to work your own forces towards the goal of liberating Japan from Britannia. Akito is somewhat hard to read, but his general attitude and rapport with Leila Malcal suggest he's likely personally loyal to her rather than the EU's military, and as such it is Major Malcal you will need to convince.
--- Given her own treatment of Akito she does not seem to discriminate against the Japanese. As such you doubt she'd approve of her unit being sent on suicide missions. Convincing her that working with you is more likely to ensure their survival, as you would not treat her people as disposable. Further, given her unit is using prototypes you would think she's working closely with scientists and engineers. You are certain that Rakshata would be eager to see their work, and could likely help them improve upon it, which would further increase the chance of her people surviving any conflict.
--- If she seems particularly sympathetic to the status of the Japanese refugees in the EU, which you suspect is not good given what you've learned, point out that with Japan being liberated they could return to their home nation. There they would not be unjustly discriminated against, and could lead happier lives.
- As an extension of that, you need to speak about how Japan fits into your plans as the ideal beachhead for the Reclamation as well as a vital linchpin to any effort for defeating Britannia.
-- Japan contains 70% of the world's known Sakuradite reserves. This makes Japan a strategic location with few equals in the world.
--- By freeing Japan from Britannia's control it severely weakens their ability to wage war abroad. From Knightmares to common guns, the Britannian war machine runs on Sakuradite. Similarly, that advantage could become that of the Reclamation if Japan comes under its control.
---- This is also a good negotiation point with the EU for sending the W-0 unit to Japan. The geographic location of Japan makes it impossible for the EU to gain control it, as they'd have to go through either Britannia or the Chinese Federation, neither of which is possible. An independent Japan is therefore better for them, especially if they have friendly relations. Britannia would be weakened, and their other rival wouldn't gain an advantage either, but by helping the revolution they could gain an advantage from increased Sakuradite sent to them. Also, just for completeness of the argument to present to the EU, if your revolution were to fail (something you assure Lord Ligier will not happen) the EU already views W-0 as disposable and could simply claim the group went rogue, but still get the combat data for the Alexanders. Participation is a win-win situation for them.
-- With Japan freed, showing that an Area can liberate itself, rebellion will increase in other places conquered by Britannia, further weakening it.
-- Japan is an ideal location to lay the foundation for achieving the objective Oramus has given you - creating an empire greater and more unique than Britannia. While greatness and uniqueness are somewhat subjective in nature, it should very much be possible to eventually meet both criteria. This is also a good platform that may be helpful for meeting the orders of the other Infernals here. For example, Milly has been ordered to have people renounce the rigid laws of Area 11, and so you could make your empire more unique by encouraging a more free thinking, fun loving culture among the citizens of your empire. You are certain you can work in other goals as well.
--- Very importantly, addressing this final point to Lord Ligier specifically, is that any empire you build must encourage it's people to worship the Yozis. Japan is, again, ideal for this, as there are many disenfranchised people and cults have already begun being built. The cursed and corrupt gods have done nothing to help them, so the Yozis and their champions are obvious alternatives. With Japan under your rule and worshiping the the Yozis, your empire will become a subordinate kingdom to Hell, one that recognizes the world's True Masters and serves their ends.
Charm Use: Three uses of Second Oramus Excellency to convince Leila.
Stunt: "Peer Akito, Major Malcal, I would like to propose that we convince your superiors to send the W-0 unit to Japan. I believe it will be a much better environment for your pilots to operate in." While you still have a hard time getting a good read on Akito, Leila is clearly hesitant, but you can see that her interest is piqued. "How so?" she asks. Giving your Essence a push, you state your case. "For seven years Japan and its people have been oppressed by Britannia, and from what Peer Akito has said about your unit doesn't indicate things are all that much better for the Japanese refugees within the EU if they have not been granted citizenship after that long. Given their lack of citizenship and the use of prototypes, I have little doubt that they are intended for suicide missions." You can tell she's upset, in spite of her efforts to stay calm. She's aware of the matter, but she doesn't like it. "I can tell you don't approve of this notion, and neither do I. An enlightened world has no place for such discrimination. If you work with me, I can assure you that your subordinates would be valued as much as my own." The look on her face says she's interested. Perhaps just a bit more bait. "Also, I'm certain that Peer Rakshata would be willing to look over the Alexanders with your friend - with the advances that come of it, I'm sure their chances of survival in battle will increase greatly." The Indian scientist smiles confidently. "So, what do you say?"
@Alexander89 - let me know if there are any issues.
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chocolote12
A Penguin Flailing Against The Keyboard Of Life.
Nitpick; lack of citizenship status.
Nitpick; lack of citizenship status.
That's exactly the point - they don't have citizenship.
ReaperofInterest
Herald of Disaster
[X] Plan Get The Gang Together
It has everything I think we should have, as well as a bit more, in addition to being logical.
It has everything I think we should have, as well as a bit more, in addition to being logical.
chocolote12
A Penguin Flailing Against The Keyboard Of Life.
No, that's not my point. My point is that you should say "Given their lack of citizenship status" rather than "Given their citizenship status", because one is more clear and sounds better. If you have to go over it in your head for a second to figure out what the writer means then the text isn't nearly clear enough abut that point.
Alexander89
Pet the pretty kitty? Y/N
- Location
- Italy
I am on a phone so I will be brief. The plan is okay, but there is no way Lelouch is going to use Excellencies when talking with Ligier. He doesn't dare, knowing it wouldn't work and fearing for it to be seen as an act of disrespect. Lulu has only Valor 2. Leila is okay though.
- Location
- Quezon City, Philippines
@Alexander89
Question though. Can you give a rough estimate on when the Philippines became Area 10 or shall I assume that the equivalent of the Spanish-American War happened?
Question though. Can you give a rough estimate on when the Philippines became Area 10 or shall I assume that the equivalent of the Spanish-American War happened?
Ok, fair enough. Removed Charm use on Ligier.
- Location
- Spain
This is weird. You are using the excellency to buff yourself and talk better, it doesn't do anything to him. There is no way that using a excellency is considered bad form, is just the equivalent to do your greatest effort to look good.
Is not like we are using shadow spite curse to give him penalties to his MDV or something equally insulting.
Enjou, you put a lot of thought into your write-ins, but goddamn do you wax verbose. Let's summarize.
-Convince Leila that her unit is being misused by the EU as suicide soldiers, and that they would be much better received and treated in Japan.
-Using the unique geographical position and resource-rich nature of Japan as an angle, convince the others that Japan would be the ideal starting location for the Reclamation and that they should all focus efforts there. Offer to pledge assistance to future efforts against Britannia to grab Leila's commitment.
-Promise Japan under your rule as a vassal state to the Yozis. (Which it would be anyways. I don't really get this. The Yozis are our bosses; anything we own, they own).
And then there's your stunt, which is less of a stunt and more defining her reactions to your words. It's also a wall of text without proper line breaks when another character speaks. Try this.
"Major Malcal, I would like to propose that we convince your superiors to send the W-0 unit to Japan. I believe it will be a much better environment for your pilots to operate in. For seven years Japan and its people have been oppressed by Britannia, and from what Peer Akito has said about your unit doesn't indicate things are all that much better for the Japanese refugees within the EU if they have not been granted citizenship after that long. Given their citizenship status and the use of prototypes, I have little doubt that they are intended for suicide missions. I can tell you don't approve of this notion, and neither do I. An enlightened world has no place for such discrimination. If you work with me, I can assure you that your subordinates would be valued as much as my own. Also, I'm certain that Peer Rakshata would be willing to look over the Alexanders with your friend - with the advances that come of it, I'm sure their chances of survival in battle will increase greatly. So, what do you say?"
While not mind control, it's definitely a shifty maneuver and not something we would do to Ligier, or any Unquestionable. He'd probably stick Lelouch into a punishment sphere for the sheer nerve.
-Convince Leila that her unit is being misused by the EU as suicide soldiers, and that they would be much better received and treated in Japan.
-Using the unique geographical position and resource-rich nature of Japan as an angle, convince the others that Japan would be the ideal starting location for the Reclamation and that they should all focus efforts there. Offer to pledge assistance to future efforts against Britannia to grab Leila's commitment.
-Promise Japan under your rule as a vassal state to the Yozis. (Which it would be anyways. I don't really get this. The Yozis are our bosses; anything we own, they own).
And then there's your stunt, which is less of a stunt and more defining her reactions to your words. It's also a wall of text without proper line breaks when another character speaks. Try this.
"Major Malcal, I would like to propose that we convince your superiors to send the W-0 unit to Japan. I believe it will be a much better environment for your pilots to operate in. For seven years Japan and its people have been oppressed by Britannia, and from what Peer Akito has said about your unit doesn't indicate things are all that much better for the Japanese refugees within the EU if they have not been granted citizenship after that long. Given their citizenship status and the use of prototypes, I have little doubt that they are intended for suicide missions. I can tell you don't approve of this notion, and neither do I. An enlightened world has no place for such discrimination. If you work with me, I can assure you that your subordinates would be valued as much as my own. Also, I'm certain that Peer Rakshata would be willing to look over the Alexanders with your friend - with the advances that come of it, I'm sure their chances of survival in battle will increase greatly. So, what do you say?"
It's the idea of "I'm using power to make myself more compelling than normal in order to convince you of something you might otherwise not accept."
While not mind control, it's definitely a shifty maneuver and not something we would do to Ligier, or any Unquestionable. He'd probably stick Lelouch into a punishment sphere for the sheer nerve.
- Location
- Spain
No, is not. Using a excellency is the same that having more dots due to a specialization in flattery.
Excellencies aren't bad form when dealing with supernatural beings, is part of who they are, just like their Presence score. Is not like Ligier isn't using his own excellency to awe us.
(Is like saying that we should act rude with Ligier, instead of politely, because otherwise we are using our smooth talking to convince him of something he might otherwise not accept and that is insulting)
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Given that Akito is the death machine of the two, Become the Hammer seems redundant...
Also, your Martial Arts charm choices have pre-requisites that aren't a part of your list and are invalid to choose.
Confluence of Savage Thought requires Bureaucracy 3, and Leila only has 2 dots in it.
Leila has no dots in Melee, so Dragon Graced Weapon is out.
1st Awareness Excellency seems okay.
Roaring Dragon Officer requires War 3, she only has War 2.
My ideas are:
Lore:
-Elemental Concentration Trance (Study things fast)
Linguistics:
-Language Learning Ritual (Learn temporarily to speak/write a language fluently)
War:
-First War Excellency- Enhances the skill of the character at guiding the flow of combat.
-Leading From Below- The character acts as an excellent officer, boosting the abilities of her leader and unit.
Awareness:
-First Awareness Excellency- Enhances the skill of the character at noticing things and detecting danger.
-All-Encompassing Earth Sense- The character and those she protects cannot be surprised; they are aware of all nearby enemies.
MartialArts-Five Dragon Style:
-Five Dragon Fortitude
ReaperofInterest
Herald of Disaster
I'm not sure Ligier's using any excellencies. Of course, I don't really know all that much about the Exalted setting, so I could be wrong.
Anyway, the point is, Ligier's pretty much the most important non-Yozi around, due to being both the freaking Sun AND the Fetich-soul of the City. Best to not do anything that has the risk of pissing him off, savvy?
EDIT: I sometimes hate autocorrect.
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- Location
- Spain
He may or may not (He has more than enough dice even without excellencies) but since this is his first contact with us, he probably want to make the best impression possible, to make us worship him unconditionally.
What i am saying is, there is not any logical reason to consider Excellency use insulting. Is like saying that acting politely (And thus, having a better chance of convincing him) is insulting.
(Hell, not using Excellencies is actually more insulting, since it means we aren't trying our best when talking with him)
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3rd Circles like Ligier probably have a dice pool of ~20 or more on most actions before their Excellencies come into play.
I wax verbose because I want to be sure I'm getting the point across in the way I want to get it across. Details matter.
The thing about stunts is that they're supposed to describe a scene. By removing all reaction from it, it's just a wall of text describing a speech, not a description of a scene. Social stunts are rather bland if you remove everything but the character talking.
We've already had reactions from other characters in stunts multiple times already, so the precedent is set unless the GM decides to change it. Generally I think it's fine as long as the reactions are in character (which we can do to an extent for known characters - we know Leila is aware of what her unit's purpose is, and we know she doesn't like it) and aren't the final result of what happens. (hence ending things with asking her the question, not her agreeing to it) If the GM has a problem with any particular reaction included, he can say so and it gets edited out.
Also, any reactions inside the stunt that wouldn't happen on stunt failure can just be written out as appropriate, just as any results from a physical stunt would be.
The thing to remember is that trying to convince someone of something is considered a social attack in Exalted. Trying to use an Excellency to enhance one when talking to Ligier might be perceived as trying to force him to accept what you want rather than letting him decide entirely on the merits of your argument. Even if it's not considered outright hostile, it might be considered insulting because it's as if you don't trust his judgement.
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- Location
- Spain
Or, more likely, can be seen as an eager new minion trying to make the best possible impression. From the point of view of Ligier, is not like we can convince him of something he doesn't want, Excellency or not. He doesn't know he has a beatable MDV score.
Trying to use a UMI charm againt Ligier would be insulting. Lying to him would be insulting. Using an Excellency to make our talk more pleasurable to hear isn't insulting. What we are doing may be considered an atack in the game mechanics, but is not like Ligier knows that. He only sees that we are trying to be as convincing as possible, and that is good. His GSP must be a good orator after all.
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Also, as long as we're using personal motes, unless Ligier is actively looking, I don't think he can tell we're using Essence, unless we do something obvious with it.
Spectrum
Tell me a secret~
- Location
- Behind you~
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ReaperofInterest
Herald of Disaster
Anyway, we can discuss why, but we won't be able to use charms on Ligier right now. Maybe once we're around Essence 5 or so and have experience dealing with him, but not when we've only been an Infernal for a few days and are at Essence 3.