I'm really happy that Metropoli are still canon, and the fact that there are apparently at least two of them running around creation probably means that you can have a classic alchemical being the people's champion in creation without needing to break open the Seal of Eight Divinities.
 
It also seems like the whole Colossus/Metropolis transformation is less of a hard line than it was in canon either. You absolutely can hit high essence while still a standard Alchemical, it's just that going to Colossus--and then Metropolis--gives you increasing scale of operations, which is very important given how hostile Autochthonia is in general.

EDIT: Oh yes, Attunement Costs for Charms are gone! You don't have to run around with an empty Personal Pool all the time!

Instead, Charm Slots are hard capped to a certain value based on your Essence. It's fairly generous apparently, but not unlimited. This also means that stuff that "Can't be removed" is a serious investment, because it's permanently reducing your number of Charm Slots by one in exchange for opening up new options.

One nice touch, is that Vat Surrogate Reweaving System is a General Charm now instead of a Spell. Colossus Rules are also baked in to the core rules as well (You can install or remove it any time after reaching Essence 5, it gives you Legendary Size and Devastating Actions while you have it installed, and submodules can let you do things like apply your Devastating Actions to other Legendary Sized targets, or to follow up grapples with an instant slam or throw with your Devastating Action, while also just automagically translating any of your Artifacts up to Colossus Scale). Only upgrade that can't be walked back from it becomes inconvenient is the Metropolis one, even Colossus is merely time consuming and expensive to install or remove, not impossible.
 
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Alchemicals! Yay! I was going to mourn my lack of spoons to read it, but it turns out today I do in fact have spoons. Please note I have (still) played zero games of Exalted 3e to date

Universal
Transpussiant (Attribute) Upgrade: Alchemical can just... add dots? Pretty cost effective, though I assume the charm slot cap puts a damper in that. Of the attribute swaps, it's funny that Strength, Stamina and Perception get two each and Dexterity, Wits, Charisma and Manipulation get nothing which feels like a statement on attribute balance. Love Unwavering Sniper Calibration, honestly think this is how all ranged attacks should have been.
Geomantic Essence Grid: Charm tax for naked Alchemicals, I guess? Hearthstone charms never really wow me. The submodule looks interesting, but I have no idea what kind of hearthstone would really kick this off.
God-Machine Arsenal Engine: Multiweapons. Boring. Funny that it doesn't take up a slot, but boring.
Intrinsic Evocation System: I'm not seeing why you wouldn't just... buy an evocation? I guess reconfiguring.
Manifold Transhuman Implants: Lunar lawyers coming to you soon.
Perfected Style Matrix: Martial Arts not taking up slots makes them tempting for Alchemicals with heavy investment into noncombat charms
Resonance Harmonizer: All your magic metals are belong to us.
Vat Surrogate Reweaving System: OK, this gives some value to the earlier 'why don't you just buy the thing' Charms.
Colossus-Class Upgrade Installation: Giant Robots cool. Having your weapons also grow is cool. This is so cool. Not going to dignify Elsewhere Compression Mode with it's own entry, though.

Appearance

Influence

Radiant Iconography Array: Emoji chat, the Charm. Largely narrative effects hinged off being at glowing or better, so not sure how useful it actually is, but funny. I'm lost what 'The Alchemical can use this Charm with Charisma and Manipulation if she has their Transpuissant (Attribute) Upgrade installed' means, what influence roll were you making that didn't use those two?
Efficient Interaction Processor: Also a Charisma and Manipulation charm in a hat, Appearance does have the advantage of letting you roll Appearance, regardless of what you're doing. Though your normal social action will be less good, I guess?
Emotive Aesthetics of the Body Electric: You know, I thought RIA was the Charm for this, but there's one that actually work all the time, making RIA even odder. Just so niche, doubly so since Charms have a slot cost now (RIA, not this, this is fine).
Patriotism-Provoking Display: Mechanics are fine, but I feel like a few conceptual jumps were made to go from strobe lighting to community based persuasion rolls. Like, superhero comics use the same style and they provoke all kinds of emotions.
Universal Advisor Comportment: This one makes perfect sense, but requiring the previous seem odd and disjointed.
Thousandfold Courtesan Calculations - Beguiling Aesthetic Perfection: The chain makes perfect sense, but it's kind of funny that the base Charm is the most specific.
Pheromone Regulation Systems: Be Spiderwoman! I'm mildly weirded out by the fact that half the submodules are scent blockers - that sorta makes sense but also why isn't that just, like, a separate Charm.
Blinding Strobe Projector: OK, apparently Appearance gets Anima limited effects and RIA is just the entry point? This makes more sense mechanically as a thing you want to do with your anima.
Ardor Embodiment Programming - Psyche-Stabilizing Beacon: These, like UAC, are very good 'control my appearance to do X' CHarms conceptually.
Theotropic Veneration Mantle: THOU SHALL NOT. Conceptually cool, but am I understanding the submodule correctly that you can be at bonfire forever?

My feeling about the Influence tree is that it's largely good except for two Charms, and unfortunately those two Charms are prereqs for a lot. Radiant Iconography Array works narratively, but it's a niche effect that's better done at base by EABE. I think it would be better to split base RIA into a submodule for EABE and turn the illusion stuff into it's own Charm with more stuff attached to it. Patriotism-Provoking Display is an Architect charm in the wrong place, IMO. Patriotism is such a scattered concept (because all communities define themselves differently) that I'm struggling to think of any physical way to convey patriotism without also being a way to convey tons of other stuff. Dramatic lighting definitely isn't it. Meanwhile, all the Charms that have it as a prereq are themed around acting as a leader or mentor.

Guile
Clockwork Composure Regulator: An interesting way to do that effect. Generate more 1s?
Mesmerizing Presence Upgrade: OK, this is the second time a sex Charm appears as a prereq to a more general Appearance Charm. As an ace, it's starting to get irritating.
Bias-Confirming Mirror Protocol: Oh hey the reason for CCR's wording.
Glistering Obsession Nodes: A reminder that Alchemicals can use Appearance for Guile at the low, low cost of 3xp

Nothing to say except Thousandfold Courtesean Calculation and Mesmerising Presence Upgrade together irks me. Why do they need to be prereqs for so many more general Charms while having such niche coverage?

Subterfuge
Integrated Artifact Transmogrifier: I-am-a-normal-humannnn
Husk-Sculpting Apparatus: Wow, a lot of submodules here. Not super hyped that smell and sound needs their own submodule (also, what about taste and touch? can people still lick you and tell you're lying?)
Aura-Dampening Component: The most interesting thing about this is that it isn't a Dex or Man Charm
Optical Shroud: Getting Halo flashbacks here. Give me a slayer katar with a very specific shape, please.
Apocryphal Operative Halo: Man in Black.. wait no, people need to get hospitalised for blindness
Stormwall Interrupter Circuits: Anima eating Charm. Meh.
Hidden Assembly Conclave: You get an invis and you get an invis and you get an invis too! I note that nothing stops your Colossal friend being a target.

Good stuff here. Only thing is that a more general Appearance swap for Stealth is surprisingly missing here, despite all the attribute swaps elsewhere.

Warfare
Semiotic Flare Projector: ENEMY THAT WAY. The fact this exists makes RAI even more baffling from a narrative standpoint
Blazing Vanguard Beacon: Double 9 charm. Boring
Maximized Ambush Processor: Please tell me that this and Hidden Assembly Conclave combine somehow
Supreme Icon of Battlefield Glory: That one Guren Lagann scene comes to mind, but this probably works more like Macross Delta
Luminous Tactical Overlay Beacons: Imagine being a soldier and a giant arrow appears pointing at you
Clockwork Soldier Pattern Projector: Localised holo-HUD. I feel like the optimal life choice is to dangle yourself from a balloon in midair.

I do like the War charms, very cute. The fact most of them don't use Anima really makes RAI a headscratcher.

Alright, that's all for today. Charisma... when I next have spoons, I guess.
 
Intrinsic Evocation System: I'm not seeing why you wouldn't just... buy an evocation? I guess reconfiguring.
Buying a permanent Evocation costs 10 experience for an Alchemical, buying a native charm costs 4 for caste/favoured, 6 otherwise. This is dramatically cheaper, at the cost of eating up a charm slot, and as you said, it can be reconfigured later, especially with Essence Pattern Recalibration. It also ties into "Transcendent Multimodal Artifact Matrix", which is presumably a charm we haven't seen yet, but seems to enable the gimmick that Essence treated as more of a main thing, where they can slot Evocations into themselves in place of charms to use them even when they don't have that artifact equipped or attuned. We'll have to see how it's handled, I am assuming it's probably a Wits charm, maybe Intelligence. Wits is usually where stuff to play around with evocations and attunement lives.

I'm lost what 'The Alchemical can use this Charm with Charisma and Manipulation if she has their Transpuissant (Attribute) Upgrade installed' means, what influence roll were you making that didn't use those two?
Influence actions rolled with Appearance, which is both a standard social attribute and the primary one associated with this charm. Albeit one that is generally more niche than the other two. The classic thing it's used for is seduction and threaten rolls, but I've gotten a lot of use out of it for my Lunar, especially with Glance Oration Technique and its upgrades making it very easy to convince an ST that it's suitable for a given roll. That is part of what Radiant Iconography Array is doing as well in addition to things like getting past language barriers etc.
 
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Radiant Iconography Array: Emoji chat, the Charm. Largely narrative effects hinged off being at glowing or better, so not sure how useful it actually is, but funny. I'm lost what 'The Alchemical can use this Charm with Charisma and Manipulation if she has their Transpuissant (Attribute) Upgrade installed' means, what influence roll were you making that didn't use those two?
I assume it's a really weird way to phrase that you can still use it if you have one of the T(A)U for the other social Attributes slotted but not Appearance. It's doubly weird given the language in EIP, but technically you could interpret it as RIA is always an Appearance Charm and thus not subject to Caste/Favored xp cost reductions for Charisma or Manipulation. Super weird.

Emotive Aesthetics of the Body Electric: You know, I thought RIA was the Charm for this, but there's one that actually work all the time, making RIA even odder. Just so niche, doubly so since Charms have a slot cost now (RIA, not this, this is fine).
EABE is a lot more limited than RIA, actually. RIA bypasses language barriers, but also time pressures and "other impediments to communicating complex ideas." EABE can also bypass language barriers without needing to be glowing+, but it explicitly cannot convey abstract or complex ideas.

Thousandfold Courtesan Calculations - Beguiling Aesthetic Perfection: The chain makes perfect sense, but it's kind of funny that the base Charm is the most specific.
The App 4, E2 submodule makes it broader, but I agree that the base charm shouldn't start with such a narrow application when Charm slots are limited.

My feeling about the Influence tree is that it's largely good except for two Charms, and unfortunately those two Charms are prereqs for a lot. Radiant Iconography Array works narratively, but it's a niche effect that's better done at base by EABE. I think it would be better to split base RIA into a submodule for EABE and turn the illusion stuff into it's own Charm with more stuff attached to it. Patriotism-Provoking Display is an Architect charm in the wrong place, IMO. Patriotism is such a scattered concept (because all communities define themselves differently) that I'm struggling to think of any physical way to convey patriotism without also being a way to convey tons of other stuff. Dramatic lighting definitely isn't it. Meanwhile, all the Charms that have it as a prereq are themed around acting as a leader or mentor.
I think PPD kind of makes sense in that while the successor Charms are framed as mentoring and guidance, they're all ultimately about getting other people to embrace an Idea, and PPD is in that vein. The whole cascade does feel awkward and like it should maybe be in Charisma instead, but I guess it's thematically appropriate that the Icon/Symbol of a nation/community have abilities to make them a better Icon/Symbol in a literal sense.

Nothing to say except Thousandfold Courtesean Calculation and Mesmerising Presence Upgrade together irks me. Why do they need to be prereqs for so many more general Charms while having such niche coverage?
Honestly, I've thought about it while typing up this response, and maybe it's a deliberate choice to push you into the intended Alchemical playstyle of having multiple specialize Charm loadouts, instead of a more generalist set you use for anything? Like, TCC isn't applicable unless you're seducing someone, so if you don't need it right now, swap it out. But if you want access to the successor Charms, you need to install TCC, meaning you have one less slot in which to put a non-social Charm.

All that said, MPU absolutely needs to go somewhere else. I can kind see what niche it's supposed to fill, but it definitely doesn't belong shoved awkwardly between a prereq that it doesn't logically follow from and a Charm that it doesn't logically follow into.
 
What do you mean Charms B is out already aaaaa

Charisma
Influence

Effective Leadership Algorithm: Good old pick-your-set Charms. The community stuff makes more sense here than in PPD IMO. Why is Control Code Algorithm not at the bottom, though? It's not even by alphabetical order
Synergy-Promoting Upgrade: Non charm dice! (Intimacy) dice, even! Weird that this one requires Transpuissant to work with other attributes but Clockwork Governance Mode doesn't. Should be the same criteria.
Universal Authorization Chevron: It's a police badge! Give yourself a cool three letter abbreviation and you're all set to kick doors open.
Perfected Union Patterning: I think it's supposed to be similar in purpose, not similar in size, the graveyard shift is tiny at most places and some nations are very large or very small. Unless this Charm does in fact only work between similarly sized nations.
Heresy Declaration Beacon: I suppose it isn't Psyche because it's just a very good Inspire roll?
Unimpeachable Emissary Programming: Acceptable Response Protocol needs more clarity
Radiant Emblem of Integrity: If you use Icon of Unshakeable Truth, does it cost you 4m still? Indefinitely, or only upon installation?
Programmed Catechism Rebuttal - Electric Fervor Inspiration: That's nice, I think?
Perfected Harmony Amplifier: Why is this super cool battle music Charm stuck behind three non-music Charm. Give it it's own music tree, damnit
Programming Language Eloquence: Y'know, I didn't expect the anti-Clarity Charm to work by making you more robotic
Propaganda Interdiction Signal: I feel like every time a Charm is named after propoganda the flavour text makes my head tilt
Vox Populi Broadcast: HEY LISTEN
Enduring Loyalty Inculcator: How does getting +Resolve on specific Intimacies work like, from a setting perspective. If you enter a place with Alchemicals, do you assume that everybody here has those bonuses?
Surging Loyalty Dynamo: A lot of Charms in this section work when you see someone making influence rolls. Does that happen often?
Unconditional Imperative Programming: I'm guessing that additional WP cost is real impressive because otherwise I;m not seeing why this is Ess3
Motivational Vocoder: The prereq charm is on persuade and threaten, this one does instills. Feel like this tree has a lot of prereqs that don't tie in well. No, wait, Appearance had them too.
Industrial Champion Icon: I was so hyped until I got to that last line... Stock up on Definings, I guess.
Ideological Override Circuitry: OK, two-step instill is cool.

Overall, there seems to be a lot of pointless prereqs to things that have weak conceptual ties. Do we really need all these prereqs? Why do I need to learn to talk good to play the guitar?

Warfare
Central Command Beacon: Woo dicestacking. Alchemicals sure get a lot of non-Charm dice, maybe because Attribute+Essence is a very low ceiling.
Fear Override Device - Unyielding Militia Protocol: It's weird the rules text for both use 'battle group's morale is bolstered' like a technical term but it means two different things. It would be clearer if those words were cut out.
Homeguard Reinforcement Clarion: Temporary Tiger Warrior training.

Wait, that's it? Appearance had more Charms for Warfare! There's nothing to discuss!

Next up, the godstat.
 
Yeesh, looks like No Moons have competition for being top Battle Sorcerers based on reading this stuff. "Can hold off on casting without losing motes" and "Can multitask effectively" package, but they've also got some fun Dice Tricks to throw very consistent results in too (Transpuissant Intelligence's bonus dice are converted to autos, and up to half of your Int in 10s generate extra dice too)

I am loving the expulsion of "The coolest stuff is gated behind being high Clarity" as a mechanic though, it allows for so much more options for playable Alchemicals outside the very low levels.

EDIT: Their spirit-buster has also been significantly improved, it's a submodule of their spirit-attacking Charm, and works on anything except functional Autochthonian Spirits (Gremlins have their protection revoked)
 
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That logic could justify making almost any Charm a prerequisite for almost any other Charm in the same rough category.

Yeesh, looks like No Moons have competition for being top Battle Sorcerers based on reading this stuff. "Can hold off on casting without losing motes" and "Can multitask effectively" package, but they've also got some fun Dice Tricks to throw very consistent results in too (Transpuissant Intelligence's bonus dice are converted to autos, and up to half of your Int in 10s generate extra dice too)

Poor Twilights, left behind by Morke's bizarre hostility to Sorcery-enhancing Charms.
 
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Playing the guitar and talking good both use the social influence system and charms that benefit general social influence also benefit more specific performance rolls.

I don't know if the explanation holds, but I believe there were writer statements in prior editions that Alchemical charm prereqs sometimes reflected Autochthon's inhuman understanding of humanity in the same way Sidereal charms reflect the Maiden's often unusual takes on abilities. "Love is X"
 
I don't know if the explanation holds, but I believe there were writer statements in prior editions that Alchemical charm prereqs sometimes reflected Autochthon's inhuman understanding of humanity in the same way Sidereal charms reflect the Maiden's often unusual takes on abilities. "Love is X"
I can see a bit of that, in that it is very much treating music and other kinds of performances as a tool to control people and make them feel/think a certain way. Like, a mode of encouraging social cohesion and making people better and more cooperative workers.

In this case it's also specifically just a charm about playing music to achieve different magical effects being found in a tree with several basic social influence boosting charms beforehand, which can all be used to boost more typical performance rolls, since those use the social influence system already. It means that, yeah, to get the flashy high powered bard shit you need to invest in basic competency charms beforehand, and have the whole suite installed in this case. That charms to make you superhumanly good at talking to people also make you superhumanly good at singing, dancing etc. is just a function of how Attribute Exalts work. "Oratory" is even a standard part of the basic performance ability.

Like...

Perfected Leadership Algorithm boosts social Influence rolls made with Charisma, generically. It even has a submodule specifically for Inspire rolls, the most common kind of roll made with Performance.

Perfected Union Patterning is a charm to boost social influence used, specifically, "to improve relations between members of two groups". This can be a verbal negotiation, or a concert -- it even has a built in "ignore the penalty for group influence" feature, which is something that Performance only has built in for Inspire actions.

Electric Fervor Inspiration is a charm to reset social rolls, which is, once again, applicable to performance, because performance rolls are social influence. Specifically, it's about a quirk in 3e's social system where if you fail with a line of argument or a social tact, you cannot then just try it again and again until you brute force them into believing or doing what you want, and have to meet a specific reset condition to try it again. In the case of Inspire rolls, you outright cannot try it again for the rest of the scene. This charm lets you bypass that through the literal magic of being a state propaganda robot. Say you sing a song about the virtue of honest hard work and cooperation etc. and you whiff the roll and the group of hungry and tired workers you are trying to convince to go back to the assembly line are unaffected. With this charm, you can simply sing the song again (or come up with a new verse or whatever), but harder, and it might actually work.

This leads to Perfected Harmony Amplifier, a charm that lets you sing or play music that grants actual magical effects in of itself. Like, in the example I made up directly above, one of its submodules is Thousand Work Shifts Ballad, which not only motivates the hungry/tired workers, but supernaturally makes them feel less tired and hungry and lets them work better despite their physical condition.

I think this progression generally makes sense if you have a decent understanding of how the social influence system works.
 
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I think the problem's on the game's end, here. By breaking down the details, you make pretty clear that it's not actually a good set of prereqs.
 
I think the problem's on the game's end, here. By breaking down the details, you make pretty clear that it's not actually a good set of prereqs.
I'm not looking at the manuscript right now but her explanation goes:

General social influence -> Influence groups specifically -> Reset influence rolls -> Influence group with a song that also magically empowers them

Seems pretty clear to me =/ Each is a progression in power and usefulness.
 
Even ignoring the social influence mechanics, a skill tree that starts with general competence powers and progresses into more specialised tools seems entirely straightforward to me.
 
Thing is, she provided some details about the middle two Charms which make the weakness of the connection pretty clear. Second Charm is apparently not group influence in general, but specifically for improving relations between groups. That seems unrelated to, and actually more specific than, the third and fourth Charms. And the third sounds like a weird little widget that maybe shouldn't exist at all; repeating the same social influence until it works via magical brute force seems pretty unpleasant for everyone involved.
 
Thing is, she provided some details about the middle two Charms which make the weakness of the connection pretty clear.
... No? It's just progressively more specific tools. 'Improving relations between groups' is, in a system that hinges on leveraging intimacies, a pretty dang general effect, but it's a bit less general than just boosting your roll, and 'I Double Down: The Charm' is the same again. You are being unreasonably uncharitable.
 
How often do you actually roll to improve a group's opinion of another group?

It happens, but not often.

...still, I worry that we're going down a well-worn and not well-loved path here. Kickstarter's on, feedback's good, then someone says something slightly negative about some aspect of the book. In this case, very slightly. And the thread, either unwilling to let the mildest criticism stand unchallenged or else desperate for something to fight about, then begins posting long defenses of why that rather-shaky aspect of the new book is actually Cool and Good. All other topics are set aside for as long as someone (me, more than once) remains unconvinced.

If we wanna do that again, I guess we can, but it didn't seem to make people very happy last time.
 
How often do you actually roll to improve a group's opinion of another group?
Like every time I've stepped into a social influence situation where I was a third party taking existing sides? Pretty common situation. Most nation writeups exist to generate groups and figureheads to represent the plights and causes of the area, for players to, well, play around with. For Alchemicals especially, do you think, just maybe, that a kind of Exalted who exist to be a bridge and an interface and an agent between state and populace might have some use for supernal skill at helping them get along? I dunno, I could be blowing smoke but it seems like the kind of thing that might just squeeze into their wheelhouse.

...still, I worry that we're going down a well-worn and not well-loved path here. Kickstarter's on, feedback's good, then someone says something slightly negative about some aspect of the book. In this case, very slightly. And the thread, either unwilling to let the mildest criticism stand unchallenged or else desperate for something to fight about, then begins posting long defenses of why that rather-shaky aspect of the new book is actually Cool and Good. All other topics are set aside for as long as someone (me, more than once) remains unconvinced.
Oh get off your high horse dude. I'd be a lot more willing to give you the time of day about your critiques of the material if your perspective was merely negative or different to mine - I disagree with Gazetteer about the game fairly often, for instance. The difference is Gaz actually reads and has a pretty solid understanding of the material, so where we disagree that disagreement arises from our different perspectives on and desires of what has actually been written, rather than the TTRPG equivalent of that Making Up A Guy To Get Mad At post. This isn't an Exalted thread problem, this is a Sanctaphrax problem.
 
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