From what I can tell, even among the First Men cousin marriages aren't completely off the table.

I see this as, ironically, Southron tendencies toward practicality above social constraints falling into alignment with even the First Men's resolution of such matters.

Is it your brother or sister? That brings no political benefit for most nobles (the Targaryens had political reasons not to marry outside the family). So that's a big no go.

But your first cousin? Well, it helps deal with a problem down the road when cousin Jimmy shows up at the gate with a small host of knights. Want to make sure your daughter gets her due? Then it isn't incest! By no means!

Azema is probably laughing herself silly, she complained about the Andals being as incestuous as the claim they aren't when it's convenient.
There's also Avunculate Marriage among First Men.

Jonnel Stark, son of Cregan Stark, married his niece Sansa Stark, daughter of Rickon Stark and granddaughter of Cregan Stark.

If the Starks were doing it I'm sure there are other more obscure examples out there.
 
Rickard Stark married a cousin.
That too. Lyarra Stark, IIRC.

I just thought Avunculate Marriage was considered more incestuous than Consanguine Marriage, so I felt the above example worth pointing out.

That said, it could easily be that the Old Gods were displeased with that particular match.
 
[X] It doesn't matter if you are evil or good, the main thing is that you are lawful!

This one does the same thing mostly and I'm feeling contrary today.

Also re incest I do vaugely recall the Catholic Church actually had a period where they were really strict about it. Like they would only approve marriages if you were something like third cousins or higher, which obviously caused a lot of issues for nobility. I wish I could remember the exact names, but in France there was this one lady who married a dude, then was told they were too related and she waged war against her bishop to get her marriage recognized.
 
Huh? I thought there's no law about that there same as with Malaysia? At least that's why I recall from my History class when we where comparing laws of nearby countries. The only countries I know where First Cousin marriage is prohibited is mine, China, and a few states in the US.

Not that it stopped people here. I know a couple of people born from first cousins, one has poor eyesight, and the other is autistic.

I just checked my sources and it boils down to:

A) Legal Laws, and
B) Seperate Religion Laws (yes, each religion have their own laws, but the Legal Laws took precedent).

And since my country and it's constitutions are heavily influence by the Islamic Laws due to more than 85% of its citizens are Muslim. I can deduce from my research that consanguneous marriages between first cousins is... ACTUALLY legal!

Huh... would you look at that? Actually, dont! I don't even want to fuck around and find out (literally in this case!!!) what's the result of the union will be. It is said that there's only 4~6% chance of there being a genetic defect for first cousins. But that's a a percentage too high of a risk for me to bet on!
 
[X] It doesn't matter if you are evil or good, the main thing is that you are lawful!

This one does the same thing mostly and I'm feeling contrary today.

Also re incest I do vaugely recall the Catholic Church actually had a period where they were really strict about it. Like they would only approve marriages if you were something like third cousins or higher, which obviously caused a lot of issues for nobility. I wish I could remember the exact names, but in France there was this one lady who married a dude, then was told they were too related and she waged war against her bishop to get her marriage recognized.

If memory serves it is not that they were entirely against it as that you needed papal dispensation. Lo and behold how many of the inbred noble families of Europe now had a new reason to seek out the pope... and pay through the nose.
 
So er I'm not sure what the usual way to announce something like this is so I'm just going to say it, I finally made a Patreon page: Link here. This is going to be the extent of my self-plugging so if anyone feels moved to donate and can afford to do so I welcome it. Don't worry I won't be locking any content behind pay walls, this is just me taking some suggestions and putting a page up for anyone inclined to make use of it

And now back to our regularly scheduled world conquest.
 
So er I'm not sure what the usual way to announce something like this is so I'm just going to say it, I finally made a Patreon page: Link here. This is going to be the extent of my self-plugging so if anyone feels moved to donate and can afford to do so I welcome it. Don't worry I won't be locking any content behind pay walls, this is just me taking some suggestions and putting a page up for anyone inclined to make use of it

And now back to our regularly scheduled world conquest.
Finally! It only took a few years.

/throws money at DP
 
Vote closed.
Adhoc vote count started by DragonParadox on Mar 1, 2021 at 11:37 AM, finished with 50 posts and 15 votes.

  • [X] Unless Lord Selmy plans to have a trial for the young man because he has committed any crimes that the Imperial Law would recognize, he should probably let him out, lest someone drags him before a court.
    [X] It doesn't matter if you are evil or good, the main thing is that you are lawful!
    -[X] The imperial authorities are not going to change the head of the loyal house.
    -[X] On the other hand, a lord does not have the right to lock up Imperial citizens without any charges.
    -[X] The prisoner must either be tried or released, and the imperial representatives will look with interest at the lord's decision and make sure that it complies with the letter and spirit of our law.
    [X] Unless Lord Selmy plans to have a trial for the young man having committed any crimes that the Imperial Law would recognize, he should probably let him out, lest someone drags him before a court.
    [X] It doesn't matter if you are evil or good, the main thing is that you are lawful!
 
I intended to throw at least my meager allowance's 2-3 euros at ya, but apparently I only get to suck dick as a student in Russia - none of my local cards are applicable for Patreon. Or Steam. Or anywhere, really.
I'll get myself a paid-for card, I suppose.
 
I did not have access to the source so I wrote Garlan Roxton here. I'll look into that for other things though, thanks. Always useful to have more potential sources.
Yesterday it was already late, and in the afternoon it is a real torture to typing from the phone, so I will tell you everything in detail now. There was a game called Game of Thrones that took place between the death of Jon Arryn and the execution of Eddard Stark. At the same time, it did not touch the canonical events and went as if parallel to the plot of the TV series and books. On the other hand, it is not considered completely canonical, and in the following books Martin can fuck up its entire plot (for example, saying that the ruler of the Ring was someone else), besides, the game took place much later than the events described in the quest and some characters could literally not get to where they got.
Unfortunately, I did not play the game itself, but a book was released on it, which I talked about in my last post. Here is a scanning of the pages of the book, although the site is Russian and I do not know how it will be displayed, in any case, I have uploaded a page with characters below.

In any case, the material as I have already said is not canonical, so it is up to the author to decide whether to use it or not.

I am very happy to see the page on Patreon, your work really deserves a reward.
💰
 
Last edited:
I intended to throw at least my meager allowance's 2-3 euros at ya, but apparently I only get to suck dick as a student in Russia - none of my local cards are applicable for Patreon. Or Steam. Or anywhere, really.
I'll get myself a paid-for card, I suppose.

Don't. Seriously if you cannot comfortably afford it you should not be giving to me. It would make me deeply uncomfortable.
 
Don't. Seriously if you cannot comfortably afford it you should not be giving to me. It would make me deeply uncomfortable.
It's not that I can't afford it, it's the logistics of doing shit that are fucked.
I appreciate you and your work just about enough to bother, even if the sum is purely sentimental. Get you a cup of coffee a month, or something :V
 
I intended to throw at least my meager allowance's 2-3 euros at ya, but apparently I only get to suck dick as a student in Russia - none of my local cards are applicable for Patreon. Or Steam. Or anywhere, really.
I'll get myself a paid-for card, I suppose.

I know that feel bro.

Does Western Union work? I would suggest crypto but the transfer fees have skyrocketed
 
@Azel, @Duesal, you wanted unlimited darkvision for our air force instead of searchlights?
I have found it!
The Vestige Geryon, the Deposed Lord (actual name) provides the ability to see in darkness of any kind without range limitation. Clearly we need to exile Geryon Lannister's soul until he becomes a vestige, and then train level 8 Binders with the Improved Binding & Quick Reconnoiter feats + lots of Spot ranks and enhancements. Problem solved!

@DragonParadox, I'll throw money at your patreon in a few hours. By the way, you should use that Dragon as your profile picture for this website!
And plug ASWAH in your sig. A sig that has a link to your patreon without a link to your quest is weird. And who knows, you might get new readers this way!
I'm sure the thread would enthusiastically suggest short blurbs for ASWAH, too. How about "A Sword Without A Hilt - What if every magical apocalypse GRRM hinted at were real, all at once? A D&D 3.5 ASOIAF Quest" or "A Sword Without A Hilt (ASOIAF/D&D 3.5) : As magic returns to the world, the blood of the Dragon is no longer a metaphor. It's a class feature!".
 
Last edited:
Winning Vote
Adhoc vote count started by DragonParadox on Mar 1, 2021 at 1:31 PM, finished with 59 posts and 15 votes.

  • [X] Unless Lord Selmy plans to have a trial for the young man because he has committed any crimes that the Imperial Law would recognize, he should probably let him out, lest someone drags him before a court.
    [X] It doesn't matter if you are evil or good, the main thing is that you are lawful!
    -[X] The imperial authorities are not going to change the head of the loyal house.
    -[X] On the other hand, a lord does not have the right to lock up Imperial citizens without any charges.
    -[X] The prisoner must either be tried or released, and the imperial representatives will look with interest at the lord's decision and make sure that it complies with the letter and spirit of our law.
    [X] Unless Lord Selmy plans to have a trial for the young man having committed any crimes that the Imperial Law would recognize, he should probably let him out, lest someone drags him before a court.
    [X] It doesn't matter if you are evil or good, the main thing is that you are lawful!
 
Interlude MXXXVIII: March of Empire
March of Empire

Thirtieth Day of the Fourth Month 294 AC

The small leather bound book thumped on the table, unheard by either Lord Selmy or his daughter. Her voice was as cold as her anger at Blackhaven had been hot. This keep would damn well be fit under Imperial Law one way or another. "My lord, unless you are able to truthfully try the young man for a crime recognized by Imperial Jurisprudence, I suggest you release him at once. Unlawful imprisonment is on the books."

Lord Arstan looked between the slim book, a summary only of the law code but a good one signed off on by the Lord Justice himself, and the grim-faced dragonrider looking him right in the eye. He rather abruptly found his inside voice, as Valaena's mother would call it whenever her daughter was too loud at the table. "He seduced my daughter with the intent to usurp my legacy."

"I shall spare you the search," Valaena said dryly. "Seduction is not a crime recognized by the law, and intent to usurp while a serious accusation must be proved to a higher standard than..."

He had already turned to Amrelath. "Come now, you see why I imprisoned the scoundrel? He deflowered my daughter, made a fool of me and a mockery of her, taking advantage of her tender years." The dragon did not react, at least until the incensed lord walked towards him.

With an almost idle seeming motion of his gloved hand and a single whispered word the wyrm ripped the air from the room around him, leaving Lord Selmy gasping and reeling back and Mertha looking on in wide-eyed shock. Enunciating carefully, as though to a particularly slow toddler, the dragon explained. "I do not care one whit who or what your daughter lays with. I do not care who inherits this particular pile of stones and the patch of dirt it sits upon. You will kneel, properly, or you will burn."

Arstan Selmy was on his knees before the dragon had even finished, never mind that the words had been meant metaphorically.

"There is no need for that," Valaena sighed, throwing the Ash-Risen a dirty look. Honestly, he could have just waited in the air if he was not going to help.

***​

At Podfield not far from Harvest Hall as the crow, or the Moonchaser, flew another Marcher lord was considering his options, and he had rather more of them than the captain of the good ship Duskrunner knew for Lord Robin Peasebury was deeper in with the Lannisters than anyone knew, deep in their pockets that is. He had taken on heavy debt with little to show for it, his support bought and paid for, but he was not quite Tywin Lannister's creature it his entirety. No geas bound him, no enchantment chained him, and so as he considered a reply from the diminutive air elemental he had freed from its bottle at the sight of the skyship he eventually deduced the same as many debtors had across the ages. Better to keep the gold and let the debt go...

The moment the resolve passed his mind searing pain lanced across his forehead as though an unseen knife carved into his flesh, and with it an overwhelming self-destructive rage.

Lord Bryce Caron, who had been trying to reason with him for the past twenty minutes, jumped to his feet at the sight of the spell. He only just managed to get out of the way in time to avoid being wrestled to the ground and strangled by his enraged neighbor.

Thankfully the captain was a suspicious sort, and the wings of Three-Eyed Ravens sharp. The sole erinyes aboard the ship made quick work of binding the bespelled lord who was quickly taken into the infirmary and from thence to Sorcerer's Deep by means of a translocation token. By the end of the night Robin Peasebury was all too glad to describe his experiences to a scribe for the Imperial Times and to describe himself as a Dragon's Man, prevented from taking his place at his lord's side only by foul Lannister magic.

What next?

[] Write in

OOC: That should be the last of the Marchers.
 
Last edited:
Ah, Amrelath. Never one to think things through, is he? Imagine creating an artificial void all around you right before you try to verbally intimidate someone. How can you expect anyone to hear you?

@DragonParadox, that might not be an idea choice of spells there...
 
Back
Top