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A Sword Without a Hilt: A Song of Ice and Fire/D&D 3.5 Crossover

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BronzeTongue said:
The base creature is only cr8. If we want to go for full cheese we could create it as cr 14-15 mighty gigantean T. Rex, then have Yss bless it with the legendary monster template after its out of the forge.

edit: added clarification.
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Oh, that sounds fantastic. Of course it'd need its own Ring of Sustenance, but that can be crafted simply enough.
 
Duesal said:
Yeah, I'm not okay with leaving our Valyrian Dragons open for attack like that, which is why I've been looking for a different dragon. We could use a Valyrian Dragon of ours, but I'm against the idea.
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I'm against using our Valyrian dragons too, my point is that if getting the seed material from our Valyrian dragons don't kill them, then getting the seed material from a captured Brine dragon don't hurt it either, which mean we might as well, see if we can't also get a minion out of the Brine dragon.

Whether that's by feeding it to Yss so he can make us a Snake dragon, or by sacrificing it to the old gods, so they can make us a Zomok I don't really care, but seeing as once we have captured the Brine dragon, all making Brine dragon material cost us is a bit of money, I'm against turning it into materials, if we capture it alive.
 
tarrangar said:
I'm against using our Valyrian dragons too, my point is that if getting the seed material from our Valyrian dragons don't kill them, then getting the seed material from a captured Brine dragon don't hurt it either, which mean we might as well, see if we can't also get a minion out of the Brine dragon.

Whether that's by feeding it to Yss so he can make us a Snake dragon, or by sacrificing it to the old gods, so they can make us a Zomok I don't really care, but seeing as once we have captured the Brine dragon, all making Brine dragon material cost us is a bit of money, I'm against turning it into materials, if we capture it alive.
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I was never planning on capturing the Brine Dragon, all we need is the corpse. As for getting a Snake Dragon, CR 12 is a very weak sacrifice and shouldn't be enough for a boon of that magnitude, unless we're trying to get a wyrmling or something similarly useless combat-wise. As for a Zomok, not only have we've already been over why they're not that useful due to a lack of mobility, but a CR 12 sacrifice should not be enough to purchase a CR 16 creature.
BronzeTongue said:
Wait, I think I misunderstood how the gigantean template calculated cr off of hd added, we wouldn't be able to make gigantean fit.
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That's a shame. :( Would Mighty still fit in there? What about Advanced?
 
tarrangar said:
I'm against using our Valyrian dragons too, my point is that if getting the seed material from our Valyrian dragons don't kill them, then getting the seed material from a captured Brine dragon don't hurt it either, which mean we might as well, see if we can't also get a minion out of the Brine dragon.

Whether that's by feeding it to Yss so he can make us a Snake dragon, or by sacrificing it to the old gods, so they can make us a Zomok I don't really care, but seeing as once we have captured the Brine dragon, all making Brine dragon material cost us is a bit of money, I'm against turning it into materials, if we capture it alive.
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I mean, and I speak for myself here, I don't really want another Brine Dragon minion. Especially one that has an active grudge pointed at it by one of our vassals. The main reason is because I don't want to vassal manage their feud which will end with one dead if we don't and the other is because I can't bring myself to care about even attempting to recruit it. Killing it/capturing it is much more fun because we could either use it as a sacrifice or use its corpse for all manner of dragon parts.
 
Abhishek M said:
Since when are Zomoks Dryads? I'm pretty sure that guy can move to any Godswood or Forest he wants. He's just been assigned by the Old Gods as the guardian for the Dawn Tree.
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He can't. He's bound to the Tree of the Dawn Age since that's where he was resurrected. He can move anywhere in Sorcerer's Deep, but he doesn't have the means to tree stride to literally any weirwood.

Zomoks aren't dryads, but since we're getting them through the Old Gods they're bound by those rules.
 
Duesal said:
He can't. He's bound to the Tree of the Dawn Age since that's where he was resurrected. He can move anywhere in Sorcerer's Deep, but he doesn't have the means to tree stride to literally any weirwood.

Zomoks aren't dryads, but since we're getting them through the Old Gods they're bound by those rules.
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If he did though he would be absolutely terrifying. Trying to cut a tree down with that would just be a bad idea.
 
Duesal said:
I was never planning on capturing the Brine Dragon, all we need is the corpse. As for getting a Snake Dragon, CR 12 is a very weak sacrifice and shouldn't be enough for a boon of that magnitude, unless we're trying to get a wyrmling or something similarly useless combat-wise. As for a Zomok, not only have we've already been over why they're not that useful due to a lack of mobility, but a CR 12 sacrifice should not be enough to purchase a CR 16 creature.

That's a shame. :( Would Mighty still fit in there? What about Advanced?
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if we used the Huge template (we have that right?) instead we could get either a gigantic or colossal one and fit Mighty for a total cr 14 pre Yss blessing.

Not as good feature wise, but it's still approaching 64 ft at the shortest and exceeding it at the largest.

Catching a gigantic T. Rex is even feasible with the way finder and polymorph, so I give us good odds of getting the upper end of that scale.
 
BronzeTongue said:
if we used the Huge template (we have that right?) instead we could get either a gigantic or colossal one and fit Mighty for a total cr 14 pre Yss blessing.

Not as good feature wise, but it's still approaching 64 ft at the shortest and exceeding it at the largest.

Catching a gigantic T. Rex is even feasible with the way finder and polymorph, so I give us good odds of getting the upper end of that scale.
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Yes, you can assume that any of the mundane templates we've got access to. Huge, Advanced, etc. We also have Druid Creature, Sorcerer Creature, Cleric Creature, and Wizard Creature.

Overall that sounds like a hell of a warbeast.
 
Duesal said:
I was never planning on capturing the Brine Dragon, all we need is the corpse. As for getting a Snake Dragon, CR 12 is a very weak sacrifice and shouldn't be enough for a boon of that magnitude, unless we're trying to get a wyrmling or something similarly useless combat-wise. As for a Zomok, not only have we've already been over why they're not that useful due to a lack of mobility, but a CR 12 sacrifice should not be enough to purchase a CR 16 creature.
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I thought it was higher CR than that, if it's only CR12 then I don't care that much, though if we do take it alive, then it's better to use it as a sacrifice than as materials, as once we have it, we can mass produce those materials.
One Autumn Leaf said:
I mean, and I speak for myself here, I don't really want another Brine Dragon minion. Especially one that has an active grudge pointed at it by one of our vassals. The main reason is because I don't want to vassal manage their feud which will end with one dead if we don't and the other is because I can't bring myself to care about even attempting to recruit it. Killing it/capturing it is much more fun because we could either use it as a sacrifice or use its corpse for all manner of dragon parts.
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I don't want it as a Brine dragon, I want it as raw materials, to forge a new minion out of.
 
tarrangar said:
I thought it was higher CR than that, if it's only CR12 then I don't care that much, though if we do take it alive, then it's better to use it as a sacrifice than as materials, as once we have it, we can mass produce those materials.

I don't want it as a Brine dragon, I want it as raw materials, to forge a new minion out of.
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Generally for getting halfway decent minions you're going to need a sacrifice CR 16 or stronger. Lower than that is simply too weak to get anything useful at our level unless we want to toss something to the baby adventurers.
One Autumn Leaf said:
@Duesal I found this bugger. He seems interesting. It is a True Dragon however.
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That does look neat, though we'd need to upgrade the forge since it seems too powerful to make at the moment.
 
We might be going a bit crazy on the True Dragon thing. Mind Dragons fine since it's basically Pseudodragons writ large. But inherently CE ones? Comeon no need for that. Atleast for dragons can we agree on only benign ones? Especially for ones that can breed?

Get the Fey Forge and spec up a Faerie Dragon if you want to.
 
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Abhishek M said:
We might be going a bit crazy on the True Dragon thing. Mind Dragons fine since it's basically Pseudodragons writ large. But inherently CE ones? Comeon no need for that. Atleast for dragons can we agree on only benign ones? Especially for ones that can breed?
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If we're literally building it obviously we get to control the alignment. DP can easily ignore the CE only part, just like he did for the Yuan-Ti.
 
Duesal said:
If we're literally building it obviously we get to control the alignment. DP can easily ignore the CE only part, just like he did for the Yuan-Ti.
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Hmm that's fine. Base it off those NG template you see if you google them maybe? Maybe also just recruit a Crystal Dragons from some far off corner of the Plabe of Earth. But I'm happy with Sea Serpents, Dragon Turtles, Coral Dragons (Neutered) and Mind Dragons for now.

Maybe craft a bunch of Elder Prausta just for flavor but that's it.
 
Abhishek M said:
We might be going a bit crazy on the True Dragon thing. Mind Dragons fine since it's basically Pseudodragons writ large. But inherently CE ones? Comeon no need for that. Atleast for dragons can we agree on only benign ones? Especially for ones that can breed?

Get the Fey Forge and spec up a Faerie Dragon if you want to.
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...or, we could make an insulting 5 headed mirror of Tiamat of our own types of dragons.

If we can't murder Tia directly, we might be able to kill her with an stroke.
 
Duesal said:
Generally for getting halfway decent minions you're going to need a sacrifice CR 16 or stronger. Lower than that is simply too weak to get anything useful at our level unless we want to toss something to the baby adventurers.
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Yeah if it's only CR12, it should probably just be a normal sacrifice, but I still think it's more useful, as a sacrifice than as dragon materials.
 
Mind, Old God Forest, Uber Fey, Epic Pyrausta and Dream?

Mind- Done
Old God Forest- Chuck a Dragon Egg to the Old Gods and make em like those Foreat Dragon hatchling pictures I linked way back
Uber Fey- CR15 specked up Fairy Dragon
Epic Pyrausta- Viserys at higher MR just makes Pyrausta and then we speck them up to True Dragon levels
Dream- Dany makes them as a counter to Nightmare Dragons.
 
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