But wouldnt it be the ideal of the empire people imagine. So what would it be . People womt imagine it as a monolitivc bruecracy
I have no clue. Was just joking. ;)

The quasi-deific Imperial entity will probably not have a Divine Realm, as it will instead be focused on the Imperium itself. We're going for Heaven on Earth, I think.
 
I always pictured that, under true seeing, it looked like the classical "absurdly menacing aura behind the character takes a specific form while he is saintly smiling".

Walk softly and be a True Dragon? :D

I might be a bit monstrous sounding.
Annoyingly so, yes.

Also the fact that the scars from the civil war will linger, and the reduction in lives will cause a reduction in productivity causing a reduction in taxes causing a reduction in reagents for making magic items to equip people. Is that what you want? Less magic items?
Those are our souls dam it.

One of the underlying rules of aSWaH is that the mortal is the final decider of who gets to decide the fate of their soul (untill something comes along and destroys it)

People, their "souls," belong to themselves. That's the point

(Unsouled people like Oddo and Xor make this more clunky to express, but my general point stands regardless)

I have no clue. Was just joking. ;)

The quasi-deific Imperial entity will probably not have a Divine Realm, as it will instead be focused on the Imperium itself. We're going for Heaven on Earth, I think.

I wonder how the Rakashas are bound to the PoB... The God of the Imperium, or whatever we end up building, might work with similar elements?
 
Last edited:
I wonder how the Rakashas are bound to the PoB... The God of the Imperium, or whatever we end up building, might work with similar elements?
personally, I am thinking about having Imperial Dream be the intermediate, a little stop where souls get a bit of time to think:
A) What afterlife of those present in Pantheon they'd prefer (given, of course, that they qualify for several) to go to;
B) if they'd prefer to stay in Imperial Dream for an indefinite amount of time, generating energy and helping out the Empire, or
C) Going straight to their relevant alignment-based afterlife, I.e turning outsider in few centuries/millenia's time.

Ofc, the Dream itself shall be the plane of beach parties a great place to be in overall.
 
I know we joke but the plane of Beach Parties sounds like a good vacation location. After all this Viserys deciding to de-stress by going there would be great. Westeros alone would be worth a century of R&R.
 
Ok, going through this and making some adjustments. Option 1:

[] Try to speak to both of them
-[] Viserys gently interjects before Lucan can fully disengage from the conversation he had just been leading. "Pardon my interruption, Brother Lucan, but might I ask you to clarify? If I understand correctly, you would deem the practice of magic acceptable so long as it is guided by the hand of the Seven, but what of those mages who reject their guidance? If they break no laws of the realm, do not seek to harm or exploit others, then should they not be free to practice their magic in peace?"
--[] "Surely you would not advocate anything so barbaric as forced conversion, Brother?" Viserys acts suitably disturbed by such a prospect. "If it is death or the Seven, then surely that would force the Faith to make war against our neighbors who do not serve them? And what then of the Fey, whom serve no gods yet practice magic as easily and naturally as you or I breath? If all magic must be practiced under the aegis of the Seven, how could any man or woman pact with them?"
---[] Depending on Lucan's answer, and any responses from Ollidor, ask the following if Viserys thinks he will receive a meaningful answer; "If the Seven are to guide mages, what of the organizations within Westeros who already employ magic to defend its people? Tales speak of some among the Lantern Bearers of Oldtown who wield some degree of magic, though a much better example would be the Golden Shields, who even now protect the realm. Should they fall under control of the Faith?"
----[] Employ the full breadth of our Social Hax to prevent Lucan from avoiding this question. It's a crucial point given Ollidor's links to the Lannisters.


Option 2:


[] Seek out Kyle and Lady Myssa, we have urgent news to share with them both.
-[] When we find them, ask to speak with them alone for a moment, if possible. If not, ask that Kyle only have those he trusts most among his faction at hand to hear our news.
--[] Go on to explain what we heard from Ollidor and Lucan's conversation, focusing especially on Lucan's statements that make it clear that no matter how lenient he seems, he appears to only trust those who serve the Seven with the ability to use magic. If this is true, then any support he appeared to offer Kyle in securing the right for mortals to bargain with the Fey, who themselves are innately supernatural creatures who practice magic in nearly every aspect of their lives and who by default worship no gods, is hollow at best, a slick bit of political maneuvering to secure his own place in the Conclave.
---[] A much worse case, however, would be that Lucan wishes to lull Kyle's faction and their Fey allies into a sense of complacency until he is able to more tightly grab the reins of power among the Faith.
----[] And finally, though we hesitate to even mention it because we cannot corroborate the accounts, we have encountered multiple individuals who claim Lucan and his followers have persecuted mages, even those who serve the Seven, if they refuse to join his cause, outright slaying some or attempting to force others to live their lives without the magic they have been 'cursed' to bear. This paints a disturbing picture of Lucan, of a man willing to say one thing but do another, and not merely the petty hypocrisies so common among flawed men, but more profound and egregious sins, such as virtually enslaving mages who would rather be left to their own business while simultaneously preaching acceptance and good will to those ignorant of his actions.

Not much to say about the second option, but the first I felt needed some tweaking. Dywen needs to come off somewhat subservient, yet passionate and truly concerned by the possibilities Lucan raised.

I would go for option one right now.
 
personally, I am thinking about having Imperial Dream be the intermediate, a little stop where souls get a bit of time to think:
A) What afterlife of those present in Pantheon they'd prefer (given, of course, that they qualify for several) to go to;
B) if they'd prefer to stay in Imperial Dream for an indefinite amount of time, generating energy and helping out the Empire, or
C) Going straight to their relevant alignment-based afterlife, I.e turning outsider in few centuries/millenia's time

*Tries to focus on Goldfish's vote ideas-*

There needs to be forms to fill in for post-life census/data collection for analysis purposes, or my happiness will be lower :p

God shopping, proper, post-life god shopping not limited by what's available in your local area while you were alive. I like.

Also, fuck it, no one goes to the lower planes*. It's a stupid concept. Stopping that from happening would be a victory beyond anything other than stopping the Others :D

*Dunno what destination to let those formally bound for the lower planes to go to, but I have faith in the thread's ability to come up with something. :D

@Snowfire, @Goldfish
I'm sorry to say this, but I'm pretty sure that DP did say that Lucan was an Initiate of Mystra. It isn't any more broken than our custom PrCs, after all...

Initiate of Mystra Feat

Dunno if he said it, but I'd not be surprised to see this on Lucan, if this is what you meant. Just refluff the lore. *Shrugs*
 
Ok, going through this and making some adjustments. Option 1:
Okay, option #1 it is for now. We might still need to use option #2 afterward.

[X] Try to speak to both of them
-[X] Viserys gently interjects before Lucan can fully disengage from the conversation he had just been leading. "Pardon my interruption, Brother Lucan, but might I ask you to clarify? If I understand correctly, you would deem the practice of magic acceptable so long as it is guided by the hand of the Seven, but what of those mages who reject their guidance? If they break no laws of the realm, do not seek to harm or exploit others, then should they not be free to practice their magic in peace?"
--[X] "Surely you would not advocate anything so barbaric as forced conversion, Brother?" Viserys acts suitably disturbed by such a prospect. "If it is death or the Seven, then surely that would force the Faith to make war against our neighbors who do not serve them? And what then of the Fey, whom serve no gods yet practice magic as easily and naturally as you or I breath? If all magic must be practiced under the aegis of the Seven, how could any man or woman pact with them?"
---[X] Depending on Lucan's answer, and any responses from Ollidor, ask the following if Viserys thinks he will receive a meaningful answer; "If the Seven are to guide mages, what of the organizations within Westeros who already employ magic to defend its people? Tales speak of some among the Lantern Bearers of Oldtown who wield some degree of magic, though a much better example would be the Golden Shields, who even now protect the realm. Should they fall under control of the Faith?"
----[X] Employ the full breadth of our Social Hax to prevent Lucan from avoiding this question. It's a crucial point given Ollidor's links to the Lannisters.
 
@Snowfire @Goldfish

I don't think the fey angle is that useful tbh, as they are a different mode of existence and many arguments in favour of letting them be treated fairly despite their magic is that they are not mortal, now outsiders from the law/chaos, good/evil planes are also exempt, but what about mentioning non-human mortals without alignment-plane-stuff as part of their being instead, such as dragons, drow, xorn, winged elves, griffons ect?

Basically, I think the faith has a a good answer for the while fey question - "they are not mortal, so special consideration is needed, it's certainly something to discuss, but the seven won't be pushing for their worship*"

*As that will never happen.
 
Basically, I think the faith has a a good answer for the while fey question - "they are not mortal, so special consideration is needed, it's certainly something to discuss, but the seven won't be pushing for their worship*"

The argument being made here isn't that the Fey should worship the Seven. It's how can any follower of the Faith pact with a Fey without risking being accused of heresy if all magic can only be safe if it is worked under the aegis of the Seven.

Edit: and if Lucan says that no true follower of the Faith ever would, that's basically the death knell to any pact between him and Kyle.
 
Last edited:
Ohhh. Right, cheers :)

[X] Goldfish

Also, something something, a) hope we have an effect that surprises Danielle and b) we get to see it in depth, somehow.

Not happening, but eh, would be cool :).
Edit: am sleepy :oops:
 
Actually can someone explain to me why the Initiate of Mystra is so broken? I mean capacity to cast under AMF aside what is the problem?
Your Soulfire Bracers don't work, your Freedom of Movement ring doesn't work, counter moves like Wings of Cover or Celerity or plain Counterspell don't work, immediate action boosters like Ruin Delver's Fortune don't work, Alter Fortune doesn't work. Your Protection from Element doesn't work, your freaking Mindblank doesn't work.

You can be fucked in a myriad of ways, and can't defend against anything. Including being Dominated.
 
Last edited:
Actually can someone explain to me why the Initiate of Mystra is so broken? I mean capacity to cast under AMF aside what is the problem?
It's super broken in standard D&D (the ability to shut down magic is pretty huge, and the ability to keep casting while the enemy loses their spells, magical gear and buffs is devastating if you can get into melee and stay there) but in this quest? It's not unbeatable by any means.

The obvious ways to defeat and AMF still work (stay back and use Alchemy or Orb spells, control the battlefield really hard, etc) but if you're stuck in melee wihtout magic gear and buffs while your opponent can use magic and is melee-specced... Well, things aren't going great.
 
Last edited:
Your Soulfire Bracers don't work, your Freedom of Movement ring doesn't work, counter moves like Wings of Cover or Celerity don't work, immediate action boosters like Ruin Delver's Fortune don't work, Alter Fortune doesn't work.

You can be fucked in a myriad of ways, and can't defend against anything.
Now I want a bullshitter of Mystra.

Fortunately for us, the Old Gods happen to have a Magic domain. Maybe we can arrange something with Bloodraven.
 
Actually can someone explain to me why the Initiate of Mystra is so broken? I mean capacity to cast under AMF aside what is the problem?
Capacity to cast under AMF.

Imagine fighting someone with Dany's buffs, and you don't have Dany's buffs.

Hell, as chosen of the Seven, I would not be surprised if a few of Lucan's magic items have a "when wielded by a chosen of the Seven, this works in an AMF cast by said chosen" rule.

Like, an anti-viserys build would have to be that crazy-op imo.
 
Your Soulfire Bracers don't work, your Freedom of Movement ring doesn't work, counter moves like Wings of Cover or Celerity don't work, immediate action boosters like Ruin Delver's Fortune don't work, Alter Fortune doesn't work. Your Protection from Element doesn't work, your freaking Mindblank doesn't work.

You can be fucked in a myriad of ways, and can't defend against anything. Including being Dominated.

Would Mythic spells be affected by an AMF? And yeah it does sound pretty broken when you put it like that.
 
Last edited:
Actually can someone explain to me why the Initiate of Mystra is so broken? I mean capacity to cast under AMF aside what is the problem?

Take the ability to cast within an AMF and stick it to a Clericzilla chassis. Now give it some of the most versatile arcane spells in the game on their spell list. Not as domain spells.

Now take into account that this means all their buffs will function in an AMF.

Watch as they laugh in the face of anything but Disjunction.
 
Back
Top