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Let others explain this:
Perhaps I should have made myself clearer: I read the last dozens of pages. I saw the arguments. While I understand the position espoused I do not agree enough to change my vote, and you tossing a dozen quote-links at me will not do the job any more than me reading them the first time. I will thank you to not continue to harass me over this.
 
[X][IDEALS] Social Democrat: Centered around the idea that it is the state's responsibility to ensure a bare-minimum standard of living, the Social Democrats add to the New Capitalist agenda with a push for a government guarantee of adequate housing, food, and water to all citizens -- itself a fairly titanic task. It remains rooted in the fundamental ideal of private enterprise. The Social Democrats have some interest in the potential of democratized workplaces and are willing to support them in an experimental measure.
[X][CRUSH] None. This is a democracy. If your ideology cannot make its case to the people in practice, it deserves to fail.
[X][POWER] You are a devolved unitary state with subordinate governments formed or dissolved by central governmental decrees according to need
[X][TEXT] The old Constitution had its flaws, but it was a document of many strengths as well. It lasted two and a half centuries. We shall honor that and preserve the original. Our changes will be amendments, as intended, with our population approving them as specified in the text.
[X][REVIEW] The new Constitution will serve just fine with a standardized system for proposing amendments.
 
Ooh. OOH! I found out what a hostile takeover looks like in a workplace democracy! This is such a fascinating bit of worldbuilding. I'm going to have so much fun with this! I'm nerding out so hard right now. You could have entire organized syndicates dedicated to targeting (former, obviously) small business owners in this way, and legally, stopping them would be almost completely unenforceable! This is fucking insidious, I love it. I would have never thought of that! This is going to add so much to the world. Thanks, Knight!

I don't really understand how this is a hostile takeover? You can only "take over" by... actually working there. In which case, what are you taking over, exactly? Control of your own labour? You had that already, though?

Also, I suspect if you tried to form a syndicate to try to forcibly influence workplace democracy, you would rapidly have the issue of people being unwilling to hire from that syndicate?
 
One of my pals got me into this quest, thought I might try voting. Don't flame me bro.


[x][IDEALS] Socialist: Having come to refer to a specific political movement rather than an entire branch of ideology, modern socialism is focused on giving the state the power to care for allcitizens, and claims that the modern Social Democrat platform does not go far enough in pursuit of this. It also calls for a massive investment into healthcare in order to revitalize the field and make sure that there are enough medical professionals to go around (long-term, they want free healthcare, but there needs to be enough of it first). They also grant unions extensive privileges over private employers. They are fervently in favor of democratized workplaces, and openly campaign in favor of granting them special concessions.
[x][IDEALS] Communist: The old revolutionary ideology has elected to push for their aims in the democratic process. Their modern platform, in this setting, is centered around the absolute implementation of workplace democracy in addition to the same welfare and legal measures proposed by other movements. The aims of the American Communists in the present day are to break the concept of private ownership of businesses, which places them in stark opposition to Capitalist and Social Democrat thought of this era. This is a part of a larger drive towards a transition to a fully Communist society, but the Communists have quite enough to be focused on at the moment and are leaving that aside.
[x][CRUSH] None. This is a democracy. If your ideology cannot make its case to the people in practice, it deserves to fail.
[x][POWER] You are a centralized federal state along the lines of the later United States.
[x][TEXT] The Constitution was utterly bereft of any kind of legal, political, or ethical merit and shall be cast into the trash heap of history where it belongs. We shall start anew from a blank slate.
[x][REVIEW] The new Constitution should be put to review and possible revision every thirty years.
 
I don't really understand how this is a hostile takeover? You can only "take over" by... actually working there. In which case, what are you taking over, exactly? Control of your own labour? You had that already, though?

Also, I suspect if you tried to form a syndicate to try to forcibly influence workplace democracy, you would rapidly have the issue of people being unwilling to hire from that syndicate?
The people taking over are doing some from a position of a numeric majority, but a minority of investment. There are more of them working at this farm, but they shouldered none of the initial burden and risk for its creation, they likely do little of the indirect work (paying bills, paperwork, etc.) that keeps it running, and so on. Their work is real and valuable, but does it truly balance against the very real personal cost and risk the 2 made?
 
The people taking over are doing some from a position of a numeric majority, but a minority of investment. There are more of them working at this farm, but they shouldered none of the initial burden and risk for its creation, they likely do little of the indirect work (paying bills, paperwork, etc.) that keeps it running, and so on. Their work is real and valuable, but does it truly balance against the very real personal cost and risk the 2 made?
which is why you choose your co-workers carefully.
 
Okay. Okay. Three last flags and now I go get some food and fall over.

First up we have this design that incorporates @AKuz's suggestion for the four star symbolism with the phoenix. I'm sticking with the Starbird design for now because fuck yeah Star Wars:

(It occured to me just now that if you added colonial America to the list of republics, or pre-colonial native nations or what have you, then the phoenix represents the renewal of the Fifth Republic. Just a passing thought.)

Next we have two variations on @Susano's flag design, again using the four star symbolism, one with the phoenix and one without. Honestly I think the phoenix works better for this design in general as the design without it looks pretty generic, like the sort of thing the Shadowrun guys would throw together for a splat on deadline. YMMV, of course:

 
The people taking over are doing some from a position of a numeric majority, but a minority of investment. There are more of them working at this farm, but they shouldered none of the initial burden and risk for its creation, they likely do little of the indirect work (paying bills, paperwork, etc.) that keeps it running, and so on. Their work is real and valuable, but does it truly balance against the very real personal cost and risk the 2 made?

If they are necessary for the running of the farm, then should they not get a say in their working lives as they do in their political lives?
 
[X][IDEALS] New Capitalist
[X][IDEALS] Social Democrat
[X][CRUSH] None
[X][POWER] You are a centralized federal state along the lines of the later United States.
[X][TEXT] The old Constitution had its flaws, but it was a document of many strengths as well. It lasted
two and a half centuries. We shall honor that and preserve the original. Our changes will be amendments, as intended, with our population approving them as specified in the text.
[X][TEXT] The Constitution serves as a broad guide for the structure of this document, and many legal concepts integral to it carry through, but it is rewritten from the ground up to serve its new situation rather than simply amending it until it fits.
[X][REVIEW] The new Constitution will serve just fine with a standardized system for proposing amendments.
 
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The people taking over are doing some from a position of a numeric majority, but a minority of investment. There are more of them working at this farm, but they shouldered none of the initial burden and risk for its creation, they likely do little of the indirect work (paying bills, paperwork, etc.) that keeps it running, and so on. Their work is real and valuable, but does it truly balance against the very real personal cost and risk the 2 made?

This would be in a massive welfare state, where there wouldn't really be that much, if any risk? As for the indirect work- that's why coops don't necessarily have the same pay for all workers, with pay depending on hours of work, quality of work, etc...
 
[X][IDEALS] New Capitalist: Aims to restore the old system with badly-needed revisions to address some of the obvious flaws. Among other things, it mandates a living minimum wage tied to government-collected measures, writes into foundational law the de-personhood of anybody who is not, in fact, an actual person, and institutes broad protections for employees against their employers (protected right to unionize, protections for whistleblowers, pension laws for companies, etc.). The New Capitalists do not give a single shit about democratized workplaces, positively or negatively, as long as they pay their taxes.
[X][IDEALS] Social Democrat: Centered around the idea that it is the state's responsibility to ensure a bare-minimum standard of living, the Social Democrats add to the New Capitalist agenda with a push for a government guarantee of adequate housing, food, and water to all citizens -- itself a fairly titanic task. It remains rooted in the fundamental ideal of private enterprise. The Social Democrats have some interest in the potential of democratized workplaces and are willing to support them in an experimental measure.
[X][CRUSH] None. This is a democracy. If your ideology cannot make its case to the people in practice, it deserves to fail.
[X][POWER] You are a centralized federal state along the lines of the later United States.
[X][TEXT] The old Constitution had its flaws, but it was a document of many strengths as well. It lasted two and a half centuries. We shall honor that and preserve the original. Our changes will be amendments, as intended, with our population approving them as specified in the text.
[X][REVIEW] The new Constitution will serve just fine with a standardized system for proposing amendments.
 
Okay. Okay. Three last flags and now I go get some food and fall over.

First up we have this design that incorporates @AKuz's suggestion for the four star symbolism with the phoenix. I'm sticking with the Starbird design for now because fuck yeah Star Wars:

(It occured to me just now that if you added colonial America to the list of republics, or pre-colonial native nations or what have you, then the phoenix represents the renewal of the Fifth Republic. Just a passing thought.)

Next we have two variations on @Susano's flag design, again using the four star symbolism, one with the phoenix and one without. Honestly I think the phoenix works better for this design in general as the design without it looks pretty generic, like the sort of thing the Shadowrun guys would throw together for a splat on deadline. YMMV, of course:

I definitely like the starbird and the four stars. Kinda wish we could find something specific to tie the number of stripes to, though...
 
@Mal-3

I cannot tell you how much I love the 1st and second flag. Starbird all the way.

When all abroad see that flag, and recognize our love of Star Wars, none shall doubt the legitimacy of our commitment to freedom and liberty.

The force shall be with us.
 
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If they are necessary for the running of the farm, then should they not get a say in their working lives as they do in their political lives?

Depending on the laws and the size of the operation, they may not even have voting shares, just a requirement that all employees be unionized.

Like, we're talking about an easily legislated edge case. "Hey, law against a syndicate scavenging from mom and pop businesses". Instead of, say, today's reality of "Amazon and UPS are literally killing their workers and no one cares. Also companies don't pay taxes."

No one hates small holding farmers or your local mom and pop corner store. Rapscallions that for whatever reason try to grift them using the existing social infrastructure will not be at all sympathetic to wider society.

This is the equivalent of some Duke going "Hey, what if you elect a corrupt mayor for your town? Checkmate Liberals. Democracy can never work." *Aristocratic Finger gun*

Anyone coming to you going "But what if... Democracy bad?" Is simply trying to sell you a load of... rotten goods. This is the sort of argument that would have led the American Republic of 1787 to stay in the British Empire and disband their state legislatures in favour of direct rule from London and titled lords.
 
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@PoptartProdigy Yeah I figured as much. The mechanical debuff doesn't what gets me, throwing any sort of founding document is a pretty big deal no matter how you spin it. It's just the wording comes off as very aggressive and pessimistic of the Constitution but I suppose in this instance people are legitimately upset as they perceive that it failed them and the nation. Still, saying it belongs in a trash heap of history is very strong wording.
 
which is why you choose your co-workers carefully.
So if a sociopath manages to charm their way onto the family farm and convince the majority of the workers to vote out the people who spent most if the effort and most of the investment starting and running the place?

What if they told the workers that the farm could be really valuable and they would make out like bandits if they threw the family off their farm, chopped it up and sold it piecemeal?

Cause that's what a culture capitalist is. Although now it's a culture communist.

That's not right. That's even less fair than traditional capitalism. You cannot even justify that by claiming Mr and Mrs Macdonald are cruel absentee landlords.
 
So if a sociopath manages to charm their way onto the family farm and convince the majority of the workers to vote out the people who spent most if the effort and most of the investment starting and running the place?

What if they told the workers that the farm could be really valuable and they would make out like bandits if they threw the family off their farm, chopped it up and sold it piecemeal?

Cause that's what a culture capitalist is. Although now it's a culture communist.

That's not right. That's even less fair than traditional capitalism. You cannot even justify that by claiming Mr and Mrs Macdonald are cruel absentee landlords.

Make a law like Akuz proposed to guard against such edge cases?
 
To be honest, If anyone is worried about some grifter taking advantage of the system to steal from people using con jobs and legal loopholes, I'd take a long and hard look at the capitalism that remains under the New Capitalist and SocDem paradigms.

Arguments against Workplace Democracy on the theory that some orange shyster is going to get elected on a platform of theft, hatred, and corruption... Well those arguements should lead us to dismissing Democracy all together.

If you oppose Workplace Democracy on the grounds that conmen exist. Then we need to go back to step one, and decide on who gets to be The King Of America.

If this is endemic, then our society is fucked anyway because no one who votes gives a shit except to hurt and steal.
 
Guessing from what others have told me, I trust the OP shall slap us harshly with the pitfalls and weaknesses of our chosen system whatever it is. I look forward to the challenge.

A very long term problem. I suspect the reintegration of the Victorian lands shall be an incredible challenge worse than South Korea hypothetically trying reintegrate North Korea because we are not economically strong ourselves.

If they are necessary for the running of the farm, then should they not get a say in their working lives as they do in their political lives?
I think the problem is of groups of nefarious conmen taking over coops with numbers and looting it empty before moving on. It may be an inherent risk of coops that people must accept to a degree in the same way capitalist businesses are at risk of being preyed on by vulture capitalists. We can mitigate both examples by legislation but I doubt you can totally remove the risk. If there is an economic system, someone will figure out to exploit it. But that is beyond the scope of a constitution to deal with.
 
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How would that law work? Operations under a certain size would not be required to democratize?

Yeah, it's a known proposal that family businesses/family farms/mom and pop institutions under a certain size or value are simply Unionized environments because the inherant power imbalance isn't as fucky. Otherwise you'd probably have to like, enforce the four year old voting if they help milk the cows and feed the chickens.

And legally and culturally it ends up being more trouble than it's worth. The idea is that those small businesses will eventually dissolve voluntarily into communes and other such groupings over time
 
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