Remove ads

Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest

Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
Reader mode
Another argument for leading the wizards, is that we would be in charge of a unique and specialist resource. Contrasting against the Stirlander contingent which is a relatively small, under equipped and not particularly skilled group of humans among many thousands. It's a better leverage of our skills and gives us more political say in the campaign.
 
DarkLight140 said:
This decision is tricky. Ultimately the issue here is that neither of these groups have any representation on the Council right now- that means that both are likely to be out of touch with the leadership, disorganized, and ultimately underutilized and susceptible to low morale and feeling underappreciated.

That's pretty bad for anyone, but there are 10,000 Stirlanders. They form a full quarter of the human forces present. If we don't pick them they will have no leader to rally around (note how the Nordlanders and Ulricans united and aligned behind the knights but the Stirlanders and misc. human forces did not). This campaign could be seriously damaged by having those kinds of numbers left either leaderless or with a leader that they don't know and have faith in.

Contrast with the journeymen- yes, they'll be not listened to and underused if they don't have someone in charge of them... but they're journeymen. They've been explicitly judged by their Colleges to be capable of self-directing, determining the best course of action and moving independently to take it. Further, if they really need something and we're on the Council in any capacity at all nothing at all stops them from approaching us and bringing it up; even if we're commander of the Stirlanders if we say "gold wizards can do X, let him" no one is going to be dumb enough to say "that has nothing to do with the Stirlanders and so we're not going to listen"; all the people without representation on the war council have to be getting their orders from somewhere and the council has to get ideas about what those orders should be from somewhere.

Ultimately I think that if we want this campaign to succeed, taking command of the Stirland contingent is the right choice.

That said, if we're here for personal development or gaining Magister cred, maybe we don't give a shit if the Stirland contingent is disorganized and dissolves/deserts.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
The thing is that is ten thousand people, odds are there is some leader among them who will be taking charge and will likely be on the council. Just because we aren't the leader doesn't mean they won't have one, although odds are their leader won't be as skilled as we are.
 
It's also worth noting that there are certainly several people qualified to lead human soldiers but we're the only one qualified to lead human wizards.
 
'Journeymanlings', that's adorable.


[X] Accept as leader of the Stirlander forces (commanding 5,000 crossbowmen and 5,000 huntsmen).

Still not over the failure of wizards on our last campaign. Give me good solid crossbows.

[X] The Stirlander forces
[X] The Halfling forces
[X] Spend time with your wolf pup, trying to develop a famliar bond.
[X] Deliver last-minute messages for Belegar, trying to scrape together any remaining support to be had before leaving.
- [X] To Dwarfholds of the Grey and Black Mountains.

I like the idea of putting our notable riding skill to use, but also trying to develop a familiar bond, but also meeting the Halflings from last campaign properly, but also getting to know the Stirlanders. These seem like the most hidebound of the hidebound Stirlanders and not likely to take well to us, so we should get started on them early.
 
Two journeymen aren't going to be that important to the campaign. It's Battle Wizards who are strategic battlefield assets. We would be much more effective leading 10,000 men with our 19 Martial.
 
[X] Accept as the most senior Wizard present (commanding two AmberJourneymen and one Gold Journeyman).
[X] The Amber Wizard journeymen.
[X] The Gold Wizard journeyman.
[X] The Stirlander forces
 
It's a question of opportunity cost sure we could do well leading those men, but so could others and no one else could lead those wizards.
 
The more I look at this vote the more I think that planned voting would be appropriate. Who we spend time with is not an independent choice from who we declare ourselves to be representing on the council; saying that we're in charge of the wizards or Stirlanders and then completely ignoring them because they didn't win the second half of the votes would be downright weird. Likewise if we say we're a College rep then running messages to the Colleges makes more sense, etc.

Sinsystems said:
The thing is that is ten thousand people, odds are there is some leader among them who will be taking charge and will likely be on the council. Just because we aren't the leader doesn't mean they won't have one, although odds are their leader won't be as skilled as we are.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
We can't guarantee that someone will emerge rather than the Stirland contingent slowly splintering into the other groups and dissolving, with no solid internal cohesion kept at all. And if they do, not only will they likely not be as skilled as we are, they won't have our level of rep backing them, and they may not actually give a damn about the success of the campaign.

Take note, after all:
Belegar gruffly concedes that though the Empire as an institution failed him, the turnout from the lands of man has made the trip worthwhile. All in all, it's a force of near a hundred thousand that gathers. Though only time will tell how many remain when you finally reach Karak Eight Peaks, or how many will survive the assault on it.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
There's a good chance that a lot of the people in the army right now won't make it to Eight Peaks; certainly Mathilde doesn't see them all making it there as a safe assumption. For one thing, we don't have an official map showing the route from here to Eight Peaks yet, but from what I recall it crosses through the whole Border Princes, which is basically the land of people deciding to abandon home and seek their fortunes- and hey, look at the Stirlander motivations!
Second of all and almost as surprising is the turnout from your home province: apparently the Elector Countess has started to phase out crossbows in favour of rifles and things have not been going well, as thousands of former troops have rallied to Clan Angrund to seek their fortunes rather than trying their luck with newfangled gunpowder contraptions. Of roughly equal size are the detachment of various hunters, poachers, and woodsmen from western and northern Stirland. A lifetime living next to Sylvania, you're sure, will make the Badlands seem homey by comparison.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
They're not here because they want to fight evil or because they have a passion to help the dwarves, they're here because they don't like the leadership at home and are striking out to seek their fortunes elsewhere. One Border Prince with a decent offer, or even one of those unnamed emergent commanders you've brought up deciding that he would like to be a Border Prince and the thousands of his fellows around are just the army to help him do it, and we could easily see mass defections amongst the Stirland forces.
 
Last edited:
No7sHere said:
It's not a question of whether the Journeymen or worth more than the soldiers it's a question of which job can only we do.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
No, it's a question of where our time would produce the largest effect. Those 10,000 soldiers can be a very potent asset if they're led competently and with purpose, whereas 3 journeymen will have a very minor effect on a campaign of this scale no matter their leadership.
 
Last edited:
BoneyM said:
"It will trigger automatically should you be slain, or can be triggered with a mnemonic. A second mnemonic will use it to heal anyone you hold your palm to. It can hold four activations of power; to recharge, allow it to sprout in soil for three to eight hours per activation, depending on the richness of the soil - I recommend sleeping outdoors for this purpose. Alternately, when time is of the essence, hold your palm to an incapacitated or bound enemy and allow the roots to feed upon them. This will recharge a single activation. In a pinch, corpses can be used, albeit for a lesser effect, albeit at a tenth of the effectiveness."
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Flippin' awesome.

BoneyM said:
Journeymanlings
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

I cannot articulate why, but I really like this term.


As for the voting, I have zero idea what those wizards can do; all I know is Amber = Beasts, Gold = Metal. Beyond 'attach the Amber wizards to units with monstrous mounts', I dunno what we'd do with 'em, so I'm leaning towards accepting command of the Stirland forces.

And while this won't be the only opportunity to gain reinforcements, we ought to try to drum up some support. We should lean on our good relations with Zhufbar. From the dorf rep section on the Info post:

BoneyM said:
Send a force to assist in a campaign against someone they already hate
If they've outstanding grudges, and you're in a position of power in the campaign, and they've got the forces to spare, your rep would be enough.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

There's only ten cannon in this whole army! Trying for more is a worthwhile action.
 
There are several competent human military forces in the expedition anyone of which could provide a competent leader, maybe not as good as us but considering that we have several knightly orders along we're hardly lacking in skilled soldiers. We are however the only magister along making us the only one qualified to lead the magical contingent. It's also worth noting that I simply do not want to play as a general I'd like to play as a wizard.
 
[x] Accept as the most senior Wizard present (commanding two Amber Journeymen and one Gold Journeyman).
[X] Spend time with your wolf pup, trying to develop a famliar bond.
[x] Deliver last-minute messages for Belegar, trying to scrape together any remaining support to be had before leaving.
- [X] To Dwarfholds of the Grey and Black Mountains.
- [X] To the Colleges of Magic.
 
Last edited:
Barnes said:
Flippin' awesome.



I cannot articulate why, but I really like this term.


As for the voting, I have zero idea what those wizards can do; all I know is Amber = Beasts, Gold = Metal. Beyond 'attach the Amber wizards to units with monstrous mounts', I dunno what we'd do with 'em, so I'm leaning towards accepting command of the Stirland forces.

And while this won't be the only opportunity to gain reinforcements, we ought to try to drum up some support. We should lean on our good relations with Zhufbar. From the dorf rep section on the Info post:



There's only ten cannon in this whole army! Trying for more is a worthwhile action.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Well one of the big that can make an Amber Wizard useful is the ability to talk to animals.
 
[X] Accept as the most senior Wizard present (commanding two Amber Journeymen and one Gold Journeyman).
[X] The Amber Wizard journeymen.
[X] The Gold Wizard journeyman.
[X] Deliver last-minute messages for Belegar, trying to scrape together any remaining support to be had before leaving.
- [X] To the Colleges of Magic.
 
aaaaaaaahhhhhhh the empire seems to break at the seams

Like, in the abstract, we should be happy that all those human forces joined the reclamation effort, but they all joined because of societal breakdown and religious conflicts.

At least it seems that the halflings are merely determined to become everyone's best friend rather than internal troubles.
 
[X] Accept as leader of the Stirlander forces (commanding 5,000 crossbowmen and 5,000 huntsmen).

[X] The Stirlander forces
[X] Spend time with your wolf pup, trying to develop a famliar bond.
[X] Deliver last-minute messages for Belegar, trying to scrape together any remaining support to be had before leaving.
- [X] To Dwarfholds of the Grey and Black Mountains.
 
DarkLight140 said:
The more I look at this vote the more I think that planned voting would be appropriate. Who we spend time with is not an independent choice from who we declare ourselves to be representing on the council; saying that we're in charge of the wizards or Stirlanders and then completely ignoring them because they didn't win the second half of the votes would be downright weird. Likewise if we say we're a College rep then running messages to the Colleges makes more sense, etc.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

I figure that if a majority is in favour of leading one then a majority won't also be voting to spend time with the other. And worst case scenario, it's not like it'd be wasted time to spend time with the wizards or the Stirlanders when you're not in command of them.
 
Important element here is that the dwarfs already know how to use the Stirlanders. Crossbow troops are a major element of dwarf forces, so they can be deployed as generic forces, if less reliable than proper dawi crossbows.

The dwarfs however, do not have any units which behave like wizards. At best they'd be used like they're adventurers, at worst sidelined.
Barnes said:
As for the voting, I have zero idea what those wizards can do; all I know is Amber = Beasts, Gold = Metal. Beyond 'attach the Amber wizards to units with monstrous mounts', I dunno what we'd do with 'em, so I'm leaning towards accepting command of the Stirland forces.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Amber has berserker rage type buffs and a bunch of close and mid range combat spells. If we were in command of them I'd probably attach them to the Ulrican knights, as they operate similarly.

Gold has mass equipment buffs and debuffs. However, since the dwarfs won't accept it on their gear, the Gold Journeyman is best attached to the Myrmidians or the Stirlanders.
 
Keep in mind that Grey Wizard plus two amber wizards opens up options like sneaking into enemy encampments, and enraging the enemy monster units who'll cause a ruckus, but it is certainly less useful in outright combat than leading the Stirlander troops if we're aiming to participate in that field while not being a battle wizard.
Second of all and almost as surprising is the turnout from your home province: apparently the Elector Countess has started to phase out crossbows in favour of rifles and things have not been going well, as thousands of former troops have rallied to Clan Angrund to seek their fortunes rather than trying their luck with newfangled gunpowder contraptions. Of roughly equal size are the detachment of various hunters, poachers, and woodsmen from western and northern Stirland. A lifetime living next to Sylvania, you're sure, will make the Badlands seem homey by comparison.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Is it just me, or does the Stirlander force comprised of either ranged soldiers, and individuals who're used to skirmishing with the horrors of Sylvania? It seems like they'd best be folded into one of the other human forces if this is the case.
 
SITB said:
At least it seems that the halflings are merely determined to become everyone's best friend rather than internal troubles.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

I personally thought of this as the Halfling political leadership trying to find some way of getting rid of an inconveniently victorious army. This would be a means of removing disruptive elements of the population and preventing a victorious general from returning to seize political power.
 
Reader mode
You must login or register to reply here.
Remove ads
Back
Top