The loss of Temp Armies doesn't come from disbanding armies, it comes from our army being very disorganized during the reform.
Paths of Civilization II: Paths of Industrialization
- Location
- Sydney
I think his point is that with relatively high Militancy and Consciousness, it is a bad idea to (temporarily) reduce our armies.
While the armies will soon recover, we do not know if any of the Constitutional options will reduce happiness. If we choose an option costing Temp SoL, for example, it could spark a revolt. Then the revolutionaries could easily win due to the lack of military force to stop them.
- Location
- Austria
A part of dissatisfaction is the lack of constitutional monarchy, so it is likely safe to assume the fact of convention and us doing something will decrease tension somewhat.
10ebbor10
DON'T PANIC
- Location
- Present
Disbanding, reorganizing. Whatever. The effect is the same. Most of our military strength will be gone, and for a long time.
Exactly.
In fact, we know that when happiness is lower than militancy, we can be faced with decisions we have to take lest we face a revolt. It's almost certain that an action as influential as a constitution will result in such a thing.
Assuming that we go for that option. Just because it pleases people doesn't mean it's good.
These are all things that could be in the Constitution. Plenty of them can cause unhappiness.
It's possible certainly that we get a constitution that makes stuff easier for us, but then we could easily end up with a constitution that Expands Crown Guilds, Clamps down on "evil" liberal sentiment, binds peasants to the land and stuff like that.
Put it simply, constitutions are powerfull and making one will create tension.
I think the bigger problem is that doing both reforms at once is that the chain of command is super unclear while in progress and we'd be forced to make compromises on the constitution or risk war via public happiness drop mid reform.
We DO recall what happened the last time we tried to reform the administration and a second project at once right?
We DO recall what happened the last time we tried to reform the administration and a second project at once right?
- Location
- Sydney
True, it probably will reduce the dissatisfaction.
As long as people are aware of the risk; that Military reform this turn might have high costs and absolutely no gain.
10ebbor10
DON'T PANIC
- Location
- Present
Anyway, here's an idea.
This turn, we don't do military reform, but next turn we double down on it. That has the advantage of allowing us to combine military reform with doctrine research.
It does have the downside of pushing us to 1 army instead of 2.
This turn, we don't do military reform, but next turn we double down on it. That has the advantage of allowing us to combine military reform with doctrine research.
It does have the downside of pushing us to 1 army instead of 2.
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Random Member
Gardener of Human Happiness
- Location
- Behind You
Eh, what was it again, that one time we nearly burned down Redshore?
- Location
- Austria
Where, exactly, are you getting this from?
Action itself only mentions -2 Temp Army, so it's not there.
Narratively, again, I raise you Peter the Great reorganizing military starting at ~1700, after the war with Sweden has already started, and punching Sweden in the army in 1709. So clearly it does not involve army vanishing into thin air.
So, you are here, again, stating your belief in that military reform will wipe out most of our army, but not reasons for said belief.
I propose counter-plan: this turn we do no industry and instead get started on military reform, and next turn, if the war has not started already, we double down on Industry.
[X] Plan Constitution
10ebbor10
DON'T PANIC
- Location
- Present
Now you just seem to be intentionally obtuse.
Very, very simply:
The army stat is a reflection of the extent and effectiveness of our army. Having low army stats means that we don't have an effective army.
Honestly, you seem to be in denial of what the action blatantly states. You appear to think that a military reform that puts our Army Stat at 2 somehow won't mean that we don't have an effective army.
Doubling down on Industry is impossible. We can only spend 1 IC, because we only have 1 IC.
And if the war starts next turn, then we won't have to worry about anything but how to write our surrender speech. War with 5 Army would be bad. War with 2 is annihilation.
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- Location
- Austria
-2 Temp Army means we are down to 7 (2), with going back to 7(4.5?) next turn. That's assuming military reform does not yield + Army - which is, uh. May or may not be the case.
I am not the one being obtuse here; -2 Temp Army is not the end of the world, at least given that Temp stats regen half the distance to Permastat per turn.
10ebbor10
DON'T PANIC
- Location
- Present
You're forgetting the Midturn.
We'll have 2 army then, as well as a constitutional reform, and the happiness/militancy issues.
Perhaps on completion it might yield additional military. But I highly doubt that a reform will complete in a single turn; especially since we don't even have an idea where to start. We're planning to start reorganisation without knowing or even thinking about the goal.
And -2 army is very much important,especially when we only have 4. Minus 2 puts us to down to 2, and thus a terribly weakened target compared to what we were. Regen does not kick in till afterwards.
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- Pronouns
- He/Him
Right now Military Reform will accelerate a number of techs in progress.
Also, you are all correct, you are at Happiness 4.
10ebbor10
DON'T PANIC
- Location
- Present
What magnitude of progress are we talking about. 1-2, or 10-20 progress.
- Location
- Austria
It depends, actually; even incomplete reform may include some bonuses due to reorganization, although it, of course, depends and thus I am not relying on it.
As for midturn...I doubt Hohozyn will be in any position whatsoever to attack us within 2 years thanks to his economy being currently on fire; 4 years maybe, 2 - haha, no.
Unless he hates us enough to suicide into us, midturn is safe from an external attack at least. Uprising is an option I guess, but we are doing...not good, but passable on stability, and revolts mostly are easier to defeat than peer Great Powers.
Ah, so it will accelerate...hrm, most likely Early Industrial Doctrine and Levee en Masse at least, maybe something else too.
Do we have any idea whether taking both Convention and Mil Reform at the same time can be a problem (or opportunity)?
- Pronouns
- He/Him
It will be in the latter range.
Random Member
Gardener of Human Happiness
- Location
- Behind You
@Academia Nut Do Poetyr or his advisors expect there to be any problems from trying to reform the army while also calling for the Constitutional Convention? Do they think they can push through both reforms at the same time?
- Location
- Mists of Albion
Holy shit yes.
We might just be able to compete for the next war!
- Location
- Sydney
Military Reform
No current plans are using diplomatic outreach, most want to leave it for later.
The second plan doesn't spend any PW, to save it all for the Constitution.
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- Pronouns
- He/Him
I could get messy, but so long as no one declares war within the next few years it should be doable.
